Aged domains question

[Bob Hawkes]

I have a question that I hope someone more experienced in domain investing can provide insight on....

Very frequently I see mention in domain name sales that the domain is aged or how many years old it is, as though this is universally a good thing.

I understand completely how if the domain has been used in a website in a positive way, has received meaningful links from other websites, etc. that being aged is a plus that will make the domain more valuable.

However, what if the domain was first registered say 12 years ago, but has essentially sat parked for most or all of that period? In this case I don't see how being aged is positive, and maybe even it could be negative if an unsuccessful attempt has been made to sell the domain over years. Of course, you may have new ideas for promotion and hope to find success where others have not with the domain name, but I still don't see why per se being aged is always positive and meaningful.

Or am I missing something? Thanks for any insights.

Bob

 

[poweredbyme]

History has shown us that age can make, but it can also break.
You only have to remember the tulips

Tulips aren't scarce. But bitcoin is scarce or its quantity is fixed. Bitcoin is similar to gold or land, but has no similarity to tulip bulbs in terms of economics.

Likewise, someotherdomain.dom, if it was registered today, might head in the opposite direction, becoming less valuable tomorrow. It all depends on the trajectory of the name's market value and whether the curve is bullish or bearish at any given point in time.

One can say that a domain's age settles old scores being the judge of character. It can make or break a name, but finding it out takes living to do.

It took the stream of time for 'beer(dot com) to become valuable, just it would take time for any domain registered today to pass or fail the test of time in due time.

Market trends and scarcity are different. There are 100 2N.com's, 1,000 3N.com's, 10,000 4N.com, 100,000 5N.com and so on. It's obvious 2N.com will be always more expensive than 3N, 4N, 5N ... domains. Domain registrants were knowing this in 90's, especially if you consider domain reg fee was 10+ times more expensive than today.

Price levels and price movements based on quantity of supply are independent from market trends (bull-bear) as quantitative fixation or placing strict upper limitation is fundamental of economics (you can see it on quotas in international trade of physical goods) 3N has been always more valuable than 4N domains regardless of trends. The real winner is the person who saw this and hand registered rare domains. So, aged domains were more valuable in 90's and will be always more valuable. Even in bitcoin domains, the best ones are the oldest domains. The best domains are ALWAYS registered first, before the normal and bad domains.

 

[namelancer]

The stuff that is available to hang reg today, was available years ago, too! However most of what was available years ago, especially the good stuff, is not available to hand register today.

Because history repeats itself, what is available to register today, in a few years' time, could be as good as the hand. reg's of the past. We, and the domains, by extension, are the products of our times and times, they are changing !

 

[namelancer]

Another striking proof: If you renew your website domain for longer 1 year in advance it ranks better in search results. I personally verified this on my own websites. Register a domain today, develop it today and renew its domain for 5 years, till 2022. By renewing its domain for 5 years, you are announcing everyone (including search engines) your site will certainly become 5 years old in 2022. Therefore your site deserves enjoying some portion of the authority of a 5 years old domain as it gives a guarantee to become a 5 years old domain.

I'll start by responding to your earlier post.

I think, that by ranking a domain/website higher, it's a google' way of saying they put a stamp of appreciation on a domain with a bright future and a long life AHEAD of it rather than the one with a glorious past

 

[poweredbyme]

I'll start by responding to your earlier post.

I think, that by ranking a domain/website higher, it's a google' way of saying they put a stamp of appreciation on a domain with a bright future and a long life AHEAD of it rather than the one with a glorious past

If you develop a website on a fresh domain, the domain itself (content age is also counted in ranking) will be 5 years old 5 years later. If you use a 15 year old domain to develop a website, the domain is already 15 years old domain today and will be 20 years old in 2022. "glorious past" is not the factor that was measured in my test to know the impact of domain age on a fresh content. Because fresh content was used in both, new and aged domains. If you publish a content on a brand new domain, it doesn't get indexed even in 10 days while the aged domain starts receiving organic traffic. The difference is huge. Even if you renew for the next 5-10 years in advance, aged domain outperforms fresh domain. I experienced this for many times. So this is almost a rule. Search engines rank aged domains better. "glorious past" is a different thing, is not very relevant. Every domain will be old in the future, every domain will have a past. But the aged domains of today will be always most aged domains. Search engines don't give authority because of a bright future. They give authority because of a guaranteed past that will happen in the future, when you renew domain for multiple years, not only for 1 year.

