Bidding on your own names at NameJet...?

[webquest]

Once in awhile I see people bidding on their own domains at NJ. I would think it would be frowned upon.

Today's seems more obvious than normal. Or am I missing something here?

Airlinejobs.com owned by Andy Booth at Booth.com and high bidder is BQDNcom (James Booth).

3 bids down we see Boothcom as a bidder.

Same thing with MovieZone.com. Owned by Andy Booth in which he currently appears to be the high bidder.

High Bid: $2,475 USD by boothcom

They actually won their own domain airplanesforsale.com. Im guessing it didnt get as high as they wanted so needed to protect it.

Bidder Amount Date
bqdncom $2,001 7/17/2017 12:23 PM
boothcom $1,950 7/17/2017 12:23 PM

 

[Captdocs]

HKDN works for NJ, why else wouldn't they ban him

 

[ksusha64]

I hope this situation gets resolved fast!

 

[MackieMesser]

It's becoming more and more surreal that we have to defend what it's ethically and legally correct in front of such people that call themselves "outside of the box" thinkers because they are questioning what is generally accepted as being right!

And it's more and more troublesome that there are other persons around here that agree on such outrageous practices or indirectly supporting these felons by trying to disrupt our moral principles!

I think it's called "alternative facts" nowadays.

 

[MackieMesser]

Wow...yesterday when I looked into this thread it was about 10 pages, now it has more than doubled and articles regarding this issue on other websites have popped up. Also apparently new things/shill bidders have been exposed?

I would appreciate it if someone who closely followed the thread would take the effort to make a summary about all these posts for all those who can't read through all the pages.

 

[DomainVP]

Absolutely disgraceful.

How is this disgraceful?

Shill bidding is disgraceful.

 

[1Darko]

Thanks for your hard work.
NJ, and all auction sites, should be doing these types of compliance investigations on a routine basis to ensure that they are clean. If they already do, maybe they can enlighten us.

A good way to prevent fraud is regulary independent auditing. Some interesting link: www.isaca.org

 

[wwwweb]

A good way to prevent fraud is regulary independent auditing. Some interesting link: www.isaca.org

Who do you think profits the most from this, and now you realize why they will never send it to an outside auditor.

It's a liability issue, someone mentioned that the named parties auctions are live again, which would mean they have finished their investigation into the matter.

 

[1Darko]

Silentptnr & others,

I appreciate your comments. Please note that we are continuing to investigate this matter (as I said we would), and we will take steps needed to preserve and maintain the integrity of our platform.

And while I can appreciate the debate around bidding practices, our rules are clear - we do not condone shill bidding, period.

I will provide a further update when I can and thank everyone for their attention and the constructive comments. This helps us do better.

-Jonathan

One constructive comment. An independent professional audit would probably be a good solution, imho
www.isaca.org

 

[offthehandle]

Wow...yesterday when I looked into this thread it was about 10 pages, now it has more than doubled and articles regarding this issue on other websites have popped up. Also apparently new things/shill bidders have been exposed?

I would appreciate it if someone who closely followed the thread would take the effort to make a summary about all these posts for all those who can't read through all the pages.

You want a summary. How about shill bidding is being investigated and the platform that had it exposed on is "working" on it. They post a Politically correct ivy league written response... but because the weather is sunny in Seattle so nobody works overtime. Besides that, it's summer. 2 of the accused popped in to berate those negative comments, then lurked in on this thread and were caught doing so as the cancer spread. Others who been mentioned and were legit bidders said they told Namejet before only to be ignored. Then one famous seller posted that sellers should openly be allowed to pump up/ shill their second rate domains they put up on NameJet. A separate thread was started to debate the merits of pumping and dumping. So after all these posts no one has come forward to state they owned the questionable domains, and that leaves the ugly black cloud hanging over the mess. Auctions continue, and business as usual. Some names were reported as being taken down, then relisted by the suspects.

Meanwhile some pretty smart people seem to believe that an 3rd party audit will fix the distrust and there is a magic bullet here, when there isn't one.

