poll How many domainers in the world?

[redemo]

A domainer is a person who registers domain names as an investment. How many domainers do you think there are on our lonely planet? What data backs up your estimate? I think the number is up to one million because most domainers are probably Namepros members and there are over one million members but not all members are active. So up to one million domainers seems like a good estimate. Then again, not all domainers speak English so maybe it's more like two million?

 

[bmugford]

I disagree, but it seems like a debate is getting fuelled as to what exactly is a domainer. I'm saying it's anybody, anywhere, who registers any domain name as an investment by any means.

Well, then you need to define what "investment" means.

Are we talking about only people who believe they can sell the domain for more in the future or people who are going to try to use the domain to make money AKA is it considered an investment if you buy a domain to possibly use to grow your business?

You could argue that buying a domain name to use is an investment in your business, though if that was the case basically all end users would qualify.

Brad

 

[bmugford]

It really depends what you mean by investment.

If the bar was say people who own 10+ domains with hopes of selling them for a profit down the road, I think the number is 100k or under.

The vast majority of registrations are made up of end users and large portfolios.

Another question is - what percent of .com even has value above registration fee?

I would be surprised if it is over 5%. Maybe 10% would have any chance to ever sell.

Brad

 

[enterscope]

How many active members on Namepros? That should be most of them...

 

[MediaCode]

First:

A "domainer" is a casual hobbyist, part-timer who attempts to earn a profit running an informal, loosely-organized portfolio of domain names but, in more years than not, fails to turn a profit on the portfolio.

A "domain investor" is a professional investor, full-timer/part-timer who attempts to earn a profit running a well-organized portfolio operation and, in more years than not, successfully turns a profit on the portfolio.

Second:

I'd guesstimate that there are upwards of 30,000 "domainer" participants and fewer than 3,000 "domain investor" participants in the aftermarket, worldwide.

The turnover rate among "domainer" participants is likely much higher than "domain investor" participants, who depend on the portfolio profits for household income, in whole or in part.

 

[The Durfer]

digital real estate investors is what it should be officially. I actually put this on my taxes last year and it accepted it. lol.

 

[Constantin S]

There are like 360M domains registered, while there are 333M registered businesses globally.

• Did a bit of research and I think it's fair to say 50% of businesses have a website (166M)
• Let's say 1% of those companies are medium-sized, that would mean 1.1M, if each of these companies owns 50 domains then another 55M domains are gone to them.
• There are also 41000 listed companies, Google for example owns 15k+ domains, but not all companies are in 'tech', so let's average it down to 1000 domains for each, that would result in another 41M gone.

All that's left now is 98M domains, so we obviously gotta split 50-50 between us(team domainers, yay) with those darn bloggers+influencers, so we only get 49M domains, sorry. If the average domainer owns 100 domains then it means there are 490k of us out there. Crap, I voted up to 100k.

Well, this took like an hour to write, it's now 4:30 AM here...don't drink coke at night kids. Good night I guess, take care

 

[ZeroVariance]

I own a few thousand domains, but I can't classify myself as a domainer. Since my objectives are different than aiming for sales.

on the other hand, I am sure people will think they are a domainer with 5 domains or less in their portfolio just to give themselves titles because they own a few and sold one in 3 years time.

Same that i have seen in PE and investing. Some random kid invests 1K in whatever crowdfunded startup and updates his title to Angel investor...

whilst I bankrolled close to 500K in total in a few startups and yet have not used the word Angel yet.


People like labels and titles.
The title 'domainer' is a flexible one and there are no strict definitions anymore it seems. It's been watered down.

Being a domainer is imo a process and not an event. People that are consistent in treating it as an actual business are the real domainers.

The ones that are YoY repeating the process and survive long enough to see others fail are the real domainers.

 

[bmugford]

Not for me. I have more important things to talk about with the lads and lasses than imaginary electronic words on a computer screen. Also you @bmugford put Brad at the end of every post, while @biggie puts imo at the end, why don't you both put it in your Namepros signatures then it's automated? You could save hours of time each year and start developing some domain names.

Thanks for your valuable feedback.

imo.

Brad

 

[Future Sensors]

I suspect that there are a few, domainers who do not have a NamePros account.

