discuss Buying domains without a reason

[Amar D]

Hello,

I think that I have a problem. I'm buying domain names without a reason. I think this is some kind of addiction, like gambling/alcohol etc. Buying too much domains without using them, or success of sale them. But when I see some keywords in media, I'm instantly searching for domains with that kw to try to resell it. Sometimes I fu*k my whole salary on that. Do you have that kind of problem with domain buying obssesion?

 

[Domainuu]

Everything has a risk. Everything is a gamble. Even the life is a chance. I mean all we are the result of one out of millions of sperms. If you read a little about evolution of species you will stumble upon a knowledge : billions of combinations have been tried by cells/gens before creating a new successful species during the life of the 4.5 billion years of our World.

Risk is nothing. It matters only when you lose and only for a limited time. If you win, you can't say "addiction" to anything, including even to true casino gambling. Life always goes on after a while from the point where a loss stopped you. The biggest risk in life is to avoid from risk for the fear of a possible loss and not to start over quickly after falling down which is certain.

If you say you are buying domains without a reason, then you feel you will fall down at some point. That's a correct feeling. You will certainly fall down. But not for the reason of you are unsure on what you are doing. The reason is simple. Everyone falls down, with or without a reason. Falling down is inevitable for every living creature. Just prepare yourself emotionally to start over quickly and keep doing whatever you do until you can't. Start over, fall down, start over, fall down and then start over again. It doesn't matter what you do, doesn't matter how much you are confident or how much you are afraid of the risks. Just keep doing. You will finally have your desired outcome, only after paying its true price.

Simply "WOW" to this response.

 

[poweredbyme]

The worst thing is not to wish/dream any outcome. If you can't dream any positive outcome for yourself even if you want to dream, you can't have a reason to start over or to do particular things. It's a typical lack of motivation after the last loss. You feel you are just living, are doing random things without a particular motivation and reason in mind. If you are buying domains without a reasonable/common motivation (making profit) it's definitely more serious problem than making financial loss. You may be still under the effect of the last loss or possibly you may be tempted to hoarding of anything.

Hoarding is very common among males as we are hunters and GATHERERs. Hunting-gathering and hoarding are very related to each other. If we hoard enough, we won't have to hunt/gather any longer. I am a webmaster. I can't pay monthly for hosting. I tried for many times and ended up with buying for a year or longer if possible. Something forces me to pay for 3 years in advance. I paid even for 5 years in my early years. I have managed to control it a bit. I know something will go wrong in 3 years with any hosting and will have to look for another hosting before 3 years. Just an example to irresistible hoarding tendency in males.

Try to organize your domains. Create a simple spreadsheet that shows expiration dates, registrars, asking prices, extension, where you list for sale and any other detail you think it's important.
Then create another spreadsheet for your cash flows that shows projected inflows (salary) and outflows (renewal fees)
These 2 spreadsheets will help you a lot for numerous of reasons. Its biggest benefit is to answer inquires of possible buyers very quickly. Cash flow spreadsheet will help you to raise or lower prices confidently based on your need for cash.

If you have thousands of domains and will need to create big spreadsheets that are beyond your computer capability to open or will take too much time, then it's a different long story.

But the best advice would be to own less domains. Someone may own 10k domains and may sell a domain every day. It's not a sustainable business model for a one person company. Every domain is unique and requires special care. More than 200 domains is not easy to manage. Even if you are not a one person company and managing thousands of domains is not a problem for you, profitability of higher and lower priced domains is different.

Go for quality. Because quantity has higher competition.

 

[Recons.Com]

The worst thing is not to wish/dream any outcome. If you can't dream any positive outcome for yourself even if you want to dream, you can't have a reason to start over or to do particular things. It's a typical lack of motivation after the last loss. You feel you are just living, are doing random things without a particular motivation and reason in mind. If you are buying domains without a reasonable/common motivation (making profit) it's definitely more serious problem than making financial loss. You may be still under the effect of the last loss or possibly you may be tempted to hoarding of anything.

