discuss TOP 10 mistakes new gTLD investors are doing in 2018 - Are you GUILTY of any of them?

[Brands.International]

Hi friends,

I did not have much time for NamePros discussions lately (except my appraisal thread for new gTLDs, where I spend some of my time), but I still like to read new articles and threads here. As some of you might know, I invest exclusively in new gTLD names. It is difficult for me not to notice that some new gTLD fellow investors are not doing well, therefore I am going to write some suggestions & hopefully it will be helpful for some members here!

TOP 10 mistakes new gTLD investors are doing in 2018!

Mistake no.1 - you are registering BAD, WORTHLESS names!
This mistake is far far the most important one - everything else can be forgotten, but if you have bad names, you will never make any profit. The appraisal thread I am running is unfortunately full of such examples...

Mistake no.2 - you are registering lot of names, and will be forced to dropped them prior the first renewal.
This is because you ignore the fact that even in best portfolios which are really well selected, only 1% of names are sold yearly for price which can be considered significant. And many portfolios I see here are not well selected, and there will be 0 sales in total, due to mistake no.1

Mistake no.3 - you spend too much time at Namepros, instead of LikedIn, Twitter, Facebook or Twitter.
Just to clarify, I love Namepros, and I love to hang around here. I also like to buy domains here for few dollars. But most of your end users (when it comes to new gTLDs) are simply not here. You need to reach out on various platforms, as here you speak mostly with other domainers, which is great for educational or recreational purposes, but not for your sales. Largest sales are made to end users, not to fellow domain speculators/investors.

Mistake no.4 - you are trying to impress, or get an agreement/approval from hardcore .com investors.
I mean, come on - selected, high quality new gTLD domain names are direct competition to valuable .com portfolios - there is only limited amount of money spent on domains, and new gTLDs are redirecting part of that money flow towards them. It is therefore logical that it is an unwanted competition for many .com holders and we can not expect lot of praise on them because of that. Saying that, I can clearly see some .com investors are very nice and genuine here, so this can not be generalised - still, it is good idea to have this notion somewhere back in your mind, as seeking approval of your new gTLDs names from someone who spent years to build his or her legacy extensions portfolio can be an doomed effort from the very start.

Mistake no.5 - you are trying to get an appraisal of your new gTLD name from .com investors.
Again, even in 2018, you will get lot of "regfee" comments or "I would stick with .com" comments -this is one of the reasons I am runnig the appraisal thread exclusively for new gTLDs, and I would like to invite other new gTLD investors to be more active in appraisal threads as well. In general, anytime someone gives you an appraisal or advice, try to check the domain portfolio of that person ..for example, if you see lot of bad domain names, it also can give you some information about the quality of such "appraisal".

Mistake no.6: you do not have your own marketplace ..
It really takes only few minutes and few dollars to create domain name marketplace, using solutions like efty.com, or to create simple webpage using wix.com. There is really no excuse for not having your marketplace nice and ready. Especially after GDPR legislation in place since May 2018, we really need to project some more credibility towards end users, and having nice marketplace is very good way to do so!

Mistake no.7: you have your marketplace created, but you operate from .com domain name...
Really???If you sell new gTLDs, you need to lead by your own example...so your markteplace also should operate on new gTLD extension. How can you possibly persuade end user to replace his long or ugly legacy name with new gTLD, if you do not operate from new gTLD? Think about it for a minute.

Mistake no.8: you are registering domain names with renewals around 500 and higher.
And you persuade yourself that you will develop it, if not flipped within 1 year. Yes, you can have 1 or 2 such names, no problem, but if you buy 30 of them, there is no way you will be able to develop all of them within 1 year. So you will end up dropping maybe 28 of them. And then you willl be really hating new gTLDs and "those greedy registries and ICANN maybe as well". This happend to many people 4 years ago, and we saw that recently again few weeks ago (who can guess the extension?), and I am sure we will see it again in near future when other planned new gTLD extensions will go to General Availability.

Mistake no.9: you do not care what are companies behind particular extensions.
You even can not tell difference between registrar and registries. You do not understand that once you drop you new gTLD domain name, it can be easily re-priced by registry, or it can be reserved by registry. You drop your good name, and then you start topics on Namepros saying "Registry reserved my name, please help!"...