 

[karmaco]

What is "in com" do you mean dot com?

Those made up names, misspelled names, one is the same as the other, in my opinion. Before branding they will never be worth much. You may keep doing what you are doing but when your inventory has nothing special in it where one name is as good as another from your competitor, it's hard to stay ahead. Of course "worth much" is all relative. To me a $500. or $1000. offer on my domains are the offers I almost universally turn down; I get such offers daily.

My inventory is mostly hand registered too, but hand registered years ago, just been patient, holding, and selling selectively at fair prices only.

You're getting way off on a tangent. Making a living or not making a living on domaining is not what this thread is about. It's about whether age matters, and it does!

You are very single minded in your replies. Many aged domains are absolute garbage and fall daily. You asked for examples eth.com which has more understood value today than 15 years ago comes to mind as well as bitcoin names. Which were not in existence 15 years ago.

What @Silentptnr was trying to say is names registered 15 or more years ago do not always translate to what is relevant. current and valuable today in almost 2018.

Only one person can own beer.com btw and very few could afford it. Your theory does not factor in that alternatives are the bigger market than boring single words only billionaires can afford.

 

[xynames]

Guys are going off on defensive tangents scrambling to prove that newer domains may be valuable too when that’s not what I am saying or not saying - I agree that some newer domains may be or become valuable. Certainly there are words that did not exist (eg bitcoin) 20 years ago that have value now and did not then.

I state simply the reality that age does matter and is a positive factor in the value of a domain. Anyway if my entire portfolio were made up or misspelled names I doubt I’d be getting daily offers or price inquiries, as I am.

 

[Silentptnr]

I get just as many offers on my newer domains as I do on my older domains. Just last month I sold two domains for 1k each that I just hand registered 65 days earlier.

I just got an inquiry earlier today for a domain that I hand regged [ r/n/c/n/e/w/s/./c/o/m ] in 2014 and consider newer. I get offers and inquiries literally almost daily both on older names and new names.

I agree that the age of a domain name can contribute to it's value, even if it has sat parked. I will add however, that I also sell domains, get inquiries on domains, and get offers on domains, that are not old.

 

[HotKey]

But I have never heard of an end user telling a broker, when listing criteria for a domain and trying to come up with candidates, that they want an old domain. And I've never heard of a buyer who was interested in a specific domain walking away because they found out it wasn't old enough.

Really? Surely you've met a collector or hobbyist before..

 

[namelancer]

Even older humans are more expensive than younger ones. Seeing a 50 years old doctor is more expensive than seeing a 35 years old doctor or an advocate, technician, accountant, etc.

What would be more expensive, is it seeing:

1. A 35 years old surgeon vs 50 years old general practitioner (regular MD) ?
2. A 50 y.o. MD with PHD vs 50 y.o. MD (Medical Doctor) ?
3. A 50 y.o. MD vs 70 y.o. MD ?
4. A 60 y.o. MD vs 80 y.o. MD, by now probably only practicing geriatrics ?

If age adds value, why is there age discrimination at workplace existing as a confirmed bias against older people ?

 

[xynames]

That's an irrelevant comparison.

 

[namelancer]

That's an irrelevant comparison.

Of course since it's preconditioned on all participants having a job which for many reaching an advanced age would be an impossibility. I guess for engineers the situation is even worse

 

[KhaledA]

Domain names values cannot be compared with human values even without experience.
Domain names and human beings are of different classes !!

 

[namelancer]

Age adds value. The reason is simple: Value is derived from scarcity. Age = time = money. Time is a scarce resource, so it's valuable, even the most valuable resource for many people. Time is money, money is time. Anything aged is more valuable by default unless ...
Little children want to become adult faster, want to get rid of childhood but time passes in its own speed. Elderly people miss the old days when they were child or young

What would be the final verdict on age ?
On the one hand, It seems as though you first extol the virtues of getting older (manifested by small children wanting to grow up faster), but later, age appears to be a liability seen in older people wishing to revert back time ?

It could be so that age is good only in small quantities, up to a certain point - as if to say 'you may go here but no longer' - but in higher dosages it can become toxic, and quite detrimental

 

[Silentptnr]

I will add that there are tons of aged domains in the GD Closeouts for $5 - $11.

 

[Silentptnr]

Basically if I'm selling an old domain, i say age matters.
If l'm selling a newer domain, i say age doesnt matter.
Depends on what I'm selling.

