SCAMMED ALERT!!! Members Beware !!! Bidding on Non Existed Domain Name on an Auction?

[master9888]

NO SCAMMED ALERT! Just Bad Business Ethics.

I want to Re-Alert All members that my recent posting as below mentions, is now taken back. I wish to put the issue behind me as the owner as make a full refund of my losses inclusive of my upgrade premium membership with their site. There is No Scammed. It is Just Bad Business Ethics.

I would like to Alert all NamePros forum users and Members to beware when Bidding at BargainDomains.com which was owned by Domaining.com.

I had a very Bad experience over there. Just two days ago I won a Bid on a domain called butnet.com for $55.00. I received an email from Francois Carrillo
Cybertonic CEO of bargaindomains.com to pay for the domains names that I won by Paypal. Payment must included another 4% Paypal Service Fees which Total to @ $57.20.

After making payment, I received an email from the a "So Called Domain owner" stating that the domain names does not belong to her. Confused, about the email I email Cybertonic CEO about this.

A few minutes latter, I received another email from them asking me to make payment and that they have zero tolerance for Buyer to dont pay-up. Instead of replying to my predicament about the issue raise before them, they are just more interested on money and just happy trigger to push or demand customer to pay up. I was annoyed and shoot another email to them asking for explanation and demand them to deliver the service ( Domain name that I just paid for ) and asking them to be responsible for failing to practice due diligence by putting a BOGUS Domain Name up on their Auction Sites, confusing the member of the public, and wasting everybody time and money.

After 30 mins they refunded my money without the courtesy of any explanation and without adding Paypal service fee which made me to suffer a $2.20 lost on receiving Paypal Refund. A very arrogant and Bad Business ethics and customer service they have.

After threatening and demanding them for an explanation, they reply with an admission and apologies . Just short arrogant explanation. Vey-very Bad customer service.

I demand them that I do not want the Money, I want the domain name butnet.com to be delivered to me with all cost, as I have paid for it, for I will only accept an apology if it was make public in their website not privately in my email as the issues are a concerned of public interest. I do not want other Bidder to suffer like me because of their failure to verify the authenticity of the domain names they put up for sale. I also demand them to put in place fraud prevention system to avoid future happening. As usual No response and No reply from them after that

I shoot another email requesting them to explain and refunded back my loses, or I will be force to take action against them and I will use the power of internet in all viral form to warned all net citizen to beware of Bidding on the auction site.

As usual they don't bother to response or they just don't care.

I really would like to convey my greatest regret in using their service at BargainDomains.com, as not only their Customer Service are below Par, They just don't have the business ethics and treat customer like scumbag.

I seek advised from members here on how can I go about to take legal action against them, or is there a place where I can make a complaint.

I also seek the assistance of members here to virally spread the news, and alert all members to beware bidding for domain names at BargainDomains.com as You will land on a names that don't exist. Very Ironic, A Domain Website putting a non-existence Domain Names for Auction, Who Should Be responsible?:?

 

[sleepysentry]

That is very unfortunate. Auction sites do not always work hard enough to verify domain ownership. Right now I'm having an issue with Afternic because I registered an expired domain, but a previous owner had listed it on the site and it is still there under that person's account.

Good luck in getting this sorted out!

 

[master9888]

That is very unfortunate. Auction sites do not always work hard enough to verify domain ownership. Right now I'm having an issue with Afternic because I registered an expired domain, but a previous owner had listed it on the site and it is still there under that person's account.

Good luck in getting this sorted out!

thnaks for sharing your experience, I had many issue also with Godaddy, Not once but 12 issues of registering and paid for a domain names with them, they confirmed my registration and their domain by proxy also confirmed my registration, but after a few hours they email me and informed that it was an error. This registration company really don't care about customer, all they care is Money.

 

[owntype]

I have been using their auction service once in the past. I assume there were only a few bidders involved since the highest bid was pretty low but the domain name is quality. The domain name I watched got removed from the auction list in the last few minutes before auction ends. This do let me down because I have been watching on the domain name for days.

I sent Francois an email and asked why the domain is removed. I got the following reply in the next day.

The seller has been banned yesterday and the auction cancelled as he sold the domain out the auction.

Sorry,

I must find ways to avoid such bad practices, maybe asking seller to pay a guarantee bid when their name is on auction or something like that.

I believe Francois is one of the trustworthy domainers in this industry and I did a pleasure private deal with him in the past. The major issue BargainDomains has is it's lack of bidders/visitors. When quality domains without reserves ended at a low price, the dishonest sellers are not willing to work it out and back out of the deal.

 

[master9888]

I have been using their auction service once in the past. I assume there were only a few bidders involved since the highest bid was pretty low but the domain name is quality. The domain name I watched got removed from the auction list in the last few minutes before auction ends. This do let me down because I have been watching on the domain name for days.

