debate Let's be real, most successful domainers are people who registered domains 15-30 years ago

[Siggy2500]

This is what nobody talks about.

Decades ago, lets say roughly 25 years ago, when the internet was in its golden age, domains were in abundance and many good names were available, the average person could usually register the domain he needed without it being taken.

Domaining is not futureproof, not sustainable, it's more of an early-internet thing, even now the internet is still very young if you think about it, BUT, as the internet gets older and more people are using it, computers are advancing, the demand increases and all the half-decent domains get sucked up, even with the new TLDs. The new TLDs are overpriced, and nothing will ever compare to when the internet was fairly new, when good domains were available & free and without having to pay thousands of dollars or even millions for them.

Now, today, more than 20 years after the dot-com bubble, realistically, no domains are available for registering, only the pickers are left and if you want to get a good domain in your collection, you have to buy it at a premium and pray someone is going to buy it, and I don't think people really profit much from that at all, because it's likely that the would-be buyer is another domainer or as the nerds call it, "domain investor" like you, and I guess if the domainer or would-be buyer is smart he wouldnt buy the domain at any higher price than you did yourself because then he would have to resell it even higher if he's trying to make a profit just like you did. Then the price continues to become so high that there isn't much room left to profit off the domain within the domaining industry, then again there are chances it gets purchased by a business or individual interested in it, and then that domain goes out of public circulation and gets used as a website, with only the trash pickers left within the domaining industry.

Nobody wants domains ending in, for example: .xyz and other ugly similarities, even if you get a good domain with such ugly endings it's still realistically worthless, be real. The only TLDs in which "good" domains are worth anything are .COM, .NET and .AI, etc and that only being said if your website has traffic, it's true if you are a logical person and not a trash hoarder. The only domains which have value are high traffic domains, and if you have an ugly TLD domain, for example .xyz with high traffic, good for you, your domain has physical people entering it, then I can make an exception and consider it "valuable".

And finally, domains are not property which means you do not own them, you only have the right to use them and that is only so if you pay the yearly fee. Domains aren't property, therefore they have no book value, no officially recognized value because as I said, it's not property. It's only speculation and it's up to the so called "domain investors" what the market value for it is.

Different can be said about high traffic domains, as I said above, they have physical backing behind them in the form of customers (humans), which are important for generating revenue for a website. The only way you can make a domain "valuable" nowadays is by developing it into a website with traffic.


Alright, that is enough. Now I will be stormed with shit, feel free to thumbs down this post and mass-report me, moderate me or or whatever. I don't care! Just stay mad. Stay edgy!


And feel free to correct any mistake I made in this post, I might take it as advice, it depends.

 

[VRdommy]

Lots of valid points there VRdommy and some good focus points on why quite a few of us curtailed our buying habits and reduced our portfolio size in recent years. If your old enough to have experienced the entire personal computing development. (right back to building your own desktops) Everything falls into place as to progression, the establishment of the internet etc. Would I want to enter the domain market today, No I very much doubt it. There is very little Pioneering today in regards new concepts or business types. Yesteryear was a time when opportunity had its reward for pure hard work, analysis and focus. Today it's mostly chasing Bubbles.

Sure, today everyone is on the internet, but that unfortunately is the point. Everything that isn't an example of a ' Wash, rinse and repeat' business type are few and far between. As thousands of businesses fold each month, so do their domain names drop and re-enter the same business cycle. But the appetite is only there for the top-of-the -tree names, every other configuration can be acceptably replicated. clever/smart wording still has its place but it just doesn't have the Kudos to attract high prices as much as it once did.

Yes, I even had a biz in the computer industry in the 80's where the biz I targeted thought at the time thought I was to young to know what I was doing....LOL It failed after a few years. Hard to get in the door and there were not many to serve.. So I went on to work in tech firms who were hungry for those that had hands on experience I got from spending lots of money buying advanced computer equipment. Good thing as I was nearly broke from it.
It is much better to learn on someone else's nickle.

So,
Stop chasing bubbles. That should be telling you that you are doing it wrong. I call it investor over-hype.
If you have been through it more than once, you should be able to recognize it by now.
You do need to learn from mistakes.
If you are simply going to cast your sail without control, you will go where the wind takes you.
Don't care where you are going ? Ride the wave !

