How many idn you have?

[tansks]

How many has been develop and how many are parked?

 

[domainstosell]

Have you ever done a percentage comparison of those numbers? :blink:

Yes, and if you do, it will show that the Chinese market is a growth market. I will always rather invest reg fees in keyword generics and strong keyword combos in a growth market than in an inundated market, where even 3-letter domains that mean nothing are expected to sell for thousands...

 

[VV]

You read thru the IDN forum and you thought my Sig deserved a responce are you serious ?

Yes. It really stood out to me as extreme. I stand by what I said.

thegenius1, no I've certainly never been a banned member, why, have you?

Calm down, you seem to be getting emotional. I have just given a few thoughts on this topic.

All good.

 

[DNWizardX9]

Have you ever done a percentage comparison of those numbers? :blink:

yep easily,

Internet usage in China is growing at a much faster rate than that of the U.S.

IE 6 didn't support IDNs so most Chinese didn't know about them. Now they will learn that IE 7 supports them.

Also there is evidence that even before IE 7 people were typing words in their native language with the .com extension on overture.

 

[VV]

Some interesting points JeffM2. Thanks for presenting them.

where even 3-letter domains that mean nothing are expected to sell for thousands...

Two quick additions to that statement, if I may be so bold.

You said "expected to sell for thousands". To be fair and complete you should add that they "DO sell for thousands". Every day. All over the world. 3 letter ascii domains sell for thousands of dollars.

Secondly, they DO mean something. They are called "acronyms". Many companies use them.

I don't think this is a direction that is going to provide IDN folks much satisfaction in a debate. The ascii domain market is THE market. It's what makes the domain world go around, and what drives the web. Sure there is room for IDN names too, and they will carve out their own niche, but it seems there is a lot of exaggerated, incomplete information being dished out in order to create buzz around them. I think the IDN folks should focus on building up their domains instead of attempting to tear down others.

You can be successful without being #1. Trying to go after ascii domains is futile.

Before trying to take over the entire world, maybe the IDN owners should just focus on making a few nice IDN sales first, and try to help establish the market.

Talk is cheap. Sales do wonders. People will listen when you can show the numbers.

I didn't intend for that last line to rhyme. It just happened.

 

[AdoptableDomains]

"China has a billion people"

I keep reading this but a fact that often gets overlooked by the people saying it, is that most of those people are not even ON the Internet. So it really doesn't matter whether you have a magic talking keyboard that speaks all languages and glows in the dark, if the people aren't online.

good point...or can't afford to buy the stuff they're making to ship here, because they are making a per capita income of about $1500 a year with a comparable purchasing power of $5900. Source

China
Population: 1,313,973,713
Telephone lines in use: 311,756 million ( <2.5% of population, 5% if you add wireless)
Internet Users: 111 million (8% of population)
Internet Hosts (server computers): 187,508 (.00014%)
Employment: 49% Agriculture

95% of the country doesn't even have a telephone even for dial up connection, and 90+% does not yet use the interent. The population is huge, but the spending power per capita is not.

 

[VV]

AdoptableDomains thank you for posting that.

China is not the world's supermarket that some try and make it seem.

 

[DNWizardX9]

good point...or can't afford to buy the stuff they're making to ship here, because they are making a per capita income of about $1500 a year with a comparable purchasing power of $5900. Source

China
Population: 1,313,973,713
Telephone lines in use: 311,756 million ( <2.5% of population, 5% if you add wireless)
Internet Users: 111 million (8% of population)
Internet Hosts (server computers): 187,508 (.00014%)
Employment: 49% Agriculture

95% of the country doesn't even have a telephone even for dial up connection, and 90+% does not yet use the interent. The population is huge, but the spending power per capita is not.

Even 10% of the population using the internet amounts to 120 million (for a 1.2 billion country)

People in America didn't make what they make today in 1960. Even a few years can make a big difference.

 

[mulligan]

AdoptableDomains thank you for posting that.

China is not the world's supermarket that some try and make it seem.

