My journey with BrandBucket (and why I'm leaving them)

[BrandVenue]

I have joined BB in the beginning of 2016. Started with only a less than 15 names just to give it a try. Within a couple months I sold one domain (May 2016 to be exact). After that sale I took BrandBucket seriously and listed 250+ names over the years, mostly hand registered domains. That was the time when BB acceptance rate was only around 20%. So I had to submit 100 domains to get 20 of them approved. Unlike now that was the time when submitting unregistered domains wasn't allowed.

For almost a year I had no sale so I sold some of my hand registered domains to other BB sellers here at Namepros. Mostly because I was not getting my 2nd sale, renewals were coming due, I wasn't sure what my next move would be if I didn't have another sale.

My 2nd sale came exactly 1 year after my first sale. After my 2nd sale I have been regularly selling one domain every month or two on BB. With each of these sale I came to realize the importance of quality over quantity. Because on BrandBucket I was only selling the names I bought from auctions. But my portfolio was filled with so many hand registered names. I wasn't so lucky to sell a single hand registered domain there.

For this reason I had changed my strategy. With the profits of each sale I bought domains from auctions. I sold off nearly all my hand registered domains from my BB portfolio to other BB sellers, kept only a few which I really like and filled my portfolio with domains bought from auctions.

Currently I have 138 domains and 70%-80% of those are domains bought for XX, XXX and XXXX figures from auctions. I have stopped hand registering domains long time ago.

Total sold : 8 domains
Total Revenue: $26K (average $3.2K)
Total Net proceeds: $18.3K (average $2.2K)

My dashboard says 3.82% sell through rate, with being top 13% of sellers.

I consider myself pretty successful on BB. But despite that I have decided to leave BB. Why?

Over my journey I have watched BB inventory grow from 20K+ domains to 50K+ domains. But quality of the names did not grow with the same pace. Nowadays BB accepts every kind of domains which would have never been accepted in 2015/16.

At first it was good to repeat last letter of a domain like Domainn , then they started to accept repeated letters anywhere on the word like and .

Even though at this point I thought they wouldn't approve repeating first letter of a domain, but after seeing it's clear that in upcoming days we will see more of this kind first letter repeated domains.

I knew BB only publish pronounceable 4 letter domains but ?

I thought removing one vowel like Tunnl (I've sold this one on BB) instead of Tunnel was good but removing 3 vowel?

And the last one which I saw today is

in the description it says - A clever spelling of "outsourced". The domain is Out/Soursd, S not C. if it was OutSourcd I'd understand why BB accepted it - they removed the last vowel of correct spelling OutSourced but why would they accept or publish a domain like Out/Soursd?

After seeing this name I have said myself enough is enough. I can't have my domains, most of which were bought from auctions for substantial amount of money compete with these kind of names. One thing is clear BB is ignoring quality issue, they now believe in quantity over quality which is against my point of view. So I've decided to leave BrandBucket.

When they were getting good number of sales they would highlight that in their newsletters, but they've stopped publishing any kind of sale related info which suggests their sale rate also dropping.

I did not have any intention to go against any other BB sellers (especially those whose domains I've mentioned here). I only blame BB for their decision to move to quantity over quality strategy. I am not saying these domains I've mentioned here won't sell, they might sell. But BB has proved that we may see more unpronounceable 4 letter domains (even CHIPS too) in future, we may see more first letter repeated domains in future, we may also see more domains like in future.

All these suggests BB inventory will grow rapidly in the future and my small portfolio of domains will be like a small water drop of a ocean, chances of selling a name there through buyer using search option doesn't look bright anymore.

I've sent them 30 days notice to remove my names. It's been a good journey.

 

[Name Trader]

I removed my (some 30) domains from BB, because, and in protest to, the search scandal which broke earlier this year (I think). Where it was proven that domains were being offered in their searches, which had nothing to do with the search terms, and were being shown before domains which clearly had better met the search criteria. Obviously not every domainer's domains were being treated fairly by BB's searches. This kind of underhand favoritism, unspecified approach to business, sows distrust, and I personally cannot abide.