I sent Francois an email and asked why the domain is removed. I got the following reply in the next day.



I believe Francois is one of the trustworthy domainers in this industry and I did a pleasure private deal with him in the past. The major issue BargainDomains has is it's lack of bidders/visitors. When quality domains without reserves ended at a low price, the dishonest sellers are not willing to work it out and back out of the deal.

Lucky for you cus u have not paid for the domain and announce as a winner and being ask to pay for something that don't exist. Thanks for sharing your personally experience with the CEO and trying to uphold his integrity as a good domainer. But you must agree with me that in business we must pratice due diligent and strict business ethics.

The must in place a fraud prevention measure, eg: once buyer won a domain names, they must contact the seller first and push the domain name in their account, eg Godaddy etc first, then they contact the Bidding to seek for payment, not just happy trigger asking bidder to pay and at the end the domain names does not exist at all.

Is is so ironic to have a website putting in the auction listing domains that they do not know exist. They just failed to provide the very essence of the service they are offering on their site, that is auction domains. Now how can You and I or even the CEO sure that their current auction listing domains names EXIST?

 

[SlimPickins]

master9888, first off.... welcome to the forum!

secondly, although I can certainly understand, and respect, your frustration at how this auction panned out, I think that this is more an opportunity to be grateful that you did not actually get scammed AND is an opportunity for you to, constructively, help Francois make his platform even better RATHER than launching a "viral" smear campaign.

1) regarding "almost" buying a domain from someone that wasn't actually the registrant..... consider if that person had listed it for sale on the forums and you paid them directly for it but of course never received it, your situation would be much worse than it is now.

2) deadbeat buyers and sellers exist, unfortunately, on most (if not every) venue.....

3) I do agree that it would have at least been less complicated (and saved you the PP fees) had Francois first requested and received the domain prior to asking for payment, but perhaps the system is such that he secures payment, ensures the seller payment has been received and provides the details for a direct push to you and that is why payment was requested first......

4) I also have only had positive transactions with Francois and sincerely doubt that, if you are polite and constructive in explaining to him about the issue of the refund being less than you paid to honor your part of the deal, he would refuse to refund you completely... he isn't interested in skimming $2 on a deal gone bad.

So, again, although I can respect your frustration, I really hope you can shift it from venting on a person that truly brings so much to the domain industry and make the best of it. SP

 

[agentscarn]

master9888, first off.... welcome to the forum!

secondly, although I can certainly understand, and respect, your frustration at how this auction panned out, I think that this is more an opportunity to be grateful that you did not actually get scammed AND is an opportunity for you to, constructively, help Francois make his platform even better RATHER than launching a "viral" smear campaign.

1) regarding "almost" buying a domain from someone that wasn't actually the registrant..... consider if that person had listed it for sale on the forums and you paid them directly for it but of course never received it, your situation would be much worse than it is now.

2) deadbeat buyers and sellers exist, unfortunately, on most (if not every) venue.....

3) I do agree that it would have at least been less complicated (and saved you the PP fees) had Francois first requested and received the domain prior to asking for payment, but perhaps the system is such that he secures payment, ensures the seller payment has been received and provides the details for a direct push to you and that is why payment was requested first......

4) I also have only had positive transactions with Francois and sincerely doubt that, if you are polite and constructive in explaining to him about the issue of the refund being less than you paid to honor your part of the deal, he would refuse to refund you completely... he isn't interested in skimming $2 on a deal gone bad.

So, again, although I can respect your frustration, I really hope you can shift it from venting on a person that truly brings so much to the domain industry and make the best of it. SP

Nicely put Slim. Doesn't sound at all like a scam to me. I'm sure once Francois is aware of the $2 difference that a refund will be taken care of promptly.

 

[Sparhawke]

Didn't you just post this a short while ago on Noomle?

I would be careful about ranting on every forum, someone might just want to make an example out of you.

 

[master9888]

master9888, first off.... welcome to the forum!

secondly, although I can certainly understand, and respect, your frustration at how this auction panned out, I think that this is more an opportunity to be grateful that you did not actually get scammed AND is an opportunity for you to, constructively, help Francois make his platform even better RATHER than launching a "viral" smear campaign.

1) regarding "almost" buying a domain from someone that wasn't actually the registrant..... consider if that person had listed it for sale on the forums and you paid them directly for it but of course never received it, your situation would be much worse than it is now.

2) deadbeat buyers and sellers exist, unfortunately, on most (if not every) venue.....

3) I do agree that it would have at least been less complicated (and saved you the PP fees) had Francois first requested and received the domain prior to asking for payment, but perhaps the system is such that he secures payment, ensures the seller payment has been received and provides the details for a direct push to you and that is why payment was requested first......

