Scam or legal?

[kellyandbryan]

I need some advice from some of you guys that have been in this business for a long time. I've been around for a while myself, but I've never seen anything like this before.

I received an offer on one of my domain names a couple days ago through domainsponsor. The offer was far to low ($100) for the quality of name (I think). So I countered higher, not knowing who I was talking to.

I immediately received a counter of $150 and a note saying that this was the final offer and the next step was DMCA. This time it was signed as sent from globat.com

I then asked why is DMCA involved here? I hand regged this name about 4 months ago and never heard from anyone until a few days ago.

My final response from this person (claiming to be from globat) is below:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

The domain name xxxxxxxxxxxxx.com was registered to another person prior to your registration. The system did not automatically renew his domain name and thus you were able to register it. The prior owner has asked us to get it back for him and pay a fair fee if we have to. If not, he is going to file a Digital Millennium Act violation to ICANN in order to get it back. It is easier for all parties if we just paid the $150.00 and got the domain back.

Let me know your thoughts and thank you for your email.

Best Regards,

Globat.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Is that even legal to take a name that they let expire? It is not a copyright name or anything like that. Just 2 generic words together.

I thought DMCA was to protect companies names not used by shady registrars to steal names from people. I've personally never heard of Globat, but a quick search here and all I can find is bad things about them.

I mean if a person can claim a name back that they used to own just by filing a complaint, then wheres the limit? Can I sell it to somone for $5000 then claim it back?

Even if this is completely legal . . . The registrar should not be the one to set the "Fair Price", I should. Possibly based on an appraisal.

This whole thing sounds fishy to me so that is why I am asking for help here. I think the next thing he's gonna ask is for me to get an appraisal at his website...LOL I know some of you guys have dealt with things like this before.

 

[NameClerk]

First thing I would do is go to archive.org and try to find out who the previous owner was or if it was even developed.

Domaintools.com also has some nice tools to find information on domain history.

Gathering some of these facts might help you decide if their story holds any water.

-Bill

 

[owntype]

It seems legal, or it would be the 1st time I heard such kind of a scam, lol

I have the same issue with an U.S corp last year, they just wanna take a domain (not a TM, and no related issues, just a 5 Letter acronyms domain) back from me, they are the ex-owner of this name but never used it for this business.

The lawyer told me that they are very confident to get the domain back by bring an accusation against my action, and for a good attitude, they would return me the reg fee to get it back. LOL. I was a bit angry for their words so I simply replied "Thanks but save your reg fee. I registered this domain name for my business in legit way and please don't bother me again.". In the next months, they sent me several emails and finally a manager (instead of the lawyer) contacted me by phone, after an short negotiation, we signed the contract and they purchased the domain for $2.4k

Just FYI.

 

[kellyandbryan]

First thing I would do is go to archive.org and try to find out who the previous owner was or if it was even developed.

Domaintools.com also has some nice tools to find information on domain history.

Gathering some of these facts might help you decide if their story holds any water.

-Bill

Archive.org shows it was never developed, simply forwarded to another domain for about 2 years. Then undeveloped for at least 6 months until I got it.

That is about all I can find out. It was not ever used by a company of that name.

It seems legal, or it would be the 1st time I heard such kind of a scam, lol

I have the same issue with an U.S corp last year, they just wanna take a domain (not a TM, and no related issues, just a 5 Letter acronyms domain) back from me, they are the ex-owner of this name but never used it for this business.

The lawyer told me that they are very confident to get the domain back by bring an accusation against my action, and for a good attitude, they would return me the reg fee to get it back. LOL. I was a bit angry for their words so I simply replied "Thanks but save your reg fee. I registered this domain name for my business in legit way and please don't bother me again.". In the next months, they sent me several emails and finally a manager (instead of the lawyer) contacted me by phone, after an short negotiation, we signed the contract and they purchased the domain for $2.4k

Just FYI.

It sems like they really didn't have legal rights to the name otherwise they would have not paid over 2K for it.

 

[npcomplete]

There is some excellent advice above! Make sure you keep careful records. There are almost always complicating issues in situations like this. Perhaps the prior owner is claiming common law trademark rights, although if that is the case they did a terrible job of protecting their common law mark.

