discuss Do you trust the major auction websites?

[equity78]

Simple question, place your vote and feel free to leave a comment expanding on your vote if you like.

There have been many bidding scandals, GoDaddy’s refusal to show bidder id’s etc…

Do you trust GoDaddy Auctions, NameJet, Snapnames and DropCatch when it comes to platform integrity, fraud detection systems in place, etc…?

Please note this vote should only be based on auctions, not registrar or other services included.

 

[Kate]

I trust them as much as the government.

 

[Name Trader]

dropcatch.com (huge domains) bids against their own users. While back-ordering on dropcatch.com, you are only alerting them to the good domains. They will probably bid against you to make you pay top dollar. If you give up, no problem for them, they could bid it to $10,000, they don't pay that, they only pay $8 because it's their platform, they paid reg-fee. IDK why anyone would use them while they pump up the prices on all the domains we try buying. Ditch them IMO, let them buy all the junk on their own, like they often do. Without everyone alerting them to the good domains, hugedomains wouldn't be doing very well.

This is the exact opposite of the truth. HugeDomains are only permitted to bid against you if you buy Discounted Backorder at DropCatch. If you bid a full priced backorder at DropCatch. HugeDomains are excluded from competing against you for the same domain. This is all clearly explained in their ToS.

 

[Name Trader]

By Major Auction Houses I presume you mean Sedo/Afternic/GoDaddy/DropCatch/NameJet/SnapNames. I've had bad experiences with all of them apart from DropCatch.

The absolutely worst examples have been with Afternic/GoDaddy, where you win the domain, you get charged for the domain, they tell you the date when the domain will be in your account, But the domain never appears in your account, and when you ask them why, they simply refund you. And you give up following the domain in the search for the truth, because it is still under transfer via Afternic/NameFind months after you have been refunded. Now if Afternic/NameFind are involved. It can only mean that it was sold by either GoDaddy or Afternic. Sister companies. And never given to me. Who won the auction. They will never tell you the truth about what actually happened. They just refund you and move on.

IMHO. GoDaddy should rethink their strategy in selling these 3rd party registrars expiring portfolios. And start again with those which only sign-up again with a common agreement. This, "we are sorry, because we have to abide by out contract with the registrar". Just doesn't cut the mustard. And they are doing tremendous damage to their expiring domain name auction status, with this excuse.

I can see why they tolerate this. It's principally, that as it stands now, they have a major stranglehold on the expiring domain marketplace. Which would be weakened by tearing up those crappy agreements they have signed with these mostly crappy registrars. Which might leave for a competitor to take over. Which is probably much less desirable to GoDaddy than fixing this crappy mess where they put the blame on the crappy contracts they have signed. This problem won't go away, until every 3rd Party Registrar is working under the same contract. Which should be the first, and most important thing to fix. IMHO. If the 3rd Party Registrar doesn't agree to these standard terms, they should not be allowed to sell their expiring portfolio, at GoDaddy Auctions. Period.

 

[JayT]

dropcatch.com (huge domains) bids against their own users. While back-ordering on dropcatch.com, you are only alerting them to the good domains. They will probably bid against you to make you pay top dollar. If you give up, no problem for them, they could bid it to $10,000, they don't pay that, they only pay $8 because it's their platform, they paid reg-fee. IDK why anyone would use them while they pump up the prices on all the domains we try buying. Ditch them IMO, let them buy all the junk on their own, like they often do. Without everyone alerting them to the good domains, hugedomains wouldn't be doing very well.

 

[imadoer]

I DO NOT TRUST THEM IN A HOUSE.
I DO NOT TRUST THEM WITH A MOUSE.
I DO NOT TRUST THEM HERE OR THERE.
I DO NOT TRUST THEM ANYWHERE.
I DO NOT TRUST GD DOMAIN AUCTIONS
I DO NOT TRUST THEM, SAM-I-AM.

 

[Name Trader]

i trust: GD only

voted NO

The worst offenders. IMHO. Actually. This is a TRUST question. The question is too broadly asked. IMHO. There are many categories "Auction House". They can rank differently in each category. There are Expiring Domain Auctions, Dropping Domain Auctions, Domains being Actioned by their owners. To name just 3. It is possible or any company to rank differently in all these categories.

For example, IMHO, GoDaddy rank bottom (for TRUST) in the Expiring Domain Category because they are auctioning domains from shoddy registrars, all with different terms and conditions (which PHD decided that was a good idea), which result in the ratio of worst domains rcvd to domains won. GoDaddy make a big deal about caring about their customers. But their actions speak louder than their words. with this ratio. The don't give a flying pig about their customers who don't receive the domains they have won but never receive. If they did, they would ban 3rd Party registrars from using their Auction Platform for selling their domains that they don't deliver, and not make excuses like "we have to abide with the contract our 3rd Party Registrar,here's your money bank, better luck next time". They would also offer compensation. Like for example, a free six month subscription to their DDC for every won domain to every customer who doesn't receive their domain. THAT is at least showing some care about their customers. I do not TRUST them to be looking after my best interests for domains not registered at GoDaddy. They may also be the only Auction House left which POINT BLANK refuse to use Bidder ID's. This no BIDDER ID's is a HUGE TRUST issue. It would be easy for GoDaddy to indicate (with a 1 char column) telling viewers of these auctions were registered at Godaddy or elsewhere. "G" for GoDaddy "blank" for registered elsewhere. But we get told to look them up in the whois. Which is a much cumbersome exercise than watching a G or No G on the screen. It should be in the search criteria too. For full disclosure, GoDaddy get low marks. Which is yet another TRUST issue

For Dropping Domain Auctions. GoDaddy don't even have a market. The best they can do is offer you a Drop Catch Service, which cannot even compete with a GoDaddy Hand Registration. The only domains they catch with this service is only domains NOT picked up by the likes of DropCatch, SnapNames, NameJet, and others, and which are not picked up by their own Hand Registrations. It's so pathetic, it would be funny, if it wasn't for the fact that they allow you can transfer the unfulfilled backorder to another domain. And repeat the cycle. To TRUST them to capture any dropping domain is absolutely absurd.

For Domains auctioned by their owners, registered at GoDaddy. Where they control their own destiny. They do a good job. Which is to be expected. EXCEPT for the lack of BIDDER ID's. Did I mention that NO BIDDER ID's is a HUGE TRUST ISSUE already?

So GoDaddy rate poorly on TRUST issues overall. IMHO.

 

[Kate]

I am surprised how many have issues with auction sites. It is concerning, but also good to see at least some of the auction sites involved on NPs and responding to concerns. I wonder if people have similar concerns with general purpose domain sites like eBay when the auction does not involve domain names, or is it something unique about domain names?

There are big differences:

1. Ebay displays bidder handles, something that most domain auctions sites do but not all of them - GD and Sedo being notable for this. With unique bidder handles you can keep track of user activity and notice suspicious patterns better.
   
2. Ebay shows your trader rating, so you instantly know how trustworthy and established the other users are
   
3. Ebay shows other info like your home country, and when you registered

Now compare Ebay to the auctions sites for domain names

 

[Name Trader]

Sometime in early 2015. I just never went back after I tried a few domains. oh well thanks for letting me know now. I read terms conditions just now and see what u are talking about, they won't bid against you if you pay for the full dropcatch price. I would be afraid to try the discount club though. Whenever I tried catching somewhere else huge domains gets them anyway so was no chance still.

Agreed.

Actually, DropCatch is my #1 choice for drop-catching dropping domains. They have a market leader domination of more than 50% market share, against their 2 biggest rivals SnapNames and NameJet, they are $20 cheaper than these two, and your bid neutralizes HugeDomains as a competitor. If there are no other bids at DropCatch for the domains you backorder. you win the domain outright. Perfect.

The only downside is that if there are 2 or more bidders, the auction go to a public auction, not a private auction for those who pre-bid on the domain. But this is not as bad as it seems. Because if you don't like it, you can take your business elsewhere, which won't win the drop-catch race for this domain anyway You can participate in the auction if you choose to do so. Or just watch it out from the sidelines.

 

[Grego85]

So far I dont have any reason to distrust any of the major platforms, but I will say that I am dissatisfied with one of them (GoDaddy). I've had 2 separate instances where they have allowed fake buyers to take my auction down for an extended time. This last time my auction was down for nearly 3 weeks before I could get it back up. They don't seem to mind people playing games on their platform. When I called customer service, they simply did not care.

 

[Kate]

But they have all had their fair share of scandals right ? I mean, we are not talking about some stuff that could hypothetically happen, but that has happened already and may repeat itself in the future, because there is no oversight and no accountability really.

In the real world certain business activities like escrow, auctions etc are subjects to audits, regulation and codes of conducts, have to abide by KYC and procedures against money laundering and insider trading. Nothing of the sort in our industry. It's the fox guarding the henhouse.

GD have done shady business, for example: https://domainnamewire.com/2008/12/03/standard-tactics-llc-how-godaddy-profits-from-expired-domains/
So, knowing this, should I trust them today, when bidding on their platform ? Maybe people become ethical and different after being caught red-handed. Perhaps shame turns people into better persons, who knows. Maybe they'll repent and improve their ways, or they will simply do better not to get caught next time.

Other registrars have engaged in dirty stuff as well, and tried to distance themselves from their dubious offshoots. Enom, Netsol, for example. I know we are not here to talk about registrars, but when they get involved in auctions sites either as founders or suppliers you have to keep this in mind. This industry is too incestuous to be trusted.

GD is also one of the few major venues that is resisting the use of bidder handles. Either they don't want to finance a costly overhaul of an old and buggy system (?), or they don't welcome the increased scrutiny and accountability that would ensue. At least, they now have a policy that forbids employees from bidding in auctions. But it took a mini-scandal for them to have a policy in place, remember. But other venues are not all that clear.
They certainly could do better.

I should also add that even if people are perfectly honest, their systems may still be gamed by insiders.
Examples: rogue employee (Snapnames), or hackers penetrating the system and gaining insider knowledge, possibility altering computer data or interfering with normal operations.
These days, hacking and data breaches are the new normal, tight security is the exception.
Some types of businesses like credit card processors, banks, casinos etc are required to follow PCI rules or undertake penetration testing on a regular basis to assess their systems. And we still have large-scale breaches like OPM or Equifax.
But businesses that are not regulated surely care even less.

 

[Name Trader]

That was the exact point I was making. Everyone knows the handles and knows who is bidding against them. We prefer the domain to stand on it's own, not be influenced by which domain investor is bidding on the domain. "Oh it's Frank, he's a really smart guy. It must be a good name. I'm going to bid." And of course various other scenarios. Our choice has been and currently is to let the domain stand or fall on it's own merit.

I'm sure if you put this to a shareholder vote. They would vote for bidder handles

 

[ecalc]

hot tip of the day for the bid validation internal audit group at a major auction house ...
amazoncars dot xyz - 17 bids - current bid $33,510 USD - time left 4D 9H

 

[Name Trader]

They changed it? hugedomains was winning ones I bid on when I first started domaining and tried them.

What time-frame are you talking about? It's been the same way since they introduced the Discount Backorder Club. I'm not motivated to do the research as to when that started up. Anyone know that answer? But it been many years already.

 

[Rich]

I do believe Godaddy does everything in their power to stop shill bidding but like stub said their agreements with other registrars are crap and I stay losing domains after they're paid for. I just paid for my last year of DDC and will be moving the remainder of my names elsewhere throughout the year.
Namejet and snap have come a long way, but have turned their heads too often when it comes to the big players.
Dropcatch may be the same from what I've read here giving extended pay periods to their biggest helpers. I'll make money using them regardless.

 

[urljunky]

When it comes to money, I don’t trust anyone.
Every company has 1 goal and that is to make as much money as possible.

 

[kam]

I trust them as much as the government.
-------------------------------
PGP key
"You are either at the table or you are on the menu"

Auction websites are at the table and you will be on the menu

 

[Joe Styler]

Now they don't have even the normal Support via email or ticket system (phone only, and just English).
LiveChat is also dead.