4) I also have only had positive transactions with Francois and sincerely doubt that, if you are polite and constructive in explaining to him about the issue of the refund being less than you paid to honor your part of the deal, he would refuse to refund you completely... he isn't interested in skimming $2 on a deal gone bad.

So, again, although I can respect your frustration, I really hope you can shift it from venting on a person that truly brings so much to the domain industry and make the best of it. SP

Dear SlimPickins, first I would like to thanks you for your constructive comments, and agreed with you on some point.

I know that the CEO of BargainDomains.com are not trying to skim me of the petty $2 on my PP transaction fee, but my frustration was more on how I was treated as a customer.

Francois (If That the Name of the CEO) Must know how to handle such delicate situation diligently. As a CEO, he must maintained good customer service to his unhappy client and must offer comfort and some reassurance. REMEMBER, I paid for the service of upgrading to Premium Member on their site, so I expect them to deliver a fundamental service which are actually offering. They failed and choose to ignore that.

I email them, seeking them to be responsible and I do not expect just a refund, I expect delivery of what was paid for.

I agreed with you that at least I was not scammed buying domains in forum, I wont do that without an esrow service in forum and buying from total strangers.

I am not trying to smear his reputation through viral means whatsover, but its really annoying being just shut in the dark, they refuse to answer my all email after a refunding my money less PP fees, they only reply they made was sorry! Do You think sorry will cure the pain? I am sorry if I bumb into you, no hard feeling,No Harm Done. No Money Paid etc. But for GOD sake they are running a business of offering domain Names for Auction and are charging people for the service, they should have the decency to treat their customers more professionally, especially a customer who are injured by their lack of due diligent. They should confront the issue maturely, But instead they choose to hide and ignoring me. Is that a good business ethics.

I must warned potential domain buyer about the same treatment they might face with such website owner who cares only money and not they welfare of their customers. If its happened to me, it can happened to anyone out there, so people must be warned to beware, they might bid on a bogus domain on auction, paying for it only afterwards realizing that it does not exist.

I may not known Mr Francois personally like you Guys out there, Good for you if you think he has done much in the domain industry, but he is not doing it for FREE, he charge, so went you charge for a service you must be able to delivered. Especially if you are called a CEO.

Everyone is entitle to his opinion, To you guys Mr. Francois the CEO is a good character, to you maybe, but my first impression of him and his people and his service is below Par, No ethics and they only know how to timidly hide behind shadow and ignore their customer problems. Is that good business ethics.

Anyway, I really from the bottom of my heart appreciate your comments and advice, your comments are fair and I take it that you are very wise and experience.

Lastly,just a piece of advise : if you are in the domain industry offering such such as our Mr CEO, Pls treat customer more professionally. If there are problem customer face, guide the customer along all they way untill it is solve with the customer don't just choose to hide under a skirts and ignore the customer in the dark. After all, customer are the ones who puts food in our dinning table.

Regards

Master Andy

---------- Post added at 04:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:55 AM ----------

Didn't you just post this a short while ago on Noomle?

I would be careful about ranting on every forum, someone might just want to make an example out of you.

Yes, as I have warned the site owner that I will alert every forum site that I am a member to it, seeking members to beware.

Anyway, I have choose to put things behind me now as I have just received a full refund from the owner.

---------- Post added at 04:40 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:05 AM ----------

I would like to Alert all NamePros forum users and Members to beware when Bidding at BargainDomains.com which was owned by Domaining.com.

I had a very Bad experience over there. Just two days ago I won a Bid on a domain called butnet.com for $55.00. I received an email from Francois Carrillo
Cybertonic CEO of bargaindomains.com to pay for the domains names that I won by Paypal. Payment must included another 4% Paypal Service Fees which Total to @ $57.20.

After making payment, I received an email from the a "So Called Domain owner" stating that the domain names does not belong to her. Confused, about the email I email Cybertonic CEO about this.

A few minutes latter, I received another email from them asking me to make payment and that they have zero tolerance for Buyer to dont pay-up. Instead of replying to my predicament about the issue raise before them, they are just more interested on money and just happy trigger to push or demand customer to pay up. I was annoyed and shoot another email to them asking for explanation and demand them to deliver the service ( Domain name that I just paid for ) and asking them to be responsible for failing to practice due diligence by putting a BOGUS Domain Name up on their Auction Sites, confusing the member of the public, and wasting everybody time and money.

After 30 mins they refunded my money without the courtesy of any explanation and without adding Paypal service fee which made me to suffer a $2.20 lost on receiving Paypal Refund. A very arrogant and Bad Business ethics and customer service they have.