BB. Were very helpful and friendly about deleting these domains after 1 month's notice. But what they don't tell you is that it would screw-up your "in good standing" ratio so badly, that it is now impossible for me to buy BB listed names any longer on NP. Because my "in good standing" is now a thing of the past, for my account, at least. And if I understand how this ratio works correctly, I'd now need to add approx 150 domains, even to improve my ratio to about 85%. Which IIRC, would be enough to get my good standing ratio to the point where I would be able to buy BB domains in the aftermarket again "in good standing". Because those 30 domains I deleted will be weighing down my ratio unreasonably. Forever.

Perhaps BB think that getting rid of a few bad apples will improve their success rate. But I would not consider myself a bad apple. I was reacting to being unfairly treated by their search results. But the consequences are dire. Because I'm no longer wanted by BB any longer. But in the big scheme of things, it's probably better for me, in the long run. My ratios are being unfairly depressed by the actions of BB themselves.

BB is not a fair playing field. Whilst those that get treated more generously than others, will still be successful, it is at the expense of mistreatment of other "members", who are not getting a fair crack of the whip. IMHO.

Roll-on the creation of an honest broker in this brandable space.

 

[imadoer]

I completely feel the same way as @stub I'm even more skeptical of them

I feel like brandbucket should be completely avoided even if things have changed. I've sold more domains on landers /auction/ afternic

At least you get a fair chance managing your own names with no exclusivity. Lower percentages and a better chance of making a sale. How much exposure are you going to get on bb? its flooded with brandables now. Are they still placing there vips stuff first? There's a guy with 770 bb names and only sold 2 that doesn't even cover the listing fees and renewals. From my experience and I say this with no hate.

I don't feel like anyone should trust brandbucket to sell your domains there a very SHADY COMPANY

 

[BRANDERX]

I think if they drop their "exclusivity" requirement, they'd be able to keep such customers & still sell domains.

 

[Keith DeBoer]

In case anyone is interested…………


BB’s goal is to sell our domains. They get a commission, the logo designer gets an award and we get the balance of the proceeds. In order to give our domains the best chance of selling, BB only accepts names that it feels will appeal to its client base. Domains that they feel have little chance of selling are rejected.


Once a domain is accepted BB invests money in presenting that domain in the most appealing way with a nice description, logo, search words and landing pages. After BB has invested their time and money in a domain they, and in most cases the logo designers, want the domain to stay on the platform so they can be rewarded for their investment of time and money.


If we allow our domains to expire it does NOT affect our good standing rating. If we give/sell our domains to another BB seller, it does NOT affect our good standing. If we give 30 days notice and remove a few of our domains it does NOT affect our good standing. However, if we remove more than 6% of our entire BB portfolio then our good standard rating is affected. This can be remedied by adding more domains to our portfolio.


Not having good standing on BB means we are not part of BB’s community communication platform and its benefits. We also cannot receive domains from other BB sellers.


But that is all.


All other benefits continue. We can still sell our domains on BB and profit. We can still get great customer service from their help desk. We can still add names to our BB portfolio.


As others have mentioned, in most cases, BB’s policies are more lenient than other brandable platforms that often ban sellers, sometimes without notice, for various reasons like they are selling their published domains on NPs etc.


BB only closes our account if we remove domains from our BB folio WITHOUT giving the required 30 days notice. This is in the terms of use that we agree to when we open a BB account.


Also, I have asked BB about the biased search allegations and they say that any such bias, if it exists, is unintended and they do not give preference in their search results to specific sellers. They ask that if anyone finds any instances of skewed search results that they contact BB ([email protected]) so they can remedy the situation for that specific search which came about as an unintended consequence of their search algorithms.


In addition when domains go through the system to be published or to be sold, there is no identifying information attached. Just the domain. The employee has no knowledge of who owns each domain. Every effort is made to give every BB seller the same opportunity to sell their domains as anyone else.


Like any organization or platform BB is not perfect. They make mistakes. If anyone sees mistakes or or has suggestions for improvement, BB welcomes our feedback via its help desk ([email protected]) and will always work to repair any errors or inadequacies in its systems or procedures.


Peace!

 

[Name Trader]

Once you place a domain with BrandBucket. You are stuck with that domain with BrandBucket forever more. You cannot sell the domain outside of BrandBucket, except if you sell it to another BrandBucket member in good standing.. Whether the buyer is in good standing or not requires quite high standards of loyalty. So you are pretty much stuck with the domain, unless you can find a buyer by BrandBucket's determination of the meaning of "in good standing". You cannot transfer any domain without losing :"in good standing" points. Which requires you basically to add somewhere like 5 times the number of domains if you have removed all your domains, in order to get your good standing rating again. BrandBucket may be be biggest Brandable Marketplace. But they are by far the worst market tying you to them and double penalizing if you sell outside of their market. Their website search results have been proved to to favor certain individuals, commissions are pretty much the worst in the industry, even the logos are extremely expensive. You cannot set your own prices (only within 20% of their set price).

