LLLL.com evaluation thread

[italiandragon]

While the last LLLL.com are taken (you can check www.dyyo.com to know how many are left) , I really feel the need to have a sort of 4L price guide on the same sort of the 3L/ 3 chars price guide.

I asked to people to create a database of LLLL.com sales but it seems no one can do it so I`m going to create it myself as much as I can on just a forum thread. If I knew how to create a database I was doing it.

Keep in mind that this thread is still in the early stage and I`ll update it as much as I can. I will update this first post so it will be easier for everyone to know what`s going on in the LLLL.com aftermarket. It is going to take me a lot of my spare time but I hope that eventually soon , someone will create a software that will run by itself Till then , let`s hope I can have time!

So, just for the newbies , let`s see what we already know about the 3 chars.com price guide:

"The quality of the letter composition can play a significant role in determining 3-letter valuations. General concensus states that the letters A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, L, M, N, O, P, R, S, T are considered premium letters. Other lesser high quality letters include: J, K, U, V, W. Lower quality letters include: Q, X, Y, Z. Domains selling for less than the above figures would represent a strong buy in today's market. Premium letter only domains tend to fetch a 500% to 600% premium (or more) over the Minimum Wholesale Price. Mixed letter quality domains have valuations somewhere in the middle of these two extremes."


I think we could adjust the same rules to the LLLL.com

Let`s play a little bit with the letters to find out what are the minimun reseller prices as for now , end of September 2007 (NOTE: THIS FIRST THREAD IS CONSTANTLY UPDATED WITH THE NEW INFO HIGHLIGHTED IN RED)

Obviously we should analyse in this thread ONLY the NON pronunciable ones to consider ONLY the quality of letters, so not even a very well known acronym but only 4 random letters.

For the "other" LLLL.com sales and evaluations based on pronunciability , then you may find useful this other thread:

http://www.namepros.com/domain-name-discussion/358387-the-llll-com-sales-report-thread.html

I`ll start with my opinion but feel free to add yours so we can get to a sort of price guide.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

A LLLL.com including 2 or more of "Q, X, Y, Z" (as long as they are not 2 of the same) I`d say less no more than $10 since there are still 12,000 of them left.

EXAMPLE: GXZH.com (no more than $10)

There is one example of these ones right now on ebay, ending in less than 3 hours:

http://cgi.ebay.com/hzxv-com-Origin...ryZ11153QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


Obviously even with 2 "bad letters" , when they start to be pronunciable this is what happens:

ZAYM.com $201

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=300162205723&category0=&fvi=1

Double letters such as:

GXXH.com
ZZDC.com
FYYT.com
DRQQ.com

I`d appraise them at minimun $20-$30 depending on the letters. Double but not consecutives letters would just be below the above ones.


XSXT.com $20.50

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=170160241510&category0=&fvi=1



Triple bad letters such as:

QQQD.com
FZZZ.com
RXXX.com
YYYG.com

I`d appraise them at minimun $70-$100 depending on the letters.


Then we may analyse the ones with only 1 bad letter (always Q, X, Y, Z):

FGZS.com
EYDF.com
PXSE.com
TFQG.com

These kind of LLLL .com are still available so reg fee to $10 , must be for them.


UPDATED:

SOME AUCTIONS ON EBAY ARE GETTING ABOVE $10:


http://cgi.ebay.com/ZWTO-com-4-Lett...ryZ11153QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/FGXR-com-4-Lett...ryZ11153QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

UPDATE 13 OCTOBER: ON EBAY PRICES ARE CONSTANTLY ABOVE $10 FOR LLLL WITH JUST 1 BAD LETTER , SOMETIMES ABOVE $20 TOO.

ZATB.com $12.49

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=270170293855&category0=&fvi=1

RLYN.com $36

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=200159375608&category0=&fvi=1


RBYK.com $29.99

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=200163278990&category0=&fvi=1


HRHY.com $30.80

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=300162203800&category0=&fvi=1


YATG.com $23.95

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=300162885146&category0=&fvi=1


a double letter with 1 bad letter :

IIZP.com $42

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=300161869692&category0=&fvi=1




---------------------------------------------------------------------
Then we have the ones which include the group "lesser high quality letters": J, K, U, V, W.