You are investing in a future, not a now. Do you know what new biz is about to be created ?
This is a predictive sport.
If you are only trying to sell to what is here, I would not know what convincing skills you would need to do that task.
Perhaps hypnosis.
You have to present 'advantage', like natural traffic or some other in marketing advantage. Very hard work.
If you are not selling 'insurance.com' (my standby example) you need to adjust for that.

Let's use the stock market as a bit of an example.
The stock market value is also a predictive sport. It does not represent the true value of biz at a given time.
For you make your bets today about future profits expectation. You don't really know what they will be. You rely on news and info to help you make that decision. News and info that you should be critical of. It can be wrong or misleading.

I am staying away from examples that might be in current play in names.

ie I see a future demand for copper since it can not be replaced in the making of electric motors for EV's.
An existing biz. I might invest in those that mine it or process it or even transport it. Exploring for it ?
There may be more biz in the future doing the same ?
I am predicting a future demand for goods or services and potentially a name for a new biz filling the void.

But knowing the cost of copper is about to escalate from the demand, someone working on an alternative to copper might be attractive. What will they need in a name if you believe that this will happen ?
It does not matter to me if I see no real potential for an alternative to copper, but just someone will try.
Should I not invest in a name I think they will need since I also predicatively assume they will fail?
Start-ups do not normally budget high for a domain name, not that you can't extract it. It's normally overlooked.
Missing an opportunity. Someone else may not.

It may not be the best example, but it is an example.

Sharpen your pencil and get ready to use it. The above is example to what you are looking for if you want to score.

I normally spend more of my time talking people out of these bubbles they get themselves in.
Nobody wants to hear that. Especially when you have 50-150 similar names with the same kind of bet.
When in the last 15 years of domain history have you seen more than 5 end user sales in any given month using the same term. With exception to Chinese over-hype that happened in all niche's more than 5 years ago if you can remember that one (99% were not end-user sales). Where are they now?
How about 30 in the same year? To end users ? (I am speaking to charted sales)
Have you been paying attention to that at all ?

It's pretty well known that most domain investors, about 90%+ of them anyway,
will loose money their first 5 years overall. Of that remaining percentage, some make some end user sales, but mostly sell to other investors on the low end of that scale. There is nothing wrong with that.
Nobody on these social boards are going to admit how much money they loose over what they just made.
But everyone takes notice of a sale. Even sales to other investors without knowing that source.
And we all do what we have to to make it to the next potential bet.

I will admit here, I have sold into investor hype. I have seen it so many times, I deem domain investors predictable.
So, when I see it brewing, I look for opportunity.
Because when I see a shortfall in demand to make it to those future prediction bets I have made, I want to survive as well without using lunch money to get there so to speak.
But the difference is, I do not promote these types of names, in fact the whole time I am doing this, I'm likely talking against the bubble. And nobody wants to listen. What more can I do. Someone is going to sell them names. It might as well be me. I don't try to sell them. Just a lander with a price. If you buy a bad name, it's on you.
Maybe I am wrong and you will make money from it ? It is quicker cash for me then the longer end user wait.

Most on the loosing side of this equation are the product of their own greed, thinking a term has more potential demand than a actual market could produce. And can't get enough of them. This is just part of that learning curve, and if you have not over extended yourself, you might survive it.

You can learn more about what not to do by watching others making mistakes.
Draw from their experience without the cost.
For the experience you need takes time to acquire.
No lessons are remembered more than those mistakes you make yourself. But you have to be willing to admit them.
But if you are observant, you can learn by others mistakes for free.
You will know you are starting to get it when you recognize others making mistakes you have made and have admired to yourself. That is how it was for me anyway.

I will not make this long story any longer than I have.

But to add one of my favorite quotes from T.A. Edison since I was a very young teen.
'Great opportunities are lost by not taking advantage of small ones'.

 

[JB Lions]

Addition: I don't think domaining has much time left before it falls out of relevance, I say there is a decade left, or two at most. The classics of the 2000s are gone, only premium domains will be worth it and the times where people register hundreds of mediocre domains and sell them will not be profitable anymore.

Domaining isn't an ''industry''.

