discuss How to register new gTLD names in 2019 (and actually sell them).

[Brands.International]

How to register new gTLD names in 2019
(and actually sell them).

This is written particularly for new domain investors - I hope it will save you some money
It is only my personal opinion, and I might be wrong (of course). So here we go:
​

1. Register 1 word domain name, in most cases try to avoid 2 word domain names ​

Example of 1 word domain name: holy.life. Example of 2 word domain name: myholy.life or ourholy.life.
Why? Because chances of selling 2 word domain name in new gTLD space is very small (consult namebio.com). Do not think you can outsmart someone with your word1word2.gTLD combo...in most cases you will not outsmart anyone, and usually you will be dropping such names after 1 year. There are exceptions from this rule of course, but safest bet is to simply avoid it, particularly when you just start with domain investing.

2. Register names with not many alternatives in new gTLD space​

This simply means, that end users can not find alternatives for your name in other new gTLD extension, for reg fee.(use uniregistry.com to check that). Particularly when you ignore point no.1 and register 2 word domain name, you will usually find that your string exists in dozens of other new gTLD extensions...and is available to be registered by anyone for reg fee. This subsequently means you will have no leverage when it comes to negotiations with end users.To learn exactly what "alternatives in new gTLD space" means, read this new gTLD appraisal thread here.

3. Register names with large pools of potential end users.​

You can have perfect new gTLD name, but if there are only few suitable end users who can use your name, it will usually take long time to sell it. If you register name where millions of potential end users exist (so something pretty broad and generic), you will be getting much more offers, and you will be able to close much more sales.

4. To be first is not always better...sometimes it is better to be second.​

When registering new gTLD names, consider this: when extension is brand new, there is almost zero awareness about it among end users (unless there is a huge marketing campaign for it you know about).
It can take years for awareness to be created. This also means that for many extensions there is almost 0 aftermarket in early times. Usually only fellow domain investors. This is natural - if something is very new, almost no one knows about it. So if you want to be first to get best names, fine, but budget for your investments accordingly - it is not wise to expect that you will buy something totally new for USD 10, and you will be able to flip it to end user for USD 10k. It happens, but rarely. There are many experienced new gTLD domain investors, who simply wait for drops after 1st year and pick up some very nice names. But this wisdom comes with years of investing experience and is not something what can be intuitively understood, at least from what I see.

5. Make sure renewals of your domain names are sustainable.​

Second most important thing in new gTLD domain investment (after quality of the name) - make sure you understand renewal fees for your domain names. In order for you to be in a long term game, renewal fees of your domain names must be sustainable (aka low). Otherwise you will be dropping almost all of your names after 1 year, and all your effort will be wasted.

6. Make proper landers for your names​

Do not just let your domain names without proper landing pages. Do not be lazy and immediately prepare landers for them. Imo best option is undeveloped.com atm, but many good alternatives are available as well.
Some old school domainers are used to the fact that they were contacted by people who found their contact details in WHOIS database - this is not possible anymore, as due to GDPR legislation most records from WHOIS database are now masked. This also means that when you have new gTLD domain name, your details will be masked in most cases (again, there are few exceptions from this rule, but do not rely on them),. Buyers thus have no way how to contact you. Clear landing pages are a must in 2019.

7. Do not follow the herd.​

Just because all people at Namepros are registering .panda (just an example), it does not mean you also need to register .panda...Most people are not profitable and are actually loosing lot of money - so if you will do the same thing as most people, you will have the same results as most people....

When you follow the herd, it is not only that competition is huge, but you will end up registering nonsense word1 word2 names, in times where there is no aftermarket created yet, when you do not know if there are some renewal promotions in future, when major domain selling sites not yet support that extension, and when there is no awareness yet among end users. Likely result of your action: you will drop your names prior first renewal round. This is happening since 2014 in many forms and shapes, still it seems like most people like to repeat those mistakes happily again and again.

You need to find your niche/extensions/areas of expertise and go from there. The most lucrative way is still to buy new gTLD names from fellow domain investors, but almost no one is doing it, except few people. Typical newbie new gTLD domain "investor" will rather spend USD 10 on 200 bad names and will not sell even 1 of them, prior dropping them all, then to pay USD 2000 for 1 great name which can sell for great profit. Which leads to:

8. Get 2-3 good names instead of 200-300 bad names (which you will drop anyway).​

Buy only quality new gTLD names, as only highest quality sells in 2019. And you know that you have great new gTLD domain name, if you have a good feeling renewing it 9 years in advance.This should be always your test: am I confident enought for this name, so I have no problem to pay years in advance for it's renewal fees? Now to critics which would tell you that you are blocking unnecessarily your capital by paying renewals in advance, I would like to remind:
a) renew your name years in advance if there is a great renewal promotion (you can save sometimes 90% of total cost, as some renewal promotions for new gTLDs are simply amazing)
b) when you renew your new gTLD name 9 years in advance, it tells your potential buyers something about your commitment....in my experience, it is much easier to negotiate if your name is renewed like that.

Buyers are not stupid: they will check everything possible about you and your names, and in most cases they are simply waiting if the name does not expire/if you do not drop it . But when we are in 2019 and your name is renewed until 2027, this waiting game is simply over for them, and they need to approach you if they want the name. But to play this game, you really need to have good new gTLD names.

