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discuss Gun Laws

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Bernard Wright

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This is just a hodgepodge of thoughts. I won't distinguish between good and bad people. I'll focus on peoples' actions.

Bad actors shouldn't have guns for committing acts of violence against innocent people, nor for threatening innocent people with potential violence. It would be nice if society could prevent a bad actor from obtaining the gun used in a bad act.

Good actors should have the right to defend themselves and others against bad actors with necessary force. Such force includes the threat of lethal violence, and the use of lethal violence if necessary.

Bad actors don't have regard for the rule of law when acting in a criminal manner.

Society is comprised of individuals pursuing their own interests. Laws are instated to ensure that individuals' rights are not infringed upon by another person or entity. When an individual infringes upon another individual's rights, there are criminal and civil procedures to deal with such matters, overseen by our governing officials. In extreme cases, when the infringing party is a usurping government, it is up to the citizens to protect their natural freedoms from that government. This happens rarely, but it happens. It is wise for an individual to aspire to maintain his/her own personal sovereignty and ability to protect him/herself from unjust threats.

A good actor is responsible for protecting him/herself and, if desired, other people from threats and acts of violence. When police officers are capable of assisting, assistance is welcomed, but the police's main duty is to maintain law and order, not to protect another individual from immediate threat. The individual's primal concern is his/her own personal safety, and this is a responsibility that lies within every individual when faced with a threat of violence.

A gun is a tool. A gun can do a number of things. Here are three examples.

1. a gun can be used to engage in a violent act.
2. a gun can be used to deescalate/end a violent act.
3. a gun can be used to deescalate/end a threat of violence.

We are all players in society with an interest in pursuing our best interests and defending our well-being. Laws that would take guns away from some bad actors are sure to also result in fewer armed good actors who could deescalate violent and potentially violent situations. Violence is not good. Good actors with guns end violent situations more quickly and effectively than good actors without guns do. There are hundreds of millions of firearms on this planet. A bad actor with the desire to obtain a gun will always have the means to locate a gun. Black markets are real.

Good actors should have the legal right to possess guns in order to protect themselves, and others, from bad actors.
 
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How would it hurt?

Lives saved because someone intervened with a gun is almost zero, as compared with lives lost.

Do you envision the Feds would just start knocking on doors and folks would welcome them inside with a cup of tea before handing over the keys to their safes? And the Feds would somehow comb every nook of every room in the country, collecting 400 million guns.
 
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Do you envision the Feds would just start knocking on doors and folks would welcome them inside with a cup of tea before handing over the keys to their safes? And the Feds would somehow comb every nook of every room in the country, collecting 400 million guns.
No, it would be a buy back program, like Australia.
 
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as far as I know

the right to own a fire gun
is meant to protect the US people
from their government

so they would be able to rescue themselves
in case the government goes crazy

to my knowledge
that won't happen anyway

you won't be able to protect yourself as a citizen
from an evil government
no way

so the core reason is no longer existing


but I'm pretty sure
that there is no way
to convince the US public
to give up their gun's


so get used to shootings
 
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My position is that criminals are not affected by laws. Only law-abiding people are affected by laws.
This doesn't make any sense. Everyone is affected by laws... We go to jail for breaking them.
 
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This doesn't make any sense. Everyone is affected by laws... We go to jail for breaking them.

Fair point, Joe. What I meant to convey, more specifically, is that violent, gun-toting criminals by definition have no regard for gun laws
 
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Fair point, Joe. What I meant to convey, more specifically, is that violent, gun-toting criminals by definition have no regard for gun laws
And drug dealers have no regard for drug laws, yet we have outlawed drugs.
 
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No, it would be a buy back program, like Australia.

That wouldn’t make a dent. Would-be criminals would, at best, sell a gun or two if it were lucrative to do so and always have more to purchase later when they needed. Or they’d weigh the cost/benefit of selling their guns and decline the offer.
 
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That wouldn’t make a dent. Would-be criminals would, at best, sell a gun or two if it were lucrative to do so and always have more to purchase later when they needed. Or they’d weigh the cost/benefit of selling their guns and decline the offer.
You begin by stopping sales. Then you implement buy back programs. Then you say, if you’re caught with specific types of weapons you get locked up.

Shit will stop real quick.
 
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Can you break into a home and threaten the lives of the inhabitants with a bag of cocaine?
 
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Can you break into a home and threaten the lives of the inhabitants with a bag of cocaine?
No, people can willingly buy what may kill them and their children. Same with guns...

But your argument is even more of a reason why guns are terrible. I get to choose my drugs but can’t choose if you break into my house with a gun and harm my family.
 
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You’re right. It’s a terrible reality that some people would do evil to others’ children in their own homes. How do we deal with that reality? A man is outside your home with a gun at 3am. He’s banging on the window, trying to break it. What do you grab?
 
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You’re right. It’s a terrible reality that some people would do evil to others’ children in their own homes. How do we deal with that reality? A man is outside your home with a gun at 3am. He’s banging on the window, trying to break it. What do you grab?
That scenario doesn’t exist, it’s a bill of goods being sold.
 
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Plenty of tragic cases exist. And it’s fair to assume that if a county were to participate in your gun buyback program, the rate of such crimes could increase. ...especially given the drug crisis, continued displacement of workers, etc.

This is an awful story and I will post this one only, with my condolences and respect to the victims. May they Rest In Peace.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...r-death-sentence-commuted-new-state-laws.html
 
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Rare it is. But it is a reality. And no family man’s ability to protect his home and family will ever be swayed by any vote I cast. The same goes for any would-be victim of gun violence. I hope your community never has to endure such tragedy, Keith.
 
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Rare it is. But it is a reality. And no family man’s ability to protect his home and family will ever be swayed by any vote I cast. The same goes for any would-be victim of gun violence. I hope your community never has to endure such tragedy, Keith.
What isn’t rare are the thousands that die each year by homicide, suicide, or accidents via guns.

I’d say we ignore what’s rare and address what’s real.
 
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It’s all real.

But how do we address the problem of gun violence in the US. A buy-back bonanza, you say? That’s the answer?
 
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It’s all real.

But how do we address the problem of gun violence in the US. A buy-back bonanza, you say? That’s the answer?
Buy back options, changes in laws. It should be extremely difficult to buy a weapon. Right now they’re practically given away.
 
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Rare it is. But it is a reality. And no family man’s ability to protect his home and family will ever be swayed by any vote I cast. The same goes for any would-be victim of gun violence. I hope your community never has to endure such tragedy, Keith.
I'm truly and honestly trying to understand how you can say you're open-minded about this topic....
 
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251 Mass shootings this year in the US , thats just plain crazy!
 
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I will state this clearly. I am 100% for any laws that will curb gun violence and make the US safer without infringing upon the freedoms of responsible and well-intentioned gun owners who would use guns for benevolent purposes. I’m yet to read any suggestions as to what those changes in law would entail. One can say “Government should make it happen”, but the question is, how? What policy prescriptions do you have that will achieve this end? By what measure is it reasonable to suggest the proposed laws won’t result in a breaking point that could escalate tensions and increase violence?
 
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