I wonder why the run of the mill domainer would ever want to use them when they can forward the domain to their own website and pocket a whole lot of change for themselves. I'm sure those who get favoritism with BrandBucket's website searches won't complain because their domains would go higher up the search results, presumably meaning more sales.

 

[Keith DeBoer]

@BrandVenue thanks for an open and honest portrayal of your journey with BrandBucket. I am sure they will be sorry to see you go. At the same time there are many marketplaces and every domainer needs to use the marketplace(s) or methodologies (landing pages etc) that the feel most comfortable with and which produces the greatest benefit for them.

I wish you continued success!


PS
A minor point - names with no vowels are starting to become popular with startups. Some examples are FCTRY and MNDFL. So NWSLTTR is a trendy kind of domain right now. Your other examples though of names of questionable quality seem to be valid and I understand the point your are making

 

[BrandVenue]

BTW if you know of any good keywords that are available to register without vowels, please send them to me via private message. I'd like to register them. I'm serious about this. I've looked and I can't find anything that's 7 letters or less (after the vowels have been removed). So I would really be interested if you come across any. Thanks!

PS they need to be CVCVC...... only one vowel between the consonants for them to work.

Thanks again for putting into words your experience and insights. Much appreciated!

Spent some time and found a few. Don't know if they are good keywords as 'good' in brandable is subjective.

bckrdr - backorder
bcklght - backlight
bcksd - backside
brrwng - borrowing
rctnglr - rectangular
trnsplnt - transplant
snsbl - sensible

similar to Mndfl
hndfl - handful
delghtfl - delightful

As per dynadot search they are all available. Sorry that I wrote here and didn't send via pm as I didn't want to move our public conversation to private.

 

[Name Trader]

Stub, I appreciate your feelings and views. Every market place has its good and bad points. Domainers should choose the marketplace(s) that best suit their needs. In some cases that means using multiple marketplaces and/or landing pages via Efty etc.

BB does require exclusivity for their listings just like BrandRoot and Brandpa. However, any seller can remove a domain(s) from BB by giving 30 days notice.

Hi Keith,

Sure they can. But every domain you remove from BB giving 30 days notice still counts negatively against their "in good standing ratio" They were very helpful in telling me that after 30 days (as you were above) I could remove my domains, which I did. But not once did they ever mention to me that it would make it impossible to use them ever again.I assumed, wrongly as it turned out, that I'd fulfilled all my obligations, when I terminated my domains by giving my 30 days notice, and would be welcomed back at any time. I'd start from scratch again since I'd followed all the rules. BUT THIS WAS NOT THE CASE.

However. If the website searched results are still so unfairly biased against us "small guys". I'm not sure I really would want to come back.

Also because I'm basically "blackballed" I cannot buy any BB domains from others sellers, even if I intend to leave them on BB. I really think there is some very twisted thinking going on. At the very least it is deceitful.

 

[anantj]

I only have three solutions here....

Landers

Landers

Landers

Make your own landers and make sure you have a link to all your domains on each landing page.
I sell almost exclusively from my landers and pay no commissions. Heck I even have my own credit card machine to cut out the middle man.

Doing it by yourself is the way to go for me

The major advantage that Brandable Marketplaces bring us is discoverability. The probability of users discovering a brandable domain by typing in the domain name is quite low.

 

[JimJammy]

Hi Keith,

Sure they can. But every domain you remove from BB giving 30 days notice still counts negatively against their "in good standing ratio" They were very helpful in telling me that after 30 days (as you were above) I could remove my domains, which I did. But not once did they ever mention to me that it would make it impossible to use them ever again.I assumed, wrongly as it turned out, that I'd fulfilled all my obligations, when I terminated my domains by giving my 30 days notice, and would be welcomed back at any time. I'd start from scratch again since I'd followed all the rules. BUT THIS WAS NOT THE CASE.

However. If the website searched results are still so unfairly biased against us "small guys". I'm not sure I really would want to come back.

