Dynadot

Bidding on your own names at NameJet...?

NameSilo
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Once in awhile I see people bidding on their own domains at NJ. I would think it would be frowned upon.

Today's seems more obvious than normal. Or am I missing something here?

Airlinejobs.com owned by Andy Booth at Booth.com and high bidder is BQDNcom (James Booth).

3 bids down we see Boothcom as a bidder.

Same thing with MovieZone.com. Owned by Andy Booth in which he currently appears to be the high bidder.

High Bid: $2,475 USD by boothcom

They actually won their own domain airplanesforsale.com. Im guessing it didnt get as high as they wanted so needed to protect it.

Bidder Amount Date
bqdncom $2,001 7/17/2017 12:23 PM
boothcom $1,950 7/17/2017 12:23 PM
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
Who here has ever known of the ability to fax or email reserve price changes equivalent to next bid wins?

Not me
 
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Listen, I'm done arguing this point but this part is critical. A SHILL BID is a bid where the person is hiding, using an alias or a proxy. If it is laid out in the TOS and the owner is clearly identified in the bidding process and the auction is a forced sale auction where no party can renege and a sale will happen no matter what, it is NOT a shill bid. It is an alternative auction structure.

Whether you agree with my proposal or not isn't the issue.

Actually, that is the issue, particularly if you're claiming people are "attacking" you for your comments. As you have clearly stated, your proposal suggests that bidding on your own domain names (in the open) should be allowed. Unfortunately, i think the issue here is that your suggestions may insinuate that you have a completely different ideology to what is considered the norm within this industry. THAT is why people are criticizing you. THAT is why your comments have created negative buzz surrounding your reputation which compelled you to defend. You are considered one of the best brokers in the business and an industry influencer and yet you have gone out of your way to defend the idea that a domain owner should be able to bid on their own domains. I'm sure I'm not alone when I say that it seems that you're splitting hairs in your attempt to "educate everyone" on what a true shill bid is. The problem with all of this, is that most people reading this thread have looked up to you. What I personally find disturbing is that you have thrown around common buzzwords such as "the free market" to defend your proposal. Why is that disturbing? Because once again, artificially inflating the demand for a product is the antithesis of a true and free market. Allowing this practice is not disruptive...it's actually destructive. THAT is why people are upset with you. THAT is why it's not allowed on the platforms. There are thousands of bidders at NameJet and GoDaddy, including genuine end-users. Your statement "its not shill bidding if my name is in the open" is ridiculous. At the end of the day, someone bidding on their own domains is still..bidding on their own names. End-users or those who are not "full-time domainers" have no freaking clue who's who and what their NameJet bidding handle is, or who owns what. They just see a domain that has a lot of bids and merely trust that the platform isn't artificially inflating the domain that they want to bid on.

Lastly, I'm not directly accusing you personally of shill-bidding (never did), nor am I suggesting that you have ever placed bids on your own domains. While I can't speak for others, my gripe is that I simply take issue with you seemingly defending the practice of other individuals who may have placed bids on their own domains (yes, in the open, not shill bidding). Suggesting anyone who criticizes you is likely just "uneducated" is actually very insulting to those of us who know a lot more than you think we know. Most of us have enjoyed watching you on Domain Sherpa. Most of us also know that you're super successful and have gained a ton of knowledge over the past decade and we sincerely want to see you continue to succeed. However, at least have some decency and respect for those in the industry who choose to criticize your stance on individuals who partake in questionable bidding (to put it mildly) within the industry. If you don't want your opinions challenged or criticized, then I would suggest that you stop throwing yourself into the spotlight at every opportunity.
 
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@Oliver Hoger
moviezone.jpg


You were the seller of moviezone.com on NameJet. Andy Booth claims that he sold this domain to you, and that you are the owner. However, Andy Booth was still listed as owner in WHOIS when you auctioned the name on NameJet.

Both you and Andy Booth bid on your auction listing for moviezone.com, a domain owned by either you or him. Why did you bid on your own auction listing?

Andy Booth won the auction and you were the second highest bidder.

It appears that Andy Booth won the auction for a name that he himself owns according to WHOIS, and you were the second highest bidder on a domain which you put up for auction.

Please explain this situation.
 
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@Oliver Hoger
Show attachment 64745

You were the seller of moviezone.com on NameJet. Andy Booth claims that he sold this domain to you, and that you are the owner. However, Andy Booth was still listed as owner in WHOIS when you auctioned the name on NameJet.

