discuss Do you ever feel bad about being a domain squatter?

[bluebox]

So I've been searching for a domain for myself (not for resell) a nice 3-letter acronym that is also be a surname.

I found around 50-ish names regged:
32 new TLDs - most aren't even resolving.
Main TLDs - .com is redirecting the rest is parked or "for sale"
ccTLDs - 10+ registered

Guess how many websites are there....
4 (cctlds)
Almost 50 domains registered and most of them is just sitting there, unused...

No wonder the rest of the world hates us.

Don't get me wrong - I know I am a hypocrite. Just the other day I used a few GD coupons to catch some domains for resale.
Still - I'm guessing 99% of 2-3 letter names and probably 90%+ of other domains is just parked/for sale.
I hate seeing names I like wasted like that...

 

[lennco]

Actually it wan't meant to be thread about domaining - but thread about the ridiculous situation when you have 90% of all registered domains parked/unused...

How many names will never ever be developed...

I'm trying to look at it from the perspective of an end user... We sit years on something we don't even use, I can understand why they hate us.

How much land/property in the world is unused but owned by someone else?
People invest in land/property for years without ever developing it, and it gets handed down to their children and so on and so on.

How is that any different?

 

[bluebox]

You guys need to beat the other identical threads in the past with the same topic. I think they went past 30 pages of endless debates. I think the old guys who had heated exchanges on this same issue, already died. LOL

Hehe
Domainer: "it's just business"
The rest of the world: "domain investors aka squatters are the cancer of the internet"
Domainer: *the outrage*... "oh, look, new extensions" *goes to register more names*

 

[discobull]

Hehe
The rest of the world: "domain investors aka squatters are the cancer of the internet"

That's incorrect. Plenty of my clients thank me and in fact ask me to find more domains for them.

Regardless, I find your position really puzzling. Besides the fact that your arguments are founded on fuzzy reasoning, it's baffling to me that you would sell domains when you so clearly believe that there's something ethically wrong with doing so. Why not just quit?

 

[forge]

 

[bluebox]

That's incorrect. Plenty of my clients thank me and in fact ask me to find more domains for them.

Regardless, I find your position really puzzling. Besides the fact that your arguments are founded on fuzzy reasoning, it's baffling to me that you would sell domains when you so clearly believe that there's something ethically wrong with doing so. Why not just quit?

Like I've said - I mostly quit but it's too addicting to stop completely LOL especially with all those $1 coupons from GD
And for the last time - I'm not against domaining but I don't like trying to find a cool name for myself (for email) and see all those parked/unused names. I don't want to spend $xxx-$xxxx just for a name for my email.

 

[RogueWriter]

It's not about domaining not being legitimate business.

It's about domains that for many, many years had just "for sale" sign.

It's also about the fact that I can't get a domain with my initials since all the good extensions are registered (and mostly unused) :P

You CAN get a domain with your initials, you just do not want to pay what those domains are worth.

There are many physical properties that are on the market for years before selling. A 9,000 square foot building in my small, rural town just sold after being on the market for two or three years. Sold for around $100K.

I was really aggravated that they would not sell that property to me 3 years ago for $500. It was just sitting there, unused.

 

[Edward Smeu]

So, in conclusion?

 

[discobull]

And for the last time - I'm not against domaining

When you read some of your comments that I've quoted below, does it surprise you to hear that people get the impression that maybe you are actually against domaining?

"No wonder the rest of the world hates us."

"But isn't it like reserving (in November) 99% seats in restaurants for a Valentine Day and trying to sell them for $xxxx? Wouldn't you be pissed on a person like that?"

"Such a monumental waste... "

"Or investors reselling land among themselves (again, never developing it) while poor farmers have to use bad quality soil..."

"So the consensus is - "as long as it makes me $$$ who cares about other people" ?"

"We sit years on something we don't even use, I can understand why they hate us."

"as an end user everytime I see parked/wasted domain I want to reach through a screen and spank the owner.."

"Seams I'm the only one who thinks that's quite wasteful..."

 

[bluebox]

So, in conclusion?

Conclusion - no one thinks that only 4 out of 50 domains used for website is a waste

Also - everyone is offended by the term "domain squatter"

 

[bluebox]

When you read some of your comments that I've quoted below, does it surprise you to hear that people get the impression that maybe you are actually against domaining?

OK, let me rephrase it - I don't HATE domainers (like some people). It's business, I get it.
BUT as an end user I hate seeing the names I want to buy registered and unused.

