domains Doron Vermaat is a stand up guy – BrandBucket Name Sells while in Auction at Namepros

[equity78]

Doron Vermaat is a stand up guy – BrandBucket Name Sells while in Auction at Namepros
A hypothetical scenario that I wrote about last week on Namepros has become a real scenario for one high profile domainer. Namepros has become the wholesale platform for BrandBucket published and approved names. The one caveat, the name is live on BrandBucket. The worst scenario you want to have happen is for your auction to be at $31 and 80 hours left to go, and you get an email congratulations … [Read more...]

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Update:

• Here's how it works on NamePros

 

[Dnbolt]

The winner gets every name, Doron would have to transfer them, in that case it would be bad timing for him and great luck for the winner.

So basically if it happens he had to ignore BB request to transfer the domain to escrow and instead transfer it to the winning bidder then, the winning bidder transfers the domain to escrow?

 

[equity78]

@DU is correct that the auction cannot be changed after it receives a bid. However, as long as it is specified upfront exactly what the bidders will receive if a domain sells elsewhere, and therefore those bidders are agreeing to that before bidding, then everything is within the rules and fair.

Example Auction (allowed): a.com and b.com will sell to the high bidder after 72 hours. If a.com is sold elsewhere during this auction, the winning bidder will receive $500 instead. If b.com is sold elsewhere during this auction, the winning bidder will receive $300 instead.​

Unfortunately, in this situation, our moderators weren't entirely clear on how this situation should be handled at the beginning of the auction when Doron tried to add a similar disclaimer, and NamePros is taking responsibility for that mistake. As such, we're working with everyone involved to ensure this auction is handled as fairly as possible given the circumstances.

In the future, this will not be an issue because we will have clearly outlined what is and isn't allowed, and everyone (sellers, bidders, and moderators) will be on the same page.

I'll be providing more details later today. It's after 4 am here. I just woke up for a drink of water and checked in.

It's almost 5:30 am here.

 

[Justin Matmor]

For what it's worth, i'll be adding an additional name to the auction so the winner will end up with 68 published plus the proceeds of 1 sold name.

IMO the new NP rules should state that BB names that are published cannot participate in an auction. Only BB approved (unlisted/unpublished) names can participate in auctions. BB published names can participate in BIN and Make an Offer.

 

[Dnbolt]

IMO the new NP rules should state that BB names that are published cannot participate in an auction. Only BB approved (unlisted/unpublished) names can participate in auctions. BB published names can participate in BIN and Make an Offer.

Namepros is just a platform for various services. If one owns a domain name then I believe it has every right to be auctioned off by the owner without necessarily being chained by some marketplace.

 

[Justin Matmor]

IMO the new NP rules should state that BB names that are published cannot participate in an auction. Only BB approved names can be involved in auctions. BB published names can participate in BIN and Make an Offer.

Namepros is just a platform for various services. If one owns a domain name then I believe it has every right to be auctioned off by the owner.

What if you have a domain and auction it off at NP and Flippa at the same time - and the domain sells on both sites.

Who gets to keep the domain?

 

[LucidDomains]

I agree with @DU.

No offence to anybody here, but the seller would be a stand up guy in my book if he didn't inform anyone of the BB sale in the NP auction.

Then after the completion auction on NP, only then tells the NP winner, "Hey guess what, a domain sold at BB, you get the full proceeds."

Then he would definitely be a stand up guy.



P.S. (I'm sure he's a stand up guy anyway )

 

[Justin Matmor]

Doron is very very unlucky to have sold a domain on BB during this period.
I reckon he probably now regrets he has 67 other domains for sale currently selling for peanuts on NP.

 

[Dnbolt]

What if you have a domain and auction it off at NP and Flippa at the same time - and the domain sells on both sites.

Who gets to keep the domain?

Then, the person has to fulfill his/her duty. If the person fails to provide the name to any marketplace then he/she will simply face the consequence that awaits them by that marketplace.