After threatening and demanding them for an explanation, they reply with an admission and apologies . Just short arrogant explanation. Vey-very Bad customer service.

I demand them that I do not want the Money, I want the domain name butnet.com to be delivered to me with all cost, as I have paid for it, for I will only accept an apology if it was make public in their website not privately in my email as the issues are a concerned of public interest. I do not want other Bidder to suffer like me because of their failure to verify the authenticity of the domain names they put up for sale. I also demand them to put in place fraud prevention system to avoid future happening. As usual No response and No reply from them after that

I shoot another email requesting them to explain and refunded back my loses, or I will be force to take action against them and I will use the power of internet in all viral form to warned all net citizen to beware of Bidding on the auction site.

As usual they don't bother to response or they just don't care.

I really would like to convey my greatest regret in using their service at BargainDomains.com, as not only their Customer Service are below Par, They just don't have the business ethics and treat customer like scumbag.

I seek advised from members here on how can I go about to take legal action against them, or is there a place where I can make a complaint.

I also seek the assistance of members here to virally spread the news, and alert all members to beware bidding for domain names at BargainDomains.com as You will land on a names that don't exist. Very Ironic, A Domain Website putting a non-existence Domain Names for Auction, Who Should Be responsible?:?

:wave: I wish To Re-Alert Everyone in this Forums that I have decided to put this issue behind me Now as the Site Owner has Fully Refund All my losses including my Membership Premium Upgrade. There are No Scammed, It is only Bad Business Ethics.

 

[kbm]

Go to hear, never shy away from posting when a deals goes bad, regardless of what anybody thinks.

thanks for the update.

 

[master9888]

Go to hear, never shy away from posting when a deals goes bad, regardless of what anybody thinks.

thanks for the update.

thanks for the encouragement.

 

[SlimPickins]

glad, and not surprised, to hear you got a full refund

but I still disagree that it is bad business ethics, but rather an unfortunate incident which could happen on any domain venue.... and possibly a result of a combination of your quick, and possibly aggresive emails (ie demanding not a refund but the domain you thought you purchased, which obviously is not within his control to deliver if the seller was a fraud.... not like he can just go and pay "whatever it takes" from the legitimate owner to make you happy), the fact that English is (I assume) neither your native language nor that of Francois and the fact that, aside from the embarrassing "hiccup" in the system and your refund being incomplete, there was no burning theft/fraud to be dealt with (in comparison to if you had paid $55, $555 or $5550 for a domain, received it only to have it yanked away by someone claiming account hijacking......

btw, you mentioned that, shortly after payment, the domain "owner" contacted you and said they do not actually own the domain.... can you elaborate? Do you mean the "seller" contacted you, although you sent the payment to Francois as intermediary, and said they can't sell it since it's not theirs? Or the person listed in whois, who somehow became aware of the "fraudulent" sale contacted you to alert you? The reason I ask is, in retrospect and with the limited facts, the point that owntype came to mind that maybe the seller is indeed the owner but, being reluctant to sell at that price, claims that they don't really own the domain to get out of it...... just a thought.

 

[master9888]

Yes Full Refund Received Only after Aggressive Persuasion

glad, and not surprised, to hear you got a full refund

but I still disagree that it is bad business ethics, but rather an unfortunate incident which could happen on any domain venue.... and possibly a result of a combination of your quick, and possibly aggresive emails (ie demanding not a refund but the domain you thought you purchased, which obviously is not within his control to deliver if the seller was a fraud.... not like he can just go and pay "whatever it takes" from the legitimate owner to make you happy), the fact that English is (I assume) neither your native language nor that of Francois and the fact that, aside from the embarrassing "hiccup" in the system and your refund being incomplete, there was no burning theft/fraud to be dealt with (in comparison to if you had paid $55, $555 or $5550 for a domain, received it only to have it yanked away by someone claiming account hijacking......

btw, you mentioned that, shortly after payment, the domain "owner" contacted you and said they do not actually own the domain.... can you elaborate? Do you mean the "seller" contacted you, although you sent the payment to Francois as intermediary, and said they can't sell it since it's not theirs? Or the person listed in whois, who somehow became aware of the "fraudulent" sale contacted you to alert you? The reason I ask is, in retrospect and with the limited facts, the point that owntype came to mind that maybe the seller is indeed the owner but, being reluctant to sell at that price, claims that they don't really own the domain to get out of it...... just a thought.

Yes Full Refund received only after aggressive persuasion. It come in a bit late, only after a bell Rings. How I wish He could have responded to me earlier and get this issue resolve amicable. He was warned to respond to my email but choose to shut me completely. I have no alternative but to go public. I 'm not a fussy customer, I just want reassurance.

