NameSilo

Direct Messages Question

Labeled as status-monitor in NamePros Community Help, started by JB Lions, May 23, 2017

Replies:
101
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Should DM recipients be allowed to share direct messages publicly on NamePros?

  1. Yes, it's their right to share messages that were sent to them directly

  2. No, they shouldn't be allowed even though they could still share those messages on other websites

  3. Indifferent, it doesn't matter to me either way

Results are only viewable after voting.
Total: 75 vote(s)
  1. Internet.Domains

    Internet.Domains Account Closed (Requested) VIP

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    The subject of this conversation was a Direct Message that was posted by a participant, but it is publicly displayed on NamePros....I get the "Community Standard" thing and agree. However NamePros should have something in place for a "reasonable expectation of privacy" in relation to Direct Messages. Again I will use the Gmail analogy. The subject of this post is like Google displaying gmail content publicly......
     
    The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
  2. MapleDots

    MapleDots Restricted (15-30%)

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    If I could give you 10 likes I would (y)(y)(y)(y)(y)(y)(y)(y)(y)(y)

    If you're going to take bids they should be public, I stopped responding to all auctions with private bids.
    I thought exactly the same thing you did.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  3. deez007

    deez007 The More I Learn The Less I "Know" VIP

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    So if DM's are supposed to private and so are emails. Why do we often share spammers and scammers emails addresses here on the forum?

    According to some of you, email is also supposed to be private, right? So we shouldn't be sharing it? Yet we still do... why is that? Well, purely based on the fact that sharing such information is for the betterment of the community. If information is important to the community then that would trump the senders right of privacy.

    That same sort of attitude should be adopted for DM's. It's not rocket science... is basic common sense. Obviously, if the information is not important to the community and the person sending the DM is not being malicious then you should respect their privacy.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  4. JB Lions

    JB Lions Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    haha, wow.

    Yes, DM/Private messages are supposed to be private. Again, we're not talking about emails. And are you seriously comparing spammers and scammers to people conducting legit business thru private message? And sharing private messages better the community? That makes no sense.

    I find it amazing how many people don't understand what private or direct means, especially if English is your native language.

    I also find it amazing seeing people go out of their way to make sharing of direct/private messages ok. Like I said, the only forum I've ever been on where this is ok.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  5. MapleDots

    MapleDots Restricted (15-30%)

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    Yes but remember in a Direct Message there can be up to 4 participants and the person that started the discussion should be able to post some of it if needed. Here is a legitimate example......

    I direct message you and ask you what you think the value of my domain sampledomain.com is. You respond by saying reg fee. I invite two other members and one says 1k and the other says 2k.

    Now I might want to post the contents of that conversation and ask for community support. No malice intended and not really breaking any privacy rules. I initiated the conversation and now I want others to help me come to a decision.

    Again, not cut and dry but it is really no different from an oral conversation. I can go on the forum and say this and this member said that... what is your opinion. No different from posting the content.
     
  6. JB Lions

    JB Lions Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    So you're asking if it's ok to post private messages without the other participants consent? Seriously.

    Again, define direct and private for me.

    "Again, not cut and dry but it is really no different from an oral conversation"

    If you started the oral conversation with, this is just between you and me. That's pretty much a direct/private message.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  7. deez007

    deez007 The More I Learn The Less I "Know" VIP

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    What are are you waffling on about, read my message again... slowly, if you have too..

    I clearly said "According to some of you" - now go back on the thread and you will see that some people were comparing emails to DM's - That statement was addressed to them - hence the "some of you" part.

    Nobody was comparing scammers and spammers to legit business dealings, I was illustrating the point about common sense.....

    If someone is talking trash via PM or being malicious then share the DM if you want too and if you feel it will benefit the community. If not, you should respect the sender's privacy.

    Sharing DM's for silly/stupid reasons will just show people how unprofessional the person sharing the DM is.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  8. JB Lions

    JB Lions Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    I read it again, read it wrong. We actually agree - "if the information is not important to the community and the person sending the DM is not being malicious then you should respect their privacy. "
     
  9. MapleDots

    MapleDots Restricted (15-30%)

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    Just saying that as long as no private information is given out and no malice is intended there should be no rule saying iron clad that a message cannot be shared on the forum. What is the difference in my scenario above if we had the same conversation via telephone or direct message.

    Either way it is an ethics issue and unless you breach ethics a conversation is just that... a conversation. In my example above there is no difference between cut and paste or me posting the entire content of the conversation from memory.