9. Get to social media and make lot of connections.
​

Do not be a secret seller. Have your portfolio clearly visible to anyone, and go to Twitter, Linkedin, Instagram, Youtube and Facebook at least. People with most success have great online presence, and professionally looking marketplaces.

10. Price your domain names as a pro, do not be a chicken
​

Look, if you price your domains with $120 price tag (for example), this will result in following: you will sell your best domains quickly for low price (and when you report it, fellow domain investors will say Congrats congrats, congrats, and you will feel great as super-seller), but at the same time you will be left with portfolio of bad domain names, which no one wants even for this low price tag. This is sure way to poor financial status and poverty. You do not want that. New gTLD names are very unique, as they are are pure phrases without any suffix, and are therefore also geo neutral. They have great value, and this value grows in time.
If you have great new gTLD name, renew it for years in advance, and do not let it go for cheap - as one day you might retire on it...

11. Bonus point - do not listen to "voices of past" with "only .com is an good investment" mantra
​

This is already past us and so not 2019 - luckily we see this nonsense less and less ...

What is your opinion when it comes to new gTLDs registrations ? ​

 

[Bob Hawkes]

A lot of good sense in this post, even for those of us who are not completely new. Thank you @lolwarrior !

I totally agree with advice to for the most part aim for single word on the left of the dot. I think the only exceptions would be in cases where two words are essential to express the idea. For example, AirConditioning sold for a good amount. It is technically 2 words, but you need them both to express the idea so it is like a single word.

The sustainable renewal point you make is critical, and you are the pro finding good renewal deals. I personally do register a number of names that I never plan to pay renewal on - unless I have some legitimate interest in the first year. The price structure does support doing this in many extensions. But for the high quality names you plan to keep until you get a reasonable offer, for sure plan on renewal costs you can afford.

Anyway thanks so much for all of your great contributions to NPs!

Bob

 

[hawkeye]

@Bob Hawkes ok maybe using the word ‘fake’ was wrong, but those 3 sales account for about 20% of that $5.7 mill in ngtlds, which skews that sales number.

Also, as @lolwarrior likes/loves to spread/share/give so much advice/appraisals etc on the new gtlds, it would ‘more beneficial’ if he’d share his sales of all the new gtlds he’s sold so far, so people can get a better idea of his knowledge base of them, and not appear to spreading advice based on his personal bias for being so heavenly invested in them. One sided advice is only good if it’s been proven, and is not just a dispersed opinion.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Hoping not to divert attention from the legitimate and valuable purposes of this thread, I did want to explain why I have decided to start giving posts like the following a dislike:

Online.casino $510,000 12/6/18
Vacation.rentals $500,300 4/11/18
Home.loans $500,000 1/24/18

All donuts sales, all fake.

It has bothered me for some time when people flippantly toss around words like 'fake' or 'not legitimate sale' without a shred of evidence. In fact in cases such as this an overwhelming amount of evidence is to the contrary (i.e. that the sales are indeed authentic): NameBio and DNJournal listed, we know the end users, they have been interviewed at DNWire in two of the cases, we know the businesses operating at the sites, the registry confirmed/announced the sales, some of us have personally met both the buyers and reps. for the sellers.

So it's just a discussion forum, why does it bother me so much? Here are my reasons.

1. It hurts end users. As we all know discussion on NPs gets Google archived and appears high on search results in many cases. If you are part of an organization that paid a hefty fee for a domain name that someone claims the sale is fake, then people might come to believe it without realizing it is a post by a random anonymous individual. If they do believe it then it does real hurt to the organization. It is simply unfair. These are real people. I have met two of them. Language like the above is hurtful and it is wrong.
2. It internally may hurt end user organizations. Quite apart from external reputation, it may cause internal issues if anyone believes it. For example at least one of these names was bought by a consortium of business leaders.
3. It hurts domain sellers. Whether registry or domainers, when we falsely claim that sales are fake we hurt reputations of sellers and also faith in the industry overall. It hurts us all.
4. It unfairly harms respected sources of information. These sales were reported in NameBio, DNjournal and DNWire. If we allow unsubstantiated claims of fake to stay unchallenged we harm the legitimacy of highly respected information sources in our community. Have they ever made a mistake? Probably. They correct when evidence is provided.
5. It means that when there is real evidence of questionable sales, no one will listen. If there are dozens of claims of 'fake' without a shred of evidence offered, when later there is a case where a sale should legitimately be questioned we will all have tuned out the constant chatter of loosely thrown around fake sales. This is unfair to those who dig deeply into transactions, who do real research. It is unfair to them, to us.
6. It does harm to NamePros. I love NPs. It is a vibrant community of individuals who debate questions, help each other, provide technical help, buy/sell/give away domain names, provide help to those in need or starting out, and make us all better domainers. When we allow unsubstantiated claims of fake (or similarly unfair and unsubstantiated claims of business wrongdoing) to go unchallenged they hurt our community, they hurt all of the posts where the individual has taken the effort to give a researched, evidenced and balanced view.

It has bothered me for a long time, but I have decided to draw a line and say going forward I will give a dislike rating to such posts. The claims are often used against new gTLD sales, hence the relevance to this thread, but they are not only in new extensions.

I want to stress that this is not only about the individual whose post I used to illustrate this - when I see a claim of this type from any NP member I plan to simply post a dislike as my statement. As most of you know, in the past I have almost never used dislike and have given tens of thousands of authentic likes. When people have a new insight, clearly did research on something, share their technical background, are encouraging, and help in a number of other ways I legitimately like them.

