Parking has died, long live parking...

[Mike]

This thread is dedicated to the all NPers that have domains parked, to collectively stand up and introduce their "how to fix it" ideas, their concepts, praise, blame.....

Let's pool our posts rather than have them scattered all over the place.
Take this chance to make your voices heard, i'm sure that as the thread grows, that we may get the attention of some of the decision makers.

This is YOUR one-stop-thread concerning Parking is dead, Long live parking!

Let it rip....


IB

Addition:

​

I moved my post from the Parked.com thread into here to give this thread a start. The parked.com thread has become a bit too diluted with general parking issues... So, here goes:

This post is in regards to withdrawing our domains from being parked for a set amount of time. You may call this: The virtual strike
Opposing to us, the domainers, the "esteemed" advertisers have other opportunities that we can't touch. Traditional advertising is still alive and won't go anywhere , anytime soon. Thus, withdrawing our domains from being parked, even collectively pausing our arbitrage campaigns isn't going to do a thing. Thinking about the big dogs, the Rick Schwarz's of the world , Marchex, etc. to be on our side, is a wet dream at best, they'd be losing too much to associate with our small time domains. They're playing in a different class...

Since the domain market in regards to arbitrage and parking has turned as volatile as the stock market, it's equally difficult to gauge, predict and analyze. Therefore, what we need is a model that is Disclosed, Enforced, Controlled.
Unfortunately, that's just another dream that won't come true anytime soon. I don't think that any parking company is ever going to voluntarily disclose their numbers, much less that Google, MSN, Ask, etc. aren't going to disclose what the true value per ad word is.

So, let the best guess scenario continue...

IB

 

[kevinvd]

hi,
i have made an alternative for parking last weeks.
Still developping but i think it deals with some problems
The main idea is to make parking pages with google adsense on it, with your pub-id.
So you see in google your revenue but don't have to pay for hosting, as it is on a forwarding-base. I call it target-pages.
Also you can add your portfolio and then share your portfolio url to others. They can make offers.
What do you think about this idea? I also opened a thread about it in this sections.
Byz
Oh... the url is http://www.sitemerchandise.com
and a little promotalk on http://www.sitemerchandise.com

Pleace note: I'm still developping the help pages and some additional pages (like lost password) but the main thing is running!

Pls leave comments
Now for real bye byez

 

[evilopinions]

The thread is dying ....long live the thread...

 

[RaiderGirl]

I'm not into this "strike" "boycott" thing.

Were all free to make choices in this business, I choose to Park and I'm pleased with the results.

 

[evilopinions]

I'm not into this "strike" "boycott" thing.

Were all free to make choices in this business, I choose to Park and I'm pleased with the results.

Now but for how long...prevention is better than cure...

 

[RaiderGirl]

What's so difficult in disclosing numbers? What's the big risk? Other than letting the domainer know what the value of keywords are, what the parking company and subsequently the domainer is getting paid per click, etc.?
I don't see the problem OTHER than it's finally becoming a leveled playing field which is probably NOT in the best interest of parking companies and feed providers...

Again, i heavily advocate: Transparency, Disclosure and Regulations for Feed Providers and Parking Companies alike.

We all want disclosure of the numbers, unfortunetely I doubt it will ever happen, and even if it did, who would oversee the accuracy?.

NP just released IMODO.com.... Would they agree to disclosure?

 

[ZuraX]

NP just released IMODO.com.... Would they agree to disclosure?

NP owns IMODO? Since when?

 

[exponent]

The thread is dying ....long live the thread...

NEVER! *BUMP*

 

[Mike]

Well, the thread has indeed began to stall a little bit. This may very well be, because we reached the general consensus of what we want from the providers (upstream and parking) and that the missing unity of domainers is what's hurting us in addition.

This thread has stalled in its transition from being a thread that was largely about venting to a thread where solutions are being brought forward and looked at. Unfortunately, it's always easier to point out and think about corrections than actually doing them.
Here is where the "fixers" should take over. The ones with the master plan and the necessary measure of ACTION and EXECUTION.

IB

 

[ZuraX]

Why should a parking company tell us what they make?
Do you ask your boss how much he is making?
Do you ask the local store how much they are making off you?

Did you know most large store chains markup 45% or more?

 

[hitchhiker]

Why should a parking company tell us what they make?
Do you ask your boss how much he is making?
Do you ask the local store how much they are making off you?

Did you know most large store chains markup 45% or more?

Unions do, they know exactly what their employer's margins are . . . Investor's do, 10Q/K are published widely. . . . and STRATEGIC PARTNERS do its call revenue sharing contracts . . .

but, not everyone needs / wants to know. those with a huge portfolio, making an extra 10% could mean $500 a day. . . so I agree, not everyone needs/wants to know. . .