    I can say member 1 said this, member 2 said this, member 3 said this.... what is everyone else's opinion.

    If I want to make fun of member number 1 it is also my prerogative. If I think his price is way out of range. That is why we are a discussion forum., we look for topics to discuss.

    I agree with you JB, it is a fine line and maybe we should have a message system similar to snapchat that self destructs after a said period of time.

    All that said, I would never post any part of a direct message but do we really need more rules when the members are making it clear the majority is against disclosure. I myself am with you and the scenario above is hypothetical, but I posted it just to toss in the other side of the coin.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2017
  10. Internet.Domains

    Internet.Domains Account Closed (Requested) VIP

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    Apparently some members (NamePros included) feel that publicly displaying a Direct Message should be allowed...That is until one of their Direct Messages is displayed publicly......I really can't believe some members are complaining about another "rule", when this forum has pages of rules and is the most moderated forum I have witnessed..... Pages of rules and nothing to protect members within a "reasonable expectation of privacy"?
     
  11. MapleDots

    MapleDots Restricted (15-30%)

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    I wonder if there is not a way to make a check box marked private that once checked could insert something like...

    CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: The contents of this message and any attachments are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential and/or privileged information and may be legally protected from disclosure.

    Remember with the current system you can invite additional members into the conversation and then what you think is private is still not. If we had a check box that prevented adding another member and added the disclaimer it would make the intention pretty clear.

    My disclaimer: I do not endorse sharing direct messages in any way and would not do so. I am simply stating an opposite side for the sake of conversation.
     
  12. Internet.Domains

    Internet.Domains Account Closed (Requested) VIP

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  13. Hello,

    Please understand that it's unlikely that we will change this policy (Keep reading for solution ideas), and we've given multiple reasons for why that is, which I suggest everyone read here, here, and here. The hacking/security explanation is a small part of the reason but shouldn't be exclusively focused on. A blanket rule that direct messages can't be shared is not a sensible solution.

    We would be more likely to add rules around what can't be shared, like this:
    I suggest that we make recommendations for what type of content can't be shared on NamePros, regardless of whether it came from an email, direct message, instant message, etc. It's unlikely that direct messages are going to be treated differently than other mediums like instant messages (Skype, Slack, etc.) and emails. If you can take a message that you received on Skype/Email from someone and post it on NamePros, then you will be allowed to do the same if that message is in a direct message.

    It'll be more productive if we shift the conversation that direction and discuss what shouldn't be allowed to be shared on NamePros at all, regardless of its source (Regardless of Where it came from).


    That means that we will make reasonable efforts to prevent anyone from accessing private content. It does not mean that we will prevent members from sharing content that they legally have a right to share.

    Post edited to add: I should also mention that if someone shares content on NamePros that they stole or did not have a right to share, we would certainly delete that content and issue a warning or close their account, depending on the circumstances.


    I hope that helps,
     
  14. NameOmnia

    NameOmnia alea iacta est VIP

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    I am 100% with JB on this. I am not American and I do not know how privacy is treated there but I can tell you that in many countries in Europe rules are quite strict.

    Yes sure no one forbids you from sharing a DM or any fort of "private communication" but whether you will have consequences if you do it it is a whole different story. In Europe you would. If someone sued you you would.

    Beside that it really should be a no brainer that what is shared privately should remain private; if rules do not state it then ethic should.
     
  15. Addison

    Addison Top Contributor VIP

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    I voted Yes. Why are people always trying to take away my freedoms??

    Voting no is like asking Google to ban my Gmail account because I shared a domain offer that another Gmail user sent to me. Gmail would never try to stop me from doing that nor would they ban my account for it, even if I shared that email message with thousands of other Gmail users or posted it publicly on my blog.

    Absolute lunacy going on with this poll.

    (No offense to @Internet.Domains. That's my homie. The rest of you voting no... tsk, tsk, tsk)
     
  16. Dave

    Dave Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Another fairy dust smoker here. Hilarious. The only lunatics are the ones voting yes.

    I don't think you understand why we're voting no. PRIVATE MEANS PRIVATE. I don't care that they're called Direct Messages (stupid name anyway). So, you post a domain for sale stating 'make offer', I PM you asking what range you're looking for, you tell me $100-200, you would be happy for me to share this info publicly even though someone could've offered you $250?