I don't plan to debate the cited post or other cases where I decide they warrant a dislike. I have decided that the best way, in my opinion which is possibly wrong, is to refuse to engage in debate with those who throw around words like 'fake' because I feel that it helps encourage them and others in similar hurtful activity. My dislike is my simple statement.

Each of you have to make your personal decision. All I ask is that you carefully consider the 6 points I have raised above. Maybe also ask yourself this question. Your niece or nephew got their highest mark ever on a Math test. Do you immediately respond with "It must be a mistake." or "Oh, you must have cheated." I don't think so.. And I ask that we all carefully consider before we post claims of false or dishonest behaviour, the question do we really have any evidence? It hurts people and organizations. Really.

Thanks for reading this long post.

Bob

 

[Bob Hawkes]

These names rarely sell, easy to say “don’t listen to .com people” but 92% of aftermarket sales are in that extension.

All new tlds combined don’t even have half of one percent. .us and .eu sells better than all new tlds combined, and they are terrible extensions to begin with!

There is no doubt that the vast majority of sales are in legacy TLDs, especially .com.

However, I believe this post does not accurately portray the global situation. Using NameBio data for the full year 2018 ngTLDs had 1464 sales accounting for a sales volume of $5.7 million. All extensions combined accounted for 82,,800 sales and $107.3 million. In both cases the real market is bigger due to the fact that NameBio is a subset of the entire market.

In other words ngTLDs accounted for 1.8% of total sales by number and 5.3% of total sales by dollar volume. By registration the ngTLDs account for about 7.6% of the total domain registrations. Therefore by dollar volume they are slightly under represented. If we take into account that about 50% of the ngTLD sales volume is to registries, and about 15 to 20% of the number of sales, you could adjust for that factor if desired.

If we are to do a comparison as the poster suggests with .us and.eu, they sold (NameBio stats) 127 sales, $136k or .us and 62 sales, $273.8k for .eu. In other words .us plus .eu combined represent about 1/9 the number of sales of the ngTLDs and a bit under 1/12 by dollar volume of the ngTLDs.

Since the 92% figure was quoted, I suspect the poster was using the Afternic/GoDaddy data presented by Paul Nicks at NamesCon. Naturally enough although GoDaddy operate globally their sales show a strong North American bias, and with that a strong .com bias. NameBio has its own selection biases, but I would argue it better represents the global situation. The presentation at NamesCon did point out that there were strong regional differences and also that while tiny ngTLDs proportionally to the previous year had done better. GD/Afternic are extending regional offices, and I suspect will have a stronger global presence in future.

Bob

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Nice to see a $7000 non-registry sale in second place on the newly released NameBio data (sale at Sedo, 319 days old domain name) 'new' in the video extension. But I thought ngTLDs never sold, or when they do it is always the registries? I must have misread this thread

https://namebio.com/new.video

I have no idea who the seller is, but let's see how it rates with the advice @lolwarrior gives in the beginning of this thread.

1. Generally a single word - check.
2. Not competing extensions available. A broad question, but if the application is video, then I guess would check the name with film, but the registry want about $7000 for it, the name in .tv is not available. I did not do a full count but the word new is gone or high premium in most extensions that could infer video even by a stretch. So I would say - check
3. Large number potential users. I think a definite - check
4. Don't rush in the first days of availability. This was picked up just under 1000 days after TLD became available - definite check
5. Make sure your renewals are sustainable. This is a premium with it would appear a renewal of about $40 (did not shop around, may be slightly less some places). That is not low, but not a killer for such a high quality name. I would say (arguably perhaps) - check
6. Make proper landers. Although this sold through Sedo, it used Undeveloped landers in the past year, among the best imho. So I would say - check
7. Do not follow the herd. This was not a blockchain, cannabis, etc. name. Good old fashioned generic word with a nice match new TLD. - check
8. Get a small number of quality names. Not sure how many seller had, but this is definitely quality. I would say - check
9. Use social media - unknown
10. Be bold with your pricing - I would say check. $7000 is a very nice price. Some might say it could have gone for even more. I checked for exact word 'new' sales on NameBio and there have been 10, this places 5th on that list. Interestingly the highest price is also a new extension sale, in the .earth TLD, by LegalBrandMarketing within the past year and it would appear also a non-registry sale. It sold for $18,800. The .tv went for $8000, so I would say this went for about the right price.

Congrats @lolwarrior. You score 9 plus one unknown out of 10. A+ work!

Bob

 

[oldtimer]

"lolwarrior: Generally I am pleasantly surprised how many people here are seriously discussing new gTLDs at the present time - 2 years ago, situation was very different, discussions were pretty heated. Some people were posting pictures of tombstones with texts like "RIP new gTLDs" or "gTLDs 2014-2016" etc, they were almost hysterically crying "new gTLDs are dead", etc. Exciting times for good debate! Those people now behave in much more civilised manner, and I think most people who are dealing with new gTLDs (at least partially) are now coming to very similar ideas and conclusions, and some general consensus starts to form as of how to approach this investment asset, in a best way possible."

- - - - -

Believe it or not the heated debates about New gTLDs stared five years before the first New gTLD was even released in 2014 and have been going on since. That environment although being kind of harsh, but has allowed those who had faith in New gTLDs to pick up some nice keywords due to lack of competition.