People's opinions for the most part are based on their own experiences. So, it's obvious domaining isn't going good for you. These types of threads are always popping up, year after year. I actually had my best year ever, last year. I expect this year to be even better**

Domains aren't going anywhere because the internet isn't going anywhere. There are apps, social media etc but domains/sites you have more control over.

**Of course it's easier if you started earlier but even the "Domain King" just went a year and a half without a sale before getting 2 big ones. Mainly because he prices for home runs while other domainers price for home runs but also, singles, doubles and triples.

While you might not buy something today at a reasonable price and sell for millions, you don't need to, to make a business out of this. You can find domains under $100, under a few hundred and sell them for thousands all day long.

There are people that have started in the last few years/recently that are making a living from this. What's the difference between them and other people into domains? It's like any other business out there, it's not for everybody, not everybody is going to be successful at it. Not everybody is supposed to be. If it's not for you and based on your post, that seems to be the case. Maybe, something else is.

Your post really isn't about domaining as a whole, it's more about your experience with it. It seems people are always trying take their personal experience with domaining and act like it's a reflection on all of domaining.

 

[VadimK]

So, what is the question?

 

[VRdommy]

Let me present a 'different view', not necessarily contrary, but different.

I have domain'd more than 20 years.
And I think what the forum starter is missing, is all of the history along the way.

While that is more than I am even willing to type out here, let me give you some highlights.

In the late 90's as not many realized the potential value and future need of domains, even fewer understood how to leverage the system itself as it was. And not all of that was without some underhanded activity.

For at a a time when search worked a bit different than you all are use to today, we all seek knowledge as to what the user was typing in the URL. Some used a partnership with cute toys folks would install to their browser to monitor that URL and compile the data back to a common place where it was weighed for potential. Call it insider info.

By just good guessing or using this insider info, you would know what domains were commonly misspelled.
That would lead the more devious ones to put up fake websites or just using the name for purposes of traffic to some other site. But you would know what folks were "looking for". A lot of money was made from this.
Many rules were created from the problems the bad actors made. But it was not immediate.

So, whether or not you could get a name in exact form, you could also determine how large some sectors were.
Buying names in the same class or might have similar demand in need.
Do keep in mind at this time a .com would cost you $100-150 to hand reg, so you were not buying in bulk.
There were no coupons or discounts.There was great value in names that had 'natural traffic'.

So, that is just some understanding of how this stuff started. It's not all pretty. Not everyone was underhanded.
Don't tell me that some of you would not jump at such an opportunity if it was looking right at you.
Or that you would not pay for some of that info.
Unfortunately, google rendered much of that useless anymore and browser security stepped up because of all the malware that was in those toys. Because that in itself became big biz spying on habits of users.
It is true that few understood the significance of domains. But that is the trick right down to the name isn't it.
This is a predictive sport.But you can't make a good future judgement unless you understand the now.

So, it can be said that those in this at that stage who made some very nice sums already had an advantage of funds to buy even more valuable names with a target in mind of a future 'high need with deep pockets'.
If you didn't have the funding, you are not going to compete at that level. You needed big sales to be able to corner the next sector.

...moving onward...

The market will continue to change...
15+ years or more ago, I would say that we hit saturation point.
That I define as the point where most everyone who existed that was going to have a presence on the inet was there with their own identity.
No more volume of people in need. Just new startups and perhaps some product expansion. No steep competition for the same name like 'insurance.com'. The best names were 'in use'.
It did not hit all at once, it creeped in from about 2007 - 2012. Most had a hard time explaining the poor sales numbers.

At about this same time, along came a new challenge.... Facebook.
Why would mid scale biz spend 100k on a name when 99% of their users were on facebook and not only could they get some very personal data about users habits and tendency's, they could specifically target them by the same. Much harder to do with a name on the web and google, but google had similar services, but Facebook analytics were indeed better because they had more intimate detail that google could not obtain.
Now the valuable info was a complete user profile complete with people you associate with who likely think the same..
Not good for names.

So the new game if you didn't have the funds to play the big game, was no longer buying and holding in bulk of just slightly better than average odds. Now you have to be decisive and well targeted about future markets. The easy game was over.

I will say, it took me a few years to adjust to this reality, but to react to it properly, you did have to understand what the market was in the past or you could never make adjustments to that going forward.

