discuss No! .com investors are not threatened by new gtld’s

[equity78]

So I read an article on the Flippa blog by Max Guerin that seems to want take shots at .com investors, Rick Schwartz and the "traditional domain press." In an article titled "The Rise of Alternative Domains" Guerin starts out the gate with cheap shots, Some domain investors have been complaining about new gTLDs (new general top-level domains) seeing in them a threat to their almighty … [Read more...]

 

[biggie]

Hi Ray

I prolly miss a lot of "not news", by not visiting flippo ​

but to me, the biggest threat to current .com investors, is new investors

cuz....they bring more competition to the game and can drive prices up for many names, that should close for much less.

but on other side of that coin,
those new investors can be a new source of buyers for your names as well.

imo….

 

[Internet.Domains]

Lots of folks try to unfairly pigeon hole investors into one corner or the other. This is quite unfair to those that invest in all types of domains, while understanding .com is still the top prize.

The .com extension is the most sought after, the most liquid, it is the gold standard. It is the blue chip stock of domain extensions. It is hard to argue its reign on supremacy.

Other extensions, whatever they may be, are more of the silver standard. They are the small cap stock. More risk, yet still a possibility to profit.

Some people diversify their financial investments, some don't. Financial advisers look at risk tolerance when deciding the ratio between blue chip and small cap stocks. Domain investors should do the same when looking at .com vs. other extensions.

Financial advisers don't look at blue chips and small caps as competitors. They understand all of them contribute to the market in their own unique way.

Domain extensions are no different than stocks, they all contribute to the market in their own unique way.

 

[korganian]

I find it humorous that a guy I have never heard of who has a so called domainer's club that I have never heard of is proclaiming that I am scared of extensions that I never even think about. The truth is that I would be overjoyed if people would buy and develop every single extension there is. It's flat out retarded for anyone to say that .com investor's are afraid of the new extensions because every one of them that is developed will drive traffic to our .com domain.and increase the value of the .com domain. The fact is that the buyers of new extensions should be afraid that every dollar they ever spend on marketing will lose a big portion of their paid traffic because people automatically type .com behind every domain name and even forget it's supposed to be another extension even after you have told them otherwise.

 

[myfavorite]

Com is still king, others are it's subjects. It calls the shots.

 

[Peak.Domains]

The more extensions there are, the less demand there is for any given name in .com, right? Since there are other options.

If there was only .com, prices would be *much* higher since there's no alternative. Following that line of thinking, the more extensions that exist, the less demand there is for the .com, even though it's still the best of all of them.

People have the option to settle for less, I don't see how that can be waved off or disregarded. If there was only Cars.com, nobody could settle for Cars.net, Cars.co, they'd all have to compete to buy the .com.

 

[jmcc]

And there will be a reckoning, with a good percentage of these new gTLDs going under over the next few years.

Another two brand name new gTLDs (owned and operated by companies for themselves rather than the public) went dotBomb this week as they've been made inactive. Most of the new gTLDs that have been terminated to date have been brand name gTLDs. Some of the public facing new gTLDs haven't been doing well. The only one that appears to have officially gone dotBomb is .WED and that had a rather novel approach of actually deterring renewals as part of its business plan. It has been in EBERO (gTLD Zombieland) since January 2018.

Can't say that I've ever heard of Max Guerin or his club but I pay more attention to the statistics rather than personalities. Some of the new gTLDs are actually domain name hacks and do run the risk of losing traffic to the .COM version (i.ie example.newgtld to examplenewgtld.com).

I've spent the last few days reading back through registry reports from the mid 2000s as part of research for a book I'm writing about new gTLDs and legacy gTLDs. The more I look at the numbers, the more obvious it seems that it wasn't the new gTLD registries that screwed up with their projections but rather ICANN in first failing to make the right decisions and then making the right decisions at the wrong time.

Quality-wise, there are some new gTLDs that are doing well but many of the unfocused ones are struggling. The renewal rates in some of them are quite terrifying because after the first few years, the bulk of a registry's revenue comes from renewals rather than new registrations. For people who are holding what may in .COM, be premium domain names in some new gTLDs, they may have to hold on to them for a long time if they expect to see some serious returns on their investments.

Regards...jmcc

 

[oldtimer]

One thing that people who are fighting don’t realize is that the whole space of Internet is growing steadily and as such there is going to be room for all viable extensions to grow as more and more people and companies want to get online. What all these competition has done is to reduce the number of pigeon dropping domains across the board, otherwise good domains in viable extensions are thriving and most likely will see an increase in demand as long as the prices are reasonable.

