discuss An offer and an interesting message.

[Primary Names]

I caught a domain name, a hybrid combination, say nioFresh.com at dropcatch about a month ago. Then I listed it for $18XX at dan.com. Few days ago it got an offer of $100. Now the offer-maker has sent this message.

I represent nioFresh, the original and first owner the domain. It expired and could not be renewed on time due to technical issues. We request you to kindly hand over the domain and accept the offer that well and duly takes care of the expenses at your end.

Personally I feel that I should let him know that being a first owner of a domain name does not give a right to own a domain forever. I mean we have annual domain renewals for a reason, right ?

Everyone knows, it is really hard to catch good names these days due to competition. I takes time, money and constant effort. If I keep giving away domains just because someone comes along and says hand it over because I registered it first, then all is wasted.

Whenever I put a backorder I hardly ever search for the history of a domain-name. TBH, there is hardly time to do so whilst chasing all the drops and expires. Also does not make sense to do the diligence all the names we backorder when we not sure will own it.

Few more points - I would be happy to let it go for high XXX to low XXXX. The offer maker is based in India and so am I.

I would like to know how you would handle this situation. Also I would like to know how trademarks work in India in relation to domains.

Please share your thoughts.

I am tagging a few individuals whose opinions I value. @wwwweb @AbdulBasit.com @karmaco @alcy @TERADOMAIN

 

[TERADOMAIN]

Hi,

If previous owner has trademark on it then he may have upper hand.

But if no trademark then we have all the power to decide anything.

If previous owner behave nice then I worked with them at price which is not wholesale nor retail. If I find out their story is true and they act nicely then I work with them in friendly manner.

If previous owner behave odd then he has to pay the price we ask for. Few months ago I had such previous owner who hired broker to force me to hand over his asset. Their offer was Mid $XXXXX , but they acted very odd including broker. I was almost willing to accept their offer but they start playing drama then I said best of luck. I end up selling that asset for High $XXXXX to someone else after 6 months. Now I don't know if current buyer and previous owner have any relationship or not because distance between their offices are hardly less than 0.5 mile. It's long and funny story which I may share in future.

If no trademark you have all the power in your hand to decide.

Thanks

 

[AbdulBasit.com]

I caught a domain name, a hybrid combination, say nioFresh.com at dropcatch about a month ago. Then I listed it for $18XX at dan.com. Few days ago it got an offer of $100. Now the offer-maker has sent this message.


Personally I feel that I should let him know that being a first owner of a domain name does not give a right to own a domain forever. I mean we have annual domain renewals for a reason, right ?

Everyone knows, it is really hard to catch good names these days due to competition. I takes time, money and constant effort. If I keep giving away domains just because someone comes along and says hand it over because I registered it first, then all is wasted.

Whenever I put a backorder I hardly ever search for the history of a domain-name. TBH, there is hardly time to do so whilst chasing all the drops and expires. Also does not make sense to do the diligence all the names we backorder when we not sure will own it.

Few more points - I would be happy to let it go for high XXX to low XXXX. The offer maker is based in India and so am I.

I would like to know how you would handle this situation. Also I would like to know how trademarks work in India in relation to domains.

Please share your thoughts.

I am tagging a few individuals whose opinions I value. @wwwweb @AbdulBasit.com @karmaco @alcy @TERADOMAIN

I agree with most of them and would suggest you to follow the same. They've explained it very well and I don't think I've much to add in it.

Good luck and let us know how it goes for you.

 

[MA000]

interesting. please keep us updated

 

[Primary Names]

If previous owner has trademark on it....

Thanks for your input. Any idea where ( website / app ) do I find out if the previous owner has a trademark on the name ? ...Perhaps a source for India based companies.

BTW - USPTO.GOV and TRADEMARKIA.COM returns no search results for the name.

 

[TERADOMAIN]

Thanks for your input. Any idea where ( website / app ) do I find out if the previous owner has a trademark on the name ? ...Perhaps a source for India based companies.

BTW - USPTO.GOV and TRADEMARKIA.COM returns no search results for the name.

Google

 

[Primary Names]

Okay so far, I think it is quite a small business ( it is what their unimpressive digital footprint on google suggests ). Also I dont think he has any sort of trademark on the name because he would have played that card by now.

I am going to sleep on it for a night and then based on the suggestions so far I am going to quote $850 and leave a very short close-ended message that says it is available to purchase at this price for the next 72 hours and then it will go back to its original price.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Perhaps a source for India based companies.

India based companies are included in OpenCorporates.

 

[Primary Names]

India based companies are included in OpenCorporates.