 

[Dnbolt]

Doron is very very unlucky to have sold a domain on BB during this period.
I reckon he probably now regrets he has 67 other domains for sale currently selling for peanuts on NP.

Since when have you become his speaker? In fact it shows more credibility to himself so don't really agree with you..

 

[Justin Matmor]

Then, the person has to fulfill his/her duty. If the person fails to provide the name to any marketplace then he/she will simply face the consequence that awaits them by that marketplace.

It is obvious there is a flaw with the system - and not with the seller's actions.

 

[Justin Matmor]

Since when have you become his speaker? In fact it shows more credibility to himself so don't really agree with you..

You don't agree he is unlucky?

 

[Dnbolt]

You don't agree he is unlucky?

I think his a Domain Shepherd and should be followed.

 

[Keith DeBoer]

@DU is correct that the auction cannot be changed after it receives a bid. However, as long as it is specified upfront exactly what the bidders will receive if a domain sells elsewhere, and therefore those bidders are agreeing to that before bidding, then everything is within the rules and fair.

Example Auction (allowed): a.com and b.com will sell to the high bidder after 72 hours. If a.com is sold elsewhere during this auction, the winning bidder will receive $500 instead. If b.com is sold elsewhere during this auction, the winning bidder will receive $300 instead.​

Unfortunately, in this situation, our moderators weren't entirely clear on how this situation should be handled at the beginning of the auction when Doron tried to add a similar disclaimer, and NamePros is taking responsibility for that mistake. As such, we're working with everyone involved to ensure this auction is handled as fairly as possible given the circumstances.

In the future, this will not be an issue because we will have clearly outlined what is and isn't allowed, and everyone (sellers, bidders, and moderators) will be on the same page.

I'll be providing more details later today. It's after 4 am here. I just woke up for a drink of water and checked in.

Perfect Eric. Requiring a 'what if' scenario at the beginning of the auction is all that is needed. This avoids one-size-fits all rules that end up penalizing either the buyer or the seller.

 

[Keith DeBoer]

IMO the new NP rules should state that BB names that are published cannot participate in an auction. Only BB approved (unlisted/unpublished) names can participate in auctions. BB published names can participate in BIN and Make an Offer.

That's a simple solution.

 

[hookbox]

What happens when the auction ends at $4,000 because the buyer knowingly participated in the auction because of this sale but then the BB buyer backs out or payment doesn't clear, then what happens. What is the TOS for the buyer in that situation? Does the buyer have to honor the payment if the BB buyer backed out of the deal?

Doron seems like a nice guy but in this situation he HAS to honor the sale. He has absolutely zero choice in the matter. He owns Efty which targets domainers so if he backs out of the deal he will look like a fool and lose his business and Michael Cyger won't be to happy about that. All this "highly professional Doron" is total bullshit. Give me a break.

 

[Justin Matmor]

What happens when the auction ends at $4,000 because the buyer knowingly participated in the auction because of this sale but then the BB buyer backs out or payment doesn't clear, then what happens. What is the TOS for the buyer in that situation? Does the buyer have to honor the payment if the BB buyer backed out of the deal?

Doron seems like a nice guy but in this situation he HAS to honor the sale. He has absolutely zero choice in the matter. He owns Efty which targets domainers so if he backs out of the deal he will look like a fool and lose his business and Michael Cyger won't be to happy about that. All this "highly professional Doron" is total bullsh*t. Give me a break.

if you bothered to read the thread, the buyer has already paid and the domain has transferred. Done deal.

 

[wwwweb]

Nothing has changed, the sale price has simply added to the auction bids.

The seller still gets the credit of the sale in the additional bids.

 

[Justin Matmor]

Nothing has changed, the sale price has simply added to the auction bids. Nobody really gains, or loses.

The loser in this is the buyer who paid 3000 for one domain.

