.tv How can there be a market for a class of domains

[localexperts]

when the following happens:

1) Daytona.tv - Sold at auction for $900. Some lite interest
2) Dayton.tv - Sold at SEDO auction for similiar price - No interest
3) Frank sold NewportBeach.tv, Raleigh.tv, Wichita.tv, and VirginiaBeach.tv for less than $1,000 each.
4) KC.tv, Louisville.tv, FortLauderdale.tv - sat as unregged premiums 24 hours after the release at $1,000/year
5) Boise.tv, BatonRouge.tv, Madison.tv - still sit unregged at ENOM for $1,000/year

Therefore, my hypothesis is that there true value of GEO .TV domains is less than $2,000 now (probably more like $1,000) that the seller side of the equation has run dry.

Does someone have data (other than two people buying) to support a different hypothesis.

I didn't start this little debate, but when I get personally drug into the debate I'm more than happy to throw out my opinion.

 

[SKG]

when the following happens:

1) Daytona.tv - Sold at auction for $900. Some lite interest
2) Dayton.tv - Sold at SEDO auction for similiar price - No interest
3) Frank sold NewportBeach.tv, Raleigh.tv, Wichita.tv, and VirginiaBeach.tv for less than $1,000 each.
4) KC.tv, Louisville.tv, FortLauderdale.tv - sat as unregged premiums 24 hours after the release at $1,000/year
5) Boise.tv, BatonRouge.tv, Madison.tv - still sit unregged at ENOM for $1,000/year

Therefore, my hypothesis is that there true value of GEO .TV domains is less than $2,000 now (probably more like $1,000) that the seller side of the equation has run dry.

Does someone have data (other than two people buying) to support a different hypothesis.

I didn't start this little debate, but when I get personally drug into the debate I'm more than happy to throw out my opinion.

Geo domains were being regged prior to you regging geo domains and they will continue to be regged after. Understand the difference between average sale price and median sale price. Just because something sold too low or two high does not make the market. Interest and awareness of geo domains in .TV increasing and I really doubt that will change whether in .tv or any other extension for that matter. Interest in Geo domains in .TV began before any of the purchases mentioned above.

In regards to the three cities left unregged, well there are currently 51,375 available .TV premiums available to register at this very moment does that mean .TV is on a downward spiral?

 

[TheBulldog]

I will just say this: Until Verisign puts out a definitive statement about the renewal prices, AND, this extremely stupid premium pricing is eliminated, names like these will continue to sit unregged.

Yes, people will sporadically pick names up, but the proof is in the pudding. Domainers are just very leary of a tld that doesn't have specific renewal rates. Could there and should there be a viable and active market for geo tv;s? Most definateley yes. Geo names should be huge right now. TV stations should be falling over themselves to buy up show names. People should be buying their names to make sure no one else gets them.


/crickets chirp

 

[MillersCrossing]

I will just say this: Until Verisign puts out a definitive statement about the renewal prices, AND, this extremely stupid premium pricing is eliminated, names like these will continue to sit unregged.

Yes, people will sporadically pick names up, but the proof is in the pudding. Domainers are just very leary of a tld that doesn't have specific renewal rates. Could there and should there be a viable and active market for geo tv;s? Most definateley yes. Geo names should be huge right now. TV stations should be falling over themselves to buy up show names. People should be buying their names to make sure no one else gets them.


/crickets chirp

Yep...Im happy I got my first and last name......James is still available at $1750 a year....wat too much for me....but I would have gone higher than the bid that ended Smashes auction for Jack.at $50 a year..........

As for this putting out a definitive statement stuff....DM had every word approved by Verisign before they returned their responses to the Allthings.TV interview....I think I asked the same question five different ways just to clear up on the fact that once a premium is bought it will not go up unless and until it is dropped, then Verisign has the option to both raise and lower the premium fee depending on how much pot they are smoking that particular day..........

Yes, it should be made clear on the home page of both Verisign and DM, but look at it this way......all those who read the interview are "in the know" so to speak.....