By the way I don't see what difference it makes as to whom the end users are buying their domains from, whether it's from the Registries or domainers the important thing is that there seems to be more awareness about New gTLDs than before, the fact that the Registries are selling the top keywords to the end users directly might actually be a good thing in creating more awareness for New gTLDs. If all the top keywords were in the hands of the top domain investors who wanted to keep them in their vault for 20 years, there wouldn’t be any awareness or sales that we could talk about today. Lets face it the New gTLDs were designed to bypass domainers and hoarding of domains, but even though most top domains are owned or reserved by the Registries there are still some good opportunities for those who want to take their chances with New gTLDs. (although there is now going to be more competition thanks to lolWarrior )

https://www.namepros.com/threads/boycott-icanns-new-domain-name-extension-release-thread.488342/

 

[Bob Hawkes]

A few ideas re getting good renewal rates on ntLDs (or anything really)::

I agree with @Ostrados re DomComp.I presume most on this list know of it, but I always check TLD-list as well to find lowest current registration, transfer and renewal rates. They have some registrars not on DomComp

Use TLD-List for Historical Rates
One of the reasons I prefer TLD-list to DomComp (but use both regularly) is that if you scroll to bottom of page for an extension it will show you the historical prices. While past does not always predict future, if an extension has gone up and down in renewals, and it is near the top now, if you can wait for a better rate it might be rewarded.

Look at Registrars Not Listed in DomComp and TLD-List
Note that neither TLD-list nor DomComp include some registrars with good prices like West.xyz so you will have to search those rates individually.

Determine Wholesale Prices As Part of Evaluation of Deals
Neither DomComp nor TLD-list include the rates at Domain Cost Club, so if you have a membership, or considering one, there be sure to check their transparent pricing on their website. As DCC show wholesale pricing (the price to registrars) I find this page of prices on registration and renewal helpful even if you never plan to pay for their service. If for example they show that $5.00 is the wholesale cost and someone has a promotion at $2.50 that is a good deal and I should take it. If however, they tell me wholesale is $5..00 but the best anyone else is offering is $9.00 maybe if I wait I can get a better deal.

NameStat Shows Rates Too
Another way to find different registrar pricing in one place is to use NameStat for the extension, and on the right they state the rates for a long list of registrars including Domain Cost Club. Note that NameStat have three tabs one for register, transfer and renew so you can check all there. NameStat is particularly helpful for those who concentrate in just a few extensions.

Read the Emails From Your Registrar!
Finding the multi-year rates is a challenge as they come and go and in general don't show up on TLD-list or DomComp. Read the emails your registrar send you (yes, really!) as they may alert you to deals. For example Domain Cost Club just emailed members with multi-year deals (I think you need to be getting them at time of registration) on 9 popular new extensions. For example you can register a .space for 10 years for $49 or for 3 years for $15.

Check Multi-Year Rates At Registration
When you first register always check what the rates are for multiple years. I sometimes find there are deals that show up that way that don't seem to be announced.

Multi Year Rates Announced Outside Domain Community
Some extensions periodically have good 5 (and or 10) year rates. For example a deal on .tech seems to come and go. Do Google search as often these are promoted in the tech and not the domain community.

Say Goodbye And Be Your Own Drop Catch Agent
Got a name you really like but can't find a renewal you want? Let it go, but watch it. Four of the domains I have now I decided even though I liked them, not enough to pay $15 to $30 for another year. They had super reduced first year rates. So I let them go. Then as the expiry period approached I repeatedly checked their availability. Two of the 4 I was able to get back at the low first year rate. I became my own drop catch agent. Yes, you don't get them all back, but the world if full of domains to handle - having no particular domain is essential to your success.

Be Alert to Time Sensitive Deals
Not as many as for first year registrations, but occasionally find some. One reason I deal with 9 different registrars is that they all tell me about deals they have.

Even after all of that, some domains will never be reduced. For example Google seem to be firm in holding renewals at around the $12 mark (although wholesale a bit less). Also, since they abandoned the discounting the former FFM extensions seem firm at registrations and renewals around the same figure.

Bob

 

[Henry Y]

This is a super great article for nGTLD investors!

Just want to add a point that keyword must match extension. For instance, "insurance" is a great keyword but does not match .flowers, so "insurance.flowers" will never be sold.

 

[Josh R]

(and sell them) lol ...

@lolwarrior has not obligation to disclose his "sales", but If you choose that path then why would you post so much public advice on new G's?... If you want to pioneer the new G space, then you have step up and demonstrate that you can at least practice what you preach.

 

[Brands.International]

Don’t waste your money.

@johnnie018 you seems to be little cranky in your posts here - do you realise that?
Why so much unhappiness? I mean, if you do not like new gTLDs, continue investing in .com, .biz or .info

 

[Brands.International]

@lolwarrior, whenever a group of people have the same interest or believe in the same cause they usually belong to an organization, association, or Club, and as such that limits the domain choices to a very few regardless of how many other extensions might be available since those don't convey the same keyword/extension message.

For example for the keyword “Save Earth” .com is taken, .org is currently for sale at 3k , .green is available to register but has a renewal of $99 dollars, and so I believe that SaveEarth.club at 99 cents and with minimal renewal charges is a pretty good domain that matches this keyword.