Both you and Andy Booth bid on your auction listing for moviezone.com, a domain owned by either you or him. Why did you bid on your own auction listing?

Andy Booth won the auction and you were the second highest bidder.

It appears that Andy Booth won the auction for a name that he himself owns according to WHOIS, and you were the second highest bidder on a domain which you put up for auction.

Please explain this situation.
If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck
 
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Hey guys, was offline for a few hours, so what is the latest? Oliver, Booth brothers, any other's where do things stand? Has NJ answered anything?
 
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Hey guys, was offline for a few hours, so what is the latest? Oliver, Booth brothers, any other's where do things stand? Has NJ answered anything?

Nothing from Namejet. I was able to prove Oliver and HKDN share the same ParkingCrew account, which means they are the same people. But he still won't admit it.

Otherwise, I'm calling it a night.

Donny
 
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@Oliver Hoger
Show attachment 64745

You were the seller of moviezone.com on NameJet. Andy Booth claims that he sold this domain to you, and that you are the owner. However, Andy Booth was still listed as owner in WHOIS when you auctioned the name on NameJet.

Both you and Andy Booth bid on your auction listing for moviezone.com, a domain owned by either you or him. Why did you bid on your own auction listing?

Andy Booth won the auction and you were the second highest bidder.

It appears that Andy Booth won the auction for a name that he himself owns according to WHOIS, and you were the second highest bidder on a domain which you put up for auction.

Please explain this situation.

These need to be answered...
 
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I think @NameJetGM owes it to his customers and all NamePros members to reveal who user HKDN is and how he miraculously knows how to bid $10 under most reserve prices in hundreds of auctions and then tell us how they are related, in blood or business to the Booth's, Hoger and Rosener? This is total bullshit what I have been reading on this thread the past 2 days!
 
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Nothing from Namejet. I was able to prove Oliver and HKDN share the same ParkingCrew account, which means they are the same people. But he still won't admit it.

Otherwise, I'm calling it a night.

Donny

Thanks Donny! Your one of the good guys, I miss the old parked.com days about 10-15 years ago when you ran the show there. Hope all is well with you, keep in touch!
 
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HI,

Sorry for delay i was traveling and cannot believe what has been said.

Everyone let me explain:

Winner888:
I have a automated bidding system that would backorder ALL the domains and bid last minute to grab bargains.
Its a script works via api would bid on all CVCV up to $2500-3000 i set daily limit on the patterns i would want to buy.

On slow days i got good deals on short domains i trade in
LLLL.com / CVCV.com / LL.com / LLL.com / NNNN.com / NNNNN.com / CCC.com etc...

I won allot of domains and a few of mine so this got closed down months ago already due to this..
Im trying to fix to be able to exclude all my domains.

Bids that hit reserve:
We do allot of next bid wins. Most of you don't know how this works.
My auctions have a reserve price. On the last day of the auction or in the last few hours
I see what the high bids are and then send namejet a list of domains ask to to set next bid wins.
So it is not that someone is bidding just under reserve.
I am lowering the reserve to just above the highest bid so that the next bid hits reserve and the domain will sell.
Just lowering reserve. Flippa has this same function built into their seller platform. You can reduce reserve any time.
Buyers are bidding the amount that they are willing to bid. I am not changing that.
I just lower reserve with next bid wins so that more domains sell.

Regarding MediaOptions:
I have done business with them for many years on the buyer’s side, seller’s side and as a broker.

Regarding HDKN:
I know HDKN and he is a big buyer of short domains, which is what I sell. I am not HDKN. I do not have access to HDKN account.
I sent him (and others) my featured listings.
All his bids and purchases are legitimate.
It has happened that I have bought some domains back from him in the past when I felt the prices were too low.

I'm sorry that I have caused so much problems and confusion. I never intended to do anything that would harm anyone.

Oliver.
Between 2016-11-29 and 2017-02-19 when your winner8888 "bot" was active, it does seem to have bid almost exclusively on 4L.com, 3L.net, 5N.com, and 3C.com. So that almost seems plausible... but do you know how many public auctions during this period matched any of those patterns? 14,901 Guess how many your bot participated in... 2,157 for a total of only 14%.