Practically everything you own or wear was made in China.
You think your Nike sneakers were made in California.
Where do you think your motherboard came from? Do wal-mart make these things...
The rubber that's on the tyres of your truck, Came from a Wisconsin rubber plantation..

Fact is America imports a lot more from China than it exports to the rest of the world.
If you think that the Chinese are gonna remain offline then you are misinformed at best.
And when they get online enmass do you think they will want to search for things in English? I think not

 

[DNWizardX9]

We make other nations rich as well....

The profit from gasoline not only goes to BP, Mobil etc but also to Arab nations.

The stuff we buy that is made in China helps the Chinese economy.

These countries are becoming stronger due to our everyday business transactions. It is inevitable that these powers are showing their true colors.

China will overtake the U.S. eventually.

 

[domainstosell]

You said "expected to sell for thousands". To be fair and complete you should add that they "DO sell for thousands". Every day. All over the world. 3 letter ascii domains sell for thousands of dollars.

Secondly, they DO mean something. They are called "acronyms". Many companies use them.

True, maybe I should have been more clear: There are LLL.coms that mean practically nothing, or are counting on a longshot sale to an end user who happens to have ZZX as an acronym (for example), that are still expected to sell for thousands.

Before trying to take over the entire world, maybe the IDN owners should just focus on making a few nice IDN sales first, and try to help establish the market.

Talk is cheap. Sales do wonders. People will listen when you can show the numbers.

Here is some info on sales: http://idntools.net - Click on the IDN Sales link.

Also: nice rhyme.

 

[VV]

Also: nice rhyme.

Hehe thank you.

I'm glad the mood has lightened. We are all in this business with the same end goals, and there is room for all of us. Sometimes I enjoy playing the devil's advocate, it's not meant to be rude.

Thanks for your posts domainstosell and jeffm2.

 

[AdoptableDomains]

I'm not knocking IDN's in general. However it does take a special zeal to put the research, effort, and time into it to know what your are doing. More power to you if you can and want to do that. However, the average trader here will probably make fewer mistakes in English or even spanish than working with Asain, Russian, Indian, or Eastern European character sets. I see instruction manuals from china all the time that trash the english language and grammar rules because the writer does not speak it fluently or uses a mechanical form of translation. The same thing can happen in foreign grammer and character sets when we try to make them up. Add puny code, the fact that it's difficult to type those things for most of us using arrogant ASCII based keyboard translators, and you have a pretty big mine field to overcome. Some domain registrants may not know that arabic read right to left, and most non-english use adjectives and adverbs on the other end of the word they describe. The equivalent of registering housewhite.com instead of whitehouse.com, leading to what Chinese might classify as worth less than reg fee picks.

Also, Yes, the Gross income of China is greater than that of the US. However, they have less disposable income to spend on non-necessities besides food, shelter, and health care. If your income were $6,000 would you spend it on a computer, WindowsVista with IE7, and an internet connection with government filtered content; or would you improve your modest home, and buy clothing and food and maybe replace their muskox with a tractor? Chinese are growing consumers, but even at the 9% growth rate, it may take a couple decades for them to catch up to the western world. China is still primarly a communist country.

Japan may be a different story, but I'd bet Japanese are ahead of the game enough to beat non-native speakers to the punch on worthwhile IDN names, since they can actually afford to invest in the domains themselves. However, they also seem to understand the importance of speaking/writing English to tap into the most lucrative markets oustide their own.

Additionally, if I were chinese and wanted to enter domains in my own character set, I'd probably also want to use the chinese TLD instead of .com. The Chinese people being new to the interent may not have the perceived need to be on .com which is primarily an English/Western world marketing format. They can possible leap past that notion, just as they are leaping past the notion of wired phones in every home and going direct to wireless. I would think companies wanting to sell to the billions of chinese would want them in the com.cn domain to target the local market. I also wouldn't be surprised if China were to IDNize the .cn TLD itself to chinese characters, which I don't think is in the plans for .com or the gTLD's. Why should the name be in local characters only to be followed by ".com".