These ones have lately bought totally so the minimun reseller price must be above reg fee , let`s say $10 - $20 depending from the letters. Some people tend to include J, K and U in the premium letters. I`d definitely include the vowel U but I guess this is a personal point of view.
Even here at NP , LLLL including just the letter U tend to outperform this category:

FGUB.com $32 (October 2007)

http://www.namepros.com/domains-for-sale-auctions/383276-fgub-com-1-start-great-4letter.html

It may be also useful to consider that K and W were sold out earlier than J and V.



There is one example of these ones right now on ebay, ending in 3 hours:

http://cgi.ebay.com/UMGV-COM-4-Lett...ryZ11153QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


UPDATE 25 OCTOBER:

Things are getting hotter (at the moment less than 7000 LLLL are left) and U and this category is quickly raising its reselling value on EBAY:

DPTU.com $54.51 now

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=300162512206&category0=&fvi=1


RWEO.com $78.00

http://cgi.ebay.com/RWEO-com-LLLL-4...ryZ11153QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


The letter U and W obviously are not that bad

The letter V in Italian is very much used , while in China is not so a lot depends from your background.

J is not my favourite in this group (as in the Italian alphabet there is no J-K-W-X-Y ) but certainly is getting attention by someone else:

RCEJ.com $30

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=120172045546&category0=&fvi=1


Then we have 2 of the group J, K, U, V, W such as:

GJJA.com
FVVO.com
KKTR.com

I`d say $30 to $50 as they are all gone and the double letter will increase their rarity.


FNKK.com $52

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=300162204984&category0=&fvi=1

2 of them but not the same 2 (double) are less valuable:

http://cgi.ebay.com/VWTP-com-4-Lett...ryZ11153QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

VDUZ.com $26

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...from=R8&satitle=200159969339&category0=&fvi=1


WPEJ.com $23.15

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=200163499690&category0=&fvi=1


With 3 of them , like :

GJJJ.com
FVVV.com
KKKT.com

I`d say $100 -$150

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Then we have the best of the best: ALL PREMIUM letters:


A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, L, M, N, O, P, R, S, T



Names like CLFO.com or FGTR.com or ATFI.com are going to get $$$.

I can`t find any of these LLLL.com for less than $100 , sometimes not even $200 buy them.
So I`d say a really minimun of $100 to easily $200 each.
At places like Snapnames.com, the all premium letters even if they are non pronunciables , are going already for above $400 and the market is getting hotter day by day.

If the name appears to have 2 of a kind like:

SSFO.com or GBBT.com then we should be at minimun $200 to $300

3 of a kind such DDDF.com or TLLL.com will get over $300 to $500

SPECIALS​

Anything like this is an added value.

In my daily observation of LLLL.com sales I noticed that any of the following abbreviations and/or suffixes are more valuable:

- IT (Information Tecnology or Italy)

- MY

Examples:

IMYO.com $449

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...from=R8&satitle=300158326938&category0=&fvi=1

BMMY.com $350

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18688&tracked=&partnerid=


HFMY.com $37.50

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=300162885558&category0=&fvi=1


- UK

UKIX.com ended on TDNAM.com @ $146

- DE

- US

- CA

- OZ (Australia)

- NZ (new Zealand)

- GO

- HI

Examples:

HIXV.com $59 (October 2007)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...from=R8&satitle=120169750537&category0=&fvi=1

- OK

- KG

- CV (Curriculum Vitae)

- DR (Doctor)

- DJ

Examples:

DJBX.com $45 (October 2007)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=170158507650&category0=&fvi=1


And more that I`ll add as soon as I can think of them!

Also,some letters add value because of their very common use.

The letter E , I and O add value usually because can mean E-lectronic , I-nternet and O-nline.

Other nice letters are:

C for Corporation or Company , L for Limited , A for Association.

