ICANN Moves Against Domain Tasting

[jmcc]

ICANN has finally moved against Domain Tasting:
http://www.icann.org/minutes/prelim-report-23jan08.htm
Section 5 and 6.

Basically the Add Grace Period (the five day period during which a newly registered domain can be deleted without cost) is being removed. Any domain registered will have to be paid for. However the problem is when this move will be implemented. This, coupled with Google's real move, may signal the end for domain tasting.

Regards...jmcc

 

[HiSoC8Y]

Good move

domain tasting isn't a good think in this market

 

[labrocca]

About time...domain tasting might just place domaining back into the light. Much of the tasting that does occur is Trademark names and typo variations.

 

[shockie]

wow. i'm not a fan of tasting either but i'd rather they hike up the fees (for example, refund only half back) than to completely remove the grace period.

 

[TheBulldog]

All they agreed to was a fee, what appears to be .25 cents, to be imposed and enforced on names dropped during the grace period.

If you think .25 cents is going to stop the practice, think again. It will slow it down, but it won't stop it.

Also, it is asking for open discussion and a vote on the measure. Do you honestly think that registrars that do this will vote for it? Hardly likely. Heck, the guy from NetSol had to leave the meeting during the discussion. So I would be shocked if a group of his peers, who just haven't been caught yet, are going to agree.

It was fairly clear that none of them wanted to just remove the 5 day grace period.

 

[jmcc]

All they agreed to was a fee, what appears to be .25 cents, to be imposed and enforced on names dropped during the grace period.

If you think .25 cents is going to stop the practice, think again. It will slow it down, but it won't stop it.

It has had a very serious effect on domain tasting in .org already. The PIR (.org Registry) changed the rules in June and the effect was quite visible. Almost the entire drop of .org domains were being tasted prior to the introduction. The effect on some tasters' nameservers was amazing. They went from large numbers of .org domains to none at all.

Regards...jmcc

 

[TheBulldog]

I understand your point, I just don't think it will have as large an impact as people think.

If they really wanted to have an impact it would work like this: If you don't pay for your name by the expiration date, it drops back into the available pool. Period. No grace period, no outrageous registrar hold and auctions, nothing, just back to available.

Then on top of that, when you register a name you have only a 24 hour grace period during which time the name will not be available for propagation. It will sit in a "hold" status.
If you call to cancel, and it will take a phone call from an actual person, then the charge is $5 per name dropped.

Make those the rules and a lot of the silly crap that goes on would halt. Then I think maybe domaining as a job/career/whatever would suddenly stop being looked at as vampires.

As long as the registrars are allowed to continue the manipulation, you can bet they will. A .25 cent fee on companies is one thing. Make the registrars stop their crap, and we suddenly have a whole new level playing field.

 

[gawnd]

I have to agree with jmcc - you can see the fee had an impact in .org. This is certainly a move in the right direction.

 

[jmcc]

I understand your point, I just don't think it will have as large an impact as people think.

I think it will. But that's based on watching the effect in .org in the last six months or so. At a guess, between five and ten million domains are tasted in .com at any time. The effect of the Dell's legal action against those taster/kiter registars has had a stabilising effect on .com and .net. The growth swings are not as wild now.

If they really wanted to have an impact it would work like this: If you don't pay for your name by the expiration date, it drops back into the available pool. Period. No grace period, no outrageous registrar hold and auctions, nothing, just back to available.

The problem with that is that there is a historical database of domains and the deletion date can be extrapolated from the date that the domain first appeared in the zone. It would take years for the historical knowledge of domain registrations dates to filter out of such a system.

Make those the rules and a lot of the silly crap that goes on would halt. Then I think maybe domaining as a job/career/whatever would suddenly stop being looked at as vampires.

Well this move will help the image of domaining.

As long as the registrars are allowed to continue the manipulation, you can bet they will. A .25 cent fee on companies is one thing. Make the registrars stop their crap, and we suddenly have a whole new level playing field.

Perhaps introducing rules against warehousing might level the playing field but the problem is that any system can be exploited. The trick is to make it too expensive to exploit on a large scale so that the problem can be contained. This is what I think that ICANN is trying to do.

Regards...jmcc

 

[TheBulldog]

Jmcc, I guess my personal thought is regardless of the short term effects, the long term benefits of an overhaul of the entire process is needed.

From end to end. That is just my opinion.

 

[DotWeekly]

I have to agree with jmcc - you can see the fee had an impact in .org. This is certainly a move in the right direction.

On a normal basis, .com domains get a great deal more traffic then .org's. Plus the click threw rate on .com's is higher etc.

Having the ICANN fee of 20 cents nonrefundable, will only take a "cut" out of the tasters profit, not stop it. It will also just add more money to ICANN's bank account.

The AGP does not need to be longer then 24 hours, in this time, the registrars could simply not allow anything on the page, by having a standard DNS that is a blank page and can not be changed for 24 hours from purchase! That would STOP tasters. Remember, the AGP is in place for people who made a typo or registered a TM domain without knowing the TM was in place etc. These type of people can wait 24 hours to use there domain name.