Are you using this domain that might in some way be infringing on the (supposed) common law mark? Collect your facts together and take this over to the legal forum here at NP and ask again. There are some great people there that can help. First you need to do a bit more homework to explain the situation and other related facts. Did you do a thorough TM search?

From the *sounds* of it, you may have legal recourse.

Here is what I do in these situations. Go to archive.org and print out any information that is relevant, then date the printed copy and sign it with a witness. Also try to save the html for the prior site to a file. Sometimes things at Archive.org go away, and you want to keep this information around.

Marc

 

[Dave_Z]

If not, he is going to file a Digital Millennium Act violation to ICANN in order to get it back.

If the other party really said they'll file a DMCA with ICANN, let them. Neither
ICANN or any UDRP provider is going to do a thing about it, except maybe tell
them to file a UDRP instead or go to court.

What you described is more common than some people care to admit. If that
former registrant is ready to force the issue, just be ready to defend yourself.

 

[kellyandbryan]

What you described is more common than some people care to admit. If that
former registrant is ready to force the issue, just be ready to defend yourself.

Well at least I know that this is not some type of scam. This really does happen.

What do you know about Globat? I just want to know what I am dealing with before I answer this guy.

 

[Dave_Z]

Not much, really, except I've read a few cases where Globat didn't renew the
domain names of their clients. I'm guessing from that email you got from one
of them (supposedly, anyway) is they're trying to make up to their client for
that.

You really don't have to do anything for either one of them. But if that party,
again, is prepared to force the issue, just be ready to deal with it.

 

[kellyandbryan]

THX for your help guys...

It seems to me that if I am forced to sell this domain back to them, they should pay what the names worth, correct?

After all, I did buy it with hopes of selling it for a profit.

A third party appraisal would be the most fair way to set the "Fair Price" they speak of.

That makes me wonder.... who's appraisals hold the most juice? I'm thinking moniker, but somebody else may have a different idea.

 

[Dave_Z]

It seems to me that if I am forced to sell this domain back to them, they should pay what the names worth, correct?

Just as you don't have to do a thing for them, they don't have to do a thing
for you as well.

Sometimes both parties can negotiate on an agreeable price, others use a 3rd
party appraisal. YMMV.

I realize I'm not really making things any possibly easier. I'm just being realistic
here, and only you can truly decide the answer on your own.

 

[npcomplete]

THX for your help guys...

It seems to me that if I am forced to sell this domain back to them, they should pay what the names worth, correct?

After all, I did buy it with hopes of selling it for a profit.

A third party appraisal would be the most fair way to set the "Fair Price" they speak of.

That makes me wonder.... who's appraisals hold the most juice? I'm thinking moniker, but somebody else may have a different idea.

If you are "forced" as you say, then I wouldn't expect anything beyond reg fee (if that).

Here is another thing to think about. If they are threatening you with a lawsuit and fail to actually file suit, then that is called "barristry", and is itself actionable. A continued threat of suit can be damaging which is why it is actionable. Don't make idle threats.

Marc

 

[abcproductions]

It seems to me that if I am forced to sell this domain back to them...

You are not forced to sell this name back to anyone and they have no claim to this domain.

if i were in your shoes, i would do two things:
1) email them some free legal advice -- tell them to file a lawsuit against the registrar (who they claim did not renew the name) for damages.
2) tell them to kiss my ass and that their threats just cost them a chance of acquiring the name at price less than $10,000.

 

[npcomplete]

...snip...
2) tell them to kiss my ass and that their threats just cost them a chance of acquiring the name at price less than $10,000.

I just love this answer. :hehe:

At this point it is probably just a bunch of people pounding their chests in an attempt to get something for nothing. If it becomes more then let them know that you can counter sue too.

What was the name of that registrar again??? I will remember that.

Marc

 

[Dave_Z]

What was the name of that registrar again?

Globat. And they're a reseller for a registrar.

 

[tricolorro]

I need some advice from some of you guys that have been in this business for a long time. I've been around for a while myself, but I've never seen anything like this before.

I received an offer on one of my domain names a couple days ago through domainsponsor. The offer was far to low ($100) for the quality of name (I think). So I countered higher, not knowing who I was talking to.

I immediately received a counter of $150 and a note saying that this was the final offer and the next step was DMCA. This time it was signed as sent from globat.com

I then asked why is DMCA involved here? I hand regged this name about 4 months ago and never heard from anyone until a few days ago.