The best positions are usually in the first or in the 4th spot depending from the letter. For example E will be better in the first spot while L for Limited will be better in the 4th spot but all of these letters can add value.


Other special categories that attract a bonus are based on the numbers of vowels.
There are only 5 vowels so the LLLL.com with 4 vowels are extremely rare and even the ones with 3 vowels perform very well as their demand is high.

Some recent examples:

OEOV.com $56

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=110183807446&category0=&fvi=1


EOAJ.com $52

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=110183814160&category0=&fvi=1

CVCV & VCVC​

Let`s start from the TOP this time:

CVCV.com

all premium letters Like BIFE.com or DAGO.com

minimun......well here it is hard since prices increase quickly ....maybe $1,500 ?


CVCV.com with 1 bad letter like BIZE or DAQO.com about $800

CVCV.com with 1 bad and 1 average letters like NUQE.com or VAXO.com about $500

CVCV.com with 1 bad and 2 average letters like WUQA.com or ZOVU.com

about $300

It was right WUQA.com that made me realize that I forgot the 1 bad + 2 average ones. People reported that WUQA.com ended on TDNAM.com at $315 (end of October)

CVCV.com with 2 bad letters like QEZI.com or ZIXO.com about $400

CVCV.com with 2 bad letters and 1 average letter like QUZI.com or ZUXO.com about $300

CVCV.com with 2 bad and 2 average letters (MUST BE DOUBLE U) like QUZU.com or ZUXU.com about 300



Now let`s see the VCVC.com

all premium letters Like IFEB.com or AGOC.com about $1,000 ?

VCVC.com with 1 bad letter like IZEB or AQOC.com about $500

VCVC.com with 1 bad and 1 average letters like OZUD.com or AXUF.com about $300 - $350 (I sold OZUD.com on SEDO in August for $330)

VCVC.com with 2 bad letters like AXEZ.com or IQOX.com about $200

VCVC.com with 2 bad letters and 1 average letter like UXEZ.com or UXOQ.com about $100

VCVC.com with 2 bad and 2 average letters (MUST BE DOUBLE U) like UZUQ.com or UXUZ.com about 100



I`m currently taking input on the CVCV and the VCVC where Y is the last vowel.

The first recent example is this one:

OGYZ.com $57.99

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dl...sid=m37&satitle=200157925898&category0=&fvi=1


I leave the CVVC and VCCV to others as I did not have much experience with them yet.


SALES OF RANDOM (NON PRONUNCIABLE) LLLL.COM AT OTHER VENUES:

SEDO.com​

Interesting Sedo Auctions show many crappy LLLL.com with bids

UPDATE: CHECK THE AUCTIONS BELOW THAT ARE NOW ALL ENDED....PRICES ARE GETTING SHOCKING!

zekh.com $120

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18336&tracked=&partnerid=

zeow.com $300

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18360&tracked=&partnerid=

ucnk.com $120

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18468&tracked=&partnerid=

ahlq.com $243

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18528&tracked=&partnerid=


hobf.com 100 Eur= $140

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18576&tracked=&partnerid=


jvbb.com 100 Eur=$140

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18693&tracked=&partnerid=

yvze.com 70 Euros=$105

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_detail.php?language=us&auction_id=18730&tracked=&partnerid=


Are we already starting to see a minimun price of $100 for each LLLL.com ?


Please share your opinions on the one of the hottest niches of the domain market

Thank you

 

[jido]

Any opinion on DYOD.com - "Do your own D......."

Thanks.

Very nice one. Triple premium, double D, like diod. Could be worth $300 I think.

 

[ssamriga]

It really depends, it should get around $1000, but quite possibly it wouldn't reach more, then again if the right buyer sees it, can go up to $2000 I think.

This one should be sold with "make an offer" and $1,500 starting price I think...

Do you think behy.com (mine currently) would go up to $1500 on sedo, or just $1k?

 

[Shenron]

Can you please comment on these?

JIQY.com
DXXN.com
EQEJ.com

Thankies!

 

[p_campos]

and what about VPHH.com?