Also because I'm basically "blackballed" I cannot buy any BB domains from others sellers, even if I intend to leave them on BB. I really think there is some very twisted thinking going on. At the very least it is deceitful.

So let me get this straight... You added your names to BB, they spent countless hours writing your descriptions, paying a logo designer to create a logo for you (if the logo designer chose that option) and then promoting those names in social media and other outlets on your behalf... and then you removed your names.

Now you want to start afresh and expect to have the same privileges and rights as those of us that haven't wasted their time and resources?

I think the question here is, what planet are YOU on?!

If you give them 30 days notice, your account stays open and you have the ability to come back, if you add your names again your score will return to what it was.

If you don't give them 30 days notice they close your account.

 

[Foggy]

They post every name on their site on social media, that is actively promoting a sellers name.

Posting names to a social media account one time—when they're published—is hardly "active."

I have been submitting and selling domains at BB for five years and the only thing I have known them to promote is BB.

I have found NMC to be a monumental waste of time.

 

[Innoverge]

I believe the 30% comm. is ridiculous, especially considering the marketplace has grown unchecked,cluttered with mediocre brandables.
For any potential buyer with decent sense of naming and brandability, sifting through BB could be close to finding a needle in a haystack, which could not only be unproductive but, also distracting, unless ofcourse they have already decided on a name and use the landing page to make the purchase via BB, in which case the 30% comm is undeserved.

If they insist on sticking to their exclusivity clause, the least they can do is maintain a curated marketplace with a boutique appeal, and not that of wholesale warehouse.

 

[Bannen]

Have I missed some notice about BB now charging 'credits' for all submissions? I know they've been charging a credit to submit any domain that is unregistered... but now whenever I go to submit a domain in the last couple days, all of a sudden they say I need a credit for each submission (I only submit domains that are registered already). What happened, anyone fill me in? Did they now change things so that every submission, whether regged or not, is charged that 1 credit?

As far as what's said in above posts - agree entirely. Harder and harder for decent names to be seen by their customers, who have to wade through thousands of - frankly - pretty darn bad/average names. I see hundreds of domains for sale here at NP, that are BB approved but owners flogging them here at a few bucks each, and I just think 'What? They actually approved those domains? Has all quality control been abandoned?' Seems like they're turning their marketplace into more of a 'submissions mill' rather than a legit selling platform for quality names, just milling the names through to rake in all those credits and listing fees for quick money...

The percentage of truly good, attractive, even premium domains there is shrinking smaller and smaller, compared to the now huge percentage of domains that customers simply have to 'wade through' to cherry pick the better ones.

 

[farouk20]

...i believe you should stay back.
You made mention of having quality names.

Then the names will standout

Fear not

 

[MapleDots]

I only have three solutions here....

Landers

Landers

Landers

Make your own landers and make sure you have a link to all your domains on each landing page.
I sell almost exclusively from my landers and pay no commissions. Heck I even have my own credit card machine to cut out the middle man.

Doing it by yourself is the way to go for me

 

[anantj]

How is Namerific a "graveyard?" They keep accepting new names and are pretty fast at filtering the good from the bad. Just visit the site to see each one they add each day. They also show which ones they've recently sold. If there's one that I personally find to be a graveyard, it's Brandroot. Brandroot does not even let you create an account right now. I read in another thread that they have a waiting list of several months before sellers get notified of their account status. Like, lol. As if they're the only game in town. If they're "too busy" to accept your domains, try their competitors. Namerific will let you know whether or not they accept your domains. Aside from brandBucket and Namerific, Brandpa is also active in accepting sellers and their domains. Here's my thorough review of the Big 3: nametaster.com (check the blog). yes, my site is still a draft until I get something better...

BR also has the worst attitude. The owner is here on NP I think and just don't get a good feeling interacting with him (whatever limited interaction I've had with him previously)

 

[Keith DeBoer]

Stub, I appreciate your feelings and views. Every market place has its good and bad points. Domainers should choose the marketplace(s) that best suit their needs. In some cases that means using multiple marketplaces and/or landing pages via Efty etc.

BB does require exclusivity for their listings just like BrandRoot and Brandpa. However, any seller can remove a domain(s) from BB by giving 30 days notice.

 

[karmaco]

Gonna have to agree with @stub on the ridiculousness of your standing going to F if you remove YOUR names following the give us 30 day notice rule.

