Dispute with Developer, what's fair?

[Spade]

I posted a project recently on GAF. The project included a web designer with a few very specific functions. The design we complete, sub par, and much of the functionality is not existant. The developer says he does not want to waste his time researching and doesnt know how to do it, really didnt understand what I was asking to begin with. (language barrier, no doubt).

He believes that he is entiteled to full payment. Is he entitled to any? I will have to find another developer to "fix" what he has done, or start over... this project has become almost a complete scrap...

What do you think? Should I pay him? Should I take whats been done and try to re-use whats decent. Or should I say sorry, I'll hire another and start over?

Justin

 

[Aguila]

You get what you pay for, everytime I have used GAF I run into some sort of problem.

People just pay someone 5-10 bucks for a good review on there so they get more winning bids.

Or you get people bidding on every project even if they cant do it.

Try using this, http://www.zend.com/store/education/certification/yellow-pages.php

You might be able to find someone local.

 

[Spade]

Bare in mind, I have not paid for anything as of Yet..... This is more of a moral ground issue.

 

[Aguila]

True, I wouldnt pay nothing, he should pay you for wasting your time. Who cares if he's nice. Everyone is nice when they want your money :hehe:

 

[-NC-]

You specified certain functions pre agreement?
He agreed, then failed to deliver?

I would say no payment.

 

[Spade]

Yah.... I think that just may have to be the case. Its just a shame, and he really didnt come through on a lot of what was promised. Im very dissapointed even with the design. I layed out pretty much what had to be done...

 

[WhiteWebServices]

If it really doesn't work, then he's broken the 'contract' by not delivering just as much as you will have by not paying.

If he's completed part of the project, and you can build on what he's done, then perhaps a partial payment would be fair.

 

[Spade]

If it really doesn't work, then he's broken the 'contract' by not delivering just as much as you will have by not paying.

If he's completed part of the project, and you can build on what he's done, then perhaps a partial payment would be fair.

Well, thats the issue. There are major functions which are not present. However, even the design work is weak (in my opinion). I layed out what was neccessary and the designer instead of recreating what I showed him, copied the exact layout from another site (including images).

I have been conflicted about this, but the truth is.... he took on a project that he didnt understand and doesnt know how to complete. I would rather start from scratch and giving the new developer complete control.

 

[NameCharger]

A bad developer is one who does not want to research how to do something s/he doesn't know how to do (hence refusing to learn) & steals sites/images for a paid project.

I'd cut my waste of time, headaches, and dollars and kick this developer to the curb and go with one who understands what you want to do completely and if they don't understand a specific task, at least have the smarts to know where to find resources to learn how to figure it out.

 

[Spade]

Well, I think its settled, Im going to just cut him loose without pay. Im dissapointed to say the least. Wasted my time and his own.

 

[ekofive]

Hey DomainSpade,

I had a very similar experience to you when I outsourced a project a few months back. First there were major delays, then what was presented to me was garbage even after several promises and attempts to make it better. I also find that sometimes these developers can try to get agressive with you, so you have to take a stance. In my case I did not pay and firmly told him I wouldn't, I don't think you should either in your case.

From now on I do extensive research into the companies I hire for web projects and obviously there portfolio is the first thing to look at as well as their website. If there website looks like crap chances are their designs are also.

I have recently been using guru.com as it lets me see where the developers are from and allows me to specify if I only want local developers to bid on it.

Anyways hope that helps.

 

[ivoy]

Hey Spade,
Just the fact that you are torn about this issue shows how honest, respectful and considerable you are. I had very similar feelings of moral confusion when a web contest for a very simple graphic ended in a fiasco. I had some 'last second' scavenger entrants who submitted total crap and who then insisted that I pay for the project as required by the rules of the website.
My first thought, I admit, was that there is no way I'll ever pay for something I am not even remotely satisifed with. But there was this other voice in my head insisting that... it's my own fault. By setting the low price for the contest I attracted nothing but the ... low talent.
Thankfully, the 'designers' did not argue for too long and the entire issue was so obvious that not even the administrators of the website wanted to get involved.
I ended up not paying, but the bitter feeling never left!

 

[Mike]

It's relatively simple, Justin.
If you buy something and the item is not as described, functional or agreed upon, you're well within your rights to refuse payment or can demand a refund. In your case, cut him lose and move on. The guy wasted your time and has in turn caused you lost revenue, he should get billed for that.

 

[WhiteWebServices]

I layed out what was neccessary and the designer instead of recreating what I showed him, copied the exact layout from another site (including images).

That's really not on. By doing that he's exposing you to legal action for infringing copyright. He's lucky to get nothing.

You sound look a good guy; sleep easy.

 

[Hitch]

If you specified you wanted the functions built, before the user took on the project, and he failed to deliver. Don't pay.

You're not getting what you asked for.

 

[neroux]

I'd go with the overall opinion here. The specified work wasnt completed at all - not even partially, but (as WhiteWebServices said) you were even exposed to third party copyright claims.

 

[CrazyCatLady]

I'm active on GAF and I have worked on a lot of projects on there for people. On all of my bids I let them know that if what I design and build doesn't meet their expectations then I don't expect payment. I would cancel the project and for the reason in the drop-down select "dispute over quality of service" - they'll cancel it and you won't have to worry about it.

No one should be paid for a shitty job, especially if the come out and tell you they don't care to look into getting done what you need done. If I don't know how to do something for a project (I'm a designer, not a programmer - my programming skills are very limited), I hire someone.

 

[Spade]

Well, this is exactly why I dont pay until a project is completed. Its ironic, after we started working on the project, he asked for half payment. I told him I would pay him in full when the project is completed.... I suppose that shouldve been the first red flag.

Alas, I have told him I will not pay him, and to my suprise, he has moved on with little fuss...

Now to find another developer.

 

[CrazyCatLady]

Yeah, I ask that 100% is put into GAF escrow and not released until the project is 100% done. That's like a deposit in my eyes - only they can release it to me and only I can cancel the payment.

 

[Airadine]

Did he (or she?) give you what you asked for? If it's crap, then he didn't give you what you wanted. So then you have to ask, did he break your agreement? If so, then you aren't required to stick by the terms of that agreement. ie: Paying him for any work he may have done.

If you can't use what he has done then ditch it and start over with a new company. File a complaint with the company that referred you to him (if possible) and keep any documentation that you have in regards to working with him in case you have later legal disputes, which I doubt, but you never know.