Michael: Wow. All right, and every programmer that I know has an umbrella company that they use for launching all of their myriad of projects. We get ideas. We think we can solve something. We launch a project. Your company was called Image Online Design, or IOD. And in doing research on IOD, I found that IOD was the first to put in a request to run the .WEB top-level domain back in 1995. Is that correct?
Chris: Yeah, it was actually ’94 that we proposed it. We were actually the first to commercially propose a new TLD at all. There were about seven or eight people who had expressed interest, but we were the first to come along and say well, we can actually do it. .WEB was one of them along with a couple others. And honestly, it almost actually almost happened. John Postel basically said show us rough consensus in running code, we built a registry, and just as it looked like there might be some new TLDs in 1995/1996, that is when the U.S. Government stepped in and said wait a minute, this is bigger than all of you put together.
Michael: Yeah. So, I want to chat a couple of minutes about that because you talk about vision in the domain name industry for people that are able to spot domain names that have a high value, but they spotted it 20 years ago. That is what you did. If you are looking at all the new top-level domains, I think arguably people would say the most expensive real estate will be .APP because there are just so many apps. The whole app economy took over, and .WEB, which is still I believe in contention. What gave you the idea to want to run .WEB back in ’94 and earlier time period?
Chris: So, I started doing web design in ’94/’95, when it was brand new, and I kind of saw the value there. I saw where it was going to be going. A lot of people were thinking this is just going to be online brochures, and it was quite clear to me that we were going to have more away. Being a William Gibson fan at the time, I had the whole Cyberpunk vision in my head.
So, we started doing websites. That is what Image Online did. We did websites for auto dealers, for local businesses. Being in a college town, where everybody was on the Internet, there were actually a lot of people who could use a website. One day, I am writing a check to Network Solutions for three thousand dollars for 30 domain names, because back then it was one hundred dollars for two years. It was 50 bucks per year. You had to pay in two-year increments.
Michael: Right.
Chris: I am writing this check and I am thinking okay, this is idiotic. I can run a zone file just like the next guy. Why don’t I just create my own .COM zone file and we bifurcate the thing? And then I start thinking about DNS and I am thinking no, that is not going to work. It would have to be a separate domain. And then, at that point, who cares what it is? I just shot off an email to John Postel and Diana and said, “This is ridiculous. I would like to run my own top-level, but there is no facility in the registration template to say I want to be at the top level, not at a second level.”
And he came back and said, “Oh, you noticed that, did you?” And so, he said, “Well, which one would you want to run – just I am curious -, and we can work on this.” I actually came up with .AUTO, .CAR, and .WEB, because we had been doing a lot for auto dealers. And actually I proposed to a couple the auto manufacturers. You want dot whatever your brand is.
Michael. BRAND.
Chris: So, I came up with that too, and I had no clue what I was talking about.
Michael: Right. Exactly, because they barely understood the web at that point.
Chris: Right. Right.
Michael: Yeah.
Chris: So, that is where it all started.
Michael: So, you started the conversation, but there was no formal application process like ICANN set forth in preparing for the latest round of the gTLDs in 2012. What happened to your application between when you put in that request in 1995 and then, in 2012, when a bunch of companies put in an application for 2012?
Chris: Yeah, so I will compress a lot of stuff. The TLDR version. So, in the early ’90s, it was proposed that there would be a modest two-thousand-dollar application fee to cover costs. We put together the application, which was based on the initial domain registration template that Network Solutions was using. Network Solutions, which later became VeriSign. We enclosed a check and put it in an envelope. Gave it to John, who said, “I am going to put this on the stack of papers for when the time is right to start doing applications.”
And we asked him. We said, “Can we give this to you now so that we do not waste time, and this establishes some priority.”
Michael: Right.
Chris: And then he said sure. After the government came along, the envelope was returned to us. John Postel claimed that he never knew what was in the envelope and we slipped it into a stack of papers, yet his note returning it said, “With the government being involved, your applications is being returned.” Well, if he did not know what was in it, how did he know it is an application?
Michael: Right.
Chris: And there have been court cases and this came out in court. So, in 2000, ICANN had their round. We applied for .WEB. So did Affilias. So did NewStar. Affilias, as we know, was given .INFO. NewStar was given .BIZ. Nobody was given .WEB and Vince Surf went on the record, and you can always go back and watch the videos. He said, “We may not be approving IO Design today, but I am not comfortable giving .WEB to anybody else because they were the pioneer.” Anybody who applied in 2000 would be considered application pending, not denied, so we are approving these seven. All the rest of you, you are still pending. Let’s see how the seven go and we will revisit it later.”
And so, some 12 years later, after touching every continent except Antarctica, going to every ICANN meeting, they came along with a round in 2012, or when they started that round, and they essentially said everybody who applied in 2000, been nice knowing you. Please go pound sand.
Michael: Yeah, and you decided at that point not to put an application in, in that round.
Chris: We chose that because ICANN said if you apply, you must sign this waiver saying you have no rights from the previous round.
Michael: Right, and you were not willing to do that of course because you had been through so much.
Chris: Sure seems like for me.
Michael: Yeah, of course. And so, I went to ICANN’s website yesterday because I could not remember what the status of the .WEB top-level domain is and it looks like it is in some sort of locked state. I cannot remember the number. It has probably ten or 15 applicants, one of which I think is a holding company for Google, if I am not incorrect.
Chris: Google is involved. I believe Donuts has an application in. I mean there are a bunch.
Michael: There are a bunch, yeah.
Chris: It was of the opinion it was going to go for the most money in the ICANN auction of last resort because I do not think those guys will agree amongst themselves. With the 41.5-million-dollar .SHOP sale yesterday or a couple of days ago, I think it might be second most. I think that 41.5 million might shock some people into more rational valuations, but I still think ICANN is going to collect upwards of 25 million dollars for it.
Michael: Yeah, wow.
Chris: I would like one percent, please.