During that period you ran 846 auctions matching those patterns, you know how many your bot bid in? 714 for a total of 84%. Weird, your bot was in such a low percentage of those auctions but managed to barely miss any of your own. Not to mention that 33% of your total bids in these categories were for your own auctions, even though your own auctions only represented 6% of the inventory in that category. Meaning you were almost 6x more likely to bid in your own auction than a random seller's auction for those categories. Probably just a coincidence, although I wonder why you didn't run the API on your main account, and instead created a second account that wasn't an alias everyone knows you by.

Even if all this is true, your bot is supposed to represent you. Meaning if you didn't stop it from bidding in your own auctions, either because you somehow didn't connect the dots that you were selling the same types of names your bot buys, or you were too lazy/cheap to get it done (it's a 30 minute job tops), then you still did quite a bit of damage that NameJet needs to correct. More than 1,000 auctions...

Now even if we take that story at face value, which is very hard to swallow, you offered up no explanation how you managed to bid in 148 of your own auctions from your "seek" account, which is not a bot. Ok, you're running dozens of auctions a day and own a large portfolio, mistakes can happen. But 148 times? Bidding so aggressively that you were the runner-up in 16 of them without recognizing the names? Even manually winning two that you already owned? That's pretty nutty.

Especially considering that your explanation for the reserves getting hit the way they did means you were reviewing your auctions ending that day, every day, to determine what to drop the reserve on. So in the span of less than a day, you take a close look at your names ending that day as part of your reserve strategy, and forget them so completely that you don't even recognize them later when you're bidding on them? Weird.

And even if all of this is still true, there's a very, very serious problem at NameJet that they have no protection in place so basic as determining when a seller is bidding on his own auctions. And that they swept it under the rug five months ago without making anybody whole.

So that about covers it, other than the Booth situation and all the oddities that suggest you may actually be HKDN. Probably more coincidences and happenstance.
 
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Sure, we have all had somebody not change their information for a while or DNS. But I've found over 30 cases so far. One or two, I can see. This is a few too many.

Donny
@forge said it was numerous. Would it be as many as over 30?
 
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@Michael thanks for all that data and hard work.
 
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The Booths are feeling a sigh of relief because it seems a bigger fish is telling stories that are even harder to swallow than the Booths.


Between 2016-11-29 and 2017-02-19 when your winner8888 "bot" was active, it does seem to have bid almost exclusively on 4L.com, 3L.net, 5N.com, and 3C.com. So that almost seems plausible... but do you know how many public auctions during this period matched any of those patterns? 14,901 Guess how many your bot participated in... 2,157 for a total of only 14%.

During that period you ran 846 auctions matching those patterns, you know how many your bot bid in? 714 for a total of 84%. Weird, your bot was in such a low percentage of those auctions but managed to barely miss any of your own. Not to mention that 33% of your total bids in these categories were for your own auctions, even though your own auctions only represented 6% of the inventory in that category. Meaning you were almost 6x more likely to bid in your own auction than a random seller's auction for those categories. Probably just a coincidence, although I wonder why you didn't run the API on your main account, and instead created a second account that wasn't an alias everyone knows you by.

Even if all this is true, your bot is supposed to represent you. Meaning if you didn't stop it from bidding in your own auctions, either because you somehow didn't connect the dots that you were selling the same types of names your bot buys, or you were too lazy/cheap to get it done (it's a 30 minute job tops), then you still did quite a bit of damage that NameJet needs to correct. More than 1,000 auctions...

Now even if we take that story at face value, which is very hard to swallow, you offered up no explanation how you managed to bid in 148 of your own auctions from your "seek" account, which is not a bot. Ok, you're running dozens of auctions a day and own a large portfolio, mistakes can happen. But 148 times? Bidding so aggressively that you were the runner-up in 16 of them without recognizing the names? Even manually winning two that you already owned? That's pretty nutty.

Especially considering that your explanation for the reserves getting hit the way they did means you were reviewing your auctions ending that day, every day, to determine what to drop the reserve on. So in the span of less than a day, you take a close look at your names ending that day as part of your reserve strategy, and forget them so completely that you don't even recognize them later when you're bidding on them? Weird.

And even if all of this is still true, there's a very, very serious problem at NameJet that they have no protection in place so basic as determining when a seller is bidding on his own auctions. And that they swept it under the rug five months ago without making anybody whole.

So that about covers it, other than the Booth situation and all the oddities that suggest you may actually be HKDN. Probably more coincidences and happenstance.
 
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Just because someone defends the idea of openly bidding on their own domain in an unregulated market, does not in any way, shape or form equal your accusation

He actually admitted, he bid on a few of his own auctions, by mistake, but then contacted NameJet to remove his bids. I think he should provide the email proof of his asking NameJet to remove his mistakenly placed bids on his own auctions.
 