We all know that most newbies start their domaining adventure by registering a lot of worthless domains and have to go through a learning curve in order to become better domainers, but what people don’t realize is that most Industry veterans and pros who applied for the New gTLDs a few years ago also acted like newbies by wasting 185k a pop on some not so viable extensions and as such we shouldn’t bunch up all New gTLDs in one group because not all are of the same quality and potential. Sooner or later the New gTLDs (and perhaps all other extensions too) are going to have to go through a correction quality and price wise (if not already for some), but for the ones that survive the future can be very bright as global demand for good domains increases across the board in all viable ccTLDs, New gTLDs, and the popular legacy extinctions such as .com (less an unforeseen shift in technology). IMO

 

[biggie]

folks act like Rick is the only domainer
they must think that, what he thinks and does or doesn't do, moves and shakes everybody else

no dis on him, but the domaining world don't revolve around one mofo

but I guess it draws attention if his name is mentioned

imo...

 

[loredan]

Excuse the ignorance but WhoTF is Max Guerin?

 

[equity78]

Excuse the ignorance but WhoTF is Max Guerin?

From the article:

Max Guerin founder of Claim.Club a domainers club which has celebrated its 10th-anniversary last year and over $1 million dollars in profit. His new venture D.NA is a premium domain boutique aimed at Blockchain entrepreneurs and other crypto startups. Max is most notably known as the “domain hacker” for having registered hundreds of (now premium) domain hacks at registration fee as did the .com pioneers in the 1990s.

 

[loredan]

He is quite famous among non dot-com guys imho. He sold cctlds/domain hacks for more than maybe 95% of dot com guys did. Or maybe even 99%.

I never heard of him to be honest and I've been playing with domains for about 15 years or so. After I asked WTF is this guy I was somehow glad to see some other old timers had no idea who he is. If he is quite famous, well kudos to him, wish him all the best with his emoji domains.

Aside from seeing that he is really confused when it comes to ccTLD's and new gTLD's what really bothered me was the fact that he took on Rick Schwartz. It looks like anyone who wants to get "famous" and drive some traffic to his website have an innocent desire to mention Rick in a way or another.

 

[biggie]

Excuse the ignorance but WhoTF is Max Guerin?

good one @loredan
no dis to him either
but he was a nobody to me too



imo….

 

[wurdd]

How many companies that have the very best version of their company name in dotcom or cctld are worried about losing business if they don't acquire an ngtld extension of the company name?

As in, we've got the dotcom, but man, if we don't get the dotcrap we're gonna go out of business!

I'll answer it for you - NONE. I understand defensive regs, but no one frets about getting a ngtld after they have the best version of their name. NO ONE.

The smartest and most successful companies (at least the ones that understand branding and image and security and relevancy) are forced eventually to acquire the best dotcom version of their name. I'm sorry, it just doesn't happen the other way around.

And, until that happens I will only invest in dotcom.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Thanks for alerting us to the article that I would not otherwise have seen, @equity78. And I fully agree with the points that you made that there is not any 'com domain media' and that new and country code extension sales are as covered as legacy by all our main sources of sales information.

It is probably unfortunate that Max's article starts with the paragraph that you quote since that masks the fact that almost all of the article had nothing directly to do with new gTLDs but was talking about cases where country code extensions used as domain hacks had both sold for good amounts and had significant real world traffic. That part is good reading.

I admit that I had not heard of Max Guerin previously but that probably is more a statement of my depth (lack thereof ) rather than about him. If I understand correctly that he is 30 years old and started ClaimClub 10 years ago and as the article notes has made $1 million in profit over the ten years, that is impressive. I personally agree with this sentiment he expresses in his closing paragraph.

I want to have more choices not less so I welcome and celebrate new (and older) extensions...

Bob

 

[DomainRecap]

The major threat to .COM investors is Huge Domains (and the continued domination of GoDaddy in the expired market), not new gTLDs.

 

[DomainRecap]

I want to have more choices not less so I welcome and celebrate new (and older) extensions...

But you can always have too much of a good thing.

A few new gTLDs like .WEB and .INC would have been fine, but 1200+ and counting is patently insane and the market simply cannot absorb those kinds of numbers - it's a pure money-making scam by ICANN, and has virtually nothing to do with "more choice" and everything to do with "more money".

And there will be a reckoning, with a good percentage of these new gTLDs going under over the next few years.

 

[eurorealtor]

How much of the new gTLDs would survive without domain investors? Just handful of them made a large sales, otherwise most of the regs are made by domaines. Many new domainesrs who can't afford to buy decent .com domains as an investment, just reg this new crap and dream to get rich of it.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I hate to be a broken record, but are people reading the original article?

The title of the article is
The Rise of Alternative Domains

He goes on to explain that he means alternatives to .com, and the success of the various country codes that have found wider use. All of the examples he gives are country code. All of them!

In the article he mentions, often multiply, domains with these extensions .io, .tv, .me, .ly, .et, .to, .ai and .am.