Hoarding is very common among males as we are hunters and GATHERERs. Hunting-gathering and hoarding are very related to each other. If we hoard enough, we won't have to hunt/gather any longer. I am a webmaster. I can't pay monthly for hosting. I tried for many times and ended up with buying for a year or longer if possible. Something forces me to pay for 3 years in advance. I paid even for 5 years in my early years. I have managed to control it a bit. I know something will go wrong in 3 years with any hosting and will have to look for another hosting before 3 years. Just an example to irresistible hoarding tendency in males.

Try to organize your domains. Create a simple spreadsheet that shows expiration dates, registrars, asking prices, extension, where you list for sale and any other detail you think it's important.
Then create another spreadsheet for your cash flows that shows projected inflows (salary) and outflows (renewal fees)
These 2 spreadsheets will help you a lot for numerous of reasons. Its biggest benefit is to answer inquires of possible buyers very quickly. Cash flow spreadsheet will help you to raise or lower prices confidently based on your need for cash.

If you have thousands of domains and will need to create big spreadsheets that are beyond your computer capability to open or will take too much time, then it's a different long story.

But the best advice would be to own less domains. Someone may own 10k domains and may sell a domain every day. It's not a sustainable business model for a one person company. Every domain is unique and requires special care. More than 200 domains is not easy to manage. Even if you are not a one person company and managing thousands of domains is not a problem for you, profitability of higher and lower priced domains is different.

Go for quality. Because quantity has higher competition.

Thousands can be managed easily if one does not go chasing transfer deals and consolidates at 1-3 registrars.

I have nearly 3000 now, 2600+ being with GD and it is piece of cake to manage. Basically just renew in time and respond to offers.

Planning to get to 10k names some time in 2021.

 

[fiftyfrancs]

Beautiful minds and rich thoughts scattered all over in this thread yet after reading all those...I just registered another domain.
You know what? I keep figuring out a beast strategy after each acquisition which demands that I try out another registration to experiment it upon. Funny, I guess my beasts are still cubs, and yesterday cubs make tomorrow's pride. Honestly we won't make the massive sale we wish we had reggd. I just think I need to do my homework pretty well then the regs

These push me to the order button:
We lose a 10000000% of a chance we never took, right?
Failure is success turned inside out

Btw comparing our Estibot and GD appraisals before a reg can *** you...

 

[poweredbyme]

Thousands can be managed easily if one does not go chasing transfer deals and consolidates at 1-3 registrars.

I have nearly 3000 now, 2600+ being with GD and it is piece of cake to manage. Basically just renew in time and respond to offers.

Planning to get to 10k names some time in 2021.

Even if you chase transfer deals it's possible to manage 10k domains by a one technically skilled person. Unfortunately most domainers I have seen on this forum and in other places are moderately computer illiterate. Most of them do domaining as a side business, are not full time domainers. So they do not have enough time to learn any computer skill.
This was one point when I said managing more than 200 domains is not an easy task.
Second point is;
You can't manage price updates, manual/direct sales and custom landing pages. You will eventually need to sell at marketplaces if you have more than 200 domains. Selling at marketplaces has advantages and disadvantages compared to direct sales.

More than 200 domains means a business model based on quantity. In my opinion it's more risky and offers low profit potential compared to less than 200 but higher priced, carefully picked domains.
Assume portfolio A has 10,000 and portfolio B has 200 domains.
Assume total worth of A = total worth B as a typical investor would have the same investment budget for domaining.

Problem starts here:
# domains in A / # domains in B = 50 = 10,000 /200
This means randomly chosen domain in B would have a 50 x price tag compared to a random domain in A.
Like, $500 vs $25,000 or $1,000 vs $50,000 or $ 3,000 vs $150,000 depending on total investment.

Questions:
1- Who will pay the renewal fees of extra 9,800 domain of the portfolio A ? 10,000 - 200 = 9,800.
2- Which is more likely? Selling a domain for $500 or $25,000 ?
If you say selling for $500 is more likely please think again about renewing extra 9,800 domains. 9,800 x $9 = $88k fees in renewal. Compare $500 in revenue vs $7,320 fee per month in renewals. You need to sell 50 x domains in portfolio A in the same time interval. In my opinion it's less likely. Because number of domain buyers is not too many regardless of the price.