OK, I'm done explaining what I had in mind when I posted this thread (i.e. 4 out of 50 names in use it's just silly for me)

 

[Kate]

Domainers cannot be compared to ticket scalpers, because the supply of domain name is infinite, while tickets (or water or something else if you prefer) are a scarce resource. The only scarcity is quality. For example there is only one sex.com.

I guess I just found it ridiculous that out of 50+ registered domains only 4 are actually used for their intended purpose.
Seams I'm the only one who thinks that's quite wasteful...

Many people, including me, buy domains to develop them later. In practice, projects can remain on hold for a very long time because we all have busy lives. And I admit I have bought more domains that I will ever be able to develop.
But if I see a nice domain that is available, I grab it now. I am not going to check back in 5 years, because it will be gone by then. Then I will be whining and cursing the evil speculators. You snooze you lose.

Also, the people who complain about the scarcity of good domain names are funny sometimes, they talk like bosses and it's like they are building the next google, and they need your domains, and they will only pay $20, because a domain "costs" $10. Seriously. You don't need a premium domain for a small-time project.

 

[discobull]

BUT as an end user I hate seeing the names I want to buy registered and unused.

They are being used. Putting them up for sale is a use.

 

[RogueWriter]

Many people, including me, buy domains to develop them later. In practice, projects can remain on hold for a very long time because we all have busy lives. And I admit I have bought more domains that I will ever be able to develop.

But if I see a nice domain that is available, I grab it now. I am not going to check back in 5 years, because it will be gone by then. Then I will be whining and cursing the evil speculators. You snooze you lose.

Exactly, I literally have enough projects now to keep me busy for 20 years......but...... down the road I may be at a place financially where I can employ a few others to help me on my projects. So I add any domain that might benefit me, rather than, like you said, waiting five years to pick up the domain and pay x,xxx.

 

[bluebox]

They are being used. Putting them up for sale is a use.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one

 

[discobull]

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on this one

That's fine but whether I do or don't use it is actually irrelevant. Would you ever think of suggesting that it's immoral for someone to stock televisions for resale because they aren't watching them? How about if a guy buys a tv because he wants to put it on his rug to keep it flat but doesn't intend to ever watch it? Immoral?

I'm sorry but I continue to be baffled by the idea that you feel entitled to be angry when other people buy something that you wanted just because in your mind your use of it is more valid than theirs. To me, it just boils down to sour grapes which as far as I'm concerned is not much of a basis for a moral argument.

 

[bluebox]

I'm sorry but I continue to be baffled by the idea that you feel entitled to be angry when other people buy something that you wanted just because in your mind your use of it is more valid than theirs. To me, it just boils down to sour grapes which as far as I'm concerned is not much of a basis for a moral argument.

Sheesh
Seams like I pushed some peoples' buttons
Relax, I'm not angry

 

[johnny12]

I'm not against domaining as I hold a few domains myself but I can understand why many are as domainers don't really add any value to the end user. As an example, many people can't design a poster or a logo or whatever to save their life so are willing to pay a graphic designer to do it for them. This isn't the case with buying domains. However, we live in a capitalist society so if someone registers a domain first, they can charge whatever they want for it, just like any other commodity.

 

[ResoluteDomains]

So the consensus is - "as long as it makes me $$$ who cares about other people" ?

What are we talking about here? I cant wrap my head about statements like that.

Go to the Ford dealer and tell them to give you a car sitting on their lot "unused".
Go to the grocery store and tell them to give you that food that's just sitting there "unused".
Go to the real-estate office and tell them you want the property owner of a nice piece of land to give it to you because its sitting there "unused"

What exactly are we talking about?

Feeling guilty about making money via investments? Sorry to say it but, this is the wrong place for you then.

I certainly care about other people. Me and my family who need to eat, live under a roof, wear clothing, go to college someday and I want a little for my retirement.

Getting tired of the general public's piss poor attitude toward domain investors. Actually, toward anyone successful. Instead of asking "how can I do that", they ask "can you just give that to me?".

 

[bluebox]

Go to the Ford dealer and tell them to give you a car sitting on their lot "unused".

Wouldn't ford dealer be registrar in this case?
And you are part of a group who decided to buy all good cars in town so they can sell them for $xx mil... ?
So now most folks have to ride a bus since they cant afford a car...
or something like that

 

[alien51]

Domainers cannot be compared to ticket scalpers, because the supply of domain name is infinite, while tickets (or water or something else if you prefer) are a scarce resource. The only scarcity is quality. For example there is only one sex.com.