All customers wanted was to felt that they are important,especially A paid customer who did not get what was paid for, and site owner has the responsibility to ensure to walk the customer through in the ordeal. If a worried or injured customer email you and complaint for not getting what he paid for, you cannot called the email from that customer harassing email. Please find the true meaning of harassing in the English dictionary. If The customer tone in his email is a bit harsh, you must understand, why the customer is reacting in that manner, he felt cheated, he has all the right to be angry.

Don't all person who paid for a service or product has the right to get what was paid for. That is the basic law of contract. Imagine you bought a car and only after that told by the car salesman that the car was stolen, and he cannot deliver.

A person entering into a contract must have the responsibility to deliver was was paid for initially. That is a basic obligatory responsibility. If you failed to deliver because of whatsover reasons dont you thinks that you need to offer the customer alternative solutions and some sort of compensation in anyway that is, eg: In consideration of the losses suffered to offer him a FREE one year extended subscriptions upgrade etc to the site.

Of course You must make the customer Happy, It is your customer, if you dont make your customer happy who else you expect make the customer happy, your competitors? Making customer happy must be within your reach. Yes I demanded a delivery of the named paid for. That was my basic rights, I am totally not wrong for asking so. He can tone me down by offering alternative solutions, not just refunding back my money and shut me up. That what I mean Bad business ethics.

In regards to the seller, I thinks he email me first, telling me not to pay for the domain, as it does not belong to him, its is a typo error, but because he could not cancelled the transaction as the is no options button to do so, and to add insult to injury BargainDomains.com site does not offer any contact information for customer to contact them or communicate and the seller do not have options. I only realize this after I make payment to Francois. As I did not recognize the email the seller sent me in my hundreds of email received every day. I only look for familiar email eg Domaining etc. This is a weakness of bargaindomains.com failed to provided contact information, what a business who dont offer contact info and just collect money, once that I know is usually the quick rich scheme website..

What piss me off, why cant Mr CEO, contact the owner first before happy trigger asking me to make payment, at lease the owner/seller can communicate and informed him of his predicament, and I dont have to be a victim of mr CEO in competents way of handling business.

After Making payment and realizing this issue from the seller, I email Mr CEO. The reply I received from Mr CEO was not about addressing the issue but instead an email asking me to make payment and they have zero tolerance for buyer who did not pay up.

So you see what type of impression I encounter with Mr CEO, after that I alerted mr CEO about the issue to updates himself about the issue not just demanding or HARASSING PAYMENT FROM BUYER.

Then only I received Payapal refund without any explanation. Is that Rude, or simply arrogant way to conduct business, simply ignoring customer.

Since, Mr CEO does not want to communicate with me, my email had to be harsh and demanding, because I think Mr CEO is Lack of business courtesy and ethics.

Then only I received a short email from Mr CEO saying that everyone is to be blamed. How could he add insult to injury. How could he say EVERYONE was to be Blamed. I for once cannot be blamed. Accept your short coming and mistake and apologies sincerely and offer solutions to solve my problem, not to include me as a party to be blamed.

That was the last email, I received from Mr CEO. I wrote him an email after email and he just refuse to ignore. He is ignoring a customer.

Its is only after aggressive campaign of alerting people online that I received the full refund. So, if You still disagree that that is a bad business ethics, then I presumed that you will also act like mr CEO in handling with your customer. ( I was just about thinking to add my domain in your site, as I have over 1650 domain names in my portfolio ) but if you carry such business philosophy like Mr CEO BargainDomain. I will certainly avoid your site for 1million miles away.

Sorry,I am not trying to offend you, just being straight forward. Business must carry with us responsibilities. That all I asking for, after all I am paying for the service.:D

 

[SlimPickins]

master9888,

since you have put this behind you I will too after these last thoughts, since I never intended my input to be construed as defense/justification of how the situation came to be or was handled or to downplay your feelings of being slighted as a customer.... I only wanted to offer input, from an outside perspective, of how it could have come to be, ask questions to clarify how the situation unfolded and to give suggestions about what you both could do, constructively, to make the best of the situation.

1) I agree that, if it truly was the case, allowing a domain to be falsely listed is something that needs to be improved. I am sure that Francois would agree and would be open to any (constructive) suggestions you might have to help improve the system. However, again, this can happen on even the "big" venues too. It certainly can and has happened that someone with a domain listed on SEDO sells it elsewhere but forgets to remove it from their sedo account and, forgetting this, pushes an offer on said domain to auction. I am sure that SEDO would not "buy the domain at all costs" to appease the buyer, and is highly unlikely they would offer any "compensation" such as free featured listings or reduced escrow fee etc for it either.