If he knew the domain was offered as part of a package on NP he could have bought the domain plus another 67 names for around $1500. Then once he transfered the names into his account, he could have given BB 30 days notice and removed the domain from BB.

 

[hookbox]

if you bothered to read the thread, the buyer has already paid and the domain has transferred. Done deal.

Where does it say that?

 

[equity78]

Where does it say that?

I don't think that got posted here Hook, I did post it on my blog because Doron let me know the BrandBucket deal was a done deal.

 

[Doron Vermaat]

What happens when the auction ends at $4,000 because the buyer knowingly participated in the auction because of this sale but then the BB buyer backs out or payment doesn't clear, then what happens. What is the TOS for the buyer in that situation? Does the buyer have to honor the payment if the BB buyer backed out of the deal?

Doron seems like a nice guy but in this situation he HAS to honor the sale. He has absolutely zero choice in the matter. He owns Efty which targets domainers so if he backs out of the deal he will look like a fool and lose his business and Michael Cyger won't be to happy about that. All this "highly professional Doron" is total bullsh*t. Give me a break.

I agree, there's no need to praise me for this. It's just standard business ethics and integrity imo. As for the domain. It has sold, not maybe sold or most likely sold. It has sold. Not sure what's not clear about that.. No need to bring one of my companies or investors into this. Seems rather irrelevant to this discussion which is about the BB aftermarket here at NP and how it can be improved for everyone involved.

 

[hookbox]

I don't think that got posted here Hook, I did post it on my blog because Doron let me know the BrandBucket deal was a done deal.

I didn't see that Ray. I only read the article and not the comments.

 

[hookbox]

I agree, there's no need to praise me for this. It's just standard business ethics and integrity imo. As for the domain. It has sold, not maybe sold or most likely sold. It has sold. Not sure what's not clear about that.. No need to bring one of my companies or investors into this. Seems rather irrelevant to this discussion which is about the BB aftermarket here at NP and how it can be improved for everyone involved.

It didn't mention anywhere on this thread or in Ray's article that the sale was a "100% done deal". I only now saw it after I read through the comments at Ray's blog.

I believe you are a nice guy and a very ethical person but I also believe you had no choice in the matter because of your company and that is why I mentioned it.

 

[equity78]

I don't think I used the word praise, I said stand up guy, I have been doing this a long time on Namepros, longer than Mr Lyon or Mr Zeiden, many have backed out for less or tried to play a game. So I kind of wrote my article from two perspectives, one as I thought it was an interesting story and something I posted as a potential scenario in a thread here, second from the perspective as a mod for over a decade. Since this story I have had comments and emails from people telling me they would have pulled a move for $2,995. Do you know how many times people try to edit auction specifics after the fact ? If it gets reported a mod can easily find out the problem because there is access to the history of the post. We have had people change auction ends after x hours to x hours plus 24.

He could have not pmmed me, just went in removed SchoolPanda.com and placed LaunchMania.com in there.

I doubt anyone would have been like "Wait SchoolPanda.com's gone"

The upside is the rules will become more clear when dealing with these kinds of auctions. There was a lot of people confused on the exact methodology.

@DU brought up a good point but BB publicly acknowledged these auctions were allowed, when all this started over a year ago I made sure to ask Michael Krell. This has been a boon for BrandBucket as a whole business model was built around, wait for a .com reg deal, register brandables submit to BrandBucket, get approved and auction on Namepros.

Now like with any method that gets overexposure the results get diluted down. I think Eric did a good job explaining that mentioning cash upfront was always allowed if done before there was a single bid.

 

[hookbox]

Quick question Ray @equity78

If the auction holder opened up a fake account or used another account to bid up the auction to guarantee he would be the high bidder just so he could then tell Namepros that the bidder backed out so he didn't have to go through with the auction. Who's to say this is not a possible scenario. Is there something in the TOS that says he has to sell to the second highest bidder? Or can he just back out and keep the sale himself?