I selected India as a parameter and made a search. But the term did not return any result as expected. I have been trying several other websites like these but their reliability has been questionable and I have decided that further headaches are not worth it. Its not like I am sitting on a 5 figure domain, although a similar logic may apply. This episode might teach me a thing or two which might be useful in future. Thank you Bob.

 

[Ategy]

I was going to write almost exactly what @Mister Funsky wrote.

IF you feel the claim they previously and recently owned it is legit (and they were polite and didn't hint at threats), and it has only been a couple of months that you have the domain, then I'd lower the price by about half (in this case $999 seems appropriate) and then give them a few days or even as much as a week. Then don't respond to anything else or just copy/paste your $999 email each time and only truly respond if they say they need a few more days to get the money. Make it clear that anyone else could potentially click the BIN as well (if they respond with the only issue being they need more time to get the money, only then would I take it off the market and give them the time they need to pay).

I've had this happen to me a few times. My reaction each time is very different depending on the uniqueness of the domain, the situation and even the behaviour of the potential previous owner. I've gone down to 25% of my asking price in one situation, while another situation I only offered the typical small discount I would have offered any other buyer reaching out.

 

[King]

Tell him to prove he was the original owner, either way, he let it drop and someone took it, that's how the game works.

 

[CraigD]

Is there any proof that email came from original domain owner - this could simply be yet another scam trying to dupe you out of a good catch.

Check prior WHOIS domain contact details for match.

 

[Primary Names]

UPDATE - dug a little deeper last night and found out that the guy has got a genuine trademark on the name that lasts till 2025. Still not sure if that makes the domainname a part of it. Certainly seems to make my position weaker. Dammit.

 

[Primary Names]

Tell him to prove he was the original owner, either way, he let it drop and someone took it, that's how the game works.

I have already established in the prior posts that he is indeed the original owner.

 

[pchip]

For this situation, I would set a BIN on Godaddy or somewhere else. Reply with the link to this person and forgot about it. Just set a price that you're happy with.

Of course if you're infringing on his trademark then maybe it's just best to get rid of it and move on.

Best of luck!

 

[Name Trader]

Can't add much from what everyone else has said. But I would do an archive.org lookup to see what was on the domain before matches what this guy is telling you. If there is a website, you can see how long it has been operational, if it was a dropcatch, you can see if the drop catch date approx matches the dates the website was up, there might also be a contact form or other information, which might help you decide whether if they are telling you the truth.

Personally. I probably would not let anything influence my decision how to proceed. If it dropped. It's they're own fault, even if they have a good excuse. Usually most websites would renew before the expiry date, or they would lose business. So they would have had a time, probably at least 1 month before expiry until the domain was removed from their account by the registrar, say another 30 days. So they have had probably about 2 months to fix any payment problems, email problems, registrar problems.

I think probably, it's all bull, from what they have told you so far. It's time for you to lay out your final position on this domain.

I would tell them the price (was it $1899) stands but you would be prepared to let it go to them (for $850) because of their circumstances. price is fixed for 2 weeks. After which the price is fixed for $1899. If neither offer is acceptable to them, tell them they should look for another domain.

rgds
stu

 

[tonyk2000]

I had one dude harass me

Actually, such an action is decreasing the domain value and makes it less saleable (to some extend). Theoretically speaking he may / might also contact the marketplace where the domain is listed, or the parking company for example. Or, after the sale to somebody else, the 3rd party buyer may also become a victim. (so he may chargeback). Not to say that such occurrences are frequent, but not impossible.
So, I'd at least politely respond to inquiries from "previous owners", if not to sell the domain - then to close the "ticket" in one way or another in his eyes.

 

[1Darko]

@Primary Names
If the buyer was indeed the previous owner and is holding a trademark and he let the domain expire that is not a thing for you to fix afterwards.
A trademark owner has not not only rights but he has also obligations to maintain the trademark. In this case the trademark owner obviously has not maintaned the domain and let it expire. To third parties it shows that this domain is not relevant for his business. If you're not infringing the trademark he should have a hard way to prove that this domain is essential for him - after all why did he let it expire.
If there where technical issues than he has to turn to whoever is responsible for this technical issues and reclaim the costs of the domain from them. If it is an employee he has to resolve this internally in his company. If it is himself - the owner - who let the domain expire than he has to talk to his spouse to approve the cost to buy it back .

What I want to say is that in no way he can blame you for his mismanagement!

I would explain this to him in clear words!

I wish you good luck with this one!

