The Elephant in the Room--Chef Patrick and Oversee Breach of Customer Info

[Ms Domainer]

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I never know with this site

http://domaingang.com/editorial/there-will-be-no-post-about-chef-patrick/​

what's real or fake, but another site also confirms this.

If true, sad day, indeed.

Either way, because it's out there, Chef Patrick needs to address this issue ASAP to either clear his name or apologize.


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[DU]

This is not an industry scandal. This is an overhyped, news seeking story of a rogue employee using his position inappropriately to obtain private information. There is no evidence that this is more than an isolated incident and the employer has taken the appropriate steps to punish the offender.

I don't see any reason for Moniker to do anything other than handle this internally. That doesn't mean it's being swept under the rug.

When you are a business and you run multiple conflicting interests there is an issue when you experience multiple flagrant lapses of judgment by what you call rogue employees.

The reality is that a serious business that has an active interest in being reputable and trustworthy builds an environment where not only are there few rogue employees, but more importantly, those rogue employees lack opportunity to act.

When a company has multiple instances of questionable activity you have to ask whether they are trying to correct the issue. Firing Chef Patrick doesn't do anything. It's one employee effing up being told to leave. How are they stopping Sous-Chef Patrice doing the same thing?

How is Sommelier Sam prevented from accessing my credit card and defrauding me? How is Host Halvarez prevented from bidding? The problem is a company can only blame employees for so long. Sooner or later you have to build a proper environment with no conflicts.

In my opinion, the repeated failures are nothing less than a continuous neglect of proper business practices. If you can't trust them with a DOMAIN PRIVACY how can you trust them with a valuable domain, your credit card? As a broker - are they misusing your information?

Whois misuse is a huge issue for ICANN right now. How whois is maintained, managed and used is a hot button topic. Bottom line is that a potentially meaningless action shows a continued lack of business CONTROLS on their part. The simply don't have the appropriate procedures, or more importantly, rules in place to effectively monitor their staff's activities.

IF you had ever been in a business that had been audited you would realize just how poor their procedures and data management must be.

All. Just IMO.

---------- Post added at 11:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:06 PM ----------

One final thought. Say Rick had done this but the subject was Chef Patrick (a nice guy) but it was say, the CEO of Enron before that got ripped open would that make it better or worse? What if someone had mentioned Bernie Madoff early on? What about Kevin Leto?

I'm not saying the level of activity is the same in each of these but the fact is that you have no idea where this was going. Was CP looking at Whois under privacy all the time as part of his role as a broker? Was he sharing this with other parties for a long period?

If this had been reported by the New York Times or the Guardian would it have made a difference to your opinion? Lots of stupid hypotheticals. Whistleblowers are never popular - less so when you are already hated by many to begin with like RS.

The lone reality is that imo Moniker isn't trustworthy until it explains how it intends to correct the issue (agents can't go under privacy unless they are authorized and their access is logged and reviewed monthly) etc

 

[silentg]

So a privacy breach doesn't bother anyone?

---------- Post added at 06:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:32 PM ----------

In his post, he mentions that he wanted to know why that person registered that name and that's why he looked it up. All he had to do was send an e-mail to the address in the whois and the e-mail will be forwarded to the owner of the e-mail. He didn't need to break any rules.

 

[Name Trader]

Couldn't he have just done this legally by claiming a pending lawsuit and asking them to reveal the true identity of the owner?

Whilst I have some sympathy for Chef Patrick's actions, he managed to break Monikers Privacy, and so I think he was rightfully fired.

 

[exsedo]

Everyone should be grateful to Rick for exposing this.

It's disturbing how many think cover-ups are OK.

If your doctor gave information about you he would be struck off, if your bank abused your privacy they would be fined millions of $.
Anyone who believes in their right to privacy cannot condone this breach.

He has now lost his integrity which will cost him dearly, not to mention the harm it will do to his ex-employer.

 

[Ms Domainer]

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I'm no big fan of Rick S., but he did sit on the story for almost three months before revealing the specifics, giving all the players plenty of time to come clean and get their press releases together.