Which brings us to the present (after skipping over a lot)

The market will continue to change (said that before didn't I)

So when you think it is all over for domains, you have given up on your own ability to see future need.
That is OK if that is where you are. The successes of the past have not hindered anyone from making money in the present. It's just not as easy now. You really gotta work for it.
Find the need, then seek the opportunity of the name to fit it.

Let me say just a few things I seen over the years that even I myself have been guilty of that still happen in this marketplace.There is probably nothing any of you newer to this are going through or even about to, that are not mistakes I have made as well. The only difference with me is I have the long history.

We all feel we do our homework well. But often, you are not looking at the right things to do your homework on.
It's not that you are not putting in the effort, it's just in the wrong things.

I am not trying to make anyone think they way I do for there is plenty I am not saying. Some of it may be offensive because you may be guilty of it yourself and not yet willing to admit you need to look at your actions a bit closer.
.
If you don't see opportunity, then it is time to get out. We all watch sales reports of 6f sales. Do you take any time to see why those names brought so much. Try it. It's a good first step to judging the future.

I might add that it's important for any of you to watch your news with skepticism. Or you may be missleading yourself.

Let's take market sales reports...
If you don't look at the buyer and the buyers use of a name to see that indeed it was a end user sale, you are letting yourself get hyped up over perhaps a category of names that are only selling because of investor over speculation that never fruits or very little. Investor buys fluctuate with the stock market. Not an issue if you intend to sell into investor hype.
But if you want to stay more on solid ground, be aware.

Better homework as to what the market is now will help you to better decide what will be.

So, do you throw in the towel or will you do your homework better for a ever changing marketplace.
Roll with the changes. There have been and will be a lot of them.

Be it known that I do not 'target' 6 figure+ sales. It is a rich man's sport but perhaps you can get lucky.
Your mileage may vary.
I find more enjoyment and success targeting low 5 figures down to 2500 to start-ups.
Better cash flow and keeps me on my game.
Know that it is more of a level playing field than it ever has been. Except for this thing we call EXPERIENCE.
Which is that little voice in your head telling you that you are doing it wrong... again !
Willing to give up what you earned and quit now ?

 

[DomainRecap]

You're absolutely correct that it was a lot easier to make money through domain investing back in the 90's and early 2000's when this was all brand new, not to mention it was cake to drown in unheard of levels of parking revenue during the 2000's.

But that doesn't mean you can't still make money investing in domains, it's just exponentially more difficult and far more capital intensive. You also have to work harder, smarter and longer than your predecessors, and almost certainly will make a lower ROI. But that's true of a lot of things today, in a globalized marketplace with a mushrooming world population.

But hey, if it was easy, everyone would do it.

 

[BaileyUK]

I'm constantly surprised by the number of angry or even just frustrated people that enter domaining. This is a sh*t business, but I'm here, so I'm going to vent my anger that really, I don't have a clue what I'm doing or understand why domains sell. So instead of directing my frustration at myself (I can't accept that) I'll have a pop at all and everything else

Let me tell you despite your beliefs. Domaining in the late 90's wasn't easy, the best domains had been snapped-up years before that. $70 registration and $70 yearly renewals. Probably around the equivalent of $200 a pop today. Do you honestly think somebody like you would have been willing to throw thousands of dollars at what was no-more than a Punt. Nothing about the internet take-up and development was certain back then. Sorry OP but you definitely don't have the strength of character to make a success either today or back then.

I certainly considered myself sweeping up the poor relations in domains even in 1999. but in time they rose up into desirables, trouble being that took a lot of years. I don't think you would have the patience to study the market and then apply a 'Marketers' mindset to your purchases

 

[johnn]

Amazing thread.
One person is wasting too many people time for discussing something that does not make any sense.

 

[bmugford]

A lot of early investors also lose massive amounts of money because for every early investment that pans out, many others go bust.

Everything looks good in retrospect.

 Brad

 

[bmugford]

There's quite a number of very active members who also happen to be very successful in domaining so... I beg to differ.

Yeah, there are several people on the forums who are successful in the domain field.

If anything, you have more free time if you are making relatively passive domain sales.

