question What's the Percentage of total sales being reported by Namebio?

[bazabizo]

I know that a lot of sales arent reported there, for example Most of the larger brokers and investors dont report their sales there! I believe that 50% at most are reported by NB if not even 25%, what do you guys think?

Afternic DOESNT report there!
DomainNameSales dont report there except annually if they actually ever did!
SEDO has a privacy option for sales!
Flippa the same!
MediaOptions rarely does
DomainHoldings Dont report there
The domain KING doesnt!
All of our private sales arent reported there!

I think I am missing a lot of guys here as well! I

 

[AEProgram]

people use namebio as they see fit, if it benefits you use it. Both buyers and sellers should be cautious like with anything else.

Example: if you are a seller and price your domain too high or too low based on namebio without realizing how if since the domain sale reported there were other transactions etc.

If you are a buyer make sure you personally go to namebio and see what the seller forgot to mention, maybe the seller hand picked what sales he shows you. And again, research ll sales by using other online tools.

Namebio has its uses but like anything it is not the answer to all, kinda like estibot.

 

[biggie]

i think it's irrelevant, you deal with the percent available:


i don't need a map to tell me which way to go.

which basically is why...

nb gets queried like a mo-fo



while those that don't know what to ask,

seek relevancy to decide.

cuz we don't care if it's priced too low

or

if it's priced too mutha freakin high


drops the mic and steps off the stage


imo...

 

[bazabizo]

i think it's irrelevant, you deal with the percent available:


i don't need a map to tell me which way to go.

which basically is why...

nb gets queried like a mo-fo



while those that don't know what to ask,

seek relevancy to decide.

cuz we don't care if it's priced too low

or

if it's priced too mutha freakin high


drops the mic and steps off the stage


imo...

???

 

[Recons.Com]

Probably 5 to 10%.

That is a fair sample size to get an idea where the market is, what sells and what price, except we don't know if it is representative enough. Meaning, are there categories that are underrepresented, are there price ranges that are underrepresented etc.

 

[bazabizo]

thats exactly why I asked! One needs to know how many LLLL.orgs sell annually to end users to know the potential in owning a 1000 for example?

 

[Recons.Com]

For LLLL.orgs, nothing reseller makes to the list, as NB reports only $100+ sales.
I have sold 6 of them to end users via Afternic in 3 months and I believe none has made it to NB. So, yes, .org sales data at NB is not representative, because absolute majority of the sales above $100 don't happen at venues that report their sales.

 

[Federer]

For West-Premium LLLL.orgs, at least 2-3% sell yearly to end users if they are priced strategically.

 

[Dorkside]

I would be surprised if more than 5% of my overall sales made it to NameBio.

 

[000]

<1%

 

[bazabizo]

guys, thanks a lot for the input, I dont care much about sales that are under $100, so lets put this aside and talk mostly about sales that are above 100, how much of these do you really think get reported? Coz I believe its low, but not as low as 1%, what do you think having said that? Thanks again for the time!

 

[DNScholar]

I think around 20-25% domain sales are reported in Namebio.
As you mentioned some Aftermarket industry/houses have their own platforms to report such sales and some have privacy.
But maybe around 50% of domain sales which happens are not reported anywhere.

 

[NameAgency]

I've brokered about $2M in the last 8-10 months. 0 reported.

 

[bmugford]

I think between all sites like NameBio.com, DNJournal, etc. it would be around 10% that are reported.

The vast majority of my sales are via Escrow.com, with some being on venues like GoDaddy, SEDO, Afternic, etc. But even on those venues like GoDaddy the sales are not publicly reported.

Brad

 

[Michael]

I'm not sure I really understand the question. Do you want people to guess the percentage that private sales make up of the entire set of domains ever sold? That's impossible due to the very nature of the question. As far as private sales go you only know your own and what other people share, but you can't know how many aren't shared. Any number anyone says is completely made up.

Even if you were friends with every single person in the domain industry and they told you every single one of their private purchases or sales, you still wouldn't be able to put out a reasonable guess because many millions of dollars in sales happen every year from people who aren't "domainers" and/or aren't active in the industry.

There are tons of companies that own domains that sell them off to email inquiries when they are no longer used. There are tons of individuals who purchased domains back in the day but only own a few and don't even know there is a domain industry. There are portfolio sales where you can't attribute a value to any one domain so they can't be included. The list goes on.

What percentage of private sales get reported to DNJournal or NameBio? I would guess an extremely small number, maybe one out of every several thousand domains sold (i.e. a tiny fraction of one percent) not even counting portfolio sales. It could be even less, as I said earlier nobody knows or can even put out an educated guess. People rarely report sales because they're either under NDA, there's limited upside in sharing other than getting exposure for your business, or they don't even know DNJ or NameBio exist. Private sales are hard to track because... well... they're private

We love it when people report sales to us, but that is just icing on the cake. Our primary goal is to track the visible aftermarket. To be your eyes so you don't have to watch nearly a dozen different marketplaces around the clock writing everything down. And we get an overwhelming majority of sales that are possible to record because they happened in public.

End user sales are so random and unpredictable that they have little value as far as data is concerned. They're mostly just cool stories that let you dream, and might help you inch a buyer up a little by citing is as a comp. But if you start basing your decisions off of random, private, end user sales you're going to get burned in short order.