Quite frankly, Chef Patrick panicked and reacted in a knee-jerk manner. Yes, he had the right to be upset at the gay porn on the "sucks" site--I'd be upset as well--but there were legal avenues he could have taken. Perhaps he should have conferred with his boss to see what could have been done. Looking up the guy's name and sending emails to his boss is just plain creepy--and it took some forethought.

A UDRP might have been in order. The guy who regged the "sucks" site bears some responsibility as well; by parking the page, it was no longer a bonafide review site but a squatted pay-per-click page. The minute that squatter put ads on that domain (what did he expect when he parked it?), he lost the right to own that domain. Chef Patrick should have known that and should have acted accordingly.

I, too, would like to know the name of the squatter, but that probably won't happen; had Chef Patrick gone though proper channels, we just might have learned the name of this vindictive person who obviously had an ax to grind with CP.

No matter how close you might be with Chef Patrick, he committed a serious breach against his former boss and a customer. This is not child's play; he may find himself mired in legal trouble for years to come.

Very sad, indeed.


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[Dave_Z]

but there is a huge difference in the seriousness..

And...that's where people (unfortunately?) disagree as the comments show here and everywhere else this issue's discussed.

If anything, it so happens some people put a premium on trust. Then again, trust is rather a fleeting commodity.

Just observing.

Me? I still don't really trust anyone.

Heh, a wise policy perhaps.

 

[GF]

Marcia Lynn made a good comment on ChefPatrick.com:

"Patrick damaged the reputation of a well-respected and long-established registrar (Moniker) by violating whois privacy protocol. Many of us pay extra for that protection, yet he decided the rules and laws didn’t apply to him and he looked beneath the layer of protection for personal reasons, then contacted the employer of the registrant for personal gain."

Why do we pay Moniker for WHOIS Privacy if it can be breached by an employee?

 

[DaddyHalbucks]

Oversee/ Moniker operates a domain trade show named Domain Fest.

Prick Schwartz operates TRAFFIC.

So, they are competitors. Do you think that fact may explain some of Schwartz's maneuvering and animosity?

 

[labrocca]

I'm not a fan of Mr. Schwartz but I'm gonna call this as I see it. I've read all the blog posts.

Chef Patrick should be fired from Oversee. He committed a serious breach of conduct and I don't fully buy his story. He admits only what can be proven but provides us a vague explanation of his motivations. I don't believe him that he wasn't aware of who the guys employer was. The fact that he started to have discussions with 3rd parties about PRIVATE data from Oversee if a real issue for me. How many people did he discuss this with?

One persons job is not worth the credibility of your company. Oversee you need to can this guy. Crying about his wife and kids and being human doesn't excuse his behavior. He's been in this business long enough to know he shouldn't have taken the course he did.

I'm sure if someone had done this to him he'd be furious and demanding action. I don't think the domainer community should be expecting anything less than his removal from your employ.

And I have nothing against CP. Never did. He seemed to be a decent guy. But this is how I see it. Can'em.

EDIT: On a side note. I've often criticized Rick and his own ego but I have to say a few positive things about the guy. One is that I think he's honest. I have yet to recall in all these years where I felt he wasn't. Yes he is a hype master (flowers.mobi). But that brings up my other positive statement. That he is a PR master. Reading the comments in his latest blog post including his it's easy to see how he became the Domain King. Not because of his brains but because he knows the politics involved in hype. Advice to anyone with a PR problem. Ask Rick what to do. And I honestly don't admire Rick. I just think in many cases he's doing the right thing. Now if he'd just lower TRAFFIC attendance prices.

 

[hawkeye]

Chef Patrick should be fired from Oversee.

I realize there's a lot of crap posting in those blogs, but if you did read all the blogs on this, you'd have (should have) noticed that he doesn't and hasn't worked at Oversee/Moniker for awhile.

 

[Dave_Z]

Uhh, no, not if you 'paid to keep it private'!!! That's like saying it's ok for every bank teller/employee to just go thru your bank records at their whim because they're an employee there!

Interesting peoples take on what is ok to do with what others have paid and trusted to be 'private'!!!

When you purchase a registrar's privacy service, what exactly do you expect? If you also read your registrar's FAQs, legal prints, etc. regarding that privacy service, how much are aligned with those expectations?