 

[italiandragon]

Just published:

LLLL.com Prices Forecast

http://www.italiandragon.com/?p=53

 

[Shenron]

Excellent post Lorenzo!
Thx a lot.

Rep added.

@Pedro Campos - Nice to see another fellow Portuguese mate around.

You have a Trip Premium there, double H... I'd say you can get $150 for it easily, but I was you I'd read Lorenzo's post and vault it.

 

[ssamriga]

Nice post Lorenzo

P.S. to many askers of appraisals: this thread is more like general evaluation of different groups and patterns of LLLL.coms rather than appraisal of concrete names, appraisals should go into appraisals section

 

[saleenant]

Anybody got an idea what HWAX.com would go for currently?

 

[vlad74]

Just published:

LLLL.com Prices Forecast

http://www.italiandragon.com/?p=53

Lorenzo, nice article, but I do not agree with you. You are expecting the tripple premium to be $500 by the year end.

As I was writing before, I expect any normal LLLL (i.e. semipremium or tripple premium be traded at $800 in one year, and tripple premium with good theird letter (i.e. U or W) will reach 1,100 - 1,400. Quad premium will be difficult to find under $2,000. Even now, it is almost impossible to get decent quads at $500, look at recent TDNAM or SEDO auction, price range $650-$1000. I do not count good ones at $2,000+

$500 or more likely $400-$450 will be a price for antipremium.

 

[DomainMagnate]

Vlad, I hope your predictions are correct and then I'll be able to buy a new ferrari by the end of the year :D
I think it's a bit too optimistic though

 

[italiandragon]

Lorenzo, nice article, but I do not agree with you. You are expecting the tripple premium to be $500 by the year end.

As I was writing before, I expect any normal LLLL (i.e. semipremium or tripple premium be traded at $800 in one year, and tripple premium with good theird letter (i.e. U or W) will reach 1,100 - 1,400. Quad premium will be difficult to find under $2,000. Even now, it is almost impossible to get decent quads at $500, look at recent TDNAM or SEDO auction, price range $650-$1000. I do not count good ones at $2,000+

$500 or more likely $400-$450 will be a price for antipremium.

well, I`m not God and don`t want to be God so, I`d be happy to be wrong if you are going to be right!! :hehe:

But in the case: how much will LLL.com worth?

And.....ok, how much you`d offer on a nice Premium like CLFO which ending with O is closer to a LLL because it could be "CLF Online" ?

Thanks

 

[RCK]

Well, I bought AAFB.com.

What do you guys think?

I know this is no appraisal section, but I am just so excited to have this one now!!!

 

[DomainMagnate]

Well, I bought AAFB.com.

What do you guys think?

I know this is no appraisal section, but I am just so excited to have this one now!!!

Great name! I'm thinking high $xxx reseller for now.
Curious to know what you paid for it :D

 

[vlad74]

well, I`m not God and don`t want to be God so, I`d be happy to be wrong if you are going to be right!! :hehe:

But in the case: how much will LLL.com worth?

And.....ok, how much you`d offer on a nice Premium like CLFO which ending with O is closer to a LLL because it could be "CLF Online" ?

Thanks

I am not offering anything now because I nbeed funds to buy few picked LLLL next days. I am not usually selling my LLLLs (just four sold in the last 3 months), therefore I need to take care of my liquidity. In general I would say that CLFO is worth at least $600.

1/26 may be not the correct relation. There are more than 26 times people who can afford to buy a $500 domain on reseller market comparing to a $ 13,000 domain. Thus, there will be more demand for $500-$1000 domains than to $20,000 domains. Thus, the relation of 4L price to 3L price may be higher than /126, it may be 1/20 or 1/15 for example.

Anyway, it is just my opinion, I might be wrong. I just told my point of view, a reality may be completely different. No one was expectiong LLLL.com to hit 10 x regfee ($70) just 3 months after the sellout. Almost no one is expecting them to hit $1,000 in a year, thats why the prices are still relatively low now

Again, I can be wrong, do not invest your rent money into domains.