I do . . .

 

[Badger]

Unions do, they know exactly what their employer's margins are . . . Investor's do, 10Q/K are published widely. . . . and STRATEGIC PARTNERS do its call revenue sharing contracts

Im not saying youre wrong, but i dont understand the connection between employees/unions/investors and the relationship domainers have with their parking companies.

At iMODO were counting the clicks ourselves and reporting them and showing the clicks as counted by the feed provider.. And guess what, theres no connection or similarity at all. As providers, we dont know what keyword or link or page or how many clicks gained the "revenue". All we get is [domain] [value].

Giving out the percentage revenue share is fine but most of it, as ive said before , is a guess...

Perhaps parking companies should just pass on the info we have. i.e. your revenue share is X%, domain A earned #value gross, you get #value.. And then domainers will be "I want to know the clicks" etc.

Im sure, if the info up a level was forthcoming this would be passed on. But you all know the reason why its not available..

 

[Mike]

I appreciate you cming here and trying to pump your new parking site but that isnt what this thread is about.

That was a little on the harsh side. In Badger's defense, from the parking industry, he's the only one having enough backbone to stand up and speak, which i believe should be seen as VERY respectable.

Ian, yes, i'd love to know what the numbers are:

your revenue share is X%, domain A earned #value gross, you get #value.. And then domainers will be "I want to know the clicks" etc.

Clicks are reported to us in the stats interfaces as it is. So, what you're suggesting is definitely a step in the right direction and would demonstrate that at least one provider is listening to us.

IB

 

[Badger]

I appreciate you cming here and trying to pump your new parking site but that isnt what this thread is about.

Yeah, thats what im doing, pumping my parking company... The umpteen posts ive already made in this thread without a single mention of iMODO was all just a ruse to get to this point to try and pump my parking company...

There was me thinking i was trying to give insight into the internal dilemmas facing parking companies and why it wouldnt be so easy to give domainers what they ask for - not being sure at any given moment if i was breaking any non disclosure agreement that i personally have signed - and doing this objectively, with no gain to myself whatsoever... But youre right... It was all just a ruse, but thanks for appreciating me coming here to do this...

Clearly there was no point me doing so as obviously you'd know yourself about contractual terms with yahoo being that youve had several 4 hour long conversations with yahoo over the past few weeks about getting your own feed.. Which you'll be getting, what did you say, next week or the week after ??

nobody is saying parked directly ay least not me. I have a QT score of 10 according to my account manager 2 days ago yet my click value has dropped for no reason as it has at ALL parking companies. What is it they all went into that closed door meeting at traffic and talked about? I am working on getting a feed from yahoo and hope to have it done in a week or two. I am just going to cut out the middleman. Myself and a few others here and on a couple other forums can make up the 2 million visits a month. I have had 4 hour long conversations with folks at yahoo over the last 3 days. Nothing wrong with a few folks geting their domains together everyone having access to there own real stats and i am sure as it grows there will be even higher revenues as I am able to get more traffic to my domains as well as the guys who end up "in the group" I like parked I like what they do I wish templates were better but right now they are the best thing going so please understand I am not speaking ill of parked directly. park is blaming yahoo and the QT score that would be the motivation for the boycot for a couple days to hurt yahoo NOT PARKED

Im leaving this thread now so, in case we never speak again troopscott, do give Sean Moriarty my best and tell him good luck in his new job at premiumtraffic when you speak to him next..

 

[NameCharger]

If parking companies publicly stated their revenue %, it would create potential antitrust situations that much easier.

 

[evilopinions]

Im not saying youre wrong, but i dont understand the connection between employees/unions/investors and the relationship domainers have with their parking companies.

At iMODO were counting the clicks ourselves and reporting them and showing the clicks as counted by the feed provider.. And guess what, theres no connection or similarity at all. As providers, we dont know what keyword or link or page or how many clicks gained the "revenue". All we get is [domain] [value].

Giving out the percentage revenue share is fine but most of it, as ive said before , is a guess...

Perhaps parking companies should just pass on the info we have. i.e. your revenue share is X%, domain A earned #value gross, you get #value.. And then domainers will be "I want to know the clicks" etc.

Im sure, if the info up a level was forthcoming this would be passed on. But you all know the reason why its not available..

Agree that was insightfull....

So you mean that you do not even receive the no of clicks received on the domain and just the amount...So the click tracking is inhouse..

Also what if there is a sizable difference between what is tracked and what is passed on to you in stats from providers...Is that adjusted as cpc...