 

[thegenius1]

Japan may be a different story, but I'd bet Japanese are ahead of the game enough to beat non-native speakers to the punch on worthwhile IDN names, since they can actually afford to invest in the domains themselves. However, they also seem to understand the importance of speaking/writing English to tap into the most lucrative markets oustide their own.

I also wouldn't be surprised if China were to IDNize the .cn TLD itself to chinese characters, which I don't think is in the plans for .com or the gTLD's. Why should the name be in local characters only to be followed by ".com".

Please Please Please Stop posting opinions and comments with no facts you are clearly out of touch with IDN reality. I will not elaborate because i dont have time to educate a person who is not willing to educate themselves before they run there mouth

"A wise man told me dont argure with fools because people at a distance cant tell who is who "

 

[domainstosell]

Some good points. I'll let someone with a bit better technical understanding comment on the IDN.IDN issue that you brought up.

It is true that the research takes more time and has a greater risk of error. But in my experience, the reward far outweighs the risk. I got into the game late, but you can see from my sig that I have some pretty decent names (IMHO), and those are just a very small sampling.

I know we got on the China topic (and I do believe in the large growth potential of Chinese domains), but I think it is also very important to diversify. I was able to register some decent generic Russian names and good combos, even at my late start (I started looking at IDNs at the end of April this year), and I think the Russian market has huge potential. I was also able to get some decent Japanese names, although I had to be a lot more speculative in those, so time will tell. I even went into Persian (the numbers one-ten in .com and .net and the numerals 4-10 in .com and .net), Arabic, Portuguese and a couple of German.

I am far ahead of the game as far as cost is concerned due to selling a few names, so I'm not worried about the potential risk at this point.

 

[DNWizardX9]

I'm not knocking IDN's in general. However it does take a special zeal to put the research, effort, and time into it to know what your are doing. More power to you if you can and want to do that. However, the average trader here will probably make fewer mistakes in English or even spanish than working with Asain, Russian, Indian, or Eastern European character sets. I see instruction manuals from china all the time that trash the english language and grammar rules because the writer does not speak it fluently or uses a mechanical form of translation. The same thing can happen in foreign grammer and character sets when we try to make them up. Add puny code, the fact that it's difficult to type those things for most of us using arrogant ASCII based keyboard translators, and you have a pretty big mine field to overcome. Some domain registrants may not know that arabic read right to left, and most non-english use adjectives and adverbs on the other end of the word they describe. The equivalent of registering housewhite.com instead of whitehouse.com, leading to what Chinese might classify as worth less than reg fee picks.

Also, Yes, the Gross income of China is greater than that of the US. However, they have less disposable income to spend on non-necessities besides food, shelter, and health care. If your income were $6,000 would you spend it on a computer, WindowsVista with IE7, and an internet connection with government filtered content; or would you improve your modest home, and buy clothing and food and maybe replace their muskox with a tractor? Chinese are growing consumers, but even at the 9% growth rate, it may take a couple decades for them to catch up to the western world. China is still primarly a communist country.

Japan may be a different story, but I'd bet Japanese are ahead of the game enough to beat non-native speakers to the punch on worthwhile IDN names, since they can actually afford to invest in the domains themselves. However, they also seem to understand the importance of speaking/writing English to tap into the most lucrative markets oustide their own.

Additionally, if I were chinese and wanted to enter domains in my own character set, I'd probably also want to use the chinese TLD instead of .com. The Chinese people being new to the interent may not have the perceived need to be on .com which is primarily an English/Western world marketing format. They can possible leap past that notion, just as they are leaping past the notion of wired phones in every home and going direct to wireless. I would think companies wanting to sell to the billions of chinese would want them in the com.cn domain to target the local market. I also wouldn't be surprised if China were to IDNize the .cn TLD itself to chinese characters, which I don't think is in the plans for .com or the gTLD's. Why should the name be in local characters only to be followed by ".com".

It makes no sense to respond to your post as you're obviously under informed about the issue here. You have done no research and your argument is nonsense..

 

[VV]

Never mind. Not worth it.

 

[Grrilla]

China will overtake the U.S. eventually.