How many new gTLD extensions does he mention anywhere in the article? 0 (yes zero). He does mention briefly that he could see new extensions finding a role like the country ones did, where you could buy them hand reg 10 years ago and now they have value (that is how he made his $1 million plus profit).

So someone barely out of their teens figures out a domain strategy that leads to $1 million dollars profit. He has built a business around it for 10 years. Sure disagree with his ideas, complain about the cheap shot that @equity78 correctly calls him out for, but at the very least I think you owe it to the author to read his article to see what it is you don't agree with.

Bob

 

[kriss05]

good one @loredan
no dis to him either
but he was a nobody to me too



imo….

He is quite famous among non dot-com guys imho. He sold cctlds/domain hacks for more than maybe 95% of dot com guys did. Or maybe even 99%.

 

[jmcc]

I think the most important contribution from Max's article is he points out that for a variety of reasons some were looking for an alternative to .com, and they turned to country code hacks in some cases, that there were and are some impressive sales in those, and some of them did well as end users (such as the musical(ly) case he mentions becoming a $1B business before being bought out).

There is a big problem with a lot of these sales, Bob,
They aren't domain name sales as such but rather business sales. The business may be valued at $1B but not the domain name. The curious thing about ccTLDs is that the more successful they become in their home markets, the more inward facing they become and the percentage of unique domain names that only appear in the ccTLD and nowhere in gTLDs increase. Domain hacks might work but they are always under the control of the ccTLD registries and they can change the rules very quickly. When Libya was destroyed a few years ago, some .LY domain names were deactivated. Some people in Northern Ireland were using the Nicaraguan ccTLD (.NI) for their sites and e-mail. The registry changed the rules and these domain names were deleted.

Regards...jmcc

 

[equity78]

The evidence of being afraid is clear with the trolling of gTLD postings. There are sales now so those dot com only investors that had a clear window they could have jumped into left it so now their only recourse is to rubbish those investments.

I don't think those people are afraid, there are many .com only investors that believe new gtlds are garbage that ICANN is corrupt and that they should have never been allowed to be released. I can say for sure that Rick is not afraid. @bmugford is not afraid, Nat Cohen is not afraid, and many more.

What is sad is that both sides of people who believe in a singular strategy, either no new gtlds or no .coms, cannot just go about their business and make their money without slinging mud at the other. (To be fair, there are many who are running their mouth that are not earning a living wage selling either, they just like to roar).

 

[MapleDots]

I hate to say it but part of that article might actually hit a nerve...

I have mentioned previously that I respect Rick Schwartz for what he has done to date. I also think he really knows his business and part of that is to protect his assets. He is naturally going to talk down the new TLD's because he has a portfolio to protect.

To that extend the article does hit a little part of truth but it's no different from the Mercedes-Benz salesman laughing at the Hyundai salesman. One day though the Hyundai is going to be a viable alternative.

So it is inevitable that the new TLD's will make an incursion into the .com space, but there will always be the people with big bucks to spend that want the Mercedes. In the case of domains that will be .com's

The really smart money goes with the investor that sees the value in both.

Personally I'll go after the Mercedes sales but I'm not too proud to sell a couple of Hyundai's on occasion.

 

[wurdd]

I completely understand Rick's view of ngtld's. I'm guilty as well. Maybe it's because I lost my a$$ on them. Maybe it's because I develop domains for a living and know what works for me and what doesn't work. Maybe I get offers weekly on my dotcom's and never once on a ngtld that I had. Maybe the prices went up 1000% the second year of registration. Maybe I've witnessed flat out lies promoted by certain extensions.

Whatever the case, I've sold .org, .net , .tv and .us names for good money. I develop, invest in and hold dotcom long term. Legacy extensions and cctlds are fantastic investments and have development potential. New tlds are neither good investments nor good for developing. And, the next person that says data leakage and misdirected/misaddressed email is a lie proves their ignorance. It confirms, to me at least, that they have no idea what they're talking about.

My advice is if you love ngtlds, develop something on your names! I mean really build a nice site on them, invest lots of money and time on them. Do something with your domains!

Rick, Brad, Lions, me and many others aren't bashing. Folks really shouldn't take it that way. We're trying to save people time and money, that's all. Been there, tried it, doesn't work. That's all I'm saying...

 

[equity78]

Hi Ray

I prolly miss a lot of "not news", by not visiting flippo ​

but to me, the biggest threat to current .com investors, is new investors

cuz....they bring more competition to the game and can drive prices up for many names, that should close for much less.

but on other side of that coin,
those new investors can be a new source of buyers for your names as well.

imo….

Good point Don, the Flippa article is talking about the rise of alt extensions and how .com domainers like Rick are scared.