The outside world are still worried about the pricing....we need NOT worry....we ae taking the risk that bigger companies are not taking -YET.....once the word gets out to the public that the premium pricing is stable...then we should see a huge increase in regging for that fact alone...not just because .TVs will be more in the public eye....

 

[DomainAgency.com]

Domainers are just very leary of a tld that doesn't have specific renewal rates. Could there and should there be a viable and active market for geo tv;s? Most definateley yes. Geo names should be huge right now. TV stations should be falling over themselves to buy up show names. People should be buying their names to make sure no one else gets them.

Longterm the renewal issue is a non factor as far as the money that will be made from these names. Demand Media will not raise prices on .TV premium names under current ownership. never has happened to date and Quinn recently addressed this issue again.

The issue isn't that those geos names are unreged because of price. The issue is pure and simple awareness. I have already gotten multiple offers on geos that I picked up when premiums were once again available for twice what I paid. Sure that is only 2K for the 1K names, but the point is people asked me directly "How the heck did you get that name?" MOST PEOPLE STILL HAVE NO IDEA HOW YOU CAN GET PREMIUMS AND HOW TO SEE IF THEY ARE AVAILABLE. This is a fact. Once .TV continues to gain popularity and people start to understand how to get premium names more and more will disappear. Right now the awareness is not there which bodes well for the people who go in early. If you published the fact the you could buy batonrouge.tv in the business section of the baton Rouge newspaper and explained how and why you can use the domain, it would be taken by someone immediately IMO (TV station or not). The point is unless you really look hard and are in the know, you simply go to sites like godaddy and search and see it is gone in every TLD. Most people think there is no way in this day and age that these names are still available.

A case in point, the name E.TV was available during the recent online.tv drop. It was 10K per year which for a company like E! Entertainment TV is peanuts. Well it was avail for about two weeks before someone else took it. If that company did know why wouldn't they have reged it? This happens more and more.

When I tell most people about my geo names that don't know the domain biz, they are equally shocked that I got them at the price I paid which for a name like palmsprings.tv costs me only $500 per year, and the fact that it was available to register in 2007.

 

[equity78]

It looks like our own Johntv put up the $10,000 for E.tv

 

[MillersCrossing]

It looks like our own Johntv put up the $10,000 for E.tv

big kahunas John has!! What a name though!!

 

[Dr. Mindwrecker]

when the following happens:

Therefore, my hypothesis is that there true value of GEO .TV domains is less than $2,000 now (probably more like $1,000) that the seller side of the equation has run dry.

.

No offense but this makes no sense...

What is the point of this post?
How do you calculate all geo.tvs at a baseline/ceiling price?

 

[xiuyan]

Very great~!
Keep up the great work~!

 

[DomainAgency.com]

The geo market is very fluid and is moving up quickly.

Another case in point:

detroit.tv was bought by NP member wlmdi at the beginning of the year for approx. $1,500 and the name has no premium fees.

I know at least 5 people willing to pay him 2 1/2 times that today and I have it on good authority that a TV station offered him high xxxx for it already shortly after purchase and this is only in a half a years time. Just wait a year from now people will look at the prices today like 5K for cincinnati.tv as steals IMO and thats without the major development that will be going on in the geo.tv space which will only drive the names even higher.

The sales that George posts about:

Frank sold NewportBeach.tv, Raleigh.tv, Wichita.tv, and VirginiaBeach.tv for less than $1,000 each.

were done around the same time period as the detroit.tv sale. That market is ancient history. Ask Frank if he would make those same sales today? My guess knowing that he could easily triple his money in today's market, his answer would be "no".

 

[hullswingerscom]

am new to domains and trying to suppor the dot tv but when i see so many good names not taken its a worry..
but its good to read this thread.
i have told people in my shop and at my football team/club about dot tv but apart from here no one is that interested my sons who are 14/18 have looked around me.tv but think its rubbish and just stick with ytube,i hope it does take off ,i have about 20 names.i was thinking becouse of the high reg prices of dot tv they will always be good names avalible every year as some domainers pull out,maybe this is not good?
anyway i will help support the dot tv for a few years yet and maybe on day my sons will be on a dot tv channel on there own then ill know its a winner.