I expect this group to be really very large. I myself only became a member of NamePros in November 2020, while I had already been an active domain investor for more than 20 years. During that time I have of course informed myself in many other ways about the developments in the field, but not as a member of this forum.

 

[redemo]

A definition for Domainer that makes sense to me "a person who registers a domain name, and sells it for a profit."

I didn't start this thread to push an agenda, but domaining isn't only selling. Domaining is registering a domain name as an investment. If a person registers a domain name in order to make money from that investment then they are a domainer. Millionaire domainer, failed domainer, newbie domainer. You smoke cigarettes you're a smoker. Don't matter how many.

If you haven't sold a domain for a profit, you are not a Domainer, just a domain debtor.

I disagree, but it seems like a debate is getting fuelled as to what exactly is a domainer. I'm saying it's anybody, anywhere, who registers any domain name as an investment by any means.

I'd argue there are less than 5,000 Domainers on the planet making an annual profit when you consider this elite group may own 25 million domains among themselves.

Interesting. Got any sources mate?

Domainers sell domains for profits, and I'd bet less than 10K persons are doing so in any given year.

So a person who registers domains and parks them for profit isn't a domainer? A person who solely leases domain names for profit isn't a domainer? A person who buys domain names in order to develop and later sell them isn't a domainer? ONLY selling domains for profit makes you a domainer, is that what you're saying? I'd say ALL of the above makes you a domainer, regardless of your income level.

 

[J.R.]

I didn't start this thread to push an agenda, but domaining isn't only selling. Domaining is registering a domain name as an investment. If a person registers a domain name in order to make money from that investment then they are a domainer. Millionaire domainer, failed domainer, newbie domainer. You smoke cigarettes you're a smoker. Don't matter how many.

I disagree, but it seems like a debate is getting fuelled as to what exactly is a domainer. I'm saying it's anybody, anywhere, who registers any domain name as an investment by any means.

Interesting. Got any sources mate?

So a person who registers domains and parks them for profit isn't a domainer? A person who solely leases domain names for profit isn't a domainer? A person who buys domain names in order to develop and later sell them isn't a domainer? ONLY selling domains for profit makes you a domainer, is that what you're saying? I'd say ALL of the above makes you a domainer, regardless of your income level.

1. Domaining isn't only selling, but its about profits. This is my definition, and your definition is your definition. Both are debatable, neither is law.

2. You posted an opinion based poll.

My opinion is that there are less than 5k-10k profitable domainers. I derive this from reading about those like Rick Schwartz and Mike Mann.

For example, Rick Schwartz has owned 6K-8K domains at different times over the last few years.

Mike Mann has registered 10K domains in one day before.

As far as a source, you are on Namepros, there are plenty of threads about small numbers of domainers owning thousands of domains.

3. If a person parks or leases their domain, they would fall under my definition of Domainer. Leasing is just selling temporary access to your domain for a fee. Until a profit is realized, you are not a domainer in my book.

4. Domaining is about profits.

 

[Sam1234]

Regarding my comments above, about the IRS handling of domains, I traced the source of my information and it was rather dated. I think the IRS has issued clarifications of the matter since then, so my understanding is probably not accurate. Sorry for that, don't mean to mislead there.

 

[bmugford]

Is there a standard to define a professional domainer? Is based on numbers of domains in your portfolio that define the probability to sell valuable items and define your income that define how much you can re-invest and...loop.?

Not really, that is why I defined it in my estimate.

Before you can estimate, you need to define what it is.

Brad

 

[Jimmysun]

The most well known domainer domainking only have 6000+ followers on Twitter so I could guess less than hundred thousand domainers in the world.

 

[ForexTopNews]

So what is a domainer then? Somebody who works fulltime monetising domain names to fund all their living costs?

It's someone who generates revenue for the hosting companies, by paying exorbitant renewal fees & holding onto domains for naught.

 

[MediaCode]

Above, I differentiated between a domainer and a domain investor with:

"A "domainer" is a casual hobbyist, part-timer who attempts to earn a profit running an informal, loosely-organized portfolio of domain names but, in more years than not, fails to turn a profit on the portfolio.

