For some reason, I've been thinking of quitting domaining recently. Yeah - go figure. I'm sharing the thoughts, feel free to share yours.

[twiki]

That doesn't mean it's not making money for me. It is. But it's not record-breaking stuff. Though it has better ROI than some other stuff I have currently.

That doesn't mean it consumes a ton of my time. It doesn't - or at least not anymore. I've streamlined stuff. I can get away with as little as 15 minutes a day if I want to. OR take 2 weeks off - completely if I want.

That doesn't mean I won't be holding domain names anymore. I will - some, my best ones. The others? I'd probably either clear or let them drop.

As one of the most frequent posters in the sales thread: You didn't see this coming from me, right?

But there are reasons I'm considering it. I'm sharing my thoughts, please change my mind. Or not.

What is currently changing my ideas:

- I don't like the current status of the market. I've never seen summer days so empty - in the sales thread. And in my own sales.

I'm making a good ROI, was expected to go past 100% soon (edit: might be there already) and past 100K profit per annum - next year. But it looks as if it doesn't get there. The world is going south - economically.

Edit: 100% annual ROI is not very good in business. Stock size vs. earnings I mean It means your stock rotation time is 6 months, which is not great. Say I have $50k in domains, I make $100k in sales, pocket $50k, that's 100% ROI and 6 months rotation.

- It does require investment. Money you keep locked in your names.

So for example with Dotible (my recent project in the sig) I have low costs and high margin - just like most tech startups would do. Domains aren't that. To make $100k you probably need $50k -$100k in assets (unless you are one of the older top domainers who have very good names).

I'd rather swing my investment towards less risk, more reward areas. Such as tech projects as the aforementioned one.

- It's a positive-feedback business, economically. That's not good right now. What I mean here is: If the economy prospers, you get more money; but if things go south, less domains are being sold. That's the positive feedback. And the downtrend has been already visible in 2022 although the business is still working and some are going quite well. But not everyone.

Things are going south worldwide as you know. I can see the writing on the wall.

In such times, good business is either 1) corporate that is solid and won't probably be touched, 2) small business but with very small cost and overhead, you just simply go ahead, or 3) negative feedback ones.

Example for 3: Repairs, pawn shops/loans or whatnot - anything a person would need in times when cash is low so they need to save or borrow etc. Domains are not of this kind.

I'm thinking of cutting a lot of the overhead, keep a minimal portfolio, have it automated... then off to new things and especially one meeting above criteria: negative feedback business OR high margin / in demand stuff, or catering to enterprise customers that would continue to be just fine in such times.

So what do you think? About what I posted above. Feel free to approve it, or criticize this, or maybe offer me some ideas (hopefully) and most importantly share your thoughts. They will be appreciated nevertheless.

P.S. Oh, and please note I'm also not scared or a quitter or whatnot. I do have good planing in general in business, and my instincts and experience tell me this is a turning point. Now. End of August 2022.

 

[Reddstagg]

Existentialism.horse.... - .wtf

I guess it is the thrill of the chase...like a beautiful woman...and now you have her and yet you tire of the everyday monotony...she's a 9 out of 10 but such high maintenance...phew!!!

Life can sometimes make no sense at all or it makes complete sense. There are too many tragic tales through history of those that thought that they were on to the next big thing, a sure fire hit. A dead cert. Do you know who really made the money during the gold rush? The guy selling picks and shovels. Go figure..right.

You're probably a bit bored too. It happens. I'd say get better and richer (if that is your true motivation) doing what you already know and aspire to go on to greater things. Life is too short to worry about what may have been or what opportunities you may miss out on.

Personally, I wake up every day and the first thing I think of is domains and it is the last thing that I do everyday. Check one last time whether I've made a sale or not. The adrenaline keeps me hard...at it. I love everything about it. It is what drives me to become totally financially independent and never having to go back to working for a living. This isn't work. Its way too much fun.

Sometimes in life you just have to take your foot off the gas for a while and slow down a little and stop and smell the roses and reflect truly on what is important and what is not.

Everyone has their own journey and as we have never walked a mile in your shoes we can only guess the journey that brought you to where you are today. We should be grateful for the opportunity that being a domain name investor gives us and maybe if you are not happy anymore then you should just go and do something else. Be a llama farmer or a beekeeper but do it well and wake each day and just be happy.

The only guarantee in this life is that there are no guarantees.