2) I also agree with your point about the minimal communication being less than ideal customer service. However, as I mentioned before, there are factors going into this, most of which only you and Francois know, that make it hard to "judge", namely:
+) WHEN the correspondence was. You have to take into consideration timezone differences (you are in Singapore, he is in France), and the fact that it is normal to receive answers during WEEKDAY business hours (again using SEDO as comparison, forget about closing a deal on a weekend or afterhours), not necessarily within 30 minutes of your email regardless of when sent.
+) how OFTEN/quickly you send, and expect immediate replies for, emails.
+) and again, as mentioned before, language differences can come into play. Although your English is quite good, you have also in these posts said things backwards/incorrectly and, given that English is also not his native language, the time it might take to formulate a response increases.
+) the TONE of the messages. I agree that a business should strive to make their customers satisfied and fulfill their expectations. However, there is a big difference between communicating with someone that, professionally, accurately and patiently voices a grievance and attempting to engage with someone that

demand them that I do not want the Money, I want the domain name butnet.com to be delivered to me with all cost, as I have paid for it

and demands them

to explain and refunded back my loses, or I will be force to take action against them and I will use the power of internet in all viral form to warned all net citizen

.... obviously such powerful language and threats requires a well thought out response.

3) your point about saving you the time and trouble and requesting the domain from the seller prior to requesting payment makes sense, however, again using SEDO as a reference, it is the standard procedure for the mediating party to secure payment BEFORE requesting transfer of the domain.

4) Regarding this:

All customers wanted was to felt that they are important,especially A paid customer who did not get what was paid for, and site owner has the responsibility to ensure to walk the customer through in the ordeal. If a worried or injured customer email you and complaint for not getting what he paid for, you cannot called the email from that customer harassing email. Please find the true meaning of harassing in the English dictionary. If The customer tone in his email is a bit harsh, you must understand, why the customer is reacting in that manner, he felt cheated, he has all the right to be angry.

Don't all person who paid for a service or product has the right to get what was paid for. That is the basic law of contract.... A person entering into a contract must have the responsibility to deliver was was paid for initially. That is a basic obligatory responsibility. If you failed to deliver because of whatsover reasons dont you thinks that you need to offer the customer alternative solutions and some sort of compensation in anyway that is, eg: In consideration of the losses suffered to offer him a FREE one year extended subscriptions upgrade etc to the site.

Of course You must make the customer Happy, It is your customer, if you dont make your customer happy who else you expect make the customer happy, your competitors? Making customer happy must be within your reach. Yes I demanded a delivery of the named paid for. That was my basic rights, I am totally not wrong for asking so. He can tone me down by offering alternative solutions, not just refunding back my money and shut me up. That what I mean Bad business ethics.

-> I never used the word harassing, I said aggressive.
-> I agree a business should strive to make their customers happy and, even if difficult to hear, listen to their frustrations and attempt to find a workable solution. However, your expectations/demands remind me of someone that finds a hair in their food at a restaurant..... if that person stands up, shouting, outraged and INSISTS on the meal being free and/or coupons for next time, the manager very well may do this (more to shut the guy up and hope he doesn't come back) but if that same person simply waves down a waiter and informs them of the mistake I am POSITIVE that the waiter/manager would make it right by comping the meal/free desserts/coupons etc.
-> you may want to read over the TOS for the site, but I doubt that it states you enter into a contract with bargaindomains for the transaction. Like, once again, SEDO and other platforms, if one party or the other doesn't complete their end of the deal (ie buyer doesn't pay or seller doesn't own domain or refuses to transfer it), the injured party cannot sue sedo for damages but rather only receives the defaulting members info and can choose to pursue them for damages on their own.

5) I also keep coming back to why the seller waited until AFTER the auction to contact you directly to say that the domain was a mistake/typo and they cannot sell it, so you should not pay for it. That, to me, is VERY suspicious.... almost sounds like they were hoping you would just not pay for it and then YOU were the one that breached the contract, rather than them. Just a thought.

So, in short, regardless of whether the domain was a faulty listing that, ideally, should have been detected when listed, or a result of a seller being unwilling to sell at that price, how the communication went between you two was not ideal. I respect your wanting things to be made right (within reason) and your desire to protect, if necessary, other people if indeed this is status quo on the site (which I doubt)..... but, MAYBE, just maybe, the whole situation could have been solved in a much more productive, professional and amicable way. Not that I am a pro, but here is an example of how the dialogue could have gone.