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Between 2016-11-29 and 2017-02-19 when your winner8888 "bot" was active, it does seem to have bid almost exclusively on 4L.com, 3L.net, 5N.com, and 3C.com. So that almost seems plausible... but do you know how many public auctions during this period matched any of those patterns? 14,901 Guess how many your bot participated in... 2,157 for a total of only 14%.

During that period you ran 846 auctions matching those patterns, you know how many your bot bid in? 714 for a total of 84%. Weird, your bot was in such a low percentage of those auctions but managed to barely miss any of your own. Not to mention that 33% of your total bids in these categories were for your own auctions, even though your own auctions only represented 6% of the inventory in that category. Meaning you were almost 6x more likely to bid in your own auction than a random seller's auction for those categories. Probably just a coincidence, although I wonder why you didn't run the API on your main account, and instead created a second account that wasn't an alias everyone knows you by.

Even if all this is true, your bot is supposed to represent you. Meaning if you didn't stop it from bidding in your own auctions, either because you somehow didn't connect the dots that you were selling the same types of names your bot buys, or you were too lazy/cheap to get it done (it's a 30 minute job tops), then you still did quite a bit of damage that NameJet needs to correct. More than 1,000 auctions...

Now even if we take that story at face value, which is very hard to swallow, you offered up no explanation how you managed to bid in 148 of your own auctions from your "seek" account, which is not a bot. Ok, you're running dozens of auctions a day and own a large portfolio, mistakes can happen. But 148 times? Bidding so aggressively that you were the runner-up in 16 of them without recognizing the names? Even manually winning two that you already owned? That's pretty nutty.

Especially considering that your explanation for the reserves getting hit the way they did means you were reviewing your auctions ending that day, every day, to determine what to drop the reserve on. So in the span of less than a day, you take a close look at your names ending that day as part of your reserve strategy, and forget them so completely that you don't even recognize them later when you're bidding on them? Weird.

And even if all of this is still true, there's a very, very serious problem at NameJet that they have no protection in place so basic as determining when a seller is bidding on his own auctions. And that they swept it under the rug five months ago without making anybody whole
So that about covers it, other than the Booth situation and all the oddities that suggest you may actually be HKDN. Probably more coincidences and happenstance.

So how does Oliver and his "cronies' answer to this now? This looks like the "nail in the coffin!
 
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If any of you are buying any of the excuses provided by the players in this shill bid drama, I have a bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell you!
 
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Between 2016-11-29 and 2017-02-19 when your winner8888 "bot" was active, it does seem to have bid almost exclusively on 4L.com, 3L.net, 5N.com, and 3C.com. So that almost seems plausible... but do you know how many public auctions during this period matched any of those patterns? 14,901 Guess how many your bot participated in... 2,157 for a total of only 14%.

During that period you ran 846 auctions matching those patterns, you know how many your bot bid in? 714 for a total of 84%. Weird, your bot was in such a low percentage of those auctions but managed to barely miss any of your own. Not to mention that 33% of your total bids in these categories were for your own auctions, even though your own auctions only represented 6% of the inventory in that category. Meaning you were almost 6x more likely to bid in your own auction than a random seller's auction for those categories. Probably just a coincidence, although I wonder why you didn't run the API on your main account, and instead created a second account that wasn't an alias everyone knows you by.

Even if all this is true, your bot is supposed to represent you. Meaning if you didn't stop it from bidding in your own auctions, either because you somehow didn't connect the dots that you were selling the same types of names your bot buys, or you were too lazy/cheap to get it done (it's a 30 minute job tops), then you still did quite a bit of damage that NameJet needs to correct. More than 1,000 auctions...

Now even if we take that story at face value, which is very hard to swallow, you offered up no explanation how you managed to bid in 148 of your own auctions from your "seek" account, which is not a bot. Ok, you're running dozens of auctions a day and own a large portfolio, mistakes can happen. But 148 times? Bidding so aggressively that you were the runner-up in 16 of them without recognizing the names? Even manually winning two that you already owned? That's pretty nutty.

Especially considering that your explanation for the reserves getting hit the way they did means you were reviewing your auctions ending that day, every day, to determine what to drop the reserve on. So in the span of less than a day, you take a close look at your names ending that day as part of your reserve strategy, and forget them so completely that you don't even recognize them later when you're bidding on them? Weird.

