Epik Recent Innovation Glitches

[dande]

Everyone knows I'm a strong believer in Epik platforms and would like to see them succeed. Make no mistakes about it. There are many positives about Epik but one or two bad negatives can destroy the whole thing. The purpose of this thread is not to condemn but to trigger a discussion.

Late later year, I moved some of my domains from Uni to Epik in hope of better days. But after nearly a year of no inquiries nor reasonable sales, I decided to test the lander, trying to see what potential buyers use to see, and what I discovered truly horrifies me.

1. A buyer will click on "Buy Now" button and the first thing he sees is a warning that his domain will be delayed for 60days before transferring to another registrar. To a Domainer, that's not a problem. To an end user, it's a huge turn off, capable of destroying a sale.

2. If the buyer managed to scale the first huddle and continued with Signup. After signing up at Epik.com he will be required to verify his email. The person will head to his inbox looking for email from Epik. On getting to the inbox or spam folder, what he will see is FederatedIdentity.com. Another big confusion capable of turning away good number of potential buyers. How is the new customer suppose to know that FederatedIdentity is the same as Epik?

The FederatedIdentity (to me) is a completely Bogus Innovation.

3. Now, if the buyer did scale yet the huddle and clicked on the verification link, the page below is what he will get.

To continue the signup all over again!

At this point, even the most serious buyer will give up and start looking for alternatives.

4. But, if his life depends on the domain and he continued with the second signup. After filling the form and clicked the "Save Settings", the whole process will simply end there. There will be no redirection to the domain transaction he has been going through all these troubles for. He's
simply gonna start the process of searching for the domain name all over again. God help him if he's an impulse buyer and has forgotten the name.

I'm of the opinion that Epik is not concentrating on what matters most. They want to be everywhere at the same time. Thereby, sacrificing users experience and good conversation rate.

I believe sales are going down the drain before of these. I still have so many things to complain about the platform but let me leave for others. If you've noticed anything, pls share it on this thread.

 

[karmaco]

I don’t like to be forced into things by a registrar. That happens too much at Epik. There is a growing list of things I do not like at Epik but I don’t intend to list those here.

Regarding subject at hand, The federated ID will not keep you logged in even if you check the box. It gets tiresome with two factor to keep logging in every few minutes. The name is bad and the concept of logging in to all is not helpful to people who just want a registrar or to buy a domain.

 

[blogspotter]

Never knew it ended up this complicated. Now it's reminding me of those "log in using your Facebook/Google account", except that it's now logging in using an account totally unheard of by everybody except long time users of Epik, and on top of that with bad UX. Yikes.

It is nit just a login frame. Takes you to a new webpage and if you auto generate password, you need open your password manager to look for it again since it is a a new url.

 

[Rob Monster]

As for the SSO, I do consider it to be strategic for the expansion of the platform and ecosystem.

Ultimately, I think we are wise to improve Federated Identity in terms of its usefulness to approved partners. I see 4 tiers of partners:

1. Epik subsidiaries and legal partners, e.g. Anonymize, Inc
2. Strategic partners and affiliates, e.g. Forum partners, Parking partners
3. Customers who build on Epik, e.g SiteBuilder, WHMCS resellers, WP plug-in
4. Non-customers, by approval, with verified domain status.

Right now we are at stage 1.

Stage 4 can be made possible through technology like TrustRatings and DNProtect to give us early warning indicators if a SSO partner would be high risk to include in the SSO federation.

Through this approach, I can see how we can reduce transactional friction for site owners who are low risk to consumers who choose to use small enterprise rather than rely on Amazon, Google, Facebook, etc

There are large players in the SSO space, e.g. Auth0, but despite vast spend most have little in the way of user traction. That market remains wide open for innovation and is a topic that I have followed for 13 years.

In the meantime, in response to this thread, do rest assured that there is progress happening already this week on 2 fronts:

1. The guest checkout should be streamlined by Friday.

2. The SSO feedback in this thread is being closely reviewed to drive improvements.

Long story short: Epik is committed to a SSO strategy and we appreciate the feedback from demanding, sophisticated customers and technologists to make it great.