Rgrds,

Redd

 

[jhm]

Appreciate you sharing your position @twiki. I admire you posting something like this. The point you're at in your life matters. Other things are becoming a priority for you. You mention going the tech route, investing in tech projects that you feel are worthwhile. I love that. You know best about the inner workings of your business, you may feel it would be productive (or better) easing off with some of your domain activities. When it comes to domains, I can tell you I've dropped my portfolio significantly, and will allocate capital to a small handful of quality domains, that I feel are worthwhile in biotech (to keep). Its private, still need to put the money in place. I'll be able to talk about it at some point. You aren't a quitter, you're simply doing what you feel is right

 

[twiki]

Existentialism.horse.... - .wtf

I guess it is the thrill of the chase...like a beautiful woman...and now you have her and yet you tire of the everyday monotony...she's a 9 out of 10 but such high maintenance...phew!!!

Life can sometimes make no sense at all or it makes complete sense. There are too many tragic tales through history of those that thought that they were on to the next big thing, a sure fire hit. A dead cert. Do you know who really made the money during the gold rush? The guy selling picks and shovels. Go figure..right.

You're probably a bit bored too. It happens. I'd say get better and richer (if that is your true motivation) doing what you already know and aspire to go on to greater things. Life is too short to worry about what may have been or what opportunities you may miss out on.

Personally, I wake up every day and the first thing I think of is domains and it is the last thing that I do everyday. Check one last time whether I've made a sale or not. The adrenaline keeps me hard...at it. I love everything about it. It is what drives me to become totally financially independent and never having to go back to working for a living. This isn't work. Its way too much fun.

Sometimes in life you just have to take your foot off the gas for a while and slow down a little and stop and smell the roses and reflect truly on what is important and what is not.

Everyone has their own journey and as we have never walked a mile in your shoes we can only guess the journey that brought you to where you are today. We should be grateful for the opportunity that being a domain name investor gives us and maybe if you are not happy anymore then you should just go and do something else. Be a llama farmer or a beekeeper but do it well and wake each day and just be happy.

The only guarantee in this life is that there are no guarantees.

Rgrds,

Redd

True, and well said.

I am not bored, will always have an interest in domains. But hmm, there are other avenues now. Which have always been there, however I waited a lot until taking the plunge.

TBH the main factor is still economy. I don't like gliding on a downwards slope, like I felt the market in 2022. I don't like having an car when there's a flood and you are probably going to need a boat. In some ways, that's how I sense domaining right now, domaining as a business not just a side gig (I'm okay with that).

That's probably my main turnoff right now. Perhaps a bit too much skin in the game, expecting smaller results in the future - for the reasons I have discussed. IT always felt growing growing for years, well in 2022 it definitely went in the opposite direction

 

[twiki]

Appreciate you sharing your position @twiki. I admire you posting something like this, quite genuine

The point you're at in your life matters. Other things are becoming a priority for you. You mention going the tech route, investing in tech projects that you feel are worthwhile. I love that. You know best about the inner workings of your business, you may feel it would be productive (or better) easing off with some of your domain activities. When it comes to domains, I can tell you I've dropped my portfolio significantly, and will allocate capital to a small handful of quality domains, that I feel are worthwhile in biotech (to keep). Its private, still need to put the money in place. I'll be able to talk about it at some point. You aren't a quitter, you're simply doing what you feel is right

I have been downsizing too. Intensively but not aggressively. Rather let them expire naturally and focused on less, more pinpoint buys.

Will see where this goes... So far the results have been good. I just have a less satisfactory feeling about the future right now.

 

[Reddstagg]

True, and well said.

I am not bored, will always have an interest in domains. But hmm, there are other avenues now. Which have always been there, however I waited a lot until taking the plunge.

TBH the main factor is still economy. I don't like gliding on a downwards slope, like I felt the market in 2022. I don't like having an car when there's a flood and you are probably going to need a boat. In some ways, that's how I sense domaining right now, domaining as a business not just a side gig (I'm okay with that).

That's probably my main turnoff right now. Perhaps a bit too much skin in the game, expecting smaller results in the future - for the reasons I have discussed. IT always felt growing growing for years, well in 2022 it definitely went in the opposite direction

But what if you could have a car that was also a boat and a boat that was also a car!!! I think that we can ride out the downturn in the economy and just keep doing what we do. The pandemic was a major hurdle for us all and I'd guess like many I just rolled up my sleeves, pivoted a little and got through to the other side. In truth, I don't think it will get much worse if at all and that only means one thing...everything from here on in goes in one direction...UP. In two years time you will be selling lie you didn't have a care in the world and you will look back and wonder what all the fuss was about. We're still here. We're still standing.