Brad

 

[Adrigan]

Some of what I was going to write has already been written by others, so I won’t repeat those aspects.

I could be regarded as one of those who bought domains 25-30 years ago (as I write this, just over 25 years have passed since I got onto the web proper) which was in the times of squawking modems, deep and heavy monitors (if you wanted a large colour one) and getting excited about seeing a photo of a nude woman on the screen, completed one swow line at a time, so it would take several minutes to appear in full.
If your baud rate was really slow, best to go have something to eat and come back later.

What the OP is saying is a person opinion/complaint. I don’t know if they are unhappy, or if they have lost money, or they “wish they were around when domain names were not seen as valuable”.
But this is true of all new things.

I remember my employer introducing email to us in 1997 and giving us training on how to use it and later, how to access the web generally (with all those horribly designed web pages in the 1990s and into the early 2000s). I didn’t give it all much notice or importance at the time because I didn’t know anyone with this new email thingy and everyone I needed to communicate with was on the same floor or below in the office, so I would just walk over to them or call them. Why sit there and type out all that I wanted to say, was my thought? Plus, phone shopping was working fine at the time, so using the web to buy something or to ask questions/get info wasn’t a thought either. The web and web pages were usually slow and clunky too, with tons of ads taking their sweet ass time to load.

Why tell you all this?

Because as some people reading this thread (and perhaps the OP too) were around in those times, but they may have forgotten how bad/slow/difficult/expensive the internet was like in those early years, and how some people thought it was a fad. For those reading this who are in their 20s to early 30s, you perhaps can’t understand this and so you probably can’t understand what making investment decisions on this new thing was actually like. I also remember how VR was going to change the world but it hasn’t and I don’t think it ever will, as it is currently offered (the general population are not going to strap some kind of glasses or screen over their eyes in order to try to experience something. Never going to happen (unless we start "living" like the people do in the film Virtual Revolution).

Does anyone remember all the mania, excitement and hype over any business that had a name starting with ‘e” or “e-“? Share prices for these businesses were going through the roof in the dotcom bubble. Those businesses are all dead now, with ebay and eharmony being the only ones I think are still going.

So early investors in anything face a huge risk, especially when investing in a whole new market/paradigm, with no real way of knowing what the future holds. Its mostly guesswork, gut feel and the like. Lots of people have lost money and some have lost their lives by gambling on the wrong area, business or invention. Yes, gambling, because that is almost entirely what investing in unknown ventures is.

The OP says that 25 years ago, domains were in abundance. Well, there were lots of names available when I started to get into this area (Feb 1998), but all the obvious ones were all taken by that point.
Real words were almost all taken, as were their plurals and so what you had to do is come up with names that were not brands which already existed nor real words, but names that could be made into a brand or business. Google is one such example, even though the real word is spelled differently. Twitter is another.There are many others of course.

At that time, I did not consider putting two words together to create a name, nor of inventing words that meant nothing but sounded good (those things came much later). Such domains would have ben available, but you had to think of that idea beforehand, which I did not until 1-2 years later.

One area I thought might take off is people using the web to post their career info on (resumes, samples of work, photos, video clips) as well as families who wanted to showcase their lives. So I registered many firstnamelastname names and some family names too. That hasn’t panned out as I thought it would although a few personal names I created did sell (in the $000’s) and which more than paid for all those that didn’t plus the annual renewal fees. I subsequently let 95% of personal names go.

If a person doesn’t have the creativity, or intelligence or the drive to pursue an opportunity, they won’t be able to take advantage of the opportunity, even if the opportunity is staring at them in the face. Plus, a person has to be able to recognise that an opportunity is an opportunity, first and foremost.

As internet use grew and grew, the value of domain names then began to rise but not before the number of people using it reached a certain point. The OP omits that aspect in his post, as indeed omits many other elements that are relevant and that played a role in how the domain name market/world exists as it does now.

The OP also claims that only domains with traffic are worth something and that the rest of worthless. I agree that there are a lot of names that are pure garbage and I see many such names put up for sale for $30-$100, etc, but I think he/she is being very simplistic as to the value of domain names. There are a great many names which have been registered but have yet to be developed. They will not have any/much traffic, but depending on the quality/usability of the name, some of those names could be worth a considerable sum. It only takes one person in the world to agree with the registrant that a name is good & valuable.

After failing to make much in the personal/family names area and also, losing a few thousand on registering generic .cn names (which were priced at $25-35 a pop for early buyers, once foreign people could register them), I stopped buying new names for several years and just held onto those I kept.

In recent years, I have begun to register names that would come into my mind, perhaps from something I would see or hear, sometimes omitting a letter or two, or switching letters around, or adding 1-2 letters, or some combo of these. I would add them to my list of name ideas, leave them for a couple of days and then go back and see if they still sounded good to me. If a name did, I would register the name after doing a few checks.

There are many examples of domain names that are in common use today that did not exist 10-15-20 years ago, or even 5 years ago, but which are not real words. Pinterest, Facebook, Bing, Sedo, GoDaddy, Groupon,, Spotify, Skype, Instacart, Door Dash, Air B n B, Zillow, and lots lots more. How did the people who came up with these names come up with them? They may have had a flash of inspiration, or they worked on names for weeks and weeks on end, or perhaps some combo of these. What they didn’t do is do nothing and then watched as others made businesses and money from their ideas, or sold their domains to those who wanted to,

The OP has made several black & white statements, but none of them are actually true. Where some people complain, or throw their hands up in frustration/despair and surrender, others ask “What can I do?”, “How can I make this work”? People with the idea, the energy and determination will be seen by others as having such and be drawn to them (like a moth to a flame). Such a person will thus often get support, tools and resources because other people want to be part of that person’s project/energy and be along for the ride. It’s much like why fans of pop stars want to touch the star, in order to somehow “get some of their magic” for themselves, that the star seems to possess.

Nobody alive now (and even babies if they could read), can tell you what will happen in the future.
For certain though, we will still be using letters and words, as we have done for thousands of years, so that aspect isn’t going to go away anytime soon. Therefore, whatever form the internet changes to, if indeed it does change, words will still be required. I suspect we may have a 2 or 3 tier internet within 10-15 years, with the top level commanding premium prices but which will be free of many of the downsides of the internet as it is now.

During the past 12-15 months, I have added over 250 names to my portfolio, which are mostly made up words that no-one has registered before and that do not have a trademark or any business connected to them. Since I started buying names in 1998, I have sold about 10 of them for a combined value of just over $70,000 (net of commissions). I had hoped for more sales but as I have said, things don't always work out the way a person imagines they will.

While the OP is spending time on forums writing frustration-based posts and arguing with people (the exact purpose of which eludes me), others are busy forming new domain names and business ideas and pursuing them. Others are buying domain names that they like and which are being offered for sale, price not being an obstacle.

I suggest to the OP to consider doing less of the former and more of the latter if he/she wants something better in this market and their life generally. The only person stopping them, is themselves, which is true of everyone.

In addition, I would like to refer to an old adage, which applies these days - The best time to invest is when there’s blood in the streets.

 

[pb]

Newsflash: people who took the biggest risk reap the highest rewards.
Or do you think that registering domains 20 years ago and holding them for all this time was free of risk?

 

[JB Lions]

This is the only account I have ever made on a domain forum, what even are you talking about?

It's not a first post type of post. It's a post of somebody who is frustrated with lack of sales. And you've posted nothing about your background with domaining. How about some basic stuff to get started:

How long have you been domaining?

How many domains do you own?

How many have you sold?

What is the breakdown of your extensions you own?

How long have you been on/reading NP?

 

[biggie]

Whenever I see that sales-pitch.

Hi

domains that "speak for themselves", don't need a sales pitch.


imo..

 

[JB Lions]

Just a quick search, some other threads like this over the years, there are many more:

DNS dying? - this one was almost 19 years ago

The death of domaining?

Domain industry is dying slowly?

The domain gravy train has passed

Is domaining becoming a "Nigerian" Scam?

Is Domaining basically one giant pyramid scheme?

Googlenet to kill Domaining?!

Buying/Selling - Is it Time to Quit Domaining?

How long can you hold on?
------
My guess is that it probably wasn't going well for most of those people who started those threads.

Same thing when I started in affiliate marketing full time in 2002*. Every year, affiliate marketing is dying threads and it usually was for the thread starter.

*Now a full time domainer

 

[Mister Funsky]

But hey, if it was easy, everyone would do it.

In my case, it took YEARS to develop the knack/ability to make a successful buy (one that would sell eventually).

Finding a decent name is the easy part...pricing, marketing, sales pitch, etc. are the tough bits but they get better/easier with time. The trick is being able to deal with renewals financially and making proper drop decisions when necessary.

I do feel sorry for the newbies that have fallen prey to the clowns that make money telling them how easy it is (by selling them a 'program' or just relying on clicks or embedded ads).

 

[branding]

It is not bad (or mean) that 25 years ago everything was easier, and people made money.

(whereas today it is much harder).

It is only bad, when you - theoretically - had the chance to invest & sell domains 25 years ago, but didn't make it,
and now see what you all have missed, what you could have earned.

Its the same with any investment. Think about when BTC was just $10/pop. And that's not even that long ago... Think about some stocks...

Could've been a millionaire. Oh well...

 

[BaileyUK]

Lots of valid points there VRdommy and some good focus points on why quite a few of us curtailed our buying habits and reduced our portfolio size in recent years. If your old enough to have experienced the entire personal computing development. (right back to building your own desktops) Everything falls into place as to progression, the establishment of the internet etc. Would I want to enter the domain market today, No I very much doubt it. There is very little Pioneering today in regards new concepts or business types. Yesteryear was a time when opportunity had its reward for pure hard work, analysis and focus. Today it's mostly chasing Bubbles.

Sure, today everyone is on the internet, but that unfortunately is the point. Everything that isn't an example of a ' Wash, rinse and repeat' business type are few and far between. As thousands of businesses fold each month, so do their domain names drop and re-enter the same business cycle. But the appetite is only there for the top-of-the -tree names, every other configuration can be acceptably replicated. clever/smart wording still has its place but it just doesn't have the Kudos to attract high prices as much as it once did.

 

[branding]

Don't get overly obsessed about becoming rich. As long as you're making money to pay the bills and support your family, you're doing fine and are a blessed person.

 

[JB Lions]

What makes you think I have failed?
Of what genes do you think you are to be saying that other people have failed solely by assumption, through a computer screen

I stated my opinions and instead of looking at my opinions you go and talk about how you think of me

Priorities first

It's pretty obvious based on your posts and the need you have to post under a new name, instead of the one you usually post under. If you did, I bet it would be pretty easy to figure out why you're failing by simply going over your past posts. Let's take a look, what name do you usually post under here?

 

[CraigWB]

Domaining currently has a half-life of 10-20 years at the moment I am pretty sure, it will be dying from now on regardless of what I've said.

Hello,

So, what you are saying is that in 10-20 years there will be no new companies, no business opportunities and NO internet just because the current .com domain investing market is saturated with people buying and selling domains, and a the best inventory was acquired at the dawn of the internet?

I can understand what you are saying from reading your post, and replies to such. However, I find your reasoning somewhat reductive. In that, it is limited to how you want the market to be, rather than the reality of what it is.

Running a business and generating revenue correlates directly to global and national economies. One simply has to look at the Macroeconomic data over the last few years. The simplest ones: High Inflation, & Higher interest rates! These have been squeezing individuals and businesses available disposable income & cash flows. Thus, reducing the available liquidity in the domain market. If one pays attention to macroeconomic data , you should be able to forecast the inflow/outflow of money to any given market, and adjust your strategy depending on the Economic data, rather than what you want the market to do, or thinking there are no long term opportunities simply because of a current liquidity drought.

When analysing the domain market, we have to analyse it like any other market in the global, and national economy, and also look at it from how new businesses, or domain buyers will think too.

Let us look at this hypothetical scenario. We have Company 1 that is pre launch and deciding on a name for their business. They will conduct research to see what social handles they can use, and then possibly see if the .com is available - whichever way the want to check. If the .com is not available, they will look to see what other extensions are. If the .com is only available at a premium price, they will see if they can actually afford it. If they can, then great they may just purchase it. If they cannot, what do you think these companies will do? They will register one of the extensions that are available and within their budget including using one of the relevant new extensions that directly applies to their industry.

Like the following:

Economics.report
Investing.broker
Spatial.Archi
420.trading
Forex.promo

All of the above, I have registered (along with many more), and do not expect to sell for a few years yet

Where you see dilution of the .com value (with other extensions like .xyz), most seasoned investors don't see that. The .com names will retain their value based on the simple premise of supply and demand. Now the supply of these is limited the demand will always be high for the right .com names and those with the access to funds to pay for them.

The introduction of other extensions like .xyz, and the newer ones, is financially a good thing. Even if currently some people don't want them for their business. It shows that the domain market is moving forward and there are still a lot of opportunities left in the market. Especially given that an estimated 100 Million new business start each year and these other extensions like .xyz will become even more valuable in 10-20 years.

I actually think, In 10-20 years, there will be newer extensions as they will be needed, and the older ones like .xyz will become more valuable as the supply will be reduced. Also, we can see the current prices of single word .xyz names now (around the $50k-$100k range for good ones - this could be a sub-market trend that is time limited rather than an indication of inherent value.

Every market generally tends to move forward with the developing economy, and I am extremely bullish on some of the other extensions that we have now. To the point that I have been buying up single keyword .xyz names that I am fully prepared to hold for 10-20years until the supply becomes limited - whether this works or not, time will tell!

Understanding how the overall economy works, rather than applying a subjective and somewhat reductive analysis based on what opportunities we missed, is what is important. We have to look at it through the lease of the customer first, and look at how they might think. .com is not the be all and end all, and there is a lot of money still left out there, if one has the right strategy.

The domain market has evolved ( and will keep evolving), and I think that your approach is somewhat nostalgic to the point you feel like you have missed out. Actually, you have not missed out, you just have to have a strategy that matches the current economic climate, as well as a long term strategy.

 

[BaileyUK]

Looking forward, you'll do best looking at the internet as Not too dissimilar to the Phone-system. Anybody involved in the very early developments of the telephone exchanges and the manual switchboards would recognise the progression into todays multifaceted and merged technologies that gave us the internet/mobile communications that we have today. Only a fool would think of the entire system being replaced by some yet to be developed new technology. Sure enhancements will continue to surprise and open-up new product and service prospects. That is a domainers foundation.

If you can't latch on to that vision, it's unlikely you'll ever be able accurately predict the new concepts that will make for future Good domain names. There's very little point in trying to envisage anything beyond 10 to 20 years ahead as some seem to do, its realistic application and life enhancement is going to be influenced by far too many unforeseen contributing factors.

By all means keep your head high but do keep your feet firmly on the ground. The comment about just how much dross was registered by early domainers and is only just being dropped after all these years should be examined by all new-commers. It will give you a real insight into just how much a lack of sensible logic influenced poor choices in domains since day one. Sadly, though that same mindsets seems to prevail today

 

[karmaco]

I don’t agree with OP. Buying average to good domains in huge quantities and selling low the likes of HugeDomains and others has proven to be a successful model. The problem is most Domainers can’t afford to replicate that.

So you have two well known avenues: huge quantity or only top quality dictionary names in smaller quantity. Both provide results.

There are off shoots of the HugeDomains model:

selling independently very low price (below 1K) good quality names to other domainers.

Selling hand regs or cheaply obtained brandables at SH BB etc below market value. This model only provides consisent success with a very big portfolio.

There are multiple ways to turn a profit in this niche but very few will get independently wealthy from it or have financial windfall which might be the best point of the OP’s take.

For 98% of us this is an unpredictable side hustle at best. It should never be considered as a replacement for a job or other income unless you have the capital and skill to maintain a huge good portfolio.

 

[JB Lions]

Domaining currentlt has a half-life of 10-20 years at the moment, it will be dying from now on regardless of what I've said.

It's dead/dying for you. Since you failed at this, you're really not in any position to make any predictions. You're saying the same things other failed domainers said 10 years ago, when this forum first started etc. Your post is nothing new, not very original.

 

[biggie]

The OP showed his industry knowledge, or lack there of, by stating the following -

“The only TLDs in which "good" domains are worth anything are .COM, .NET and .AI”

Hi

i was going to say he forgot to mention .org

and i also think .ai will fade once all the best one-two word combo's are gone.
cuz who's gonna reg 3-4 word names in .ai, like we do with .com?

imo...