So yes, we're just the tip of the iceberg, not a complete list of every domain ever sold public and private. But that doesn't make the data any less useful or actionable. You can get a good sense of wholesale prices to make smarter buys, and you can find crazy comps for practically any domain trying to convince a buyer to pay more. It's certainly a lot better than operating blindly or only based on your own transactions and experiences.

 

[Michael]

I guess in short, what I'm saying is this: Would you rather buy an LLLL.com knowing what 13,665 of them have sold for in the past year alone, or would you rather disregard our data and wing it simply because there are tens of thousands more that sold but we don't know about them?

 

[Recons.Com]

End user sales are so random and unpredictable that they have little value as far as data is concerned. They're mostly just cool stories that let you dream, and might help you inch a buyer up a little by citing is as a comp. But if you start basing your decisions off of random, private, end user sales you're going to get burned in short order.

? Why are end user sales random, unpredictable and just cool stories? 1-3% sales annually out of good quality portfolios to end users are not unheard of. Reseller sales make very tiny % of total sales for many in the industry.

 

[Michael]

? Why are end user sales random, unpredictable and just cool stories? 1-3% sales annually out of good quality portfolios to end users are not unheard of. Reseller sales make very tiny % of total sales for many in the industry.

I'm not saying the occurrence of an end user sale is random and unpredictable, I'm saying the price paid is. There are so many variables at play including how desperate the buyer is, how big their budget is, how strong the seller is, what alternatives are available and the prices of them, etc.

With all those variables, which you'll notice have nothing to do with the domain itself, the price paid is almost meaningless other than to cite it as a high comp. If you take an unreported end user sale and ask 10 experienced domain investors what they think it sold for, without saying who the buyer or seller was, you're going to get some wildly different answers. If you ask them what it sold for on NJ, you're going to get a much, much, might tighter grouping.

I've said this before, but a domain in the hands of someone like Frank Schilling is much more valuable than the exact same domain in my hands, because he has the balls and the means to ask for really high prices. Take his sale of Media.net for $500k a few years ago as an example.

What does this sale tell you, and how does this "data" help you as a domain investor? If I sold the domain I probably would have caved at $75k. Maybe you would have caved at $150k. So what does that $500k number really mean to your business? Are you going to start asking half a million bucks for all your strong dictionary.net domains? Are you going to start paying $100k for good dictionary.net domains expecting to make hundreds of thousands more in profit? I really hope not.

So what is it good for, if that sale would have been much different if anyone else owned it, and the price paid was the intersection of a bunch of different unpredictable variables? Not much, other than a cool story, and something to cite to a buyer who is inquiring on your dictionary.net domain (which probably won't make them cough up half a million or anywhere close to it). It isn't actionable data; it's like recording the winning numbers of a lottery ticket, it tells you very little.

End user sales are so "all over the place" that you can't glean much from them. I can show you a hundred other end user dictionary.net sales that were 1/10th of that price or less and everywhere in between.

Again, they're helpful to have as comps when negotiating, and we have enough of them that you can find a comp to justify practically any price point for practically any domain. But I wouldn't make any decisions based off of these random end user sales. The wholesale sales are the more predictable, reliable data. Then you say: well, if a re-seller would pay $2,500 based on the comps, I probably shouldn't sell it for less than $25k to an end user (or some other multiple where the margin works for you).

 

[Joe N]

@Michael - This is one heck of a good post. I think the newer people in this industry (like myself) need to be aware of these things.

 

[Recons.Com]

@Michael

You have to decide if NB is a platform for pretty much reseller values or ANY, including end user.

Yes, end user prices can vary wildly, but there is a pattern and range for absolute majority. I would not be interested in a tool that focuses on reseller or fast liquidation (most of auction marketplaces) prices, as those are often 2% to 10% of the true end user value of the sale, without even outliers.

Consider this. I had a top keyword .org. I posted on flippa with reserve and auction got to $5K max with couple of recycling. Before the auction I had 40K+ offer for it (a year before) and few months after the auction I got direct offer for $45K and sold. There was nothing crazy about it or no wide ranges, but if your tool would focus on flippa type of values, it would grossly undervalue the domains and I would try not to use it for my sales, as I avoid using Estibot.

 

[Joe N]

@Recons.Com - How do you suggest NameBio should go about obtaining enough confirmed end user sales to do this?

 

[B&J]

I think between all sites like NameBio.com, DNJournal, etc. it would be around 10% that are reported.

The vast majority of my sales are via Escrow.com, with some being on venues like GoDaddy, SEDO, Afternic, etc. But even on those venues like GoDaddy the sales are not publicly reported.

Brad

DNPric.es have more data, but add it slower than other reporting services.

 

[Jasonn]

out of the hundreds of domains i've sold over the years i've never reported a single one. end users don't care for it and its just too much of a hassle.

 

[B&J]

... it and its just too much of a hassle.

Unless you plan to build a strong and widely recognised agency with growing pipeline of deals. Then reporting actually helps. Many do it manually, smarter automate.

 

[Recons.Com]

@Recons.Com - How do you suggest NameBio should go about obtaining enough confirmed end user sales to do this?

Maybe they can work with escrow.com so that escrow could add a feature "report the sale to NameBio?".

The sale would be reported as "Escrow.com/Sellerssite.com" giving both promotion in exchange for sharing info and would not require extra verification/administration. DN.com could also join, probably.