1 you win the auction and receive instruction to pay. you do so.
2 you receive an email directly from the seller stating they cannot sell the domain as the listing was a typo.
---> you FORWARD this email to Francois, asking him to retain your funds and to look into this. Specifically: does this seller have any other domains listed for sale and, if so, does the whois info actually indeed match that of this domain, why did the seller contact the buyer, rather than contacting admin to end the auction early and, very importantly, to ask the seller what domain they MEANT to list (and allegedly mistyped) and check whois info to compare contact info of alleged domain and sold domain to registration info on bargain domains.
3 if indeed it was an accidental mistype, he refunds you entirely (and, who knows, throws in a few compensation prizes for the help and understanding) and decides what action to take with seller. If it turns out to be the case that the seller is actually only looking for a way out of the deal, you now have Francois on your side to secure the domain and, if they refuse, would likely provide relevant info to legally pursue the seller as well as ban them from the platform.

Again, just a thought.

In closing, I appreciate you taking the time to check out my site and consideration of listing domains there... however, that is not an option (the "sell domains" page only lists what domains I would personally be interested in buying) since I only sell my own domains for this very reason: I do not want the stress or potential liability of ensuring the listings of others there are accurate and/or up to date.

Well, those were my last thoughts on this. I am glad it worked out in the end though. SP

 

[master9888]

master9888,

Dear Mr SlimPickins/Snappy Domain. First Let me express my sincere appreciation, thanks and gratitude for taking the time and effort to reply to my comments and suggested a very constructive point of view.

I Fully Regrets my impulsive action of going public trying to Alert Members about BargainDomains.com. After Refunding back all moneys inclusive of my membership Upgrades including PP Fees, Mr Fancois email me personally and explained his situation and his limitation most vividly. After receiving that email I was touched by his sincerity, honesty and trustworthiness and the situation he is in. He is certainly not a scammer nor he is a con artist, He is what You said He is, a Man full with integrity and suddenly I felt a bondage towards him and realize that I have done him wrong. I truly Admit I was wrong of being too impulsive in my approached towards Mr. Francois, I thought I was ignored by those Big Corporations who are just Arrogant towards their customer. I did not know Fancois limitation, not until he vividly informed me by email recently. I Totally Regret what has happened, and I should fully agreed with you, about time factor, communication/language barrier are contributing factors.

since you have put this behind you I will too after these last thoughts, since I never intended my input to be construed as defense/justification of how the situation came to be or was handled or to downplay your feelings of being slighted as a customer.... I only wanted to offer input, from an outside perspective, of how it could have come to be, ask questions to clarify how the situation unfolded and to give suggestions about what you both could do, constructively, to make the best of the situation.

1) I agree that, if it truly was the case, allowing a domain to be falsely listed is something that needs to be improved. I am sure that Francois would agree and would be open to any (constructive) suggestions you might have to help improve the system. However, again, this can happen on even the "big" venues too. It certainly can and has happened that someone with a domain listed on SEDO sells it elsewhere but forgets to remove it from their sedo account and, forgetting this, pushes an offer on said domain to auction. I am sure that SEDO would not "buy the domain at all costs" to appease the buyer, and is highly unlikely they would offer any "compensation" such as free featured listings or reduced escrow fee etc for it either.

I truly admire your comments, and insight into this issues because you truly state the facts and to the point, your argument are fare and justify. How I wish, if every businessman is like you, the business world will be a best environment ever. This is my honest compliment from the bottom of my heart. Maybe I am not into Forum Life like now and this is my first time in a Forum, but I find it truly amazing, how a member in this forum like you would take all the trouble and time to offer insight and constructive comments. I have infact learned much from your comments throughout this incident. May be it is a blessing in disguise. I never know forum life until this incident, that I start registering in forum in the hope to alert members, but the way I look at things now is that I'm the one who need to be Alerted of maintaining my compassion and patience towards events that may annoy me whatsoever. Again Let me express my sincere Thanks to you for teaching me the most valuable of life experiences.

2) I also agree with your point about the minimal communication being less than ideal customer service. However, as I mentioned before, there are factors going into this, most of which only you and Francois know, that make it hard to "judge", namely:
+) WHEN the correspondence was. You have to take into consideration timezone differences (you are in Singapore, he is in France), and the fact that it is normal to receive answers during WEEKDAY business hours (again using SEDO as comparison, forget about closing a deal on a weekend or afterhours), not necessarily within 30 minutes of your email regardless of when sent.
+) how OFTEN/quickly you send, and expect immediate replies for, emails.
+) and again, as mentioned before, language differences can come into play. Although your English is quite good, you have also in these posts said things backwards/incorrectly and, given that English is also not his native language, the time it might take to formulate a response increases.
+) the TONE of the messages. I agree that a business should strive to make their customers satisfied and fulfill their expectations. However, there is a big difference between communicating with someone that, professionally, accurately and patiently voices a grievance and attempting to engage with someone that and demands them .... obviously such powerful language and threats requires a well thought out response.