I'm more excited about the future now than I was a couple of years ago when I really didn't have a Scooby Doo (clue) what I was doing. I figured it out, set forth a plan and I put it into action.

There are too many tales of woe but your success gave hope to many that there was light at the end of the tunnel which wasn't a train coming to run us down.

You could always start investing in hyphenated names LOL. Now, there is a challenge.

Rgrds,

Redd

 

[twiki]

But what if you could have a car that was also a boat and a boat that was also a car!!! I think that we can ride out the downturn in the economy and just keep doing what we do. The pandemic was a major hurdle for us all and I'd guess like many I just rolled up my sleeves, pivoted a little and got through to the other side. In truth, I don't think it will get much worse if at all and that only means one thing...everything from here on in goes in one direction...UP. In two years time you will be selling lie you didn't have a care in the world and you will look back and wonder what all the fuss was about. We're still here. We're still standing.

I'm more excited about the future now than I was a couple of years ago when I really didn't have a Scooby Doo (clue) what I was doing. I figured it out, set forth a plan and I put it into action.

There are too many tales of woe but your success gave hope to many that there was light at the end of the tunnel which wasn't a train coming to run us down.

You could always start investing in hyphenated names LOL. Now, there is a challenge.

Rgrds,

Redd

There are always new avenues and things to try out, even within domaining.

I guess what drives you is most important. My drivers might be changing right now. But I will always continue to be a domainer even if I'll do it as a side gig. The knowledge you have, stays with you.

I see developing the domains into a website right now a more attractive option. It takes time but low investment. It also takes time until it gets profitable, but once you get there it can be a steady source without significant amounts locked in. With names, I'd rater focus on long hold, keep the best and look to renew for a few years maybe until they sell - to the right end buyer.

There are always more possibilities than things we get to actually try.

 

[enterscope]

Domaining is a long game. Quick profits are possible, but not for your average domainer.

 

[lovely4ever]

- I don't like the current status of the market. I've never seen summer days so empty - in the sales thread. And in my own sales.

This is what really depressing , The current market bad and foggy situation , leading to very slow or no results in domain sales , as we see in sales thread no actions and excitements like it was before .
This main fatcor to depress you and let you think to change the direction .

.

 

[DomainNature]

If you feel doing something else it's time to shift, the world will not get better but worse, there are reasons for all that happens today in the world, I personally plan to learn programming as a side job, I see some people even locally make allot.
I plan to build my own true secure browser, search engine, social media, chat and email, I have the perfect domains but not the programing skills.
Go buy a bike take some rides, only don't buy electric ones, I personally think they are for lazy people and long distances, bicycles are made so you train the body but not sit and grow your belly.

 

[twiki]

This is what really depressing , The current market bad and foggy situation , leading to very slow or no results in domain sales , as we see in sales thread no actions and excitements like it was before .
This main fatcor to depress you and let you think to change the direction .

.

I would not label it as depressing.

However it is definitely a situation that leads to temporary inability to create projections. (Edit: Predictability is vital for any business). But of course, for some domainers who had worse results than me, it could even be very depressing.

One thing is clear though - in the world, things aren't going up.

And in business, there is no static situation. You're either going up, or going down. Same is with the economy.

And to me it is really not looking as if it's going up anytime soon.

 

[twiki]

If you feel doing something else it's time to shift, the world will not get better but worse, there are reasons for all that happens today in the world, I personally plan to learn programming as a side job, I see some people even locally make allot.
I plan to build my own true secure browser, search engine, social media, chat and email, I have the perfect domains but not the programing skills.
Go buy a bike take some rides, only don't buy electric ones, I personally think they are for lazy people and long distances, bicycles are made so you train the body but not sit and grow your belly.

This is cool, but programming-wise I'd suggest refrain. I have 30 years of coding behind and owned a software dev house back in the days, so I kinda have an idea about how things are in this field.

Professional level programming is NOT as easy to learn as it appears. I'd say it takes a minimum of 5 years to get anywhere near that. Guys who throw some Node.js or Laravel and voila' - something is made - don't really acquire the skills to build something of that magnitude in an year or two of dabbling. Most never do. ( Edit: those makeshift applications tend to have various issues, such as for example poor security; even that aspect in itself takes years to master.)