Mistake no.10: you registered 1000 of very bad names, which will be only pure money loss.
Then (because you got lucky), you finally get a really good new gTLD name, with low standard renewal. Finally something good! This is a name which you should keep and wait for good ofers. But (because you have spent money on those 1000 bad domain names and everyone laughts at you ) you feel you need some casflow now! And because you are lazy to create your own marketplace (and from unknown reason you cannot also create your LinkedIn profile which is free of charge), and you do not like to send emails to end users because it is too much work, and you do not like to make phonecalls (from your country it is expensive anyway), you start $1 auction here...then it goes like this:
1
up
up
last 24 hours, SUPER PREMIUM name, a STEAL!!!
2
up
LAST BID IS $2, SUPER PREMIUM, INSANE NAME!!! Can anyone give $3? Do I see $3 for it?
up
up
up
me: ok, I will take it for BIN, USD 10...

And then you are again left with your bad 1000 names.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So guys, are you guilty of any of this?

 

[Brands.International]

@lolwarrior Thanks Marek, it is great contribution and sharing valuable thoughts, where there are many aspects you referring are correct and worth to look into and change the mind for future. Specially points 2,7,8 & 10. But you should not add a word guilty to the people which I don't think is correct word to represent their level of understanding towards domaining. And yes there should be many many people might got into this trouble unintentionally, but I believe this is called domaining. I am not professional, but I have acquired 4-10 most highly premium gTLD names in which 2-3 have renewal around 100 to 250$.

I really appreciate & like your every kind words written for gTLD supporters or investors in order to be aware and do better job accordingly

Thanks friend, I appreciate that!

 

[Brands.International]

Great post @lolwarrior - There are a growing number of us ngtld investors and we have all probably made most of the mistakes on your list.

As has been mentioned in this thread, it's the one worders that have the best potential - my strategy was to go through namebio's top .com sales and then check against popular ngtlds and pick up what was available. I did well if I do say so myself and most are listed on Sedo - I get offers fairly often, but they are low ball.

My theory is these extensions are for the next generation & those who can afford to hold for 10 years will reap the rewards. We all know tech advances constantly and why wouldn't domain extensions evolve to.

Thanks @Ollie3000 - this is the reasons why I really like to discuss here - this strategy that you was going through namebio's top .com sales and then you checked against popular ngtlds is imo very good. That possibility did not occur to me until I read your post. But I think this is also one of the ways how to pick up an interesting new gTLDs, while higher sale of the same string in .com guaranties you that there is almost certainly at least some value in the combo you have picked. Good idea

 

[Brands.International]

Guilty as charged, offence #3.

But TBH, if anything, being a member of NP (the only SM site I really use) has drastically improved my investing habits, and helped reduce the amount of clutter I used to collect pre-2016.

My fellow DN warriors with their willingness to share triumphs and pitfalls and everyday grinding continues to reinforce the fact that a quality domain name will always rise above a hundred crappers, no matter the hype or trend.

Yourself, LOL, are evolving and maturing I see. Your posts are becoming more quality and less noise. Kudos. Generally, threads from people who post "advice" or "how to" or "Q&A" if they have only been in the industry for a few years should be taken with a grain of salt. Anyone who thinks they know what's going on with less than 5 years into something has no idea what's going on. A few here and there might strike gold with a good name, but the real cache should be found in the words of those whom have been slugging it out for years.

Definitely agree with you @HotKey , Namepros is for me definitely no.1 place to share and discuss ideas about domain names. One can really get tons of interesting ideas when we interact together here. It helps a lot. Lot of great and clever people here, I am very grateful to be here.
And thank you for your kind words, I appreciate that.

 

[briguy]

As has been mentioned in this thread, it's the one worders that have the best potential - my strategy was to go through namebio's top .com sales and then check against popular ngtlds and pick up what was available. I did well if I do say so myself and most are listed on Sedo - I get offers fairly often, but they are low ball.

My theory is these extensions are for the next generation & those who can afford to hold for 10 years will reap the rewards. We all know tech advances constantly and why wouldn't domain extensions evolve to.

I also use the same strategy for ccTLD..sure it applies to any extension!

Totally agree with your "strategy"...personally it is the holding for 10 years (registration fees for a few new GTD's that scares me, compared to the "old GTD's" ) that holding me back (AKA tight budget for a high risk/high yield play) and sure am not a "new generation''. old enough to remember when Yahoo was #1 search engine and had a active "myspace" account...yes there are people that old lol!

Sure not a hater of nGTD's, just ignorant (<lacking knowledge) and a slow learner...if there was a (dot)toohonest, I registered "Sometimebriguyis(dot)toohonest

 

[Ollie3000]

I also use the same strategy for ccTLD..sure it applies to any extension!

Totally agree with your "strategy"...personally it is the holding for 10 years (registration fees for a few new GTD's that scares me, compared to the "old GTD's" ) that holding me back (AKA tight budget for a high risk/high yield play) and sure am not a "new generation''. old enough to remember when Yahoo was #1 search engine and had a active "myspace" account...yes there are people that old lol!