 

[xynames]

Anyway, I'd rather have my pick of 1000 names that were available to register say, twenty or twenty-five years ago, than a portfolio of 1000 of the names that are available to hand register today. Or even comparing what you could buy 25 years ago for fifty or a hundred bucks versus what you could get today for fifty or a hundred, still I'd take the 25 year old domains. No question. Which means that the pool of available names was superior back then. Which means that age matters.

 

[namelancer]

Anyway, I'd rather have my pick of 1000 names that were available to register say, twenty or twenty-five years ago, than a portfolio of 1000 of the names that are available to hand register today. ... Which means that the pool of available names was superior back then. Which means that age matters.

It's true under one condition: that you would have picked up right landing on a winner each, or every other, step of the way. Greater pool equals more choices, but it also brings confusion, decision anxiety and predilection for making a wrong choice.

If you could have had foresight then, you could have it now.

 

[Silentptnr]

Anyway, I'd rather have my pick of 1000 names that were available to register say, twenty or twenty-five years ago, than a portfolio of 1000 of the names that are available to hand register today. Or even comparing what you could buy 25 years ago for fifty or a hundred bucks versus what you could get today for fifty or a hundred, still I'd take the 25 year old domains. No question. Which means that the pool of available names was superior back then. Which means that age matters.

Agree except for the end. Age "sometimes" matters. Age is usually a plus. Names are bought for many different reasons. Age might be one.

Yes, the pool of domains today is less rare in most cases than those available years ago but it doesnt "always" make them more valuable.

This discussion then leads in to domain extensions which is not part of the ops question. But, its not a simple question to answer.

An aged, parked domain could be valuable or could be worth very little. Odds are, worth very little. There was a larger pool of bad names back then too.

 

[HotKey]

What would be the final verdict on age ?

Basically if I'm selling an old domain, i say age matters.
If l'm selling a newer domain, i say age doesnt matter.
Depends on what I'm selling.

Though quality will almost always be the bigger factor, unless:
https://www.namepros.com/threads/wtb-at-least-1-domain-from-1990-1991.1029196/#post-6259373

I really don't care about the quality of the domain.

it is specifically implied.

 

[xynames]

"An aged, parked domain could be valuable or could be worth very little. Odds are, worth very little." --- that's a very wrong statement, to imply that being parked equates to less desirability. Whether it was used for anything or parked may often have nothing to do with its value today one way or another.

Consider...a classic Rolex Cosmograph, say a 6239, or a 6241. You or your family have had it since say, the early 1980s. In the 1980s it was worth maybe a thousand dollars, no one wanted those things, they wanted the newer ones. By 2000, worth about ten grand. By 2007, worth about 25K. Today you see them being sold as high as 75K.

All along the way you or whoever in your family passed it on to you, kept getting offers for it, but would not sell. It was "parked" all that time, occasionally on your wrist, but mostly in a safe.

That watch has increased in value, the same as the identical Rolex that was bought and re-sold ten times over the past few decades. You cannot say that the Rolex that was parked that no one ever bought over a thirty year period is less valuable than the Rolex that changed hands many times. What matters is the watch, its condition, etc. - not whether or not it changed hands or was even ever taken out of the safe other than to wind it every now and then, to keep it running smoothly.

Same with the domain, saying that "Odds are, worth very little" is implying that the domains that were not sold, whose owners refused to let them go during the entire period, did so because no one wanted them. Not necessarily!

Some of these super valuable one word domains have been nothing but parked (including with PPC links) since the beginning.

 

[shorterwinters]

Some of these super valuable one word domains have been nothing but parked (including with PPC links) since the beginning.

baseball.com

 

[Silentptnr]

"An aged, parked domain could be valuable or could be worth very little. Odds are, worth very little." --- that's a very wrong statement, to imply that being parked equates to less desirability. Whether it was used for anything or parked may often have nothing to do with its value today one way or another.

Consider...a classic Rolex Cosmograph, say a 6239, or a 6241. You or your family have had it since say, the early 1980s. In the 1980s it was worth maybe a thousand dollars, no one wanted those things, they wanted the newer ones. By 2000, worth about ten grand. By 2007, worth about 25K. Today you see them being sold as high as 75K.

All along the way you or whoever in your family passed it on to you, kept getting offers for it, but would not sell. It was "parked" all that time, occasionally on your wrist, but mostly in a safe.