 

[Recons.Com]

Even if you chase transfer deals it's possible to manage 10k domains by a one technically skilled person. Unfortunately most domainers I have seen on this forum and in other places are moderately computer illiterate. Most of them do domaining as a side business, are not full time domainers. So they do not have enough time to learn any computer skill.
This was one point when I said managing more than 200 domains is not an easy task.
Second point is;
You can't manage price updates, manual/direct sales and custom landing pages. You will eventually need to sell at marketplaces if you have more than 200 domains. Selling at marketplaces has advantages and disadvantages compared to direct sales.

More than 200 domains means a business model based on quantity. In my opinion it's more risky and offers low profit potential compared to less than 200 but higher priced, carefully picked domains.
Assume portfolio A has 10,000 and portfolio B has 200 domains.
Assume total worth of A = total worth B as a typical investor would have the same investment budget for domaining.

Problem starts here:
# domains in A / # domains in B = 50 = 10,000 /200
This means randomly chosen domain in B would have a 50 x price tag compared to a random domain in A.
Like, $500 vs $25,000 or $1,000 vs $50,000 or $ 3,000 vs $150,000 depending on total investment.

Questions:
1- Who will pay the renewal fees of extra 9,800 domain of the portfolio A ? 10,000 - 200 = 9,800.
2- Which is more likely? Selling a domain for $500 or $25,000 ?
If you say selling for $500 is more likely please think again about renewing extra 9,800 domains. 9,800 x $9 = $88k fees in renewal. Compare $500 in revenue vs $7,320 fee per month in renewals. You need to sell 50 x domains in portfolio A in the same time interval. In my opinion it's less likely. Because number of domain buyers is not too many regardless of the price.

You are artificially creating a problem and then trying to resolve it.

The only real time consuming part is acquiring. Managing is easy.

You don't have time, can't/don't want to hire a help?

1. Place all 10K names at 1 registrar.
2. Bulk upload into marketplace(s) with BIN prices.
3. Bulk upload to landing page provider service (or do it at the time of acquisition spending couple of minutes per name
4. Set auto-renew on names you are certain to keep

Enjoy it on autopilot, as most sales will come from BIN sales and spend 2-3 hrs/week responding to inquires, closing sales on offers etc.

As long as the quality of your names provide for sell through above around 0.4%, you'll be profitable. If you can reach 1% sell through, you will be making above $10K/month even after paying the renewals.

Again, I have just under 3000 names, I am spending maybe 1 hour/week renewing (not on auto on purpose), 1 hour responding to inquires etc.

Now, acquiring is different story. I spend almost 3-4 hours a day looking at the lists, bidding, listing at marketplaces etc.

I have algorithms in mind to save time on this phase too, but need to get to putting it into a task and ordering custom built scripts to handle this.

In short, managing thousands of names is easy, if you have organized it properly and are not chasing transfer deals. I'd rather focus on making 1 extra deal a year than run around trying to save $3000 on renewals.

 

[Moosan]

Welcome to the Club @Amar D

 

[Goku]

Same obsession.

I literally restricted myself by not adding funds to my NameSilo account. I was sitting on around 500 domains last year with the least sales. So I lost more than I made :p

 

[imadoer]

Excuse me. Can you spare some change for a .com??

 

[Karluch]

Hello,

I think that I have a problem. I'm buying domain names without a reason. I think this is some kind of addiction, like gambling/alcohol etc. Buying too much domains without using them, or success of sale them. But when I see some keywords in media, I'm instantly searching for domains with that kw to try to resell it. Sometimes I fu*k my whole salary on that. Do you have that kind of problem with domain buying obssesion?

I have same problem, so you are not alone. I am old to boot and have almost zero skills on building the most simple web site.

 

[Igor Mironyuk]

It is a serious question you raise @Amar D. I don't think that domaining is in the manual of addictions, but it could be. It has some features of gambling and game addictions, maybe others.