Sure not a hater of nGTD's, just ignorant (<lacking knowledge) and a slow learner...if there was a (dot)toohonest, I registered "Sometimebriguyis(dot)toohonest

Yea this definitely applies to all domain extensions but you have the best chance of finding one with the ngtlds.

Yes the renewal fees are terrible on some, I think the average for me next time around is $30 each - meaning I will have to pay a few thousand to keep mine each year! I won't keep everything though, just the best ones and ones I've had offers on.

I still remember and used Lycos to search (like back in the 90's when life was easy) & the 'Acorn' PC was the best - going off topic but the operating system was basically like windows but before 'Microsoft' or 'Apple' had thought about using that type of look. Think it was called RISC and they could and should have been massive - no idea what happened there. So we're not all (that) young but hopefully I'll be around for a while!

 

[slader23]

I think having one or two very good new gtlds in your portfolio makes perfect sense if you want to hedge long term risk. In the short term however, the liquidity is not present in new gtlds. Over time this may change but if you want to actually make good money in domains you need to be operating in the most liquid markets because that is where the majority of opportunities lie. Wholesale exit strategies that are profitable do not really exist in ngtlds and that this why they are less attractive to the majority of domain investors.

The biggest mistake imho is going all in on New g's. They have potential for sure but you need to make sure you're diversified into domains that will net you profit TODAY so that you can pay for your renewals and buy more premium ngtlds, if that's your thing.

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

Yes the renewal fees are terrible on some, I think the average for me next time around is $30 each - meaning I will have to pay a few thousand to keep mine each year!

If you can spend ~$30 yearly per domain - then better invest in .TV, they can be sold in 4F range... and some even up to low 5F.
Instead majority of nTLD domains are selling usually for mid $xxx or not selling at all.

 

[lock]

@lock if you have only few of such names and you can sustain to hold them long term, then it is not a mistake imo. Would you buy 100 such names, then it is a different story of course

If developed each and every one would make money it is just management outley and time. Hard to decide whether to be a rock star, domainer or web developer, computer technician, sales person, business manager as so much is involved.

 

[lock]

The other mistake is expecting an instant return on new market when the gamble is in holding out.

 

[Brands.International]

The other mistake is expecting an instant return on new market when the gamble is in holding out.

I think many of keyword1keyword2 / app buyers will be able to confirm that in 9 months or so...I hope I am wrong, but I can not see what kind of magic would enable those resales for big bucks to happen, when aftermarket is just forming atm...although those who bought nice and meaningful combos keyword / app will do very well in future, imo.

 

[kriss05]

I think we also need "TOP 10 tips/strategies for ngtld investors".

 

[Bob Hawkes]

There is a huge amount of truth in this thread, both in the original post from @lolwarrior and in numerous responses. Now that I have been into new extensions almost 2 years (although just meaningfully trying to sell them for about 15 months) the points that seem most critical to me are:

• The odds of a name selling (really in any extension but particularly in new extensions) will be low. Make sure you account for that in your financial plan.
• New extensions often do sell for amounts very comparable with the most established domain names.
• It is super important, as lolwarrior does in his appraisal thread, to take into account renewal costs and probable time frame in determining if a name is viable. Some good names still are not economically viable.
• Now that I have done 6 months of ngTLD sales analysis, I am constantly surprised how often the first sale after no activity for an extended period in an extension, will be a large one. I think in ngTLD the name and match of the name with extension is much more important than the extension alone (not saying that some new extensions are not more valuable just that it does not seem to dominate like com does in legacy).
• I think when everything is looked at the legacy do have better ROI prospects, but I think the difference is shrinking.
• I think new markets and new uses offer the best promise for new extensions, rather than taking a bigger piece of the conventional business market.
• I am probably more guarded than I was a year ago about ngTLDs, although I do see many promising signs as well.
• What do we need for ngTLD market to suddenly get lots better? Some more big recognizable company names using ngTLDs in meaningful ways; some creative forward thinking branding people from outside the domain field that are influencers embracing them in a big way; a major promotional campaign from some of the registrars aimed at students currently in colleges and universities that get young startup owners on board; less misinformation being spread about them (by those who have never liked them); possibly a few super star personalities adopting them for their sites; the ending of premium renewal rates and a maximum rate of increase of renewal rate. A big wish list!

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

Take 1K (or more) legacy domains and 1K (or more) nTLDs into your portfolio...
And after 6-12 months - compare your results... inquiries and sales volume, average price, profit or loss overall.
Very simple procedure.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Take 1K (or more) legacy domains and 1K (or more) nTLDs into your portfolio...
And after 6-12 months - compare your results... inquiries and sales volume, average price, profit or loss overall.
Very simple procedure.