I am an American and I agree w/ this statement basrd on what I have read in the Economist and other respected manline financial publications that forcast China as being the world's leading economy in as soon as 15-20 yrs. Putting xenophobic tendencies aside one could not arrive at any other logical conclusion considering China's land mass, population and available natural resources. It does not necessarily follow that having the world's #1 economy means that China will have the highest standard of living or world's best quality of life. There are several countries where the people have a better quality of life than what is, currently, being enjoyed by the people who compse the general population of the United States. Italians, for instance, have a daily one to four oclock "siesta", during which all of the shops close down and families meet up at home to have their large meal toether and than relax, read a book or take an afternoon nap. This is an incredible way to live and something that most Americans who are on the production treadmill can only dream of. Having a a job where month long vacations and 4 day work weeks were the norm, as is the case in Germany, for instance, would be the envy of most working Americans. Having a high quality of life is not isolated to industrialized nations, either.

During my travels to several of the so-called "Third World Nations" I experienced a joie de vivre and general "laid back"attitudes among the people that I, rarely, experience on a regular basis or out in the open in the US. Certainly, the citizens of other countries rich and poor have their own set of problems. The lack of emplyment oppurtunities in nations that w/ weak economic infrastructures and modest natural resources can cause tremendous problems for the indiduals living in those countries.

The father of one of the Arab families that I lived with worked on a Moroccan freighter for 4 months of the year because 4 months wages were enough for him and his family to squeak by on for a year and because the Maroccan government had divided the position into 3- 4 month jobs so that 2 other fathers could, also, have jobs and be able to support their families. These people did not have alot - a single knife was the only tool in the house and was used for everything from Fatima chopping vegetables, to Ahmad tightening a screw that had come loose on a door panel to helping me uncork an "illegal" bottle of wine for them, after which, Cherif would chop and sift some less "illegal" kief for me.

We had a summer of incredible evenings together inside a household that, by American standsrds, would be considered to be at poverty level. And wow! did we laugh! In traditional Arab fashion, the men all ate together, first, and it was not uncommon for a Grandfather, a brother, and a couple of cousins to, miraculusly, appear a minute or two before Fatima brought out the meal. (The nucleat family is still is alive and well in much of the world) Of particular amusement to all of the men were my antics at trying to roll a ball of couscous in one hand and flick it into my mouth. Early on, the oldest man sitting at the table, (the table was round and a pillows on the floor were our seats), rolled me up a few, lest nobody would have been avle to eat due to eveyone laughing their a~~es off at a grown man who didn't know how to feed himself, but before long, I grew up and was able, once again, to feed myself w/o grandpa's help.

The point that I am trying to make w/ my long winded tale is that what constitutes #1 and what is meant by being the #1 economy can mean many different things. China will be the worlds leading economy. But take it from me, a guy who was brought up in a country and has never known anything other than being #1- it ain't all that it is cracked up to be. You win the bragging rights but you also receive a score of other unexpected goodies that comes w/ the package. I may or may not live long enough to see China take the top spot but I wish them the best of luck once they do hit it. :tu: :tu: (oops! my smileys got shuffled on me- 2 thumbs up is what I meant)

 

[thegenius1]

Disagreement or debate is fine. It's good. It's healthy.

Its Not healthy when people run there mouth withought having a clue of what they are talking about... And i mean not a clue he is so far off i could say alot but there is no point i have IDN's to buy , so he only gets a sentence or two , Sorry that i dont want to argue with a person that is bringing up defeated points

 

[AdoptableDomains]

Please Please Please Stop posting opinions and comments...

I can post opinions and comments if I wish. This is not China! In the US we are actually allowed to have opinions and state them publicly. Maybe some of that Chinese communist censorship has rubbed off on you while finding chinese IDN names :imho:

"A wise man told me dont argure with fools because people at a distance cant tell who is who "

You calling me a fool? Okay, I'm not an evangelical self proclaimed IDN "genius", but I'm not a fool. I agree some people may find it hard to tell who is the fool, so maybe he was a wise man. lighten up, this is a freindly place where opinions are generall welcome and people are generally friendly.