I consider myself an environmental enthusiast and find the domain name SaveEarth.club a good choice for the cause of saving earth so perhaps you should add a new rule to the list that says it's a plus if you are passionate about what your domain represents so that way at the very least you can do something with it yourself that makes you happy.

@oldtimer I totally agree with you .. it is always great when we own domain names we like, we are passionate about and we might even develop in future by ourselves. I have few such domain names as well, which I personally just love

Now, when it comes to resell value:
I learned to be very strict when it comes to registrations. I have to be. And one thing I learned very soon in the game is this: whenever I am about to register a new domain name, I always ask myself this question:

Is there an easy and cheap way end user can bypass me and my domain name? (Aka : can they register something very similar to my name for cheap price?)

Or this is just another way to ask : "are there plenty of available alternatives in new gTLD space for this string?"

Now I will be harsh, but it is just an discussion and opinion's exchange, so I hope it ok:

For example, your name SaveEarth / Club. Lovely name, very memorable, and makes tons of sense.
Byt imagine I am one of those end users who simply do not want to pay anything more then reg fee for a domain name. Here is what I can do:

1. I can go to uniregistry.com, and put string "SaveEarth" to the search field. In 2 seconds I will learn that I can register following names for following prices (information valid at the moment of writing):

a) SaveEarth.live for $1.88
b) SaveEarth.websie for $0.99
c) SaveEarth.online for $3.88
d) SaveEarth.agency for $4.88
e) SaveEarth.center for $4.88
e) SaveEarth.international for $4.88
e) SaveEarth.fund for $4.88
plus another 295 available new gTLD extensions for this string are available as well.

Now, we can of course start arguing if .club fits better then .fund or .center or .international for this string and possible use of the domain name, but obviously that would be very very very rare situation that someone would want exactly your extension THAT much that they would pass all the alternatives which they could get very cheap.

And this is the reason I wrote rules 1 and 2. Most people who starts with new gTLDs (I was one of them when I started) are not aware how strongly those rules will affect your profitability results (in minus, if you do not follow them).

2. And that is not all: even if above is not enough, when you have string like SaveEarth, you can not only find hundres of available alternatives in new gTLD space (meaning in other new gTLD extensions), but you can find also dozens of close alternatives to that string itself! Consider this:

SaveEarth vs ProtectEarth vs CleanEarth vs.....
and
SaveEarth vs SavePlanet vs SaveGaia vs...
and
SaveEarth vs CleanPlanet vs ProtectGaia vs ...

So ...you can also create variations and permutations in first and second position of the string itself.

I am not going to bore you with exact math, but if you consider that instead SaveEarth / Club you can also easily register something like ProtectPlanet / Center, the number of available alternatives (which are more or less close to your orginal domain name from semantic point of view) goes to hundreds of thousans of names....
.....................
Saying all above, it is worth mentioning imo that we have also .earth extension. Imo most valuable string you can get in new gTLD space in this context is of course save / earth (if you visit the page it is on landers of sedo at the moment of writing with a BIN price which (I find very reasonable), and the name seems to have also very reasonable premium renewal of around $80 / month. Disclaimer - I have no idea who owns it, and I am not connected anyhow to it)

So, conclusion: from resale point of view, I think name like save / earth is simply amazing (rule no.1), while from above reasons of tons of available alternatives I am not really fan of names which are in breach of rules 1 and 2.

As an couter example : I recently purchased from OP here at Namepros name Act.Best, which I absolutely love - and what I love most, is that there are basically no alternatives to it in new gTDL space (or any space we can imagine)

All of above just imo....

 

[NickB]

I hope the rhetoric in this thread can be toned down a little. @lolwarrior put some effort into developing a set of 10 principles. I would love to see discussion of those, if we could please try to stop taking the discussion into attacks on people. Please? (I'm Canadian, we say that a lot - in fact please, thank you, and sorry are our favourite words, oh and hockey too )

Sorry to delay in responding to the points you made in reply to me @JB Lions - took some time to enjoy the beautiful outdoors. Anyway, here they are....

My apologies, I was just trying to make sure we have accurate statistics. Very sorry if that was repetitive. I do have one person on Ignore, so maybe miss part of the conversation.

I am sorry to be dense but I have no idea what this means. Maybe the comment was not intended for me even though it was in a reply to me? Thank you in advance for clarification.

I did. I am sorry if you feel I am not writing sensible things. I simply am an old man doing my best to write accurate, current, balanced and logical things. I know I fail sometimes. and I apologize for those times. I just do my best, it really is all any of us can ask of ourselves. I know you have a huge amount of experience in domains, and I apologize if you feel my contributions are not sensible.

Anyway, can we all just turn the heat in this thread way down. Just a simple request. Please.

Bob

Bob,

You have nothing to apologise about.

Everyone on here has an opinion and they will never be a day when everyone agrees on something

Keep providing yours as it is always worth reading and please do not apologise for it!

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Can I state something obvious, but that I think we overlook. Many (not all) new extensions have significantly lower prices in the first year than in later years, even if you do shop around for the best renewal rates as discussed earlier in the thread.

If we look at the idea that your probability of a sale times the expected net profit from the sale must be greater than a yearly cost for the investment to make sense, then it seems to me that there are domains that make sense to hold for one year, but may not have sound arguments to hold longer.