By all means, keep the feedback coming. Those who, in good faith, engage in co-creation will be acknowledged either in public or in private.

 

[oldtimer]

Although getting feedbacks from the members here is a valuable thing and can help streamline certain problems, but in all fairness to Rob who is open to hearing all our feedbacks I believe that we should do it with a little less negativity and animosity and go about it in a more positive and constructive way. I am glad to see that the title of this thread which referred to bogus innovations has now been changed to something more positive.

While we are on the subject of creating better and easier experience for clients and customers (including domainers) I noticed that when I went to renew some of my domains that had expired two or three days ago ( on August 31) it only gave me the option to renew them if I did it for the minimum of 2 years which doubled the renewal price.

I believe that this can create a bad experience for domainers if they can't renew their domains for one year the day after they are expired. Unwilling to pay double to renew my domains I decided to register some new domains, but I wish I could get the full 45 days grace period to renew my domains at the Special 8 dollar price without being penalized and having to pay extra.


PS: just got a message from Rob that said he has extended the grace period on my account so that I can renew my domains for one year at a time at the special rate, I guess if they ask he will do this for domainers where the renewal charges are a main factor for them. (Thanks Rob).

IMO

 

[7363824]

Although getting feedbacks from the members here is a valuable thing and can help streamline certain problems, but in all fairness to Rob who is open to hearing all our feedbacks I believe that we should do it with a little less negativity and animosity and go about it in a more positive and constructive way. I am glad to see that the title of this thread which referred to bogus innovations has now been changed to something more positive.

While we are on the subject of creating better and easier experience for clients and customers (including domainers) I noticed that when I went to renew some of my domains that had expired two or three days ago ( on August 31) it only gave me the option to renew them if I did it for the minimum of 2 years which doubled the renewal price.

I believe that this can create a bad experience for domainers if they can't renew their domains for one year the day after they are expired. Unwilling to pay double to renew my domains I decided to register some new domains, but I wish I could get the full 45 days grace period to renew my domains at the Special 8 dollar price without being penalized and having to pay extra.


PS: just got a message from Rob that said he has extended the grace period on my account so that I can renew my domains for one year at a time at the special rate, I guess if they ask he will do this for domainers where the renewal charges are a main factor for them. (Thanks Rob).

IMO

Glad to hear that got solved. FWIW I can see from Epik's point of view why the grace period is so short since the registry will collect the renewal on the expiry date whether or not Epik has your payment. So I get the impact on cash flow and appreciate their willingness to extend it.

That said I really don't like the 2 year minimum if its already expired. And I know they will do it for 1yr if you ask but I think by default it should be standard 1year. Instead they should have some sort of upsell dialog or banner saying something like Did you know you can renew for up to 10 years? IMO

 

[uzver]

Regarding subject at hand, The federated ID will not keep you logged in even if you check the box. It gets tiresome with two factor to keep logging in every few minutes. The name is bad and the concept of logging in to all is not helpful to people who just want a registrar or to buy a domain.

Now that this topic arose, I remembered I have some issues here too.

I added 2FA on FederatedIdentity.

Now, when I need to login to my Epik account I have to first login at FederatedIdentity.com (login/password + 2FA) and then I’m being redirected to Epik where I have to login again (My Epik’s 2FA that’s different from FederatedIdentity 2FA).

I’m guessing I may need to disable the “old” 2FA at Epik, so that I don’t get asked twice. But I see some disconnect here, it shouldn’t behave this way regardless. For this reason I don’t feel safe to rely on FederatedIdentity only — I keep it as is (2 x 2FA).

 

[Rob Monster]

Glad to hear that got solved. FWIW I can see from Epik's point of view why the grace period is so short since the registry will collect the renewal on the expiry date whether or not Epik has your payment. So I get the impact on cash flow and appreciate their willingness to extend it.

