BIN - Buy It Now - Regulation needed!

If bidder2 really wanted that domain he could have claimed it when BIN was $99.

It's seller's domain and he can change BIN anytime to any amount more than current bid (following namePros rules by posting a new reply updating BIN). Why will he care who's online?

JMO

BIN increase/decrease should be anounced 24h before and notify all bidders.

So seller would post something like:

"New BIN will be $xx, effective 24h after this post.
@bidder1 @bidder2 @bidder3"

imo its more of a buyers job to keep track of items he wants to buy, rather than sellers job or duty to check who is highest bidder and adjust BINs or times of putting changing bins according to highest bidders etc.

in short, keep close look on aucitons you want/bid on. and spend as much time on namepros as you can to maximize your chances of getting good deals.

I've no problem with first come first served. right time and right place.
it's how the world works. not just namepros.

so that'd be my 2 cents on that. thanks for listening to my opinion.

cheers

the ability to change a bin price in auctions is a bad and unfair practice opening doors to any kind of manipulation and behind the curtain dealings.
bidding becomes a waste of time and energy when you know that anyone can pm the seller and have a deal directly by setting agreed bin and claming it the same second... while you been bidding for days like a complete idiot
i wonder why at all it was introduced and implemented? i missed that moment, and now i - and i believe many here - just lost any interest in auctions, totally...
what other established marketplaces allow bins to be changed during an active auctioning? i dont see any... so why namepros has it?

First come first serve

Namepros is about liquidity, not bin of rights for all bidders, as soon as its announced, first come first serve...

This is about sellers who need quick funds to be able to raise them quickly, not wait on buyers.

Sellers domain they have the right to price at what they want. This is a free service, if you don't like it you have a choice, at no cost to you.

wwwweb said:

Sellers domain they have the right to price at what they want. This is a free service, if you don't like it you have a choice, at no cost to you.

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on any respectable marketplace (and not only domain related) a seller can not price an auctioning item at what they want after the auction begins... otherwise its not a fair auction. its not an auction at all..

and its also bad for sellers - smarter buyers dont bid, they would wait till 5 min before action ends and pm you with +10% over last bid offer... of course, seller sells... and he would normally get much higher price if all buyers had to bid or claim (fixed) bin to win.

imho

This is business. Nothing about it is fair.

4pm said:

on any respectable marketplace (and not only domain related) a seller can not price an auctioning item at what they want after the auction begins... otherwise its not a fair auction. its not an auction at all..

and its also bad for sellers - smarter buyers dont bid, they would wait till 5 min before action ends and pm you with +10% over last bid offer... of course, seller sells... and he would normally get much higher price if all buyers had to bid or claim (fixed) bin to win.

imho

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It is the sellers domain, if they choose to make a bad business call, and yield less it's on them, what do you care?

People need to understand namepros is not heritage auction, this is an exchange where people come to get quick liquidity, and usually not always the highest price the market will provide.

Buyers should not dictate, how sellers sell their names, and for how much, if buyers don't like rules they have every right not to proceed with bidding in a free open marketplace.

4pm said:

on any respectable marketplace (and not only domain related) a seller can not price an auctioning item at what they want after the auction begins... otherwise its not a fair auction. its not an auction at all..

and its also bad for sellers - smarter buyers dont bid, they would wait till 5 min before action ends and pm you with +10% over last bid offer... of course, seller sells... and he would normally get much higher price if all buyers had to bid or claim (fixed) bin to win.

imho

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FYI this happens on flippa all the time. Whether you consider that a respectable marketplace or not, I don't know ... But just pointing out it is not something unique to NP.

i'd agree with above point.

I am of opinion, and I hope it does not come across as mean, that namepros auctions are here and should be here to favor and accomodate sellers.. more than buyers. to give comparaison, ebay is definitely about putting buyer before seller. big time. namepros should be opposite of that. and I believe it is. like someone pointed out, it's about liquidity, sellers wanting to flip, needing funds etc. I don't just sell here, I buy also. nonetheless, I prefer namepros continue to favor liquidity and sellers priorities. versus buyers desires at expense of sellers. because in the end, the moment you do something for buyer, including this thread feedback, then at same time u take somethign away from seller.

It's also another reason not to lowball auction bids. There is way too much low balling here.

21x20 said:

It's also another reason not to lowball auction bids. There is way too much low balling here.

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Lowball, or no balls, it is the sellers choice to say yes, or no!

At least the seller has that choice, liquidity in this industry comes with constraints. You need to give up something in order to receive a 15-20% commission savings, and instant payment.

These considerations are not shared at some other exchanges, where sometimes you need to wait weeks to get paid, all while being deducted 20% in the meantime.

Same situation with timed auctions, if you snooze you loose, we all put them off to the side, got busy, and forgot to bid. Should godaddy extend every auction 24 hours with each bid, they would yield a larger payout no, where do you draw the line? Same rule, and case evolves here, let the sellers control their auctions, bidders have every right not to bid, but enforce fundamental namepros rules.

Shane Bellone said:

This is business. Nothing about it is fair.

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We can make it fair.

timestamp said:

We can make it fair.

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Why?

timestamp said:

We can make it fair.

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Socialism is supposed to make things fair too, yet people build rafts out of garbage and die trying to get away from it.