At the very least, you expect the registrar not to show your domain's actual contact details (and maybe contact name) in WHOIS, right? Many registrars' prints detailing their WHOIS privacy service say they do that.

Now, do you expect a registrar's employee not to look at your domain's actual details in their internal tools for any reason whatsoever? Will there be an objection if, say, an employee looks it up to notify you for renewal, or if they receive a UDRP notice or...knock on wood...a court order, even if their legal prints indicate that?

I ask because sometimes it helps to keep one's expectations real. Otherwise, you can find yourself needlessly frustrated if you keep insisting on something others might not necessarily be willing to do.

But again, that depends what exactly you expect, and what the registrar's legal prints say.

 

[~ The 34 Year Buzz!!]

...What if someone had mentioned Bernie Madoff early on?

Google it you'll be amazed.
Reports were filed with the SEC in the late 90's (plus more a few years later), and they didn't follow through.

 

[Vito]

Think about it...
I mean seriously think about it for a minute.

Our reputations mean everything in this business, right?

I still cant believe this but I have people whom I have never ever met in my life, contact me and are not afraid to send me $xxxx w/out escrow at all to buy a domain from me.
That is outrageous...All because of me having a very good reputation.

Would I do the same, sure to someone w/a great reputation also, but to someone I dont know or who has an "iffy" reputation, definitely not!

So, fast forward to the Chef.
Great Guy....lots of friends, Great Reputation, always very public, never scammed anyone before, etc.

Someone has a beef with him and shortly after that he finds out his name is regged with "SUCKS" added on the end of it, AND on top of that that the domain is forwarded to a gay porn site!!! WTF???

Now put yourself in his shoes...
You have All Access to Whois Privay.
You bet your A$$ you are gonna look up who that scunmbag is that is trying hard to tarnish your reputation.

Then, after you do that..
You find out it is someone who you thought was a very good friend of yours! WTF again!

Frustration turns into betrayal, and serious anger now.

Vengeance is next.
Do you sit back and think before contacting your so called "friend"?

Now the email was definitely the nail in his coffin but seriously everyone,
Look at these circumstances and then say that you yourself would have taken the Mother Theresa approach and honor the privacy that your job requires and just leave that mystery forever unknown.
Yeah Right!

The guy is human, he is positively paying for what he did.
He lost his F-ing job!
Thats HUGE in itself in these awful economic times.
He has to wake up everyday now and remember the dumb move he made while not going to work. That is punishment enough.
Let him be.

and If you're pissed at Moniker still, well be pissed at them for that Halvarez B.S. that was 100x worse. IMO

 

[firefly]

I have no doubt that Moniker has a lot to answer for with all that has gone on there, but at the end of the day there is always a right and a wrong way to go about things when it comes to individual actions. There are quite clearly two separate issues here; the ongoing problems at Moniker and the unethical actions taken by a single individual regardless of the reasons.

One of my all time favorite quotes is from J.C. Watts and I think it is applicable here:

"Character is doing the right thing when nobody's looking. There are too many people who think that the only thing that's right is to get by, and the only thing that's wrong is to get caught."

As for the mud slinging that is going on now between the two main protagonists; it is only furthering the poor perception of the industry as a whole.

I won't have anymore to say about it because of who that individual is. It saddens me and everything that is going on around this is nothing more than a massive black eye that the industry as a whole, will take a lot of time to recover from. That will only start when one mans up and apologizes properly and the other one shuts up and stops stoking the fire. JMO

 

[mosilager]

Indeed, a very sad turn of events, I happen to read the Chef's blog once in a while...

Here's the original blog post that started uncovering this whole unethical issue....

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I never know with this site

http://domaingang.com/editorial/there-will-be-no-post-about-chef-patrick/​

what's real or fake, but another site also confirms this.

If true, sad day, indeed.

Either way, because it's out there, Chef Patrick needs to address this issue ASAP to either clear his name or apologize.


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[seven]

HAHA chefpatrick.com:gn:

Just read his blog and as of last week he was pulling the old ready to move on to other endeavors.