Yes, they are the same.

You do not scalp tickets that are not in short supply, for example the General Admission tickets on the roof deck that nobody wants.

The same way, domain names may be infinite. But you don't squat on domains that nobody wants. You squat on domains you believe is important to someone, which is therefore worth squatting for money.

Scalping and squatting, both operate in the principle that you make money by simply getting a resource ahead of everyone else even if you don't need it, with the intention of selling it back to the one who actually needs it at inflated prices for your own personal profit.

 

[discobull]

Yes, they are the same.

You do not scalp tickets that are not in short supply, for example the General Admission tickets on the roof deck that nobody wants.

The same way, domain names may be infinite. But you don't squat on domains that nobody wants. You squat on domains you believe is important to someone, which is therefore worth squatting for money.

Scalping and squatting, both operate in the principle that you make money by simply getting a resource ahead of everyone else even if you don't need it, with the intention of selling it back to the one who actually needs it at inflated prices for your own personal profit.

Oh my, you people are so dramatic. We're not talking about hoarding penicillin, we're talking about domains which are nothing more than marketing tools. I think it's worth remembering that despite all the "tragic injustice" that domainers heap upon the world, that somehow, day in day out, people still manage to hand reg domains for their businesses. Nobody actually "needs" my domains despite your contention to the contrary. If people put in the effort, they still have the option of finding something they can use at reg fee. This is obviously the case, since people are still doing it. For those that want to get better domains, or prefer not to put in the effort, the option exists to spend more money and thereby save themselves time and effort. So what?

Moreover, if domainers didn't buy domains, what do you think would happen? The small guy that bought apple.com for his personal blog in 1995 would still get approached by apple corp and a slew of others and end up selling it to them at an inflated price and the biggest players would still end up with the best domains. So, is it your belief that if I buy a domain for my own use and then sell it at a substantial markup that I'm somehow in a morally superior position than the guy that bought it for the specific purpose of reselling it?

 

[forge]

Moreover, if domainers didn't buy domains, what do you think would happen? The small guy that bought apple.com for his personal blog in 1995 would still get approached by apple corp and a slew of others and end up selling it to them at an inflated price and the biggest players would still end up with the best domains. So, is it your belief that if I buy a domain for my own use and then sell it at a substantial markup that I'm somehow in a morally superior position than the guy that bought it for the specific purpose of reselling it?

Furthermore, many successful registrars would not even exist today without domain investors. Likely the new gTLDs would have never rolled out (of course ICANN would vehemently deny this). A world without Donuts. Imagine!

(It's easy if you try.)

 

[alien51]

Oh my, you people are so dramatic.

It's not dramatic. Like i said, the "principle" is just the same, no matter what term you use: domaining, scalping, squatting, hoarding, hostage-taking.... the "concept" is the same. You are not adding "value" to the domain to justify the almost 100% inflation in the price tag. You are just capitalizing on the "need". The more that someone needs it, the more you raise the price. That's the purpose of "auctions", right ?

By the way, Somalian pirates are grabbing merchant ships off the African coast. They get paid millions in exchange for the release of the ships. It's a pretty good "investment". LOL

It only becomes "dramatic", because you humans are so emotional when it comes to terminologies.

Terminologies, are just words. The "scheme" or "business model", is the same.

 

[forge]

I think the scalper/domainer comparison is crap. Domain names are an investment. Buying tickets at face value to then scalp them is not investing, unless you call ripping off concertgoers and sports fans investing. Once the show is over, the tickets are worthless. Domains will always have at least the potential to increase in value. Until that dreaded day when all domains become a part of nostalgia.

 

[forge]

It's not dramatic. Like i said, the "principle" is just the same, no matter what term you use: domaining, scalping, squatting, hoarding, hostage-taking.... the "concept" is the same. You are not adding "value" to the domain to justify the almost 100% inflation in the price tag. You are just capitalizing on the "need". The more that someone needs it, the more you raise the price. That's the purpose of "auctions", right ?

By the way, Somalian pirates are grabbing merchant ships off the African coast. They get paid millions in exchange for the release of the ships. It's a pretty good "investment". LOL

It only becomes "dramatic", because you humans are so emotional when it comes to terminologies.

Terminologies, are just words. The "scheme" or "business model", is the same.

Somali pirates? Dude, you have a warped, truly effed up view of the world. Unbelievable.