Building your own secure browser and search engine? Those are some daunting tasks for the best coders out there. I've worked years on my own search tech and never got anywhere, as it is extremely daunting. I do however have an clear idea as to how I could build that, if ever.

Try having 10 years of solid programming behind, be a full stack dev (one stack at least) before even thinking about that.

I'd start by building some websites and go from there. Perhaps do some changes or add some features via code first. Or leverage /resell /repack some service from another firm (easy).

 

[redemo]

You might be over-thinking this mate. Take a chill pill on your domaining and go out into the world. Find a hot chick, buy a VW camper and go explore. Doesn't need to be over-analysed.

 

[twiki]

You might be over-thinking this mate. Take a chill pill on your domaining and go out into the world. Find a hot chick, buy a VW camper and go explore. Doesn't need to be over-analysed.

This is some good general advice, that can generally be very useful - thanks.

However, by analyzing your brief analysis, I've came to the conclusion that I'm not over-analyzing too much. I might have to spend some time analyzing the result of my latest analysis to draw some deeper conclusions though.

Joke aside, I'm on the track with VW camper thing already, or something similar.
Buying a mountain spot and building a house there in the ideal place on Earth for me.

Nah, I'm not over-analyzing. I'm not even worried - and I do relax enough on a daily basis. It's something else. But self-check duly done as per your "notification".

As a business person, I've learned over the years that everything can be made or broke by timing. And often it's easier, faster and better to switch lanes rather than staying one that puts you in slow motion or (God forbid) grinds you to a halt.

I run this like a business, sorry but that's what I am (long time multiple SMB owner) and can't help it. Well planning and projections are part of the "day job". I'm seeing where it all goes and this seems to be an appropriate conclusion for the time being.

More its like I'm seeing a lot anyway and my mind is an analytic engine that cannot be shut off, not that it impedes or affects my functioning in any way; but rather it's the way I am, and I feel good like that.

If you look at my posts, they are generally elaborate and with great detail, lots of analysis. So it's rather a personal trait, which works well for me and not an issue caused by worries or something.

Sort of moving my domaining from all-in, to a side gig. The latter being actually the thing you'd do if you buy a camper van and go explore. So in some ways, I'm already doing that - what you suggested.

 

[redemo]

If you look at my posts, they are generally elaborate and with great detail, lots of analysis. So it's rather a personal trait, which works well for me and not an issue caused by worries or something.

Which is why you'd make the perfect blogger on some of your developed domain names .....

 

[Laguna]

Try putting yourself in my shoes lol. Over 4 years and not even a lowball offer or fake offer. I'm constantly on here or twitter trying to get exposure for my names . I know everyone says patience but I've had a few of these names from the beginning. And yes there's a lot of crap there too but a few of them should have received some kind of offer by now. It's demoralising and hard to keep pressing on for zero reward. I'm extremely busy at work too so don't have much time to do any more than I already do. I admit I only have 6 I will renew forever or until sold . Anyway back to the day job for me. Hope you guys have a fantastic day

 

[zomainhacks]

Sort of moving my domaining from all-in, to a side gig.

Seeing even you "kinda quitting" is very depressing, BTW market changes and it's completely rational looking for less volatile and more rewarding investments.

Wish you all the best for your projects

 

[twiki]

Seeing even you "kinda quitting" is very depressing, BTW market changes and it's completely rational looking for less volatile and more rewarding investments.

Wish you all the best for your projects

Hey, don't be depressed. That was not my intent anyway.

It's not like I don't make money. I do.

But I'm also aware this is not the same as it was 1-2 years ago.

Who knows what the future holds. I'm just preemptive due to my business-formed instinct. (might be right, might be wrong)

The biggest problem I see now for my model is that clearance doesn't work anymore. I clear better and better names and get fewer and fewer sales, close to 0 in the last months.

But other domainers are still making good money and each one's portfolio is different. I'm talking just about my particular case and thoughts.

 

[ResoluteDomains]

Hey, don't be depressed. That was not my intent anyway.

It's not like I don't make money. I do.

But I'm also aware this is not the same as it was 1-2 years ago.

Who knows what the future holds. I'm just preemptive due to my business-formed instinct. (might be right, might be wrong)

The biggest problem I see now for my model is that clearance doesn't work anymore. I clear better and better names and get fewer and fewer sales, close to 0 in the last months.

But other domainers are still making good money and each one's portfolio is different. I'm talking just about my particular case and thoughts.

You are absolutely correct -- its not the same as it was. I know exactly where you're coming from.

