discuss [Resolved] Domainer Loses $26k On A Stolen Domain!

[Silentptnr]

Darn! Another scam and this time it is an experienced domainer James Booth.

James must have thought he was making a sound acquisition as he transferred approximately 26k to escrow for CQD.com. Instead, after completing the escrow, the domain was taken from his account by the registrar without notification and returned to the "true" owner.

Turns out the person that sold him the domain CQD.com, may not have been the true owner.

Apparently this incident involves several parties including the registrar and the escrow.


Thanks to Theo over at DomainGang for the tip on this.

 

[Kate]

IMO Rebecca needs to file a police report and seek proper legal advice. This forum is not the venue to settle this dispute. Publicizing the theft is the right thing to do so that it can't be flipped to another unsuspecting buyer, but this won't return the domain where it belongs.

 

[DNWon]

March 2017 - Rebecca aka CQD owner aka @spoiltrider for no apparent reason, registers the domain ComquestDesigns.com as an alternative to CQD.com.

I'm pretty sure she did this as a backup plan domain name in case CQD was to sell for the end user price she was hoping it would sell for as she had it listed on Afternic.

I think some of you should back the f$%# off @spoiltrider, I'm pretty sure she's telling the truth, but maybe is just confused that the name was stolen, sold, stolen again and resold and that explains most of the discrepancies in her story. How would you all feel if you had a 25K to 125K asset stolen from you, you know where it is, can't get it back and it was attached to your real estate business? She doesn't owe this forum anything in the way of proof. If you don't want to believe her, don't, but show some professionalism and empathy and stop attacking her here!

 

[Silentptnr]

I'm pretty sure she did this as a backup plan domain name in case CQD was to sell for the end user price she was hoping it would sell for as she had it listed on Afternic.

I think some of you should back the f$%# off @spoiltrider, I'm pretty sure she's telling the truth, but maybe is just confused that the name was stolen, sold, stolen again and resold and that explains most of the discrepancies in her story. How would you all feel if you had a 25K to 125K asset stolen from you, you know where it is, can't get it back and it was attached to your real estate business? She doesn't owe this forum anything in the way of proof. If you don't want to believe her, don't, but show some professionalism and empathy and stop attacking her here!

If it was me, or any business professional, there would be clearer, more concise information.

 

[DNWon]

If it was me, or any business professional, there would be clearer, more concise information.

I think she's a little frazzled, upset, doesn't understand all the nuances of how the domain industry works, it's total lack of oversight, operational integrity and basic lawlessness of registries, registrars, escrow companies, hackers, thieves, shillbidders etc. and most other domainers total lack of empathy and she let it show. It's been a crash course for her in what's wrong with the domain industry!

 

[Silentptnr]

I think she's a little frazzled, upset, doesn't understand all the nuances of how the domain industry works, it's total lack of oversight, operational integrity and basic lawlessness of registries, registrars, escrow companies, hackers, thieves, shillbidders etc. and most other domainers total lack of empathy and she let it show. It's been a crash course for her in what's wrong with the domain industry!

Believe me, I know. I have had clients that thought they knew eeeeevvvverything....and knew nothing.

Who knows. It's gotten sort of convoluted over the past few days. I still hope that whoever or whatever did wrong will correct what they did.

 

[winst]

Unfortunately at this point this is a case of identity theft. The only way for Rebecca to get her domain name back is hire a domain name lawyer, gather the Whois history, records from Escrow.com, Network Solutions, find out the fake-seller's address, where "he" cashed the check, find the best strategy to force Network Solution to return the domain name, or maybe even make the bank and Escrow.com to admit negligence.

When someone steels your identity and take out a loan from a bank, it takes a lot of work to convince the bank it was not you.

 

[offthehandle]

I don't understand why the US doesn't step up and stops being a third world country when it comes to banking. A cash check in 2018, really? An Escrow company, proud of having a "sophisticated" KYC system in place and then it just sends out a cash check? Have the money wired to a traceable and verified bank account and you have a large paper trail that investigators can follow up on. But don't even pretend to comply with KYC when you offer "checks" as one of your forms of payment. In Switzerland they would charge you with complicity in money laundering.