This was a big win for tasters and really did not help domainers out at all. imo

I also forgot to add... with Google doing there thing, will not fully help, as there are other providers like Yahoo, Ask etc.

Even if all the add providers stopped ads from being on a domain that is less then 5 days old, how would that stop Forwading the Traffic to a domain that is more then 5 days old? They Cant!

 

[Rebies]

It did not help domineers for an all together different reason. There is going to be more surplus of domain names, meaning aftermarket values will drop. Yes, premium.com's won't change in value so much, but your second tier .coms will go down in value.

On a more related note.. this news seems very questionable about what is happening. I see no definitive reason to believe there will be a full price on the domain, or even a $0.20 fee. Can anyone clarify what this means?

 

[jehnidiah]

Digg the article: http://digg.com/tech_news/ICANN_Moves_Against_Domain_Tasting

 

[Prof. Goldbloom]

The fact is, this move is going to stop mass tasting and kiting...there's no doubt about it. The problem with tasting was never with those domainers OR registrars who were making mistakes. Nor was it a problem with people grabbing a number of domains in order to see if they were any good before dropping them.

The problem was with registrars who were automatically picking up millions of domains and then dropping the worthless ones...and, of course, the kiters.

25 pennies per domain name WOULD stop it cold. Even if they were only doing 100,000 names, it would still cost them $25 K. And most of the names would be worthless.

People might still do it, but it wouldn't be automated. And this WOULD level the playing field some.

I say Peanut Butter and Jelly to ICANN for stepping up to bat when Verisign wouldn't.

 

[Dave_Z]

Basically the Add Grace Period (the five day period during which a newly registered domain can be deleted without cost) is being removed.

That's one way to interpret it. Another is to read exactly what the link says,
but I'll include what's "essentially" the gist of it:

THEREFORE, the Board resolves (2008.01.04) to encourage ICANN's budgetary process to
include fees for all domains added, including domains added during the AGP,
and encourages community discussion involved in developing the ICANN budget,
subject to both Board approval and registrar approval of this fee.

A voice vote was taken of all Board Members present and the motion was approved by a vote of 13-0.

There is nothing there stating the Add/Grace Period will be removed. The part
in bold is what it exactly states.

However, I agree this can make it more costly and less financially beneficial in
the long run to engage in domain tasting...unless someone figured out a way
how to still make it work.

Now ICANN's next challenge is to consult VeriSign on their contract about this
item. Expect the worst.

 

[TheBulldog]

I agree and say exactly what I said before, but with more ideas.....

Let's say a taster registers 100K domains. It costs him 25K. As long as he makes 25K from ads, clicks, sales, whatever, then he loses nothing. And that is likely to happen.

Again, the only way to make domain tasting go away is to stop domain tasters from being able to measure traffic or ads.

Give them 24 hours with no access to ads or stats. The whole intent of the rule was to give people who did a silly reg, or let's face it, a drunk reg, some time to delete.

So they get 24, and they have to make an actual phone call to delete. If that doesn't stop the tasting, I don't know what will.

 

[binaryman]

This is just the beginning of the end of domaining folks. Next thing that's coming is that parking of domains will be banned. You must either have a proper site and not infringe any trademarks or nothing at all. Parking a domain will normally infringe on somebody's legit site and that legit site does not have to have a registered TM either. If they have been in business long enough they automaticly aquire rights and any domain that is just parked can never aquire such rights. Domaining is getting a reputation as a sleasy business and registering a domain should require proof of the owners intent and content and rights to that content. If you cant proof such the domain must not be allowed to be registered. Also selling of domains for a profit should be banned. Only the registries should be allowed to sell domains and that at the normal prevailing going rates. Developed sites are another matter of course and will need some other rules and regulations.

 

[kektex]

ICANN Moves To Disable Domain Tasting

Well apparently ICANN is going to do something about domain tasting:
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/01/30/0347216
http://www.icann.org/minutes/prelim-report-23jan08.htm

It´s a pity that some companies abused this system so badly it had to come to this.
I have used Moniker´s domain delete feature when I get second thoughts about a domain I just regged.

 

[squid]

As not having any experience with changing my mind after a domain purchase and only being annoyed by the network solutions stealing domains thing, i think this is a great idea.

 

[edit]

I hope the companies that made a bundle of cash on this saved their money lol. Luckily in the end I think this will mean more chances for the 'little guy' to score some exipred domains.

 

[Pred]

:kickass: :kickass:

better late than never

 

[domainerph]

Levelling the playing field. Bring those bulldozers in..

 

[hawkeye]

Yippee Kayee!!! About time they did something on this!!

 

[kektex]

As not having any experience with changing my mind after a domain purchase and only being annoyed by the network solutions stealing domains thing, i think this is a great idea.

This has only happened to me twice. Once I thought about it better and deleted the domain about 6 hours later.
Another time I registered a domain for a friend for his business and about a day later he thought of a better name and I just deleted the previous one.

I also hate what NetSol and domain kiters are doing. I just think it sucks it had to come to this because of a few individuals. But something had to be done I guess...

 

[labrocca]

Next thing that's coming is that parking of domains will be banned. You must either have a proper site and not infringe any trademarks or nothing at all.

One can only hope.