This does two things:sever all possibility of future business ties and if you think about it no one has any real incentive for giving that notice now do they?

I realize Brandroot is the same or worse on this subject. Don’t know if they have this very unsavory term “good standing”.Thank God Brandpa doesn’t have that yet. No one likes to be judged like that. They should be treating their sellers like the valuable commodities that they are.

If everyone removed their names their would be no brandable sites. Ponder that.

 

[Name Trader]

I had one sale on BB.. good sale. But everything has been dead since. I'm considering just removing my names.

If you do. You need to be certain that you are gone for good. Because you only are allowed 6% of your portfolio to be removed before your they slap the title of "Not in Good Standing" on your account. So you cannot buy domains to replenish what you have removed. You will also find, there is a multiplier effect. You cannot replace like number of deletions with like number of additions. For me the multiple is about 3:1. Which becomes even more frustrating, when Sellers won't sell you names because of your account, not in good standing. and because of the stricter approvals being enforced.

 

[Recons.Com]

If you do. You need to be certain that you are gone for good. Because you only are allowed 6% of your portfolio to be removed before your they slap the title of "Not in Good Standing" on your account. So you cannot buy domains to replenish what you have removed. You will also find, there is a multiplier effect. You cannot replace like number of deletions with like number of additions. For me the multiple is about 3:1. Which becomes even more frustrating, when Sellers won't sell you names because of your account, not in good standing. and because of the stricter approvals being enforced.

Why did you come back? I have 227 names with them, good standing and all, and zero sales in 6 (!) months! Even afternic with no forwarding is performing much better and brandpa with just 60% of the name count, has sold 5-6 names for me in the period. And most of the names AF/BP are selling are BB rejects.

BB, at this point, for any outsider seller, is dead.

Basically, either their sell through has collapsed or they still do get sales, but make sure their own names show first for any search.

And if someone would, e.g., search for sofia, my name sofiax/com would come up. But if you click in, then you see at the bottom "other names related to "Sofiax": zathos, solaxo, sawaza, zenosa, xorvox etc. This name alone brings in few hundred clicks to BB, by the way.

How the heck is sawaza related to sofiax? And I am also guessing this names are not random.

I will wait couple months more and move all 227 names out. Sunk cost shouldn't dictate the decisions.

 

[HotKey]

Come over to the nGLTD world and then you don't have to worry about competing in a grade 3 spelling bee..

 

[karmaco]

You should only take names that can’t sell themselves as easily to brandable marketplaces. Any super high quality name can be sold on your own.

And then you have to ask yourself how much exposure is your name getting with 50 K plus names over there. And what are you paying the 30% plus $100 for? The logo? It’s not like anyone is actively promoting your names.

If you notice people normally can’t sell B.B. listed names for more than peanuts. So even being a reseller to others is not worth it.

I see people celebrating tiny profits when a sale does happen. That probably just covers the submission fees they paid the entire last year to get names evaluated and maybe some renewals.

The question is could you have sold that name on any other marketplace for a better ROI or even the same amount? Giving a third party that high of a commission is no small thing and has to be taken into consideration depending on the name.

 

[italsat]

@stub look at your account , i think is update at new system and is in good standing , now need pay 1 for submit a domain.

 

[BrandVenue]

Thanks Keith.

@BrandVenue
A minor point - names with no vowels are starting to become popular with startups. Some examples are FCTRY and MNDFL. So NWSLTTR is a trendy kind of domain right now. Your other examples though of names of questionable quality seem to be valid and I understand the point your are making

Dropping one vowel in the end is ok like Flickr, Tumblr, Tunnl (which I've mentioned before), this way the pronunciation remains same but the word creates an uniqueness. These kind of names are not available to register anymore and when they come to expiry auction prices go from XXX to XXXX figure depending the keyword.

But dropping all vowels? I don't know if it's becoming trendy but IMO it's weird and very confusing. There are not so many companies doing it right now. Apart from FCTRY and MNDFL there are also SRSLY, SQRRL etc. Although these names are not as same as NWSLTTR, latter one is 7 letters long even after dropping all the vowels.

There are many names like these currently available to hand register, so I assume BB will also accept those names in future, put $2K+ price tag and increase their already 50K+ inventory.

It's just my point of view. BB or a buyer's point of view may be different from me. Brandable is all about perspective, I'm sure you've said it many times and I agree to that.