Ian , I appreciate you continuous involvement in the thread and understand if you do not wish to participate here any further...You can PM me ! or try an answer in some other thread...I will be watching ur posts.. :hehe:

 

[ZuraX]

I still dont see how it is anyones business in knowing what a parkign company makes.

I know what my boss makes on each item but thats because it is a part of my job. If I didnt have to know I wouldnt know or even care. I dont go running to him and say hey I know you make $X a day so I want a raise!

 

[evilopinions]

I still dont see how it is anyones business in knowing what a parkign company makes.

I know what my boss makes on each item but thats because it is a part of my job. If I didnt have to know I wouldnt know or even care. I dont go running to him and say hey I know you make $X a day so I want a raise!

That my friend is the difference between , you working for somebody and you working with somebody..

I guess we as domainer work with somebody and not for somebody...If not why do they call us partner...fancy word eh ? "our parthner program ensures........ ? "

 

[ZuraX]

I park most of my domains but I dont care what the parkign company makes.
If you are so worried why not make your own parking system and then youll know?

 

[evilopinions]

I park most of my domains but I dont care what the parkign company makes.
If you are so worried why not make your own parking system and then youll know?

Read the thread again...

No one collectively want to know how much the parking company makes...

we want to know that at individual level...no one will ever know how many domains a parking company has parked and how much they are making of it as a whole and no one cared for that even !

 

[OctaneInv]

I still dont see how it is anyones business in knowing what a parkign company makes.

I know what my boss makes on each item but thats because it is a part of my job. If I didnt have to know I wouldnt know or even care. I dont go running to him and say hey I know you make $X a day so I want a raise!

Quite possibly the best post in this thread.

It should make no difference what they make, and what you make. besides, if you did know what they make, would you honestly do anything different? Would you really make it a big deal? No. You would still park there, you would still complain you aren't making enough, and you would still not be any happier.

The world has became far too of a greedy, nosey, place.

Zura, rep+ for you.

-Octane

 

[Mike]

Alright folks, this thread is taking on a trend of hostility and starts going in the wrong direction. What we should be concerned with is how to make the situation better, not how to be defusing each other's interests.

ZuraX: If you don't believe that you don't have the right to know what you're truly worth, that's perfectly fine. I on the other hand, many others do believe that we have a valid request when we ask for clarity and transparency about the value of our domains. As EvilOpinions already stated, we're partners, not employees of parking companies. As a partner, or in this case, supplier of revenue FOR the parking company, i believe that we're very well entitled to know what we're generating FOR them and what our subsequent cut is.
It's not about pointing fingers or disagreements about the factual value, it's a problem with not knowing anything at all about the values.
Example: If a parking provider tells me:
The keyword is worth: XX
Your click generated: $8
We keep: $2
You get: $6
Then i know what i'm worth, i know what the keyword is worth, i can make needed adjustments to increase revenue and i'm not going to start screaming about the parking company's cut. If i dislike the split, i have options to leave, just as i do today. Granted, the above example is a super simplified one, in all reality i'd expect more information than that, but it outlines what this thread is partially about.
Why would i ignore the fact that a parking provider is generating money THROUGH and WITH me? It'd be foolish and unwise not to ask for complete clarity as the information gained can contribute to improvements, better target group approach and overall MORE revenue through increased clicks. In the end, if you're still with me, you'll realize that through disclosure, we could ALL gain more profit. Right now, we're guessing, and that's not in anyone's best interest.
The big shots, the Rick Schwartz' of the world, have no problem to negotiate their best terms. I'm certain that he knows what his keywords are worth, what the parking company generates through him and what his cut of the revenue is. He'd be insane not to push for the complete run down of numbers, as ever single day in his domainer life generates thousands of dollars.
In all actuality, this is what the common domainer should be able to do as well. While most of us are not the proud owner of Poker.com, Sex.com or even any other extremely valuable domain, we're making it up in numbers.

In regards to "boycotts", strikes and such: No one is calling for a strike, what's been called for is unity under domainers. We're all on our own, Namepros and a few other forums are the only meeting places we have on a daily basis. A unity would give us the needed power to influence the market to better the situation. In the end that would mean more profits for parking companies and the individual domainer alike. Is it a project that can easily be done? Not at all, it would require some major efforts to attain acceptable results. However, i see Google, Yahoo, MS, etc. go through extraordinary lengths to generate their billions, while we're sitting in our comfortable office chairs, passing on the opportunity to do the same. Ultimately, upstream providers and parking providers alike, are only doing what we enable them to do. At this time, since we're not setting any limits, boundaries, expectations and trends, they're left to do whatever they feel is right, with complete and utter disregard to the domainers well being.
Granted, there are a few companies that make a concerted effort to listen to domainers, iModo, Parked.com and Bodis to name the top 3 that come to mind, and while these companies are starting to move in the right direction, we're still not anywhere near where we could or need to be.