I dont know what it is, blame it on the global pandemic or the globally depressed economy. I really dont know. All I know is I've been in this domaining business for 22 years and never, ever have I experienced over a year of no sales. Last sale (was a lease) was April 2021. Before that August 2020. TONS of inquiries though. Same number, perhaps slightly lower number of inquiries but sales - gone. Its a stage-1 drought.

Some give advice to do outbound. I have never done outbound in 22 years and wont start now. Too much chance of being labeled a spammer and domainers already get a bad rap for being "squatters". So no, no outbound. I've always done very well, happily well, listing domains at marketplaces and auction sites. It doesnt seem to be working anymore. My names arent stellar domain names but they're also not pigeon crap either. The fact that they receive what I perceive to be legitimate offers tells me they're worth something, but not $10 or even $100. LOL.

So, I, too, have been considering exiting and that consideration didnt begin today, last month or even earlier this year. I've been contemplating it for at least a year now, waiting for the market to pick up... its beyond frustrating now.

 

[Mkt Sales Leads]

You are absolutely correct -- its not the same as it was. I know exactly where you're coming from.

I dont know what it is, blame it on the global pandemic or the globally depressed economy. I really dont know. All I know is I've been in this domaining business for 22 years and never, ever have I experienced over a year of no sales. Last sale (was a lease) was April 2021. Before that August 2020. TONS of inquiries though. Same number, perhaps slightly lower number of inquiries but sales - gone. Its a stage-1 drought.

Wow, tough going over a year of no sales - did that make it easier to decide which names to renew and drop?

Domaining can feel like a banging head against the wall venture even in the best of times

 

[Laguna]

Wow, tough going over a year of no sales - did that make it easier to decide which names to renew and drop?

Domaining can feel like a banging head against the wall venture even in the best of times

4 years is even worse

 

[twiki]

4 years is even worse

You need to get better names. Those are under any threshold.

You are absolutely correct -- its not the same as it was. I know exactly where you're coming from.

I dont know what it is, blame it on the global pandemic or the globally depressed economy. I really dont know. All I know is I've been in this domaining business for 22 years and never, ever have I experienced over a year of no sales. Last sale (was a lease) was April 2021. Before that August 2020. TONS of inquiries though. Same number, perhaps slightly lower number of inquiries but sales - gone. Its a stage-1 drought.

Some give advice to do outbound. I have never done outbound in 22 years and wont start now. Too much chance of being labeled a spammer and domainers already get a bad rap for being "squatters". So no, no outbound. I've always done very well, happily well, listing domains at marketplaces and auction sites. It doesnt seem to be working anymore. My names arent stellar domain names but they're also not pigeon crap either. The fact that they receive what I perceive to be legitimate offers tells me they're worth something, but not $10 or even $100. LOL.

So, I, too, have been considering exiting and that consideration didnt begin today, last month or even earlier this year. I've been contemplating it for at least a year now, waiting for the market to pick up... its beyond frustrating now.

There is a multitude of factors. The decline of tech market (although a bit more stable now) is affecting domaining. So is the crypto price decline, although it might not seem a direct factor.

Major tech stocks have sunk even 80% this year. Fear and uncertainty ahead.

Do the math. It's easy to see, really.

But what comes next? Nobody knows. I'm hoping for the best, but preparing for the worst. Not just with domains, with everything.

 

[bmugford]

My biggest issue is really the lack of opportunities.

In general, reseller prices are far too high for the math to work when it comes to investment.

When you finally do find a good one, Epik takes it from your account a month later, and another party gets the sale.

Brad

 

[1Darko]

@twiki - thanks for sharing your thoughts.

I'm in this game from 2015 and I can say that even if today is the end of the world I don't regret nothing. I'm maintaining a small portfolio and have no stress at all. I still like this business from day one on.

I can understand your thinking because you're on a different level than me and you have probably invested serious money in your portfolio. I would like to thank you for all your postings and your sales reports were always inspiring.
I wish you all the best whatever you'll decide to do.

 

[twiki]

@twiki - thanks for sharing your thoughts.

I'm in this game from 2015 and I can say that even if today is the end of the world I don't regret nothing. I'm maintaining a small portfolio and have no stress at all. I still like this business from day one on.

I can understand your thinking because you're on a different level than me and you have probably invested serious money in your portfolio. I would like to thank you for all your postings and your sales reports were always inspiring.
I wish you all the best whatever you'll decide to do.

I'll still hang around and post stuff. No worries

It's rather a personal decision.

And the world is not ending.