That watch has increased in value, the same as the identical Rolex that was bought and re-sold ten times over the past few decades. You cannot say that the Rolex that was parked that no one ever bought over a thirty year period is less valuable than the Rolex that changed hands many times. What matters is the watch, its condition, etc. - not whether or not it changed hands or was even ever taken out of the safe other than to wind it every now and then, to keep it running smoothly.

Same with the domain, saying that "Odds are, worth very little" is implying that the domains that were not sold, whose owners refused to let them go during the entire period, did so because no one wanted them. Not necessarily!

Some of these super valuable one word domains have been nothing but parked (including with PPC links) since the beginning.

I did not say that parking makes any domain less desirable. The point was that there are aged domains with very little value today. There are new names that can bring good roi. Age is good, but names are bought for many reasons.

The "Odds are" part was me pointing out that more domains with little value even today, were registered back then, than were ultra premium domains.

 

[Michael]

Really? Surely you've met a collector or hobbyist before..

I said end user specifically. If someone finds the right domain for their project and they fall in love with it, they're not going to walk away from it because you just registered it last year. And someone who is in search for the right domain for their project is not going to have their main criteria be "I want it to be old". They care about number of words, length, the feeling it gives, how memorable it is, etc. You should care about what the end user cares about.

Sure, domainers/collectors/hobbyists care about age. But they shouldn't, it is silly noise. If you find a good domain and it isn't old, go ahead and pass on it so I can have it. And buy up every crap domain just because it is old so you can blow your budget and not spend it competing with me on good names. Please

I get a fair number of emails where people ask me to appraise domains. Many times I tell them reg fee because the names are genuinely crap, and they reply "But it has age!" I can't help but shake my head. Yes, most good domains are old and most new regs are crap. But a LOT of old domains are crap, and a small number of new regs are good. It's that last statement that proves that age doesn't determine value, it's just a decent predictor of value, but the only thing that really matters at the end of the day is demand. Plain and simple.

Basically if I'm selling an old domain, i say age matters.
If l'm selling a newer domain, i say age doesnt matter.
Depends on what I'm selling.

Exactly, lol.

 

[poweredbyme]

What would be the final verdict on age ?
On the one hand, It seems as though you first extol the virtues of getting older (manifested by small children wanting to grow up faster), but later, age appears to be a liability seen in older people wishing to revert back time ?

It could be so that age is good only in small quantities, up to a certain point - as if to say 'you may go here but no longer' - but in higher dosages it can become toxic, and quite detrimental

We have to consume (demand) time even when we don't need it (remember hopeless patients waiting to die in hospitals) or when we want the time to pass faster (when we were children or when we are bored or when we are waiting for something to happen). We don't control time in both demand and supply. We usually control what we demand. But the time is an exception. You may drink only 1 beer in a bar if you don't want 2. Noone can force you if you don't want to demand something. But you have to demand exactly 24 hours everyday, neither 25 hours nor 23 hours. In supply side, we can't produce time, can't add 1 day to a week or 1 hour to a day. 1 day is 24 hours we can't change it to 23 or 25 hours, neither the future days nor the past days. Time is an ultimately solid measurement. When we call something as "x" years old, it's a universal measure, is same everywhere, everytime. Probably the most universal measure is time. So time is included in all measures including value measuring. Time is integral part of everything. So, age isn't just a number. Some posters wrote age is just a number. I don't agree with them and shared my arguments. Age changes value of all commodities. Age lowers the value of a food (meat, egg, tomato, fish) while raising the value of scarce things (gold, bitcoin, domain, land). When you hold something scarce its age will raise its value mainly because more people will demand it as population raises over the time. This is the main reason of why land and gold value don't decrease in the long term. The same mechanism applies to domains. If you have a 3L domain, its value should only increase as more people will want to buy it in the future because the more population in the future.

 

[HotKey]

You should care about what the end user cares about.

Sure, domainers/collectors/hobbyists care about age. But they shouldn't, it is silly noise.

I am the end user, as well as the collector. I know what I care about. What's silly noise to you might be exactly the noise a person like me is trying to hear.

Having blanket beliefs, one can cut out an entire niche of folk..thereby losing potential sales.

Now, a couple of comments have been made regarding to a lot of aged domains being "crap". I think we should define what we mean by aged..5 years, 10 years, 15 20 etc? Personally to me aged is 15+. But that's as a collector. Others might find a 5 year old domain suits them just fine for the age factor. I don;t think we're going to see many 20+ year old crap domains. Why? Because mid-90's, thousands upon thousands if not millions were available for reg still, eliminating the need to warp a strong one or two worder.