Simultaneously, ZureX, you mentioned, that you don't care what the parking company makes? I'm sure you do care how much you're making. What if someone told you that you could potentially make 30% more than what you're making today? Would you be interested? I'm guessing you would be. Unfortunately, since you don't know the numbers in the background, you have NO clue how much you're really worth.
No one said you have to negate the parking companies income through your domains, but if you were to find out that you're getting less than you feel that you'd deserve, i'm relatively certain that you'd be having a quick change of mind. The same goes of course, for the above mentioned opportunities to adjust, focus and direct your keywords and efforts towards a well susceptible audience, commonly referred to as "Target Group".

Last but not least, i was hoping to see more parking providers taking part in this thread as the original intention was to build a repository of thoughts, suggestions and future directives. Badger was the only one that took the opportunity to speak, if he mentioned iModo in the process, then he's done that rightfully so. I have no problems with self promotion, provided that we're listened to and that our posts are being taken in consideration. The nature of a forum dictates that he would have had to read our posts to adequately respond to them, thus, from all parking providers, he has been the only one to make a concerted effort to contribute.

Let's continue on a constructive note, invite your parking representatives to look at this thread and to contribute.
Some may say that i'm naive to believe that such a thread will indeed change anything; my answer to this: If we don't start somewhere, we might as well conceit to the fact that we're going to continue to throw money away and contribute to someone else's wealth.

IB

 

[ZuraX]

I dont care what I make because I ran a PPC search site. I know for a fact that many of the "clicks" were either cheaters, search bots, other types of bots, worthless traffic from people from countries that most advertisers wont pay for, etc.....

Just because you got an $8 click doesnt entitle you to that $8. What if it was a guy in China clicking an ad for a place that only sells to the UK? Do you expect that UK business to actually pay for that click?

 

[DnPresident]

Fraud is Fraud

Very well written and informative IntelBank....Something some people are not saying much about is the fact that we are not hourly employees at the mercy of an employer. Most parking companies refer to us as partners and tell us exactly what percentage we will earn from the opening of our account and some of us even get the parking companies to agree to higher percent than they offer new account holders/partners.

Of course it would be nice to know for sure you were earning the full % agreed upon, to see the numbers and really have the feel of being a partner.

Big dogs at the parking services SAY it's against terms between them and their feed providers to disclose revenue but yet they tell us what percent we will be making. If you tell me I'm getting 50% of the revenue earned, aren't you telling me what you earned?

I guess if you have agreed to a specific percentage of revenue and if a feed provider or parking company does eventually have to open their books. If the domain owners found out they were getting less than the agreed upon amount, Either the parking company would have to eventually through a court order pay out ALL the BACK PAY that was DUE or the owner would likely end up in prison for a few years.

Fraud is Fraud and when you advertise that you are paying a particular percentage of the earned revenue, I hope the parking companies are smart enough to up hold to the agreement but until the books are open.....Who really knows but the parking companies?

Why would i ignore the fact that a parking provider is generating money THROUGH and WITH me? It'd be foolish and unwise not to ask for complete clarity as the information gained can contribute to improvements, better target group approach and overall MORE revenue through increased clicks. In the end, if you're still with me, you'll realize that through disclosure, we could ALL gain more profit. Right now, we're guessing, and that's not in anyone's best interest.
i was hoping to see more parking providers taking part in this thread

 

[evilopinions]

Mike , very very spot on.

I dont care what I make because I ran a PPC search site. I know for a fact that many of the "clicks" were either cheaters, search bots, other types of bots, worthless traffic from people from countries that most advertisers wont pay for, etc.....

Well I must say that you need to see some quality traffic domains still ! Some domains have very very high % ctr converting much more than what they are paid for....

Just because you got an $8 click doesnt entitle you to that $8. What if it was a guy in China clicking an ad for a place that only sells to the UK? Do you expect that UK business to actually pay for that click?

If an $8 click is charged 8$ by the top providers like yahoo and google , I believe we have all the rights to that $ 8.

Also a click is charged $8 because the rate at which that converts back is in terms of thousands..What I am saying is a click would only be charged substantially if there is avery high chance of conversion or return...If a guy is selling something in UK , a click from china would never be charged that substantially...


I think what we now should concentrate on is trying to get something definite in place..a solution , or even a small movement should begin...I have no doubts that this will catch momentum....

 

[ZuraX]

Yahoo charges $8 to advertiser.
Yahoo pays Parking company 50% = $4.
Parking pays Domainer 50% = $2.

If your names are so great why dont you just eliminate the middle mad?