There is no one solution but I have found it helpful to set limits on amount I will invest or number of domain acquisitions until the next sale. I think it is also helpful to define at outset if you are in it as a hobby, part time gig or more. Keeping balance with other things in life is also important.

I personally have same framework as @MrAcidic. I am in it essentially as a hobby and invest only what I can afford to lose.

I think most of us have had the feelings you have. I hope you find solutions that work for you.

Take care,

Bob

Domain auctions on Godaddy, Dynadot, NameJet, SnapNames, Sedo is real gambling addiction.

 

[Igor Mironyuk]

I live in Switzerland, my salary is 4900 CHF per month, so imagine to spend a lot of that money just on domains. Also using sometimes card of my wife, that's another 4200 CHF.

My first obsession with domains started in days of MSN (Windows Live Messenger) when you could create address with your domain eg [email protected], so I was buying a ton of domains and changing my MSN ID. I was always looking for beautiful email address to have.

I think I will start to use niceguy96ch_Fu @ hotmail com to cure myself from that hahaha.

Also after that I was doing cybersquating and I didn't know anything about that term. Swiss companies were buying domains just normally from me when I offer it to them. After that I make little sales of 400€ once in 5 months. But spend ton of money. More in minus, than in plus.

You have to carefully choose which domain to buy. Always remember gold domaining rule:

Quality than quantity

 

[Igor Mironyuk]

I live in Switzerland, my salary is 4900 CHF per month, so imagine to spend a lot of that money just on domains. Also using sometimes card of my wife, that's another 4200 CHF.

My first obsession with domains started in days of MSN (Windows Live Messenger) when you could create address with your domain eg [email protected], so I was buying a ton of domains and changing my MSN ID. I was always looking for beautiful email address to have.

I think I will start to use niceguy96ch_Fu @ hotmail com to cure myself from that hahaha.

Also after that I was doing cybersquating and I didn't know anything about that term. Swiss companies were buying domains just normally from me when I offer it to them. After that I make little sales of 400€ once in 5 months. But spend ton of money. More in minus, than in plus.

You have to carefully choose which domain to buy. Always remember gold domaining rule:

Quality than quantity

 

[poweredbyme]

As long as the quality of your names provide for sell through above around 0.4%, you'll be profitable. If you can reach 1% sell through, you will be making above $10K/month even after paying the renewals.

If renewal fee is $10 and average BIN is set to $1,000, the cost is 1% per year. You have to sell 1% of your domains just for break even.
100 domains x $10 = $1,000 in renewal fee. You have to sell 1 domain for $1,000 per year just to pay renewal fees of 100 domains. Or 2 domains for $500 each or one domain for $2k every 2 year.

If you have thousands of domains you will eventually be forced to price as low as possible for the cash need for renewals. Lower profits per sale will likely lead to bankruptcy in couple of years.

Renewal cost is very dangerous. It's wise to acquire only high priced domains to keep your - renewal fee / BIN - ratio as low as possible. $10 cost is 1% for a $1,000 domain, 0.1% for a $10k domain and 10% for a $100 domain. $10 is your fixed cost regardless of your BIN price.

0.4% break even is possible if average BIN is $2,500 with zero acquisition cost ($2,500 net profit per sale) OR $1k per sale if the renewal fee is $4.

 

[Recons.Com]

If renewal fee is $10 and average BIN is set to $1,000, the cost is 1% per year. You have to sell 1% of your domains just for break even.
100 domains x $10 = $1,000 in renewal fee. You have to sell 1 domain for $1,000 per year just to pay renewal fees of 100 domains. Or 2 domains for $500 each or one domain for $2k every 2 year.

If you have thousands of domains you will eventually be forced to price as low as possible for the cash need for renewals. Lower profits per sale will likely lead to bankruptcy in couple of years.

Renewal cost is very dangerous. It's wise to acquire only high priced domains to keep your - renewal fee / BIN - ratio as low as possible. $10 cost is 1% for a $1,000 domain, 0.1% for a $10k domain and 10% for a $100 domain. $10 is your fixed cost regardless of your BIN price.

0.4% break even is possible if average BIN is $2,500 with zero acquisition cost ($2,500 net profit per sale) OR $1k per sale if the renewal fee is $4.

Again, you are complicating without reason.

Renewals are 8.29$ so no need to assume $10.

I don't understand why are you forced to sell for $1000? My average is around $3500 net after commissions, but I assumed just $2000. And my sell through is 1%+.

So certainly doable and scalable, as I have almost doubled my portfolio in last 12 months.

 

[poweredbyme]

Again, you are complicating without reason.

Renewals are 8.29$ so no need to assume $10.

I don't understand why are you forced to sell for $1000? My average is around $3500 net after commissions, but I assumed just $2000. And my sell through is 1%+.

So certainly doable and scalable, as I have almost doubled my portfolio in last 12 months.

Because I heard or read somewhere average second hand domain price is around $500 in major domain marketplaces like sedo. It may be a false information.
Is the $8.29 normal price or after bulk discounts? The lowest renewal price I know is $8.99 at namesilo. The lowest transfer fee I know is $8.25 at name.com. So it's safe for me to take average renewal fee as $10 as there are too many registrars charge more than $10 for renewals.

 

[Recons.Com]

Because I heard or read somewhere average second hand domain price is around $500 in major domain marketplaces like sedo. It may be a false information.
Is the $8.29 normal price or after bulk discounts? The lowest renewal price I know is $8.99 at namesilo. The lowest transfer fee I know is $8.25 at name.com. So it's safe for me to take average renewal fee as $10 as there are too many registrars charge more than $10 for renewals.

I have Godaddy Domain Discount Club - DCC acount (costs around $120/year, if I am not mistaken, and there are coupons with discounts for this) and the renewals are $8.29 with no need for any bulk etc. But because of the DCC cost, it makes sense only if you have 500+ names. It is also must have if you are buying names at GD auctions and closeouts, as otherwise on top of the auction fee you have to pay 1 year renewal and you'd be paying extra $7/name.

Average price: could be weighed down by the fact that lots of people buy names at $1-3 at promos, and then try to sell within a year at any price.

If you have quality names and are long term holder, no point in doing this. I sold enough just in May, 2019 to cover the renewals for all my names for the year.

But, again, everything starts from quality names that make sense for a business to pay $xxxx for. Always, ask yourself this before buying and if you are positive that a profitable business can benefit from it, then buy.

 

[bmugford]

If renewal fee is $10 and average BIN is set to $1,000, the cost is 1% per year. You have to sell 1% of your domains just for break even.
100 domains x $10 = $1,000 in renewal fee. You have to sell 1 domain for $1,000 per year just to pay renewal fees of 100 domains. Or 2 domains for $500 each or one domain for $2k every 2 year.

If you have thousands of domains you will eventually be forced to price as low as possible for the cash need for renewals. Lower profits per sale will likely lead to bankruptcy in couple of years.

Renewal cost is very dangerous. It's wise to acquire only high priced domains to keep your - renewal fee / BIN - ratio as low as possible. $10 cost is 1% for a $1,000 domain, 0.1% for a $10k domain and 10% for a $100 domain. $10 is your fixed cost regardless of your BIN price.

0.4% break even is possible if average BIN is $2,500 with zero acquisition cost ($2,500 net profit per sale) OR $1k per sale if the renewal fee is $4.

I would say quality and quantity is what works really.

Scenario 1 - High Quality & Low Quantity

I know people who have done this and hit a dead end capital wise. You basically are using a lot of capital to acquire quality domains, but at the same time the average end user sell through rate is low. The good news here is renewal fees are not a major factor. The bad news is if you only have a handful of domains you can get stuck waiting with no capital coming in.

Scenario 2 - High Quantity & Low Quality

You own lots of bad domains, many maybe bought with coupon codes. While you might make a sale here or there, it is often not enough to cover renewal costs. The renewal costs become a huge financial drain.

Scenario 3 - Quality & Quantity

This is the ideal scenario in my view. You own a quantity of mixed quality domains.
You might have some amazing high upside domains, liquid domains, brandables, and many other types in different price ranges.

In this situation with variety you are likely going to have something that appeals to various buyers, which means you are likely to always have some capital coming in.

People who have been in the domain world for awhile, making consistent sales are likely using Scenario 3 now. It is what happens over time when you are making steady sales and re-investing. The sales justify the renewal fees.

Brad

 

[poweredbyme]

I would say quality and quantity is what works really.

Scenario 1 - High Quality & Low Quantity

I know people who have done this and hit a dead end capital wise. You basically are using a lot of capital to acquire quality domains, but at the same time the average end user sell through rate is low. The good news here is renewal fees are not a major factor. The bad news is if you only have a handful of domains you can get stuck waiting with no capital coming in.

Scenario 2 - High Quantity & Low Quality

You own lots of bad domains, many maybe bought with coupon codes. While you might make a sale here or there, it is often not enough to cover renewal costs. The renewal costs become a huge financial drain.

Scenario 3 - Quality & Quantity

This is the ideal scenario in my view. You own a quantity of mixed quality domains.
You might have some amazing high upside domains, liquid domains, brandables, and many other types in different price ranges.

In this situation with variety you are likely going to have something that appeals to various buyers, which means you are likely to always have some capital coming in.

People who have been in the domain world for awhile, making consistent sales are likely using Scenario 3 now. It is what happens over time when you are making steady sales and re-investing. The sales justify the renewal fees.

Brad

Scenario 3 should be the most common one. Most purchase decisions are not systematic for all, both for resellers and end users. We simply purchase what is avaliable and viable at the moment. I don't mean Scenario 3 is wrong. Instead it's the best. But it requires high knowledge and control ability over financial management as it's the most complicated one. Thus it's the riskiest business model indeed (so the most profitable) contrary to what it seems. Managing a non-mixed portfolio (pure quality or pure quantity model) is much easier in terms of cash flow management.

 

[Blitzpotz]

Wow what a brave outing. First I thought you are talking about me!

Every recommendation in this thread is valuable. Take it serious. However, when I look onto your photo I see a rather young man who is looking for something. Looking for truth, looking for the ultimate answer in reply to everydays "Why?". Perhaps the answer is anywhere else and not in domains, not in speculation: your Bosnian origin. Your wife. Your family planning, don´t forget this task.

If you are heavily investing in new global Top Level Domains like dot.tips or dot.top then make a break. Read threads and posts of successful "old" domainers in this forum, google for Domain Kings´s blog and transfer their experiences into today. Why not investing in good LLLL coms (e.g.!) instead of paying for so-called Premium nTLDS. When I started I lost my money in dot.mobi whatever reason. I coulda woulda have bought super LLL coms for about 7k USD then. Did not, of course.

Accept Domaining as a hobby, too. Creating words is workout for your brain. You do not have to make profit on everything you touch. Aber verzocke nicht Haus und Hof, as we say in German.

I wish you all the best, you will find your answer and perhaps hang in there until your first year of profitabilty which feels like new born.

And if you don´t like my posting: no problem, I always chat with myself, too.

 

[Kassey Lee]

When I started I lost my money in dot.mobi whatever reason. I coulda woulda have bought super LLL coms for about 7k USD then. Did not, of course.

Hello my friend from Mobility. I lost money too in .mobi, but gained valuable experience in domain investing. Good advice.

 

[Blitzpotz]

Wise man Kassey Lee, nice to meet you again. Still remembering your book edition series in dot.mobi with a good feeling.

 

[Kassey Lee]

Wise man Kassey Lee, nice to meet you again. Still remembering your book edition series in dot.mobi with a good feeling.

Thanks. That loss taught me to focus only on .com.

 

[Mister Funsky]

I'm buying domain names without a reason.

I didnt read the whole thread but....I do it almost every day!

Over the years, my impulse (or 'no reason' domains) have been some of my best sellers. If you have the domain buying (insight) gift of selection...go with it! Just dont invest too much until you determine if you have the natural 'gift'.

 

[Silentptnr]

You can always register them to get your fix then cancel them.

From personal experience, Dynadot only gives a partial refund. NameSilo gives a full refund.

Refunds Rock!

Hope this helps.