That said I really don't like the 2 year minimum if its already expired. And I know they will do it for 1yr if you ask but I think by default it should be standard 1year. Instead they should have some sort of upsell dialog or banner saying something like Did you know you can renew for up to 10 years? IMO

See Expired Domains Policy here:

https://www.epik.com/support/faq/expired-registration-recovery-policy/

A few thoughts:

1. We can go up to 35 days on .COM for example. Just ask.

2. We uniquely allow you to monetize your own expiry stream with NameLiquidate.com. You can even automate it:

https://registrar.epik.com/account/portfolio-settings/

There is a portfolio setting that lets you opt out of the default 2 year grace renewal.

I am actually not aware of another company that is doing as much to empower domainers to monetize their expiry streams at any registrar.

 

[uzver]

I agree with those who doesn’t like the SSO title — I think EpikIdentity would be less confusing.

@Rob Monster When I added 2FA via Google Authenticator app, its title/description says just Identity (no prefix/suffix):

We all know what’s Twitter, Epik, now we also know FederatedIdentity. But what’s Identity? Too generic, IMO.

As someone who has 30+ 2FA’s connected to my Google Authenticator, I would appreciate more descriptive name.

UPDATE: I have just realized I can actually change the login name below the automatic title.
I can add my own description. Not a big deal, but it still good to have it added automatically.

 

[jideofor]

This is painful... I noticed that there had been clicks to my domains of recent, like 5-6 for a particular domain name. Normally, the prices are announced in my pitches and I usually wondered why I don't hear anything back. I mean 5-6 clicks to page mean they are somewhat interested as they already know the price before going there.

I never knew that when they clicked the buy now, they see a warning sign.

Thank you.

 

[7363824]

This is painful... I noticed that there had been clicks to my domains of recent, like 5-6 for a particular domain name. Normally, the prices are announced in my pitches and I usually wondered why I don't hear anything back. I mean 5-6 clicks to page mean they are somewhat interested as they already know the price before going there.

I never knew that when they clicked the buy now, they see a warning sign.

Thank you.

This is what is shown as soon as you click buy now:

Yes it does mention a 60 day lock but im sure ICANN requires them to notify customers of that. And even if it isn't required being upfront is the tight thing to do.

 

[jideofor]

This is what is shown as soon as you click buy now:

Show attachment 165953

Yes it does mention a 60 day lock but im sure ICANN requires them to notify customers of that. And even if it isn't required being upfront is the tight thing to do.

It is not the right thing to. Which other registrar does it when buyer tries to purchase IF it is ICANN rule?

 

[7363824]

It is not the right thing to.

Since when is being upfront about any requirements/restrictions not the right thing to do?

 

[karmaco]

We should not have to ask for 35 day grace period. It should be automatic like everywhere else. We should not have to ask not to have to renew for 2 years it should be automatic. We should not see our names two days after expiration have an Epik lander as though its Epik’s name. We should not see gray locks and be unable to do a side to side push unless we provide proof of id. Control freak behavior does not help domainers.

 

[branding]

Since when is being upfront about any requirements/restrictions not the right thing to do?

That 60 day lock is not an ICANN requirement. Shame.

 

[branding]

As a matter of fact,I'm tired of registrars hiding behind old and outdated ICANN regulation.

 

[7363824]

As a matter of fact,I'm tired of registrars hiding behind old and outdated ICANN regulation.

Technically it is required IF it is not opted out of by the previous owner.

Idk about you but if I as the previous owner were given the choice between

A. 60 day lock but guaranteed to get the domain back if the payment is reversed/fraudulent

Or

B. No 60 day lock but if the payment is reversed and the domain was transfered out im left with nothing

I'd pick A. Epik just makes that choice for all of its sellers.

After 1 December 2016, registrars must impose a lock that will prevent any transfer to another registrar for sixty (60) days following a change to a registrant's information. Registrars may (but are not required to) allow registrants to opt out of the 60-day lock prior to the change of registrant request.

Source: https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/ownership-2013-05-03-en

 

[branding]

Epik just makes that choice for all of its sellers

That's the problem. They shouldn't be interfering with my business and make that decision on my behalf.

The lock should be considered an opt in btw, not an opt out. It has become industry standard by now and only subpar registrars are still hiding behind old and outdated ICANN rules.