3) your point about saving you the time and trouble and requesting the domain from the seller prior to requesting payment makes sense, however, again using SEDO as a reference, it is the standard procedure for the mediating party to secure payment BEFORE requesting transfer of the domain.

4) Regarding this:

-> I never used the word harassing, I said aggressive.
-> I agree a business should strive to make their customers happy and, even if difficult to hear, listen to their frustrations and attempt to find a workable solution. However, your expectations/demands remind me of someone that finds a hair in their food at a restaurant..... if that person stands up, shouting, outraged and INSISTS on the meal being free and/or coupons for next time, the manager very well may do this (more to shut the guy up and hope he doesn't come back) but if that same person simply waves down a waiter and informs them of the mistake I am POSITIVE that the waiter/manager would make it right by comping the meal/free desserts/coupons etc.
-> you may want to read over the TOS for the site, but I doubt that it states you enter into a contract with bargaindomains for the transaction. Like, once again, SEDO and other platforms, if one party or the other doesn't complete their end of the deal (ie buyer doesn't pay or seller doesn't own domain or refuses to transfer it), the injured party cannot sue sedo for damages but rather only receives the defaulting members info and can choose to pursue them for damages on their own.

I know, you did not used the words "harassing"it was actually words I quote from Mr Francois, it was not your words.

5) I also keep coming back to why the seller waited until AFTER the auction to contact you directly to say that the domain was a mistake/typo and they cannot sell it, so you should not pay for it. That, to me, is VERY suspicious.... almost sounds like they were hoping you would just not pay for it and then YOU were the one that breached the contract, rather than them. Just a thought.

So, in short, regardless of whether the domain was a faulty listing that, ideally, should have been detected when listed, or a result of a seller being unwilling to sell at that price, how the communication went between you two was not ideal. I respect your wanting things to be made right (within reason) and your desire to protect, if necessary, other people if indeed this is status quo on the site (which I doubt)..... but, MAYBE, just maybe, the whole situation could have been solved in a much more productive, professional and amicable way. Not that I am a pro, but here is an example of how the dialogue could have gone.

1 you win the auction and receive instruction to pay. you do so.
2 you receive an email directly from the seller stating they cannot sell the domain as the listing was a typo.
---> you FORWARD this email to Francois, asking him to retain your funds and to look into this. Specifically: does this seller have any other domains listed for sale and, if so, does the whois info actually indeed match that of this domain, why did the seller contact the buyer, rather than contacting admin to end the auction early and, very importantly, to ask the seller what domain they MEANT to list (and allegedly mistyped) and check whois info to compare contact info of alleged domain and sold domain to registration info on bargain domains.
3 if indeed it was an accidental mistype, he refunds you entirely (and, who knows, throws in a few compensation prizes for the help and understanding) and decides what action to take with seller. If it turns out to be the case that the seller is actually only looking for a way out of the deal, you now have Francois on your side to secure the domain and, if they refuse, would likely provide relevant info to legally pursue the seller as well as ban them from the platform.

Again, just a thought.

In closing, I appreciate you taking the time to check out my site and consideration of listing domains there... however, that is not an option (the "sell domains" page only lists what domains I would personally be interested in buying) since I only sell my own domains for this very reason: I do not want the stress or potential liability of ensuring the listings of others there are accurate and/or up to date.

Well, those were my last thoughts on this. I am glad it worked out in the end though. SP

Remorsefully I have reply to Francois and sincerely apologies to him, if in any way I have done harm to his reputation by my viral campaign to alert members about his service.

I should have listened to you in trusting Francois earlier, I realize that there are very few honest, reliable people like him in this online world, and this species are Rare and Extinct.

To conclude I would like to informed all members here that Domaing.com, BargainDomains.com or Chatcy.com or any other website that owns by Mr. Francois are fully recommended by Me with all thumbs UP, 7Star. Its hard to find such site owner like him who is honest and trustworthy. He may be slow in responding, but he is sincere. What happens earlier was only due to my impulsiveness which I truly Regret.

I will also try to mend my mistake by offering all my mights to support him in anyway and every way I could ( That was your initial suggestion ). This was my promise to Mr Fancois to mend my mistake.

Thanks Again for your comments and I look forward to be your humble fans and supporters.:great:

 

[SlimPickins]

wow, that's GREAT to hear that you two were able to sort it out, person to person, and that you can be humble, and responsible, enough to see how it "could have" been handled differently (and that it was largely an unfortunate incident and misunderstanding) and to step up and correct your accusations. That makes me even happier than your very generous compliments of me.

BTW, did you ever discuss with Francois the possibility it was indeed an attempt by the seller to avoid having to sell? Curiosity is getting the best of me!

Aynwho, glad it was sorted in the best way possible in the end, hope you stick around the forum and wish you all the best with your domains and projects. Cheers, SP