I'm not trying to rain on your parade. If you do well with IDN's great! However, some newbies reading all the great things you post about it need to know the whole story, and that it does take research, it is speculative, and you can easilly make mistakes doing it. I'm just pointing out that with every rose bud there are many thorns. May you pick your roses without getting stuck too many times by the thorns.

 

[Grrilla]

​

 

[Rubber Duck]

Truce declared with VV.

BTW, ALL .com domains are ASCII, and only use translation protocols to convert them. Even SE asian character sets still end in .com, .cn, .jp, which looks kind of strange to me.

No, actually very soon most Dot Coms will be IDN. Dot Com really is King!

 

[Rubber Duck]

Truce declared with VV.

 

[VV]

Its Not healthy when people run there mouth withought having a clue of what they are talking about... And i mean not a clue he is so far off i could say alot but there is no point i have IDN's to buy , so he only gets a sentence or two , Sorry that i dont want to argue with a person that is bringing up defeated points

Judging from his portfolio and sales, I think AdoptableDomains has a "clue" about the domain business. Your post is disrespectful towards him and I don't think he deserves it.

People are more willing to listen and learn when the person talking is friendly. Try it!

These rather dumb statements need some clarification and substantiation.

That seemed rude, but I won't let it bother me because I'm a lover not a fighter. But let me remind you, there are plenty of folks thinking the same thing about YOU, and YOUR statements.

It seems that a few of the IDN folks are incapable of discussing or debating a topic without resorting to insults, being rude, or putting labels on everybody. If somebody doesn't believe the same thing you believe, they are "dumb" "arrogant" or you don't have time for them.

very soon most Dot Coms will be IDN.

That comment leaves me speechless....

 

[thegenius1]

Judging from his portfolio and sales, I think AdoptableDomains has a "clue" about the domain business. Your post is disrespectful towards him and I don't think he deserves it.

First off a portfolio or sales does not make you a expert in a field were clearly you dont have a clue ie:

"I also wouldn't be surprised if China were to IDNize the .cn TLD itself to chinese characters, which I don't think is in the plans for .com or the gTLD's. Why should the name be in local characters only to be followed by ".com"."

This guy doesnt even know that China has already done this , let alone how would he know about ICAANs plan to implement .IDN

If you want a newbie to have a whole story please present facts and Not just Made up opinions

"Have they been around long enough to drop? "

I mean this guy thinks IDN's have been around less then a year , clearly to far out of touch to debate with

It seems that a few of the IDN folks are incapable of discussing or debating a topic without resorting to insults, being rude, or putting labels on everybody. If somebody doesn't believe the same thing you believe, they are "dumb" "arrogant" or you don't have time for them.

Personally people are tired of people coming into the IDN Forum talking with No facts, Read-Up and then state your case , but having to call out all your flaws gets pretty iratating

There is nothing to debate:

If you want to debate with yourself ask yourself these questions

http://www.namepros.com/idn-discussion/207009-not-sure-about-idns-ask-yourself.html

If you want to Educate yourself Read this post :

http://www.namepros.com/idn-discussion/208112-idn-facts-by-olney.html

 

[Rubber Duck]

good point...or can't afford to buy the stuff they're making to ship here, because they are making a per capita income of about $1500 a year with a comparable purchasing power of $5900. Source

China
Population: 1,313,973,713
Telephone lines in use: 311,756 million ( <2.5% of population, 5% if you add wireless)
Internet Users: 111 million (8% of population)
Internet Hosts (server computers): 187,508 (.00014%)
Employment: 49% Agriculture

95% of the country doesn't even have a telephone even for dial up connection, and 90+% does not yet use the interent. The population is huge, but the spending power per capita is not.

I suggest you take a course in basic arithmetic. 311m and 756m represent 23% and 57% of the population, which is quite high as you would not necessarily expect each couple to have two phones, or indeed the entire primary school population to have them either.

I can see with such a poor grasp of the numerical art of mathematics you are going to struggle to differentiate between sound investment and poor your cash down the tubes. Good Luck!

AdoptableDomains thank you for posting that.

Truce declared with VV.