 

[bras0746]

this board is a mutual back-slapping arena.

everyone on here has a vested interest in high .tv valuations so they keep making outrageously opimisitic appraisals etc and generate a false market. namepros domainers can't keep buying .TVs forever. you need some end-users and they are few and far between. yes the end users may appear sooner or later, but to assume it's sooner is just self-serving.

 

[meeks]

I agree with some of what you said bras,
But the end users are coming and some are here, look at mercedes-benz.tv or audi.tv and tell me they aren't real end users?

As for the board it has been a great source of info for me and there is a lot of knowledge on here to learn from.
To be honest I dont think "outrageously optimistic" appraisals happen here all that often.

I agree100% when you say "Namepros domainers cant keep buying .TV's forever" I think the renewal fees are too high for that therefore I think you will find a lot of these "Namepros domainers" will become developers and owners of sites before long.
There are some fantastic names owned by members here, and 1 or 2 good developed sites will pay renewal for those great names for a few years yet.

 

[RogueWriter]

this board is a mutual back-slapping arena.

everyone on here has a vested interest in high .tv valuations so they keep making outrageously opimisitic appraisals etc and generate a false market. namepros domainers can't keep buying .TVs forever. you need some end-users and they are few and far between. yes the end users may appear sooner or later, but to assume it's sooner is just self-serving.

As an affiliate marketer, I feel like I am in a win win situation. If a market develops to the point that I can resell my domains at the price level I want, hey, great. If I can't, well, I'm still going to earn money, albeit with a bit more effort, by adding to my network of affiliate sites.

Now, I might be singing a different tune if I was registering the premium domains, those folks are heavily invested with a lot to lose - but they also have much, much more to gain than I do, too.

It's a risk, but so far it seems to be paying off for a number of NPers.

 

[ownthisdomainnow]

No offense to anyone, but the solidity of the market is not based on the resale value of domains names in the first 3 months of the relaunch. I have several names, and I am sure I will get several more. I sell my names when I can, but am not worried when I think about my names in about 12 months time.

Outrageous sales reports and good products that go untouched are not a good barometer, in any business.

 

[DomainAgency.com]

The bottom line is .TV is a developers extension, If you have a plan for your names (like the geo.tv's) and you execute it, it is irrelevant what others think the current "market" is because you have created a situation in which you add quite a bit of value to the land that you purchased.

Without knowing what someone else's development plan is, or how it is being executed, the value is somewhat subjective and is based on, historical purchases in the same sector, what you think the potential for that particular piece of land is, what is already being built on similar pieces of land, and who owns those similar pieces of land which gives you an idea of the potential. The fact that a major media giant is using hamptonroads.tv as its pilot city when it owns several other major geo.tv's like atlanta.tv and seattle.tv is huge. That fact that tulsa.tv has survived and makes money with a staff of aprrox 10 people in a market the size of tulsa is huge. Boston.tv is 15 people all creating content for the city of Boston. The point is, these people are already doing it and making money and getting great exposure in their local markets. Boston.tv was written up in a nice piece in the Boston Herald. Now a company who has only used .com in the past with cityatlantic.com launched atlanticcity.tv and spent good money to do it. We are at the tip of the iceberg people and a pattern for effective use of geo.tv's in now out on the market.

I for one think the long term value of geo.tv's is staggering but in the end part of my reasoning for this feeling is because I am using my contacts in the entertainment industry to move more forward on the development end of the things.

Look at Rupert Murdoch's bid for the Wall Street Journal as a perfect example of how the overall bigger picture creates a different value for different companies based on their own development circumstances. To some his bid is too high and over valued, but obviously when you look at the new financial channel Fox is launching later this year and take into account the value that owning the Wall Street Journal Brand has to him versus others who have no vested stake in launching a financial channel, clearly the value and impact to Fox is much different based on the development plans they have.