And even if all of this is still true, there's a very, very serious problem at NameJet that they have no protection in place so basic as determining when a seller is bidding on his own auctions. And that they swept it under the rug five months ago without making anybody whole.

So that about covers it, other than the Booth situation and all the oddities that suggest you may actually be HKDN. Probably more coincidences and happenstance.
Wow that was great analysis, freakanomics level
 
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It's hard to blame someone even if it looks shady without proof.

The bigger issue here is simple.

Why in hell, does NJ let this happen to begin with, these folks are just playing the game..
It's the rules of the game that need a serious explanation. The guys bot bid on 84 percent of his own auctions...screw the cold beer...I need a bong hit now.
 
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Why in hell, does NJ let this happen to begin with, these folks are just playing the game..
It's the rules of the game that need a serious explanation

Bidding on your own auctions is against the NameJet Terms of Service which I believe should be considered the rules, but now I'm not so sure the rules applied to everyone equally!
 
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I think @NameJetGM owes it to his customers and all NamePros members to reveal who user HKDN is and how he miraculously knows how to bid $10 under most reserve prices in hundreds of auctions and then tell us how they are related, in blood or business to the Booth's, Hoger and Rosener? This is total bullsh*t what I have been reading on this thread the past 2 days!

Didn't Oliver just say he reset the reserve price on all those auctions?
 
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Bidding on your own auctions is against the NameJet Terms of Service which I believe should be considered the rules, but now I'm not so sure the rules applied to everyone equally!

Maybe it's ok if you do it "mistakenly"
 
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So who posted this? You are pretty quick.

 
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Between 2016-11-29 and 2017-02-19 when your winner8888 "bot" was active, it does seem to have bid almost exclusively on 4L.com, 3L.net, 5N.com, and 3C.com. So that almost seems plausible... but do you know how many public auctions during this period matched any of those patterns? 14,901 Guess how many your bot participated in... 2,157 for a total of only 14%.

During that period you ran 846 auctions matching those patterns, you know how many your bot bid in? 714 for a total of 84%. Weird, your bot was in such a low percentage of those auctions but managed to barely miss any of your own. Not to mention that 33% of your total bids in these categories were for your own auctions, even though your own auctions only represented 6% of the inventory in that category. Meaning you were almost 6x more likely to bid in your own auction than a random seller's auction for those categories. Probably just a coincidence, although I wonder why you didn't run the API on your main account, and instead created a second account that wasn't an alias everyone knows you by.

Even if all this is true, your bot is supposed to represent you. Meaning if you didn't stop it from bidding in your own auctions, either because you somehow didn't connect the dots that you were selling the same types of names your bot buys, or you were too lazy/cheap to get it done (it's a 30 minute job tops), then you still did quite a bit of damage that NameJet needs to correct. More than 1,000 auctions...

Now even if we take that story at face value, which is very hard to swallow, you offered up no explanation how you managed to bid in 148 of your own auctions from your "seek" account, which is not a bot. Ok, you're running dozens of auctions a day and own a large portfolio, mistakes can happen. But 148 times? Bidding so aggressively that you were the runner-up in 16 of them without recognizing the names? Even manually winning two that you already owned? That's pretty nutty.

Especially considering that your explanation for the reserves getting hit the way they did means you were reviewing your auctions ending that day, every day, to determine what to drop the reserve on. So in the span of less than a day, you take a close look at your names ending that day as part of your reserve strategy, and forget them so completely that you don't even recognize them later when you're bidding on them? Weird.

And even if all of this is still true, there's a very, very serious problem at NameJet that they have no protection in place so basic as determining when a seller is bidding on his own auctions. And that they swept it under the rug five months ago without making anybody whole.

So that about covers it, other than the Booth situation and all the oddities that suggest you may actually be HKDN. Probably more coincidences and happenstance.
Sorry, 5am here and I haven't slept yet... I messed up the first query about how many auctions matched those patterns. The first two paragraphs are inaccurate, and I don't have anything to show that it wasn't a bot. My mistake. But the rest of the post stands, doesn't really matter if it was a bot as long as you control what it does. And who wants to monitor two NJ accounts instead of one, I don't see why you'd create the new alias.
 
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@forge said it was numerous. Would it be as many as over 30?
The huge number of domains Mr. Hoger must own makes comparisons almost pointless IMO, though I must have a dozen and possibly twice that or more (that I no longer own, with unchanged NS).
 
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