    Perhaps you've sent me a PM asking for a pre-purchase appraisal? I'll go share it with the world. Maybe you're sharing a private story? I'll share that too.

    This isn't rocket science.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017
  17. Silentptnr

    Silentptnr David George VIP

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    People keep pointing out the scenario of requesting a price, getting a price, then posting it publicly. It doesn't normally happen but really...so what.

    Using the example given, the seller just wants to sell and doesn't care who buys it.

    Should it be okay to claim the existence of offers but not have any? Those should be provided if requested.

    Are people using dm for such high level talks that require protection? Or are people using this "privacy" to make stuff up?

    This forum seems mostly professional but I don't think it's good to use messaging to lie about offers. I would want that exposed.
     
  18. Addison

    Addison Top Contributor VIP

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    Oh my, where to begin with you. I'll start with it's a pleasure to make your acquaintance, since we haven't crossed paths till now. FYI, I am allergic to dust mites and don't smoke (not to mention that fairies don't exist; do I really need to explain that to an adult?). The hilarious part is watching you reach to form a logical argument based on illogical foundations.

    Jokes aside... you're not known around here for your syllogism, are you? Allow me to properly introduce myself: I'm Addison, and if you can't grasp facile logic, I will Etch A Sketch you a picture so that you can.

    Hey, watch me do this just like you: PUBLIC means PUBLIC. I don't care that they're called Direct Messages (stupid name anyway). I'm optimistic that you can grasp what I just sketched here.

    Direct doesn't imply confidentiality or privacy. If a website uses it that way, it doesn't become ubiquitous. Please reference your nearest librarian and dictionary directly. :bookworm:

    Rocket science, you say? How about an experiment?

    Head over to Twitter, tweet a message from your Twitter direct messages that the person didn't give you permission to tweet, and then let's see if Twitter will create a rule to prevent that and ban you.
    It won't happen, and you lied to yourself if you thought there was a 1% or greater chance that Twitter would ever do that.

    Bear with me, Etch A Sketch pictures take time...

    Why are you asking for a rule on here that doesn't exist on a single analogous website that is a household name? Only smaller websites should have unnecessary, mindless rules? Yes, that makes sense (sarcasm).

    I'm with you on that. Good thing, because I can't Etch A Sketch a rocket.
     
  19. Silentptnr

    Silentptnr David George VIP

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    Whether or not a conversation is kept private is between the individuals conversing. I can't see it being any other way. The parties each have rights. I don't know why this is so difficult. The platform should not be responsible for policing conversation "Leaks" by members.
     
  20. JB Lions

    JB Lions Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    It's not tho at Namepros. Just one can decide to post in public, even if the other participant doesn't want it public. That's why private usually means private. And NP should be responsible for policing, since they own the place and can set the rules. That's part of what admins/mods are supposed to do, enforce rules.

    All this outside stuff of legality, hacking etc was just introduced to muddy what is a simple conversation.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017
  21. Silentptnr

    Silentptnr David George VIP

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    Should a seller claiming they have received offers be required to provide them on request?

    Should a member be able to fabricate a private conversation?
     
  22. Internet.Domains

    Internet.Domains Account Closed (Requested) VIP

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    Addison - You mention "Freedoms"....It should be known that the right to privacy is one of the greatest freedoms one can have. It is the difference between liberty and tyranny.... This debate is more about freedom than anything else. Having a reasonable expectation of privacy when using Direct Message is a small freedom, however it should be granted....
     
  23. JB Lions

    JB Lions Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    Private message means private. If you and I are talking about something via Private Message, it stays there as far as I'm concerned unless permission is granted from the other party to share publicly.
     
  24. Dave

    Dave Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    You're correct. Read below.. (DM's should have an expectation of privacy as suggested, by default).

    Hahaha. Thanks, I haven't laughed so hard for a while. What household names are you referring to exactly? Do you understand the term 'professional courtesy'? That is what we're asking for here. PROFESSIONALISM. By default, DM's or whatever you want to call them should have a reasonable expectation of privacy, and no further sharing of said messages should be allowed without consent of all participants. I don't give a shit about legalities or such. I don't give a shit about your household names, considering you are generation z you're most likely referring to Facebook... if so then that is hilarious.

    Have a nice day.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017
  25. JB Lions

    JB Lions Top Contributor VIP ★★★★★★★★★★

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    I don't think it even matters at this point. I think it was decided that people can share private messages around here, even tho the majority here would disagree and most forums on the internet.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2017

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