 

[GF]

So, let me see if I understand what allegedly has happened:

1. Someone registers ChefPatrickSucks.com with domain privacy
2. Chef Patrick (who worked for Moniker/Oversee at the time) checks the domain ownership since he supposedly had access as an employee
3. Chef Patrick sends an e-mail to the employer of the owner of the domain attacking his/her character, etc.

Did I get this correct?

Seems a little far-fetched, especially considering Patrick's reputation. I'm not saying it did not happen... I'm just saying that I'd hold off on making a judgment until Patrick has a chance to clear his name.

-G

 

[Archangel]

Patrick's always sounded like a good guy. This just doesn't sound like his territory. And even if he DID do it: So what? I don't want ppl to give me rigmarole about how it could have happened to anyone/any domain etc etc etc Doesn't this seem nugatory to you? I think it should.

So, let me see if I understand what allegedly has happened:

1. Someone registers ChefPatrickSucks.com with domain privacy
2. Chef Patrick (who worked for Moniker/Oversee at the time) checks the domain ownership since he supposedly had access as an employee
3. Chef Patrick sends an e-mail to the employer of the owner of the domain attacking his/her character, etc.

Did I get this correct?

Seems a little far-fetched, especially considering Patrick's reputation. I'm not saying it did not happen... I'm just saying that I'd hold off on making a judgment until Patrick has a chance to clear his name.

-G

 

[GF]

And even if he DID do it: So what?

That's where the issue lies. If he DID do this, then he (as an employee for a domain registrar) used his position for personal gain (and to bring down someone else).

If this did happen, it's a BIG deal.

It's like someone at your bank releasing private details about your account activity to someone who doesn't have authorization to receive it.

There is a reasonable expectation of privacy when you register a domain with private registration.

That's where this whole controversy lies - IF he did it.

 

[Archangel]

I understand you perfectly, GF. I suppose it IS a big deal but to me, it's nothing to crucifix over since it was/is a paltry domain. Still, a crime is a crime and if he did it, he should be dealt with, accordingly.

 

[GF]

I understand you perfectly, GF. I suppose it IS a big deal but to me, it's nothing to crucifix over since it was/is a paltry domain. Still, a crime is a crime and if he did it, he should be dealt with, accordingly.

Yeah, I totally get what you mean. It's not a crime against humanity. :P

Hopefully we find out it was a misunderstanding!

 

[DU]

He did do it...

http://www.chefpatrick.com/

So ChefPatrickSucks.com was a good reg imho. Worth mid-high $xx

---------- Post added at 04:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:25 PM ----------

There is a reasonable expectation of privacy when you register a domain with private registration.

There is. But you should read the vague "terms and conditions" provided by your registrar. Imho you shouldn't expect much with the industry the way it is, with the money distributed the way it is, with the registrars setup the way they are.

They are not banks.

There are standards and I think he should have been fired based on Moniker/Oversee/Snapnames fairly dubious reputation.

//That said I don't think he did anything malicious and it was a misunderstanding but it was a lapse in judgment.

 

[PlusNames]

I'm sorta on Chef Patrick's side... yes, he shouldn't have looked up the information, but he didn't do anything malicious.

I read his blog posts and to me it just seems like Rick is doing this for publicity. Don't understand how this became such a big deal... it should have just been between Moniker, Chef, and the person who regged the domain.

Btw... if you find out that someone regs a domain with your name and sucks and it points to gay porn, wouldn't you do the same? (was pointed to gay porn unintentionally, domain was parked).

 

[DnEbook]

I'm sorta on Chef Patrick's side... yes, he shouldn't have looked up the information, but he didn't do anything malicious.

I read his blog posts and to me it just seems like Rick is doing this for publicity. Don't understand how this became such a big deal... it should have just been between Moniker, Chef, and the person who regged the domain.

Btw... if you find out that someone regs a domain with your name and sucks and it points to gay porn, wouldn't you do the same? (was pointed to gay porn unintentionally, domain was parked).

so if someone doesn't like your names they can contact your employer and dump a load of shit of you ????

sorry but the bigger 'crime' was the contacting of the employer , personally i would never bother to even check 'mynamesucks'

great example of the bad side of human nature