 

[boboski]

The bottom line is .TV is a developers extension, If you have a plan for your names (like the geo.tv's) and you execute it, it is irrelevant what others think the current "market" is because you have created a situation in which you add quite a bit of value to the land that you purchased.

Without knowing what someone else's development plan is, or how it is being executed, the value is somewhat subjective and is based on, historical purchases in the same sector, what you think the potential for that particular piece of land is, what is already being built on similar pieces of land, and who owns those similar pieces of land which gives you an idea of the potential. The fact that a major media giant is using hamptonroads.tv as its pilot city when it owns several other major geo.tv's like atlanta.tv and seattle.tv is huge. That fact that tulsa.tv has survived and makes money with a staff of aprrox 10 people in a market the size of tulsa is huge. Boston.tv is 15 people all creating content for the city of Boston. The point is, these people are already doing it and making money and getting great exposure in their local markets. Boston.tv was written up in a nice piece in the Boston Herald. Now a company who has only used .com in the past with cityatlantic.com launched atlanticcity.tv and spent good money to do it. We are at the tip of the iceberg people and a pattern for effective use of geo.tv's in now out on the market.

I for one think the long term value of geo.tv's is staggering but in the end part of my reasoning for this feeling is because I am using my contacts in the entertainment industry to move more forward on the development end of the things.

Look at Rupert Murdoch's bid for the Wall Street Journal as a perfect example of how the overall bigger picture creates a different value for different companies based on their own development circumstances. To some his bid is too high and over valued, but obviously when you look at the new financial channel Fox is launching later this year and take into account the value that owning the Wall Street Journal Brand has to him versus others who have no vested stake in launching a financial channel, clearly the value and impact to Fox is much different based on the development plans they have.

Well said! Value is in the eye of the beholder.

 

[MillersCrossing]

this board is a mutual back-slapping arena.

everyone on here has a vested interest in high .tv valuations so they keep making outrageously opimisitic appraisals etc and generate a false market. namepros domainers can't keep buying .TVs forever. you need some end-users and they are few and far between. yes the end users may appear sooner or later, but to assume it's sooner is just self-serving.

That was a rather sweeping statement......"THIS BOARD"..."EVERYBODY HERE"

I will speak for myself and have already stated that at least 90% of hand regges in the last few months are a waste of money......trying desperately to find a .tv name that sounds like sense more often than not does not make sense...there is a reason it has not been registered (in 90% of the time)...because those who could have regged it did not, because they know it is just too difficult a niche to develop themselves and know the chances of resale are close to zero.....

"you need some end-users and they are few and far between"...whats your cut off point?? Cause stick .TV on google in English, spanish and german and french and italian and start counting the number of developed end user sites.......I predict a day when there will be more end user sites in SPAIN that end in .tv than .com......so many .coms are parked in Spanish, whilst the .tv extension races ahead with development year over year.....

Alot of people on this board are being forced to become pioneers of this extension because they have finnaly come to realise that it is the best hedge against their .tv portfolio to develop as many as they can......it brings in a good revenue stream if done right, offsets renewal fees for the premiums and adds to an ever growing mass of developed sites that will in time reach that most important of milestones - critical mass..................the .TV event horizon

 

[Dr. Mindwrecker]

this board is a mutual back-slapping arena.

No that is a ridiculous statement, this is not a "rubber stamp" outfit, everybody here has criticized and been criticized, and some people here flat out do not like other people on this board, and that is an understatement.

I have been her since late December 06 and have seen quite a few different positions, so that is asinine to assume everyone here is "rubber stamping" everyone else's work and regs as well as the .TV extension in general.

I am not a DOT TV original gangster like some of the people on this board but I can assure you that the interest in what is going on with .TV is increasing...

 

[TheBulldog]

this board is a mutual back-slapping arena.

.

Huh-what?

I have butted heads with so many here that I have permanent lumps on my head.