My final response from this person (claiming to be from globat) is below:

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

The domain name xxxxxxxxxxxxx.com was registered to another person prior to your registration. The system did not automatically renew his domain name and thus you were able to register it. The prior owner has asked us to get it back for him and pay a fair fee if we have to. If not, he is going to file a Digital Millennium Act violation to ICANN in order to get it back. It is easier for all parties if we just paid the $150.00 and got the domain back.

Let me know your thoughts and thank you for your email.

Best Regards,

Globat.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Is that even legal to take a name that they let expire? It is not a copyright name or anything like that. Just 2 generic words together.

I thought DMCA was to protect companies names not used by shady registrars to steal names from people. I've personally never heard of Globat, but a quick search here and all I can find is bad things about them.

I mean if a person can claim a name back that they used to own just by filing a complaint, then wheres the limit? Can I sell it to somone for $5000 then claim it back?

Even if this is completely legal . . . The registrar should not be the one to set the "Fair Price", I should. Possibly based on an appraisal.

This whole thing sounds fishy to me so that is why I am asking for help here. I think the next thing he's gonna ask is for me to get an appraisal at his website...LOL I know some of you guys have dealt with things like this before.

:hi:

I may be able to shed some light on what is going on.

I made the big mistake of becoming a Globat customer.

There is something extremely wrong with the company.

Even though I paid for domain renewals Globat failed to renew the domains. The domains are set to renew automatically and Globat charges your credit card.

They dropped and someone else grabbed them because they were very decent domains.

This happened several times.

They were domains that I regged but had not yet developed.

They were just parked.

I was online part time then and failed to follow up to make sure that Globat did renew the domains.

Big mistake.

Since Globat was the Registrar, I never received any notice that my domains were in jeopardy.

This is most likely what happened to the person who owned the domain you now have.

Globat sends an email before the renewal date indicating that the domain will be automatically renewed.

He paid Globat for the domain which was supposed to be automatically renewed and Globat failed to do so.

Now he is putting pressure on Globat and Globat is putting pressure on you.

If Globat "lost" your domain(s), you'd be pissed too.

Sad scenario really,

Patrick

 

[abcproductions]

in this case, the former domain owner has a claim against Globat (and i'm sure Globat knows this) so that is why Globat is trying to resolve the situation by "reacquiring" the domain from the current owner. the current owner has legally registered this name and has no obligation to sell, transfer or do anything else they do not want to do. Globat should have been honest when contacting the current owner, said they were the former registrar who failed to renew the name for their client and would like to purchase it back at a price fair and acceptable to the current owner. instead, they decided to bully with threats so that is why i recommend telling them to get lost unless they are willing to pay a premium for it.

by the way kellyandbryan, if they ever do make you an acceptable offer, be sure to use an escrow service of your choice at their expense.

 

[kellyandbryan]

in this case, the former domain owner has a claim against Globat (and i'm sure Globat knows this) so that is why Globat is trying to resolve the situation by "reacquiring" the domain from the current owner. the current owner has legally registered this name and has no obligation to sell, transfer or do anything else they do not want to do. Globat should have been honest when contacting the current owner, said they were the former registrar who failed to renew the name for their client and would like to purchase it back at a price fair and acceptable to the current owner. instead, they decided to bully with threats so that is why i recommend telling them to get lost unless they are willing to pay a premium for it.

by the way kellyandbryan, if they ever do make you an acceptable offer, be sure to use an escrow service of your choice at their expense.

I like your attitude. It is my attitude exactly. I hate bullies. I am going to counter-offer him with more than my first counter :hehe:

One more thing. I am glad this is being discussed here so maybe other people won't ever use Globat. I see this is not their first lost domain.

If you research Globat on google, all you find is ticked off people.

 

[lzy]

Check whois history and perhaps contact the previous owner to resolve matters? Or is this bad advice? :notme:

 

[kellyandbryan]

Should I post this question in the legal section, or can it be moved there? I didn't want to post the same thing twice. I know some forums are crazy about that kinda stuff.

 

[rexvnus]

Hi everyone,

I just open the thread which is my current case, please advise me.

http://www.namepros.com/domain-name-discussion/401827-please-advice.html