I love this comment. A Check is implying Money Laundering?, remind me not to return to Zurich with Euros... whoops I mean francs. A check? The US 3rd world? iPhone transactions? I've done 6 figure transactions with a cashiers checks. Many times, Real Estate. Until all the brilliance of the Financial and Banking goons in the OECD decided to limit and control cash. Under the "guise" of protection. It's control. Meanwhile one or two of the major banks there paid a huge fine for non compliance. Sure wires make more sense in all cases and would prevent some of this.

 

[offthehandle]

Multiple requests for evidence above, continual postings, no screenshots from either party and this thread goes to 18 pages. No Bill of Sale, nothing, and one claims stolen property with no evidence and the other refuses to give it back with no evidence of a bill of sale. Hope this goes well for whoever is correct.

The inclusion of Namepros of RR is bad news, I saw that when this thread started and did not think to much of such irresponsible comment made. All this free publicity and help that is unidirectional, meanwhile the forum name gets trashed, hope that it can be removed.

 

[winst]

I love this comment. A Check is implying Money Laundering?, remind me not to return to Zurich with Euros... whoops I mean francs. A check?

Don't get me started. In the US, our entire society is based on maximizing "profit", the fewer the "blockers" the better. Institutions overlooks "fraud", "scam" because most people are honest and restrictions = reduced profits.

One comment earlier says the neither party needs to prove anything on this forum. They let the police and the lawyers do the talking.

 

[Silentptnr]

So any bets on how this goes?

For Booth, 8 bucks a year and TFA keep his 3L.com domain safe and secure.

 

[offthehandle]

You guys who have contributed to the thread in expertise have given $26k worth of help already. Look at the XY and JB input, that's xxx.xx per hour.

There is no way if this isn't settled out of court that even paying for a retainer fee makes sense at all. And if the complainant is the true owner and in real estate, that should be self evident.

 

[Silentptnr]

You guys who have contributed to the thread in expertise have given $26k worth of help already. Look at the XY and JB input, that's xxx.xx per hour.

There is no way if this isn't settled out of court that even paying for a retainer fee makes sense at all. And if the complainant is the true owner and in real estate, that should be self evident.

Perhaps registrars need to be much more proactive in educating their customers about the importance of security and what options are available and how to use them.

Certainly for customers with very valuable domains, that they know are not using every available option to secure their domains.

Another thing...today I read that two domain investors or brokers helped a family reclaim and renew a valuable domain that was going to auction due to expiration. To me, that's a shame that a registrar wouldn't contact their customer in a case like that. Registrars are generally very weak in these areas. Too busy trying to make money.

I'm not saying that it is all the registrars responsibility, but they should be doing more in this respect.

 

[offthehandle]

Perhaps registrars need to be much more proactive in educating their customers

Another thing...today I read that two domain investors or brokers helped a family reclaim and renew a valuable domain that was going to auction due to expiration.

I got like 12 emails each over and over begging me to renew way before were expiring for some names I dropped from Godaddy. And with Namesilo and Namebright a couple. One problem is old email addresses if they are old domains. That person/persons has to be checking the email account with whois a couple times a year, or prepay 10 years I did that before, if not well-poof they are gone.

That sort of story needs to be posted! Very nice to hear!, please start a thread on the investors/brokers who helped. I am glad to hear good stories here, but it seems over and over these debacles, well at least one every 4 months one at least.

 

[tonecas]

just dropping a little bit of information.

on 2017/03/09 i reached the administrative email "[email protected]" and got this reply on 2017/09/11:

"
Hello,


This email address hasn't been accessed for a long time because it's full of email.


I am not the rightful owner of this domain name.


It's for sale and You should ask the owner at [email protected]


I will also forward this email to him now.


Becky
"

 

[offthehandle]

just dropping a little bit of information.

on 2017/09/11 i reached the administrative email "[email protected]" and got this reply:

I am not the rightful owner of this domain name.

"

Wow Tonecas, haven't heard from you in awhile! Thats quite a scoop, did you look up domain buzz 56?. More drama to the saga here.
edit: no google or bing results for that email address.

 

[tonecas]

Hi @offthehandle. Sorry, not more info. Been with too much on my plate in the last months.