UPDATE

I read once again, in general I am writing the same what you have also wrote already (when I was reading first time, I somehow skipped this pragaraph ):

So, my forecast is the in the long term (up to 5 years) both will rise but eventually LLLL.com will reach even 1/20 value of their similar LLL.com instead of capping at 1/26 , that`s because there will be more investors at the “base of this tree” , like imagine 100 people fighting over LL.com , 10,000 over LLL.com and 1 million people over LLLL.com.

I just think mid and low end of LLLL.com will appreciate very strong in the coming months (5-10 times), whereas new minimum for quad premiums will be may be at 4 times the current minimum of $500.

 

[Pred]

Hi Guys,

i have had an offer of $300 for DPUD.com
should i take?

also a mate has ZLUZ.com
i said it is very nice, but would check on value as pretty pronouncable and brandable imho

be grateful for analysis

cheers

 

[DomainMagnate]

Pred, I'd take it, sounds good.
Or ask for more if you feel they can stretch it :D

 

[vlad74]

Hi Guys,

i have had an offer of $300 for DPUD.com
should i take?

also a mate has ZLUZ.com
i said it is very nice, but would check on value as pretty pronouncable and brandable imho

be grateful for analysis

cheers

if you need money, go for it. if not, ask for what is you think reasonable (i.e. $500, $2000 whatever). :imho:

 

[Alex]

I need some advice from you guys to know what is pronounceable and what not, out of these. What is clearly pronounceable (if any), and what is not at all:

Givb
Havg
Jolv
Oxhe
Sfuh
Iwih
Ubew
Udiw

Thanks.

 

[DomainMagnate]

ubiw and udiw is pronounceable, others I'm not sure, probably not

 

[dag]

Just got PYHU.com for $160 -- good deal? Counts as a CVCV, after all, right?

 

[Travis]

I need some advice from you guys to know what is pronounceable and what not, out of these. What is clearly pronounceable (if any), and what is not at all:

Givb
Havg
Jolv
Oxhe
Sfuh
Iwih
Ubew
Udiw

Thanks.

All are kind of pronouncable, but not really. I personally like Jolv the best.

 

[Shasta]

I need some advice from you guys to know what is pronounceable and what not, out of these. What is clearly pronounceable (if any), and what is not at all:

Givb
Havg
Jolv
Oxhe
Sfuh
Iwih
Ubew
Udiw

Thanks.

This is what I hear...

Jolv - pronounceable

Oxhe ---rhymes with oxy, moxy, roxy

Iwih ---with short i rhymes with ew, glue, with long i sounds like Ira,

Ubew ---rhymes with u do, you blew, you sue, etc..

Udiw ---same as "ubew"

 

[dnb8]

edit - not so important

 

[mahadeva]

DYOD.com

Any opinion on DYOD.com - "Do your own D......."

Thanks.

Very nice one. Triple premium, double D, like diod. Could be worth $300 I think.

It really depends, it should get around $1000, but quite possibly it wouldn't reach more, then again if the right buyer sees it, can go up to $2000 I think.

This one should be sold with "make an offer" and $1,500 starting price I think...

Thanks guys!

 

[bricio]

Just got PYHU.com for $160 -- good deal? Counts as a CVCV, after all, right?

yes, dag CVCV... another steal for sure!!! :tu:
you can have 100% ROI immeadiately if you want to, and it isnt from me


nice post in your blog Loenzo
the most important thing you wrote there and it is regarding premium LLLLL; their scarcity
i didnt count how many of them will drop as you did but i saw they are just a few and this is the main factor to increase all LLLL prices and of course the LLL ones
to this case we can also state 'more investors at the “base of this tree”' as is written in your blog
it is very difficult to predict the prices to all of them in 2009 but premium, three premium letters, CVCV and VCVC will be expensive if we compare their proces right now

i also agree with the prices you set for LLLL in the end of 2008; though i would really like vlad 74 be correct :hehe:
i wouldnt buy a ferrari (great collection there Michael_Goldman) :tu: :hehe:

i have had an offer of $300 for DPUD.com
should i take?

it is a fair offer
i am sure you know how to negotiate :hehe: