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trademark Can you sell trademark domains if the trademark isn't globally recognized?

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Chris Hydrick

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I'm wondering if you could sell a domain such as Segway . tld?

I was informed that it wasn't globally recognized, therefor it could be sold.

This is interesting, because I thought if a domain had a trademark, you couldn't sell it. When I googled segway definition, google included that it was a trademark.

If it is not a globally recognized TM, then you am allowed to sell a TM domain?

upload_2017-11-21_3-31-4.png


Thank you in advance.
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
Explain to me in legal terms why you can't?

read the previous posts or search archives. i doubt someone will waste an hour to write it again...
 
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read the previous posts or search archives. i doubt someone will waste an hour to write it again...
I wasn't talking too you
 
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According to the Lin
Your overlooking this..... " the complainant must show that its mark has become a distinctive identifier which consumers associate with the complainant’s goods and/or services."

If mcdonalds drop their domain name and I register it and start a company using that domain name in a business that is unrelated to their goods and/or services .... they can't do anything.

When you register a trademark you have to specify what "class" your registering your trade mark in. There is hundreds of different classes. If you register that name in a unrelated class you good.


for ex: www.nickiminaj.com vs www.mypinkfriday.com

If what all thinking was true, I doubt she would be using mypinkfriday.com instead of nickiminaj.com
 
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If mcdonalds drop their domain name and I register it and start a "NEW" company using that domain name in a business that is unrelated to theirs.... they can't do anything

Say McDonalds forgets to renew and a name expires. If they want the name back, because they screwed up and you want to argue it, good luck.

You can spend all the money you want to argue it in court.
 
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Say McDonalds forgets to renew and a name expires. If they want the name back, because they screwed up and you want to argue it, good luck.

You can spend all the money you want to argue it in court.
If I was to do that and lost in court, I strongly believe it would be a morality thing. Not a legal.
 
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because you neglect the exceptions that are made for famous brands
*** my last reply before you commented

"If I was to do that and lost in court, I strongly believe it would be a morality thing. Not a legal."
 
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*** my last reply before you commented

"If I was to do that and lost in court, I strongly believe it would be a morality thing. Not a legal."

at least for german trademark law
as far as I know

you will lose based on law
and not on misfortune

--
I am not a laywer
no legal advice
 
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Even when using a trademarked name in the area of the trademark, things aren't clear cut. The trademark owner has the power to protect it as they see fit.
I had a small site with "apple" in the domain for some years, offering upgrades, repairs & servicing for Mac computers. I wasn't an "Apple Authorised Service Provider", and made it clear that I wasn't affiliated to Apple Inc. I also stated that for "in warranty" repairs the user should contact Apple, and I provided a link to Apple's own service page.
I'm sure Apple was aware of my site, but I think they saw that it was just a local guy fixing their "out of warranty" Macs.
 
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Even when using a trademarked name in the area of the trademark, things aren't clear cut. The trademark owner has the power to protect it as they see fit.
I had a small site with "apple" in the domain for some years, offering upgrades, repairs & servicing for Mac computers. I wasn't an "Apple Authorised Service Provider", and made it clear that I wasn't affiliated to Apple Inc. I also stated that for "in warranty" repairs the user should contact Apple, and I provided a link to Apple's own service page.
I'm sure Apple was aware of my site, but I think they saw that it was just a local guy fixing their "out of warranty" Macs.


what are ou trying to prove
just because nobody sued you
that doesn't mean its legal
 
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Debating selling or using trademark names like this, even if it is borderline shows why as with all things in life a few people mess it up for the rest. The few ruin PR and misrepresent the rest of the populace.

The Domain investor industry is on the fringe, first reaction with many people you meet when asked what you do their response is “So you are a cyber squatter”.

Just like what the media portrays this sometimes. So we all become lumped together as domain name squatters. Only these stories of squatting make it to the public eye and main stream news. Now, add in trademark infringement, and another black eye.

I see the globalization of business and of the UDRP, bringing more risk to legitimate domains and trademarks registered worldwide and coming from anywhere and like some guy in Denmark selling flowers wants to take Queen(.)com from US based Rick Schwartz.

I have been reading many clear violations of TM in UDRP reading lately and see as John pointed out most of the arbitration is against clear violations. Tons of domains transferred to the TM owner corp used to sell fake Viagra, fake gucci purses, ipad/iphone traffic names, typo squatting, etc.

Segway is a trademark. Never should have been registered or sold imho.
 
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what are ou trying to prove
just because nobody sued you
that doesn't mean its legal
I just thought it might be relevant to the conversation. I think that buying or selling trademark names is asking for trouble. I regged the name before I knew much about domaining. This was perhaps an example of how the trademark owner might have used discretion, and didn't demand that I take the site down or relinquish the name.. probably because I was offering a service on their machines, and definitely wasn't making much money out of it :xf.smile:
 
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I just thought it might be relevant to the conversation. I think that buying or selling trademark names is asking for trouble. I regged the name before I knew much about domaining. This was perhaps an example of how the trademark owner might have used discretion, and didn't demand that I take the site down or relinquish the name.. probably because I was offering a service on their machines, and definitely wasn't making much money out of it :xf.smile:

most probably they didn't sue you
as they didn't come to notice you

now please pay a lawyer a few thousand USD s
and only after that
come back to the discussion

or get a a legal degree
whatever you may choose

- I have done version 1

--

I am no lawyer
no legal advice
 
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Even when using a trademarked name in the area of the trademark, things aren't clear cut. The trademark owner has the power to protect it as they see fit.
I had a small site with "apple" in the domain for some years, offering upgrades, repairs & servicing for Mac computers. I wasn't an "Apple Authorised Service Provider", and made it clear that I wasn't affiliated to Apple Inc. I also stated that for "in warranty" repairs the user should contact Apple, and I provided a link to Apple's own service page.
I'm sure Apple was aware of my site, but I think they saw that it was just a local guy fixing their "out of warranty" Macs.
The issue with what you did was you used their likeliness to make money. Whether you did or not, that is how they got you. I use to hire an art studio/design agency with the word apple in their domain for years. And they are still up and running with no issues.

If you use apple in your name and make money without using "Apples likeliness" you will be ok.

The Beatles sued Steve Jobs about "apple" because he made a big mistake by telling the world he chose the apple name because of his love for the Beatles. :)
 
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I think this sums it up pretty well.


In 2003 the United States signed the Madrid Protocol
treaty permitting the holders of U.S. trademark applications and/or registrations to extend their U.S. trademark rights globally into over 80 countries around the world simply by filing requests to do so through the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. Although the treaty dramatically simplified the process of protecting U.S. trademarks internationally, it did not create the mythical global trademark as many believe. In that regard, here are a few tips that every U.S. trademark holder should know about the current state of protecting their U.S. trademarks abroad in today’s global marketplace:

1. There is No “Global Trademark”
First, there is no “global trademark” that can be used to protect your trademark in every country around the world. Although treaties have been entered making it easier for trademark owners to extend protection of their trademarks into other countries, the world’s trademark systems remain largely separate and maintained on a country-by-country basis.

The myth of the global trademark most likely emanates from the Madrid Protocol system and how trademark rights are extended through the World Intellectual Property Office’s (“WIPO”) clearing house for trademarks. In short, when you apply for international protection of your U.S. trademark through the Madrid Protocol system you effectively extend your U.S. rights to WIPO’s global trademark clearing house located in Geneva, Switzerland. When this occurs, you receive an international certificate of registration which, in and of itself, is relatively affordable. However, that certificate does not protect your trademark in all of the countries of the world or even the countries that have signed on to the Madrid Protocol treaty. Rather, once received, this “international registration” is used to extend your U.S. trademark into the other member nations of the Madrid Protocol that you select.

As such, under the Madrid Protocol, a U.S. trademark holder does receive an “international registration” but this is not effective to protect its trademark in the other member nations until the trademark is specifically extended into those countries by the trademark holder. Each country, in turn, has a fee for such extension.

Thus, under the Madrid Protocol it is easy to extend your U.S. trademark internationally on a country-by-country basis. But the myth of the global trademark remains just that, a myth.

2. Extending Your U.S. Trademark Under the Madrid Protocol
Although there is no one global trademark, U.S. trademark owners can still extend their U.S. trademarks easily and affordably under the Madrid Protocol into more than 80 countries worldwide. To do so, U.S. trademark holders need to:

a. Own a U.S. trademark application or registration;
b. Be a U.S. citizen, a U.S. business entity, or have a real and effective presence in the U.S., and
c. Know which specific countries in which they would like protection that are part of the Madrid Protocol. For a list of those countries Click Here.

An application to extend their U.S. trademark rights may then be made with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office directly seeking protection in specific countries who have also signed the Madrid Protocol.

3. Additional Information About the Madrid Protocol
The Madrid Protocol has vastly simplified the international protection of trademarks. However, trademark owners should be aware of a few important facts when extending their rights under Madrid.

a. Filing Fees are Non-Refundable: As with a U.S. application, the government and/or organizational filing fees to extend your trademark under Madrid are non-refundable. As such, it is highly recommended that you have a professional Research Reportconducted to search the U.S. and international records of the countries in which protection is sought prior to filing for the same to make sure the trademark is available for you to be registered;

b. The 5-Year Rule: As mentioned above, a U.S. trademark holder may extend protection of either their U.S. application or registration filed or registered with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. When doing so, however, be advised that for the first 5 years extensions of protection under the Madrid Protocol rely on the continued existence of the underlying U.S. trademark application or registration. As such, if your trademark application gets refused in the U.S. or otherwise becomes abandoned you will need to convert any requested extension under the Madrid Protocol into a nationalized or direct application with that country’s intellectual property office in which an extension was sought. Typically this is easy to do. However, additional costs apply.

c. Examination by Foreign Trademark Offices: It should also be noted that just because you request an extension of protection of your U.S. trademark into a foreign country through the Madrid Protocol it does not mean that you will automatically receive protection therefore. The foreign trademark office, like the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office, will, upon receiving your requested extension, examine your request to determine if your trademark is entitled to protection in that country. This may result in your trademark being registered in that country wherein you will receive a document known as a Grant of Protection or it could involve having your trademark refused on procedural or substantive grounds.

4. Protection in Non-Madrid Protocol Countries
Lastly, protection for your trademark is also available in countries that are not members of the Madrid Protocol. For instance, as of the publication of this article most countries in Africa, South America and the Middle East are not members. As such, to protect your trademark in these countries the same must be initiated by filing directly in these countries’ respective intellectual property offices via local counsel and not through the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office.

Summary
In conclusion, there is no global trademark. However, the United States’ membership in the Madrid Protocol has made it easy and affordable for U.S. trademark holders to protect their trademarks in roughly 80 countries around the globe. Moreover, protection can be secured in non-member nations as well, it just takes a few extra steps.
 
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As an Apple comment, not sure who is aware here, but I recall reading this years ago, the irony is that birth and name Apple Computer was in conflict with the Beatles Apple records TM, so in fact Apple Computer started out being an infringing company themselves. As I recall, they promised not to enter the music business. So iTunes store made them renegotiate after being sued again. Found this article below. It says they entered the music went back and forth to court settling to buy the Apple right rights for $500 million.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Corps_v_Apple_Computer
 
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The issue with what you did was you used their likeliness to make money. Whether you did or not, that is how they got you. I use to hire an art studio/design agency with the word apple in their domain for years. And they are still up and running with no issues.

If you use apple in your name and make money without using "Apples likeliness" you will be ok.

The Beatles sued Steve Jobs about "apple" because he made a big mistake by telling the world he chose the apple name because of his love for the Beatles. :)


The reason might be slightly different

The beatles. Owned the trademark for
Apple in the class of music

While jobs owned
Apple in the class
Of computers

The problem started
When itunes sold music
 
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Does anybody know a good us trademark lawyer
I need to file a trademark myself
 
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I have Taylor swift .me .I have no idea About Trademarks connected to Domains
 
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