4pm said:

the ability to change a bin price in auctions is a bad and unfair practice opening doors to any kind of manipulation and behind the curtain dealings.
bidding becomes a waste of time and energy when you know that anyone can pm the seller and have a deal directly by setting agreed bin and claming it the same second... while you been bidding for days like a complete idiot
i wonder why at all it was introduced and implemented? i missed that moment, and now i - and i believe many here - just lost any interest in auctions, totally...

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+1

Business can be unfair or fair it's up to each one to conduct it the way they think it's best for them.
There are people with a short term view and people with a longer one; the more you want to stay in one industry the more you want to play fair.
I said that before : people who do business unfairly are scammers. They never last long.

The only thing I think is unfair and that I've seen this on NP so many times ..

The seller puts a domain in auction with a BIN : TBD. And winner after 72 hours without bids.

Bidder 1 bids $200
Bidder 2 bids $250
Bidder 1 bids $275
Bidder 3 bids $300
..no more bids for 71 hours ..

Then BAM!! at the very end the seller decides to set BIN for the first time at $305 to grind a few more bucks.

Bidder 1 gets it !! Leaving Bidder 3 with absolutely no chances to react and bidder 3 never had a chance to use the BIN.

--

That kind of "small late" BIN are often going against the bidder that was the most interested in the name.

That being said. The seller has all the rights to do it.

There are various parameters where a bidder could lose the "chance" to bid and win, which NP forum (or any online auction) cannot really cater for:

People sleep, go out, lose internet connection, etc.

The problem you highlighted is really only "I needed to be away from the forum", and it's quite a specific scenario where bidder leaves after bidding and bids ensue and BIN is met. Because when bidder1 bids and then goes offline it's usually through numerous other bids that the BIN is reduced close to the now current bid, and usually the current bid is a fair bit more than the bid bidder1 left before disappearing. This simply makes it an "auction" and if you are not around then you lose the chance to buy/bid.

Dineshkp said:

Consider on Jan 9 when the seller drops BIN to $62 with highest bid of bidder2 at $60, bidder2 is offline and bidder3 is online and claims BIN, bidder2 comes online only to see he lost by $2 and that too by BIN?

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OR
Bidder2 could have won with their $60 regardless of BIN lowered to $62 because bidder3 was offline instead, or bidder3 might not have seen the auction, or not wanted it for $62, etc etc.

Because everyone has equal opportunity to bid, BIN, be at or away from the forum.

Dineshkp said:

IMO: It is unfair to the highest bidder for a seller to set such a close BIN.

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There is no unfairness, you state that based solely on a bidder being away from the forum when the BIN is placed. There is nothing that can be done about this without adding complications, nor should there be really as we all have equal opportunity to be here, or not.

Dineshkp said:

BIN should never be lowered to less than $10 difference to the highest valid bid. Also, BIN should be lowered only a fixed number of times (for example 3 times per auction).

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This is a good example of why it's mostly impossible for the forums to regulate this, as you have not seen the additional complications your suggestions bring.

1)
What's to stop bidder3 outbidding bidder2 (who's now offline) from just buying at $10 more? They don't need to bid $2 more, or anyone else for that matter. This stops seller from being able to choose what their price is, and also effectively bumps up the price for buyers too - just because someone was not on the forum? There are many users not on the forum when BINs are placed, nothing can be done to cater for that.

2)
Bidder1 posts $60, seller reduces BIN to $70 ($10 greater as per your new rule), bidder2 bids $62, BIN is now only $8 difference to highest bid, breaking your new rule. Should the forum not allow the $62 bid? Or perhaps the seller now has to raise their BIN?


It all becomes too complicated and convoluted, especially when the only problem you are trying to resolve is "someone needs to be away from the forum".


I recognise the the problem you have identified, that someone could be offline etc etc, but I think the problem is inherent in all auctions, market places, and is not really resolvable.

Take a physical supermarket as an example:
You go in to buy a frozen chicken and they're all sold out, is that "unfair"?
Should the store have one behind the counter in case someone comes in and they're all sold out? Who is the "special" person who is allowed to have the one from behind the counter, which other equal customers could not have from the freezer?

I know it's not great when it happens, sincerely, but this is simply the nature of the beast, and if you want a domain name badly pay the current BIN, or PM the seller and negotiate

Personally I am of the opinion that once bidding has started that a BIN price should be locked in essentially. The ability to change it is too open to abuse.

Peter said:

Personally I am of the opinion that once bidding has started that a BIN price should be locked in essentially. The ability to change it is too open to abuse.

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Abuse, an owner has the right to sell their domain for whatever they choose, if they choose to close a sale quickly, and want fast cash, dropping the bin should be open to them.

You need to remember namepros is a free exchange, mainly to give domainers liquidity quickly.

If you want fixed bins, and such with all the toppings, then you should turn to sedo, godaddy, and spend your time there.

Peter said:

Personally I am of the opinion that once bidding has started that a BIN price should be locked in essentially. The ability to change it is too open to abuse.

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wwwweb said:

Abuse, an owner has the right to sell their domain for whatever they choose, if they choose to close a sale quickly, and want fast cash, dropping the bin should be open to them.

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Both good points.

Perhaps even ground would be to limit the number of times a BIN can be changed? eg 2 times per auction.

james haw said:

Both good points.

Perhaps even ground would be to limit the number of times a BIN can be changed? eg 2 times per auction.

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That's a logistical nightmare, for everyone.

Agreed with @wwwweb on NP being a different kind of marketplace. Truth is people try to get away and lowball with their bids. Every so often, someone is going to get burned by a BIN change because they didn't make a bid truly valuing a name.