 

[offthehandle]

Hi @offthehandle. Sorry, not more info. Been with too much on my plate in the last months.

Cool, always like seeing your posts, you are a voice of reason here on various issues, so just wanted to say hi and glad to see you back even if for a few minutes.

 

[xynames]

$26K sounds like a lot but if the money has traveled and disappeared into a foreign country the US government is not going to pursue the matter as far as prosecuting the foreign thief over a mere $26K.

Technically the buyer is guilty at this point - since he is on notice - of the criminal act of knowingly receiving (holding, concealing) stolen property - but again, in that he paid good money for it straight above the board, doubtful any D.A. will pick up the case.

Owner’s best recourse is probably to sue current holder of the domain under a theory of unjust enrichment among other causes of action, including a civil unlawful conversion, civil action for recovery of stolen property, etc

 

[Crysis]

More updates

Mike Han says:
March 15, 2018 at 12:28 pm
This is Mike Han again, you guys seems very curious about my transaction of cod.com. So i will show you guys the details. However, i do not find any place to upload the screenshot of the transaction of cod.com on domain gang.com.
At first, i contacted the seller of cod.com for a client, and we agreed on the price of $19K, so we started the escrow.com transaction. My client trusted me so he give me the money first, that’s why i acted as buyer on the escrow.com transaction and the domain transferred to me after the escrow.com secured the money. After I received the domain, my client asked me again if the domain is safe. So i checked again, and i find it is a little strange. The seller’s name wasn’t match with the whois and the website showed. Therefore, i suggested my client give it up and returned the domain. I contacted escrow.com and let them not to release the money, and i give the code to the seller so that it can be transferred back to them.
We received the money back from escrow.com after the domain back to the seller. So our lost is just the fees on escrow.com and bank transfer fees. If anyone will help me upload the record, you can email me [email protected].

Copyright DomainGang.com

 

[tonecas]

here is some more info, by trying to get access to this gmail account

note also that the registrant email address on the domain WHOIS (which can be the primary account email address on NS) changed to "[email protected]" on around 2016-08-13

 

[tech4]

According to some other research from a post DomainGang.com:

"Nevins McTwisp says:
March 15, 2018 at 9:19 pm
David — I agree that those involved need to start posting screenshots, BUT I also think seasoned domainers like yourself need to exercise more caution with their comments. ie Stop assuming and start researching

For example, you said
“March 2017 – Rebecca aka CQD owner aka @spoiltrider for no apparent reason, registers the domain ComquestDesigns.com as an alternative to CQD.com.”

However, if you bothered to check a free historical WHOIS record, you would find that Rebecca had registered ComquestDesigns.com on June 18th, 2015 using her Yahoo email address. Possibly hosted with 1and1.com. Given the current registration date (March 2017) it’s safe to assume that she didn’t renew the domain; ie the 2017 WHOIS date is a re-registration If you can’t tell by the bold my issue with your comment, is you assumed she registered her full business name for no apparent reason.
Then you said “The owner of CQD.com is the person on the WHOIS. And that is James Booth. Period.” … So you’re saying you’ve seen screenshots from James that proves he actually dealt with Rebecca? As far as I know, James hasn’t posted any…"

Basically it seems that Rebecca has lost her CQD way before James Booth bought it, as early as 2015. Maybe she sold it short, which makes sense because she posted it for sale on Afternic. Then later registered comquestdesigns.com to replace CQD. Either she sold it, lost it, or had plans to "sell and resell it" like it is happening right now. She apparently knew of the Oct sale from Escrow because she said Escrow contacted her but instead put it on James $19k instead of the $25k.

So...I think we don't whoever this Rebecca is, she knew the domain was lost a long time ago in 2015, even if she didn't knew it then, she then knew it again in Oct of 2017. But pretends everything is just fine. After James went online to claimed back the domain, she appears to claimed to be the "real owner".
------------------------------------------------------------
Basically whoever she is, real or fake, chose 1)Lied about having used CQD till it was "stolen" by some hacker because in 2015 she registered an alternative but here on NP she claimed she only used CQD. 2)Lied about not knowing it was sold multiple times and never provided any screenshots from Escrow. Which furthers complicate any thought that she is a real person and not the "hacker".