A "domain investor" is a professional investor, full-timer/part-timer who attempts to earn a profit running a well-organized portfolio operation and, in more years than not, successfully turns a profit on the portfolio."

I would add that real estate investors are called real estate investors, not "real estaters". If we as investors in domain names wish to be taken seriously, we should insist on being called – and should refer to ourselves and each other as – domain investors, not "domainers".

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I may have missed it in quickly reading this discussion but someone asked about how many members of NamePros. From the site it gives 1,055,752.

Now some of those are deceased, and many are not active.

I suspect the tech folks know the actual number of active members to some degree, my guess is maybe 1/5 to 1/10 of that currently active to some degree?? I have no inside information just a guess.

I suspect that there are a few, domainers who do not have a NamePros account. And some who are not domainers but do have an account. There are many Chinese investors not on NamePros I presume, and also to some degree other non-English speaking countries.

So I would answer somewhere between a few hundred thousand and 1-2 million, if we define domainer as someone with at least 10 or so names purchased with intention to sell for profit, or make revenue from parking, etc..

Bob

 

[MasterOfMyDomains]

To many

 

[The Durfer]

domainers is a more fun name for domaining, elite domainers comes about by the sorting class of domains themselves.

 

[0frills]

So what is a domainer then? Somebody who works fulltime monetising domain names to fund all their living costs?

I'd say, he may or may not work fulltime monetising domain names to fund their living costs, rather someone who buys domains, to simply sell them for profit sometime in the future, without really adding any value to the domain, like creating a website or a product around it.

 

[Sam1234]

I think there are probably around 1000 professional domainers at any time, most of whom can be found on Namepros (possibly not counting people with established businesses like HD) at various times. And maybe 100,000 investors who are just holding one or more names they picked up in the past, though I consider these people to be investors and not domainers.

 

[Recons.Com]

Let's assume absolute majority of domain investors would list their names on Afternic.

There are 22MM names listed there. Let's further assume around 60% of those names are in the hands of 100 largest investors, including HD, BD, GD, DM etc. That leaves only around 9MM names left for small and medium investors.

Now, if we assume the average holding is 100 to 1000 (excluding those 100 top guys), then the range of the domain investor number would be 9000 to 90000.

 

[Sam1234]

I would add that real estate investors are called real estate investors, not "real estaters". If we as investors in domain names wish to be taken seriously, we should insist on being called – and should refer to ourselves and each other as – domain investors, not "domainers".

The IRS defines an investor as (something like) a person who is not engaged in business/commerce, but buys an item to hold with the idea that it will go up. When an investor makes money that money is recorded as capital gains rather than business income, and is exempt from Self-Employment Tax. Domainers in general are classified in this way because domains are viewed by the IRS as intellectual property, not "inventory". So I view an investor as "anyone holding a domain as an investment", while I view a domainer as someone who is actively engaged in the business of domain buying and selling, as a business (though in either case the classification is the same to the IRS). This is just how I view things but may not be in line with how the terms are typically used by domain peeps.

Really it should be up to the person asking the question, "how many domainers are there" to define what they mean by the term. If they are asking the question while at the same time asking, "what is a domainer", that might be the kind of thing that would expose them to a lot of anonymous downvotes.

None of the above is tax advice, nor should it be viewed as such. Neither am I qualified to give tax advice. I am just stating my own understanding of the matter.

 

[bmugford]

Has anyone ever ran into another "domainer" in their every day life? I have not.

I don't think the number is in the millions, otherwise you would run into them far more often.

Brad

 

[bmugford]

How many people have YOU told that you dabble in domains? Think about it. It's not something you'd say on a date, or to the cops, or at the store, or at the football. In fact outside of this forum I have very rarely mentioned it to anyone. So, tell me something interesting about yourself, Rob? Well I collect these digital names other people don't want and build electronic empires and talk about it on a forum neh heh heh. How cool am I? You're dumped.

F.Y.I. @Bravo Mod Team I'm not being antagonistic, rude, off-handed or instigating. This is my tone and I have made a legitimate point.

Many times. What you do is a frequent topic when you meet someone.

Believe it or not, having the freedom to work from anywhere, having no boss, and being able to set your own schedule frequently leads to a productive conversation. That is what most people would love to do.

Brad