We have email to the auctions team [email protected]. We have live chat, and we have phone support in so many languages and local country phone numbers I lost count. Here is a link to the different local phone numbers in local languages. https://www.godaddy.com/contact-us.aspx.

 

[Name Trader]

We have email to the auctions team [email protected]. We have live chat, and we have phone support in so many languages and local country phone numbers I lost count. Here is a link to the different local phone numbers in local languages. https://www.godaddy.com/contact-us.aspx.

We can't wait 3 days to get a reply to an email to [email protected]. I have 1 issue right now which is going on 9-10 days (3 rounds of email) without resolution. And the problem itself is older than that The days mentioned here is from my first email, only. But every reply takes the 3 full days to get an answer.

We also need email support for your control panel which you have dropped. What Companies drops email support worldwide on their core business?

However. I will say that phone support has been good-to-excellent, calling a local number from outside USA. No complaints. Although I've never heard 1 word of the native language I am calling from (which is good for me)

 

[anantj]

How would they know it is Frank Schilling they are bidding against?

His nick is known and visible on Namejet unlike GoDaddy who refuses to make bidder handles public!

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I am surprised how many have issues with auction sites. It is concerning, but also good to see at least some of the auction sites involved on NPs and responding to concerns. I wonder if people have similar concerns with general purpose domain sites like eBay when the auction does not involve domain names, or is it something unique about domain names?

For those on Twitter, I see that right now @Darryl Lopes is auctioning a 4 letter .com domain on Twitter. As far as I know this is first time this has been tried (if not, can you let me know, as I was thinking of a future blog post on the topic after the auction is over)? For those who have issues with the traditional auction sites, it does offer a different alternative that you control yourself. Obviously there are potential issues which I am sure Darryl has thought about, but it is a creative new way, and one where in a way transparency is obvious (as long as no brand new Twitter accounts are allowed to bid).

 

[Joe Styler]

Care to share names ? You mean audit companies like EY and the sort ?


Seriously ? So you are the only venue that wants to hide the action and doesn't want a bidding war among users ? Interesting.
But then you should get rid of this too:

Show attachment 96317

I haven't personally been involved in the audits for a while thankfully, because it is a lot of time so I am not sure who is auditing us now. I do know we are because the guy who gets to be part of it now in my place sits two desks away and I know when he's involved in them. He's training our European Aftermarket team right now and it's night there so I can't just yell over to him for the answer. I can tell you it is big name auditors, like Deloitte for instance. If you want names you can ask the investor relations group, they should be able to give you the most up to date info. GDDY.com is the site for that. You can also see our financials and questions from analysts etc there. We do get asked Aftermarket related questions each quarter on the earnings calls if you are interested. It is important to note, these are regular normal outside checks, we are not being audited for any wrong doing of any kind to the best of my knowledge, just normal everyday stuff.

 

[Joe Styler]

Right which is my point. Knowing the bidder influences your bidding. Our Philosophy is the domain should stand on it's own and not be influenced by who is bidding on it. We can keep going in circles here but I have explained why we do what we do which is all I am here to do. I am not trying to convince you otherwise if you don't agree with our philosophy that is fine but at least you can see why we choose to do what we do.

 

[Smiles76]

This is the exact opposite of the truth. HugeDomains are only permitted to bid against you if you buy Discounted Backorder at DropCatch. If you bid a full priced backorder at DropCatch. HugeDomains are excluded from competing against you for the same domain. This is all clearly explained in their ToS.

What type of outside oversight is there in place to ensure that they comply? You're mighty naive if you think that just because it's in their TOS that they abide by it. HugeDomains doesn't have the best reputation out there and it's owned by the same people that own DropCatch.

 

[JayT]

What type of outside oversight is there in place to ensure that they comply? You're mighty naive if you think that just because it's in their TOS that they abide by it. HugeDomains doesn't have the best reputation out there and it's owned by the same people that own DropCatch.

I think people would find out eventually though whois. They would have to use alias and even then, sooner or later they'd get caught.