Or she is the real person, happens to be a serial online syndicate selling and reporting and selling just to make money. And this does happens when the whois information is hidden from the public, on purpose to cover up who the actual thief is.

 

[Silentptnr]

My response to this was...
"Nevins – I try not to assume too much, but maybe every now and then….

Thanks for the insight into the whois history for comquestdesigns. I did a quick whois search and saw 2017.

Even if it was 2015, there is so much we do not know. Looking at this from my perspective, not knowing this individual personally, I still don’t even know if the person portraying themself as Rebecca….is actually Rebecca from the whois history.

All I know is that we have a person claiming they did not sell their domain, and two other people saying they lawfully purchased the domain and paid through escrow. One returned the domain and the latter kept it. The one that kept it claims they did “their” due diligence. The person claiming they did not sell says they did receive a message from the current registrant. Who’s telling the truth?

Additionally, we have a registrar that has sided with the current registrant.

What is to be done with all of this? The person claiming to be a victim needs to lawyer up.

Seems these parties are no longer asking for any type of assistance. Perhaps they are moving on.

If nothing changes, the current registrant (James Booth), will remain…"

 

[tonyk2000]

Basically it seems that Rebecca has lost her CQD way before James Booth bought it, as early as 2015. Maybe she sold it short, which makes sense because she posted it for sale on Afternic. Then later registered comquestdesigns.com to replace CQD

If she registered comquestdesigns.com and listed cqd on afternic at the same time in 2015 or so, this would make sense. Listing the domain on afternic by itself means that a replacement should be ready for a com quest website. Indeed, she posted:

I DID NOT SELL MY DOMAIN! it was on afternic for at least 2 years

As for October 2017,

So...I think we don't whoever this Rebecca is, she knew the domain was lost a long time ago in 2015, even if she didn't knew it then, she then knew it again in Oct of 2017

It appears the she was a listed owner in Oct. 2017 after the domain was returned from ename.cn:

Whois Record for 2017-10-25
Domain Name: cqd.com
Registrar: NETWORK SOLUTIONS, LLC.
Registrant Name: ComQuest Designs LLC

What is interesting is that Rebecca knowingly used a screenshot of a reversed 19K 2017 transaction in the current discussion and stated that it was James who paid this amount, which must have happened in 2018 then, as she was speaking about recent events:

you're asking me to buy back my domain for how much? 25k? i have a screenshot of a 19K receipt you paid sent to me from escrow platform that they supplied me when i first called this out as fraud!

 

[xynames]

here is some more info, by trying to get access to this gmail account

Show attachment 83168
Show attachment 83167
Show attachment 83166

Show attachment 83165


note also that the registrant email address on the domain WHOIS (which can be the primary account email address on NS) changed to "[email protected]" on around 2016-08-13

When I get to gmail login screens like that it is after entering the correct PW but gmail requiring further verification. Such as requesting answer to secret question, city usually logged in from, recovery email address or recovery phone number.

Or did you reach those screens after clicking Lost Password. If so I think you’ll find that even after going all the way through with supplying info and an email address to receive a recovery code and then supplying that recovery code back to google that gmail will at the end deny you access - unless you are able to answer the question about when account created precisely AND the email address you supply for the recovery code IS the recovery email address on file for that gmail with google. Otherwise it’s just an exercise in futility you will not gain access to a gmail via some random recovery email address not on file for that gmail without knowing the correct password for the gmail in the first place.

 

[tonecas]

When I get to gmail login screens like that it is after entering the correct PW but gmail requiring further verification. Such as requesting answer to secret question, city usually logged in from, recovery email address or recovery phone number.

Or did you reach those screens after clicking Lost Password. If so I think you’ll find that even after going all the way through with supplying info and an email address to receive a recovery code and then supplying that recovery code back to google that gmail will at the end deny you access.

place a wrong password when trying to login to the account. then click forgot password when the login shows as failed. then click "try another way". then click on "I don't have my phone". place the date Sept/2017. and you get the associated email address for recovery.

i am not interested in trying to get access to the email account, only following the footsteps.