It may be simple, but it is not inexpensive experiment to run (unless you already have 1000 + in each category!

Also, it would be an experiment, but dependent on both the choices made in each category and quite probably also the connections, skills and effort of the seller, and how they might be suited to legacy vs new as the potential markets are, I would argue, somewhat different. When they have tried somewhat similar educational experiments on two modes of instruction, most of the time the biases of the instructor toward one style or another meant that even if they tried to teach some topics in one instructional mode and some in another, it was not a valid comparison for this reason.

I would argue that a way to do the same experiment you propose is to look at large scale statistics of sales relative to for number of domains for sale using databases such as NameBio. Now admittedly it depends on the degree to which NameBio represents all sales - is it 20% of sales, more or less? As long as the factor is similar across the two categories, it does not matter.

That data suggests that if your experiment is run that after one year of the 1000 domain names about 10 will have sold for the com.

Of the 1000 domain names for ngTLD about 2 or 3 would have sold (although it seems for a slightly higher price each).

The actual numbers of course depend on the quality of the domains, and how much you paid for them in each, and how hard you worked to sell them. So if comparing $10 hand reg in new it must be same in com. I am sure individuals some would sell many more than that, and some not at all.

Nevertheless, I do like the idea of your experiment, @Jurgen Wolf ! Thanks.

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

Without any additional work...
Strict inbound... just park them and then compare your trade results.

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

how hard you worked to sell them.

This summer some girl (she is here on NP) sold 3 .PROs to various endusers for ~$3.2K each on average and inbound.
How many nTLD-sellers with such/comparable results you know?

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

And all 3 - BIN.
Without negotiations.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

This summer some girl (she is here on NP) sold 3 .PROs to various endusers for ~$3.2K each on average and inbound.
How many nTLD-sellers with such/comparable results you know?

Well all the registries I guess

 

[Bob Hawkes]

This summer some girl (she is here on NP) sold 3 .PROs to various endusers for ~$3.2K each on average and inbound.
How many nTLD-sellers with such/comparable results you know?

My apologies for answering your question previously with the flippant short answer "the registries" @Jurgen Wolf although it is truthful that they are ngTLD sellers that no doubt did have those level of sales.

More seriously, I personally don't know anyone, but I am not sure that I know anyone with 1000 or more high value ngTLDs in their portfolio that publicly release their sales data (I presume @lolwarrior probably does, but he does not disclose sales in order not to hurt relations with his client base, wise in my opinion). Most others either have dozens to a few hundred ngTLDs, or perhaps more but all low value/low cost ones held for short periods.

The comparison is only fair if you have similar acquisition costs and quality in the two groups. Like not fair to compare 1000 legacy that were picked up in drop for say $100 each and held for 10 years with 1000 ngTLDs that were bought for $1.00 each and were not yet renewed.

As I said earlier, I am pretty sure that legacy would win by a factor of 2 or 3 in equal quality test, probably even more if strictly inbound as you now propose. I think, because they are outside norm, that outbound or creative marketing is more essential with ngTLD than with legacy. Would be interested to hear what those with more success in new extensions think.

It is impressive that 3 pro were sold this summer for those figures (were they the 3 in NameBio at that level since May, or not in NB? And not clear, do you mean she facilitated sales for you or they were from her portfolio? If the former, would actually not class them as entirely inbound, but that i maybe splitting hairs. Congrats if they were your sales!).

Anyway, thanks for your input to the discussion! Multiple viewpoints and approaches always valuable! To borrow an expression from our football league here in Canada "diversity is our strength" I honestly believe that with respect to domain investing. It is good that different individuals take different approaches. Have a good day!

Bob

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

She sold via Afternic, Sedo and Uniregistry listings.
Fixed prices: 2 .PRO x $2,995 + 1 .PRO x $3.5K

p.s. Forget NameBio.
I already said in other thread and can repeat here.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I do not accept "Forget NameBio" @Jurgen Wolf , but thanks for your response.

To discount a database of over $1.6 billion in sales and replace it with perceptions based on individual sales, no matter how important and significant those portfolios are, is I think unwise. Yes, totally important to realize that NameBio misses many sales due to venue, and be alert to biases that introduces.

But data helps inform sound decision making in my opinion.

 

[Jurgen Wolf]

I prefer my own brain.
And I don't want to debate about NameBio or any other 3rd-party website.

Yesterday I got one more inquiry on nTLDs from US company... And again under $500.
They don't want to pay higher for such domains... and exceptions are very very rare.

 

[Brands.International]

I wrote a similar article in Feb 2019, which expands this thread. you can read it here:

https://www.namepros.com/threads/ho...in-2019-and-actually-sell-them.1124142/page-5

GL