Putting in some simple numbers. Let's say I have a name that based on previous sales if it sells would sell for $1200. Let me also estimate that the probability of sale is 1/400 This means it only makes sense as a domain investment if the annual cost is $3 (overlooking a few things for simplification). That means it might be worth my while to try it for one year if I can get it at $1 or $2 (although barely so) but probably not worth keeping if my lowest renewal (at a registrar I want to use) is $9. It also means if I could get a multi year renewal at $3 per year it might make sense, but not at $6 per year (if I trust the precision of my numbers to that degree).

Google's extensions have pricing that make them more like .com, except for premium and EAP about $12 per year period, but many others are like my example.

I think deciding some of your domains have a one year exit plan, unless you have offers or inquiries which makes the probability more favourable, also is an inducement to get them listed and in front of potential purchasers.

Bob

 

[barman]

This is excellent advice. Great post!

I'm still sticking to .com though...

 

[vravis9]

My opinion about ngTLDs...

Read the above article before getting into this...

Wish I had read this one year before... I would saved good amount of money...

Time travel is not yet available...so careful steps now onwards..

Thanks @lolwarrior for this great checklist...it is concise and very valuable.

Thanks,
Ravi.

 

[Henry Y]

Someone stated that there were three $500k ngTLDs sales in 2018, which is incorrect. The top 3 ngTLDs sales in 2018 should be $510k (online/casino, Donuts), $500k (home/loans, Donuts) and $300k (the/club, Brandaisy).

An additional information is that sales at 5 figures or more happen in multiple venues, such as Donuts, Brandaisy, Sedo, Uniregistry, GoDaddy, NameSilo, Undeveloped, Jiangsu Bangning, Alibaba Cloud, etc.

 

[NameJi]

How to register new gTLD names in 2019
(and actually sell them).

This is written particularly for new domain investors - I hope it will save you some money
It is only my personal opinion, and I might be wrong (of course). So here we go:
​

1. Register 1 word domain name, in most cases try to avoid 2 word domain names ​

Example of 1 word domain name: holy.life. Example of 2 word domain name: myholy.life or ourholy.life.
Why? Because chances of selling 2 word domain name in new gTLD space is very small (consult namebio.com). Do not think you can outsmart someone with your word1word2.gTLD combo...in most cases you will not outsmart anyone, and usually you will be dropping such names after 1 year. There are exceptions from this rule of course, but safest bet is to simply avoid it, particularly when you just start with domain investing.

2. Register names with not many alternatives in new gTLD space​

This simply means, that end users can not find alternatives for your name in other new gTLD extension, for reg fee.(use uniregistry.com to check that). Particularly when you ignore point no.1 and register 2 word domain name, you will usually find that your string exists in dozens of other new gTLD extensions...and is available to be registered by anyone for reg fee. This subsequently means you will have no leverage when it comes to negotiations with end users.To learn exactly what "alternatives in new gTLD space" means, read this new gTLD appraisal thread here.

3. Register names with large pools of potential end users.​

You can have perfect new gTLD name, but if there are only few suitable end users who can use your name, it will usually take long time to sell it. If you register name where millions of potential end users exist (so something pretty broad and generic), you will be getting much more offers, and you will be able to close much more sales.

4. To be first is not always better...sometimes it is better to be second.​

When registering new gTLD names, consider this: when extension is brand new, there is almost zero awareness about it among end users (unless there is a huge marketing campaign for it you know about).
It can take years for awareness to be created. This also means that for many extensions there is almost 0 aftermarket in early times. Usually only fellow domain investors. This is natural - if something is very new, almost no one knows about it. So if you want to be first to get best names, fine, but budget for your investments accordingly - it is not wise to expect that you will buy something totally new for USD 10, and you will be able to flip it to end user for USD 10k. It happens, but rarely. There are many experienced new gTLD domain investors, who simply wait for drops after 1st year and pick up some very nice names. But this wisdom comes with years of investing experience and is not something what can be intuitively understood, at least from what I see.

5. Make sure renewals of your domain names are sustainable.​

Second most important thing in new gTLD domain investment (after quality of the name) - make sure you understand renewal fees for your domain names. In order for you to be in a long term game, renewal fees of your domain names must be sustainable (aka low). Otherwise you will be dropping almost all of your names after 1 year, and all your effort will be wasted.

6. Make proper landers for your names​

Do not just let your domain names without proper landing pages. Do not be lazy and immediately prepare landers for them. Imo best option is undeveloped.com atm, but many good alternatives are available as well.
Some old school domainers are used to the fact that they were contacted by people who found their contact details in WHOIS database - this is not possible anymore, as due to GDPR legislation most records from WHOIS database are now masked. This also means that when you have new gTLD domain name, your details will be masked in most cases (again, there are few exceptions from this rule, but do not rely on them),. Buyers thus have no way how to contact you. Clear landing pages are a must in 2019.

7. Do not follow the herd.​

Just because all people at Namepros are registering .panda (just an example), it does not mean you also need to register .panda...Most people are not profitable and are actually loosing lot of money - so if you will do the same thing as most people, you will have the same results as most people....

When you follow the herd, it is not only that competition is huge, but you will end up registering nonsense word1 word2 names, in times where there is no aftermarket created yet, when you do not know if there are some renewal promotions in future, when major domain selling sites not yet support that extension, and when there is no awareness yet among end users. Likely result of your action: you will drop your names prior first renewal round. This is happening since 2014 in many forms and shapes, still it seems like most people like to repeat those mistakes happily again and again.

You need to find your niche/extensions/areas of expertise and go from there. The most lucrative way is still to buy new gTLD names from fellow domain investors, but almost no one is doing it, except few people. Typical newbie new gTLD domain "investor" will rather spend USD 10 on 200 bad names and will not sell even 1 of them, prior dropping them all, then to pay USD 2000 for 1 great name which can sell for great profit. Which leads to:

8. Get 2-3 good names instead of 200-300 bad names (which you will drop anyway).​

Buy only quality new gTLD names, as only highest quality sells in 2019. And you know that you have great new gTLD domain name, if you have a good feeling renewing it 9 years in advance.This should be always your test: am I confident enought for this name, so I have no problem to pay years in advance for it's renewal fees? Now to critics which would tell you that you are blocking unnecessarily your capital by paying renewals in advance, I would like to remind:
a) renew your name years in advance if there is a great renewal promotion (you can save sometimes 90% of total cost, as some renewal promotions for new gTLDs are simply amazing)
b) when you renew your new gTLD name 9 years in advance, it tells your potential buyers something about your commitment....in my experience, it is much easier to negotiate if your name is renewed like that.

Buyers are not stupid: they will check everything possible about you and your names, and in most cases they are simply waiting if the name does not expire/if you do not drop it . But when we are in 2019 and your name is renewed until 2027, this waiting game is simply over for them, and they need to approach you if they want the name. But to play this game, you really need to have good new gTLD names.

9. Get to social media and make lot of connections.
​

Do not be a secret seller. Have your portfolio clearly visible to anyone, and go to Twitter, Linkedin, Instagram, Youtube and Facebook at least. People with most success have great online presence, and professionally looking marketplaces.

10. Price your domain names as a pro, do not be a chicken
​

Look, if you price your domains with $120 price tag (for example), this will result in following: you will sell your best domains quickly for low price (and when you report it, fellow domain investors will say Congrats congrats, congrats, and you will feel great as super-seller), but at the same time you will be left with portfolio of bad domain names, which no one wants even for this low price tag. This is sure way to poor financial status and poverty. You do not want that. New gTLD names are very unique, as they are are pure phrases without any suffix, and are therefore also geo neutral. They have great value, and this value grows in time.
If you have great new gTLD name, renew it for years in advance, and do not let it go for cheap - as one day you might retire on it...

11. Bonus point - do not listen to "voices of past" with "only .com is an good investment" mantra
​

This is already past us and so not 2019 - luckily we see this nonsense less and less ...

What is your opinion when it comes to new gTLDs registrations ? ​

Thanks Great points. I would like to add below point:

Both Left side and right side of dot is important. Consider buying only ultra-quality one word domains on both sides. Also flip the sides (left.right vs right.left) and compare the prices and valuations. Your domain name (left.right) should be readable and together should have demand. Some of the popular new gTLDs has popular left and popular right. For example, sex.live, book.store, training.live, study.group, video.cool, emails.market -- in these cases both left and right are popular words and highly brand-able.

 

[Henry Y]

Online.casino $510,000 12/6/18
Vacation.rentals $500,300 4/11/18
Home.loans $500,000 1/24/18

All donuts sales, all fake.

I just quoted from NameBio:
Vacation.rentals, $500,300, 2017-12-04, Uniregistry
Probably this domain was owned by Donuts but sold at Uniregistry as Uniregistry was the broker of the deal. The deal was made in late 2017 but was reported in April 2018.

I think all the sales are not fake as they were verified by multiple independent parties (e.g. NameBio and DNJournal) and different people from different companies were involved in the deals. It is reasonable that the highest ngTLDs sales were from Donuts because Donuts owned many extremely great ngTLDs domains. It is nonsense and not responsible to say that the sales are fake just because of the same registry, the similar prices and the public events. You have to provide soild evidence to show the sales are fake, e.g. to prove that the sales documents are forged documents or all involved parties (sellers, buyers and brokers) were actually a group. Otherwise, it is just your imagination.

Also, it is meaningless to only look at the top 3 sales and ignore other high sales. Domaining is not a kind of contest. We should have a holistic view. High ngTLDs sales (5 figures or more) took place in multiple venues (e.g. Brandaisy, Sedo, Uniregistry, GoDaddy, NameSilo, Undeveloped, Jiangsu Bangning, Alibaba Cloud) and countries. Can you say these high sales are all fake?

 

[Bob Hawkes]

@lolwarrior you should take it as a compliment that while a few (one individual in particular that seems a little grumpy) have expressed some general hate against ngTLDs, I have not seen in the thread any logical arguments against the points you started the thread with. That means it was well written! The addition by @henrypcyeung adding stress to the importance of the across the dot match is a good addition.

I might also say that much in your post is of value to domain investors even if they were not in ngTLDs. Things like a sustainable and realistic business model with projections re renewal costs, locking in renewals in advance, having good landers for your names, not following mindlessly trends, and emphasize quality over quantity are all universally true. The renewals is more important in ngTLD because so much variability in charges, but even in .com I am amazed some pay more than they really need to.

Thanks again for a great thread @lolwarrior and have a great day!

Bob

 

[Ostrados]

..i still dont get it

did your rules actually bring in any sales ?

why not share

..no NDA bs pls

Even if he has 0 sales what is your point?

He was kind and shared his experience with us, and his guide is 100% correct and is helpful for new gTLD investors, so why are you annoyed by this thread?! I see it as very informative and high quality thread.

BTW I personally prefer to stay away from new gTLDs (I only have 12) because they are very difficult to sell due to the numerous number of options (700+ extensions) available for end user, unless you get rare high quality domains, but those are usually premiums with hefty renewal fees which increases difficulty level even more.

 

[Internet.Domains]

I see a future in using ngTLDs in phrases used in marketing campaigns (although will take years to happen) and that is why I am so keen on new extensions that work well on this. I just like their elegance, and how well they work as clickable links in Tweets

I agree with this. There is great potential for a unique marketing strategy in the future with NewGtlds.

I have begun to notice the youngest of computer users are finding it fashionable to use dots (.) when communicating via devices. They are using the dots to distinguish two words. You can find this often on Instagram. It's possible this style or trend transitions to marketing and propels the NewG's.

I remain diversified with optimistic views of NewGtlds and .com.

 

[oldtimer]

Some very good advice by the OP, here is what I can add to this discussion:

I like to go with the 80/20 rule which in this case means 80% of the portfolio should consist of .coms , ccTLDs , and other legacy extensions and 20% should be New gTLDs.

In 5 to 10 years it might go the other way around like 20/80 but no one really knows for sure so it's best to play it safe.

Regardless try to get the best New gTLDs that you can find at standard registration and renewal fees, if they are on sale that's even better. The high renewal New GTLDs were meant for end users who only want one or two domains, so unless you are a pro with deep pockets who can afford to pay $200 or more for renewal for several years on one domain and then sell it for six figures then it's best to stay away from those because most likely you'll end up dropping the high renewal domains after couple of years because they are not sustainable for the average domainer.

Also don't be afraid of two word domains if they make sense, because in my opinion two words that make sense and that are a good match for the extension are better than a second rate single word with a less popular extension.

Here are some examples of some of my two word New gTLDs that in my opinion make sense:

HomeLoan.company
HomeMortgage.loan
SmartPhone.center
SmartHomes.forsale
SelfSustaining.homes
3dPrinter.forsale
FlyingCars.forsale
PreAssembled.homes
VacationHome.agency
ArtificialIntelligence.systems

And lastly try to get a few high quality New gTLDs that you might actually want to develop yourself in case you can't sell them. You can't play the numbers game with New gTLDs the way some people do with .coms who register hundreds or even thousands of domains and then try to sift through them, for one thing I don't think any one can find a thousand high quality New gTLDs since most are reserved by the registry and also paying the renewals for several more years even at discounted prices might not be sustainable for most domainers without having some sales which at the moment are kind of rare for New gTLDs

So it might be best to register domains (or buy them) that make sense and that you actually enjoy owning incase you want to put them to some good use some day yourself.

Disclaimer: this is just my opinion based on my own experiences, there are many different paths to success, you have to find the one that suits you. Domaining is just a hobby for me to keep my mind active since I am now really an Oldtimer

 

[Bob Hawkes]

While I have no doubt that what @Kate says is true for Global sales it is because that is one of the few registries that report their sales, or at least all over $1000. Virtually none of the other registries do that. Top report in a sort of ad hoc way many of their significant sales but certainly not all. Radix twice a year report a selection of their higher sales from their 9 extensions, but certainly not all. Almost all of the other report none. Therefore you can't apply the Global numbers as though that applied to all ngTLD sales.

In my series of monthly analysis of ngTLD sales (I know life has intervened and I am a couple of months late) I do make an effort to work out by number and sales volume the ratio registry for that month. It usually is about 20% by number of sales are registry while about 50 to 55% by sales volume are registry (because they dominate the top 10 sales each month).

You can get links to my monthly reports at: (I will add the last couple of months there as well when I do them)
https://domainworld.info/main/ngTLD.html

I only started doing the registry stats at a suggestion of a NPs member so the first few do not have it.

I also in the last number of reports give information on how the sales break down by type of name - i.e. how many 1 word, 2 word, very short, etc. What I found is certainly consistent with the advice that @lolwarrior gives.

Bob

Here are the stats from the last few reports:

month ending Nov 22:
Registries accounted for almost 51% of dollar volume and about 27% of the sales by number this month.

month ending Oct 22:
Registries accounted for almost 64% of dollar volume, but less than 19% by number.

month ending Sept 22:
Registries accounted for just over 40% of the dollar volume of these sales, but less than 10% of the number of sales

 

[Henry Y]

Unfortunately the reported sales figures are skewed by registry sales, meaning that no domainer made a profit.

One example: reported sales for .global (source: Namebio)
Namebio has 416 entries total, but as a guest I can only see the top 100. Maybe someone who has an account can fetch the whole list.

So among the 100 latest reported sales, 97 are registry sales.
The remaining 3 are:

tourism.global    700    2019-01-28    NamesCon
cheapflights.global    400    2019-01-28    NamesCon
converter.global    3000    2018-05-25    Flippa

This may be an extreme example, but what's left for domainers is the crumbs. Here, 3%.
Again based on a sample of 100 sales out of 416. Maybe the percentage is a bit higher if you look at the whole data but not very encouraging though

Why just look at .global? I can see from NameBio that the latest 100 .xyz, .app, .chat sales are all from domainers.

It is a selection bias if making conclusion about ngTLDs by just looking at only one ngTLD extension. We should make conclusion based on all ngTLDs.