 

[7363824]

That's the problem. They shouldn't be interfering with my business and make that decision on my behalf.

Thats at least a fair criticism. In theory they could add a setting to control the lock on domains you sell.

IMO though its not worth the fraud risk to not use a 60 day lock. Even NameBright does it when you buy a name from HugeDomains. IMO if anyone could eat the loss from fraud it'd be them.

 

[branding]

I haven't checked the latest regulation on transfers but the keyword is may.

It's not a requirement. The registrar
knowingly and willingly imposes the lock on you.

Don't go and hide behide ICANN if it's your decision. If you want to enforce it, be transparent about it.

 

[branding]

IMO though its not worth the fraud risk to no use a 60 day lock. Even NameBright does it when you buy a name from HugeDomains. IMO if anyone could ear the loss from fraud it'd be them.

For the aftermarket, and buyers/sellers, restrictions in terms of locks are never a good thing. They're just covering their own ass. I don't mind, but let's be honest about it.

May there be issues, there's ways to go about to deal with it. 99% of the time that's not the case.

Domain transfers should (after initial registion) be without restrictions, and ultimately free of charge. That will move this industry forward.

 

[7363824]

For the aftermarket, and buyers/sellers, restrictions in terms of locks are never a good thing. They're just covering their own ass. I don't mind, but let's be honest about it.

May there be issues, there's ways to go about to deal with it. 99% of the time that's not the case.

Domain transfers should (after initial registion) be without restrictions, and ultimately free of charge. That will move this industry forward.

For the record, I dislike locks as much as the next guy but I am also aware of the problems around payment fraud.

IMO 60 day locks make sense for aftermarket domains as they are usually larger value, and many times are from a one-off customer.

For traditional registrations I think registrars should stop enforcing locks automatically once a customer has proven to be a good trustworthy customer. Honestly Epik's process of allowing customers to ask for the lock to be removed s the closest I have seen to that....but there is room for improvement.

 

[Rob Monster]

That 60 day lock is not an ICANN requirement. Shame.

Last I checked with ICANN, we are required to have folks opt out and we make that easy:

Besides, we don't enforce it.

That said, will check with @Sufyan Alani if we can drop that checkbox entirely and not be outside of ICANN compliance.

 

[Samer]

Last I checked with ICANN, we are required to have folks opt out and we make that easy:
Show attachment 165957

Besides, we don't enforce it.

That said, will check with @Sufyan Alani if we can drop that checkbox entirely and not be outside of ICANN compliance.

Hallelujah.

“60 Day lock” is the worst.

 

[7363824]

Last I checked with ICANN, we are required to have folks opt out and we make that easy:
Show attachment 165957

Besides, we don't enforce it.

That said, will check with @Sufyan Alani if we can drop that checkbox entirely and not be outside of ICANN compliance.

Thats great. And correct me if I am wrong @NameDeck I think the concern mentioned here is applying the 60 day change of registrant lock to marketplace purchases. So perhaps it would be possible to include an option to opt out of the lock on marketplace sales, and if so not to make any mention of a 60 day lock on the checkout page.

Presumably that would mean that reserved payments may not be able to have the domain returned if it was transferred out, but if that's the tradeoff some sellers want to make I personally say why not if they are aware of what it means.

 

[branding]

Last I checked with ICANN, we are required to have folks opt out and we make that easy:
Show attachment 165957

Besides, we don't enforce it.

That said, will check with @Sufyan Alani if we can drop that checkbox entirely and not be outside of ICANN compliance.

Thanks. Potatoes potatos... Point being, the way Epik is handling locks currently is adding friction to the transfer/selling/buying process.

There are registrars handling it in a worse way but that does not mean we cannot discuss the downside and possible issues you may run into by using Epik.

I have voiced my opinion about this multiple times. Empowering domain owners comes in a lot of forms. Ownership with as little restrictions as possible is one of them, imo.

Like I said, discussed this before so I'll leave it at that. Pro lock people made their point. I made my point. Happy days