 

[blogspotter]

SHit happens all the time. I have also let domain expire due to personal reasons, and a domain that was doing XXXX revenues a month. I didn't pursue because when I got back to normalcy he had already spammed my domain for some porn shit because it had thousands of visitors a day, and didn't want to deal with recovering it. But I couldn't renew the site due to personal reasons. I mean shit happens in life.


If it was me, I would give him back for the cost price of the backorder.

It is not about rights, but I feel it is right. This is not the first and last domain you will ever sell. Sometime doing good feels good.

I mean you can give yourself a thousand reasons to convince yourself to refuse him if you won't to, but if he was the rightful owner of a website who couldn't renew due to some reason, I would have gifted it back if I was me.
But it is just me.

Now I am not going to entertain those bullshit mails lowballing becasue they are working on a project, but it takes a lot of effort to build up a website and I think it is good karma to listen to the otherside if it is a genuine case.

But of course, it is in your hands. Finder keeper and all that. And you can do whatever you want.
You asked, so I wanted to give my alternate opinion

 

[BrandEntrance.com]

I have received similar messages. I have also lost a name I needed and had to buy it back at a premium price.

 

[BrandEntrance.com]

Hi,

If previous owner has trademark on it then he may have upper hand.

But if no trademark then we have all the power to decide anything.

If previous owner behave nice then I worked with them at price which is not wholesale nor retail. If I find out their story is true and they act nicely then I work with them in friendly manner.

If previous owner behave odd then he has to pay the price we ask for. Few months ago I had such previous owner who hired broker to force me to hand over his asset. Their offer was Mid $XXXXX , but they acted very odd including broker. I was almost willing to accept their offer but they start playing drama then I said best of luck. I end up selling that asset for High $XXXXX to someone else after 6 months. Now I don't know if current buyer and previous owner have any relationship or not because distance between their offices are hardly less than 0.5 mile. It's long and funny story which I may share in future.

If no trademark you have all the power in your hand to decide.

Thanks

My searches reveal no TMs. Nio means 9 in Swedish.

 

[UncleBrand]

you can go to archive.org and see what their website looked like
this will give you a clear picture of their business

it happened to me,
and it was a small ngo, i let them have it back for 700$ based on their activities,
they were not able to pay a higher price and it was really a legit ngo

 

[Kuffy]

Back in 2003 (if my memory doesn't fail me ) I picked up the name gipsygirl.com from the expired domains drop list. Just after I registered it, I received a nice email from a hosting company explaining that the name was used by one of his clients for his girl friend, and he offered £25 for the name. He implied that his client would lose his night entertainment rights if he lost the name. I thought the mail was entertaining, and I agreed to sell the name. The next day I received a vitriolic note from the previous owner accusing me of all sorts of things. My reply was to tell him to eff off, and I hoped his wedding tackle fell off as a result of disuse. I still own the name, but have never used it.

The name is not the most popular spelling, and probably isn't worth anything like the renewal fees I have paid. I did plan to put a hedgerow cooking site on the name, but haven't got round to doing this, as I keep eating the products. I guess the moral here is that one should take a quick profit if one doesn't have plans for a name.

 

[YairDD]

How did it go?

 

[Primary Names]

UPDATE

My last message

Hello xxxxx,
I appreciate your humble approach. But you know it well that being a first owner of the domain does not give one a right to own a domain forever. I know my rights.

It is a nice name and I actually registered it for a small project with a friend but had to put it on temporary hold due to insufficient funds, though we are quite ready at this stage. But it is still possible to settle this like gentlemen for $500, so that I can look for other equally nice alternatives.

Best regards.

Then I revoked last offer of $1500 and set new offer of $500

Last reply

Hi xxxxx,

xxxxxxxxx.com has been on the backburner since 2018. We own the trademark in India, the Gmail account, registration on Flipkart and Amazon India, among other things. We may or may not revive the brand this financial year. As such, the domain itself is not worth USD 500 to us, since we are busy with other ventures. Should you or anyone, however, start a business in India with this name, we will contest the rights in a court of law as is our right. So the domain is of a limited use. My original offer still stands.

If you plan on going ahead with your business idea and this domain, I offer the legal rights and assets of the company for a suitable sum. The process might involve our lawyers and accountants as well.

Best.

So gentlemen, we got a hustler here.

Thinking about my options.

 

[koolishman]

UPDATE

My last message


Then I revoked last offer of $1500 and set new offer of $500

Last reply


So gentlemen, we got a hustler here.

Thinking about my options.

Did you check if has Indian TM?

https://ipindiaonline.gov.in/tmrpublicsearch/frmmain.aspx