Shilling while many believe is not usual, have no idea of the real slimey behind the scenes of the entire auction world is. I know first hand. But don't simply believe me, do your own research. Read the links, this domain name shilling is kids stuff. Ebay will always have it and warns their customers. Which is all they can do anyway. This domain thing is Pennies if you look at corruption at more major auctions in real estate, fine art, sports memorabilia, and even Gov't surplus.

The Realtors and the Auction houses even debated the issue as though it was acceptable! Again, read the OC register article I posted.

I left out details. Lots of demands and comments made. Some jokes interjected.

 

[anantj]

Thanks. Exactly my point, that this HKDN guy knew about the reserve and just made a bid that was just short of the reserve.
I too think it's Oliver only.
I would request DSAD staff and Shane to clarify as to why they removed content from May 14th article about HKDN.
It's getting indexed on Google but not there in the post.
I think they got some warning from NameJet, their sponsors, or were asked by Oliver to put that down.
If NameJet asked them, then I think NameJet would be in deep trouble here.

This is what you're looking for

Google Webcache link: https://webcache.googleusercontent....-auction-sunday-may-14th/+&cd=8&hl=en&ct=clnk

 

[Addison]

I just noticed that @Addison had written about this back in April as well.

https://www.namepros.com/threads/giant-shill-bidding-operation-at-namejet-exposed.1013479/

Michael did superb work and his posts are a must read:

1. https://www.namepros.com/posts/6265695/
2. https://www.namepros.com/posts/6266130/

My visceral reaction in April to the shill bidding at NameJet was outrage, because they looked complicit.

Now, I'm just overwhelmed with despair. This is a sad state of affairs for us all.

 

[offthehandle]

https://www.law.cornell.edu/ucc/2/2-328

Item 4, shows in UCC's its even legal for the seller to bid if disclosed.
Ridiculous, but it is true. For those who believe in bidding up their own names, it is legal if it is disclosed!!! Unethical, but legal.

The fall of the hammer is also noncompliant and does not apply either when expired names are allowed to be renewed, an invention and creation of the various fake expired domain auctions that allow it.

§ 2-328. Sale by Auction.
sale by auction if goods are put up in lotseach lot is the subject of a separate sale.

sale by auction is complete when the auctioneer so announces by the fall of the hammer or in other customary manner. Where a bid is made while the hammer is falling in acceptance of a prior bid the auctioneer may in his discretion reopen the bidding or declare the goodssold under the bid on which the hammer was falling.

sale is with reserve unless the goods are in explicit terms put up without reserve. In an auction with reserve the auctioneer may withdraw the goods at any time until he announces completion of the sale. In an auction without reserve, after the auctioneer calls for bids on an article or lot, that article or lot cannot be withdrawn unless no bid is made within a reasonable time. In either case a bidder may retract his bid until the auctioneer's announcement of completion of the sale, but a bidder's retraction does not revive any previous bid.

seller's behalf or the seller makes or procures such a bid, and notice has not been given that liberty for such bidding is reserved, the buyer may at his option avoid the sale or take the goods at the price of the last good faithbid prior to the completion of the sale. This subsection shall not apply to any bid at a forced sale.

 

[anantj]

See the auction of eoeh.com on NameJet.
It's an auction by Oliver.
Russel made a bid of $200, next bid by HKDN of $501, waiting for someone to take the bait

I think NJ is watching this thread. The auction has been removed

 

[Hemanttilotia]

I think NJ is watching this thread. The auction has been removed

Rnof, eebf, rheh..all auctions by Oliver are going on as usual with hkdn sitting at $501, waiting for you.
NameJet has turned a deaf ear.

 

[Beezy]

So in @Addison 's original thread, @NameJetGM thought it was proper to take action:

https://www.namepros.com/threads/gi...t-namejet-exposed.1013479/page-3#post-6110474

That is a link to the comment where he admitted he banned the account behind the shill bids.

But in this case... we'll see...

Same bidding pattern here.

Going to take some mental gymnastics to justify keeping these people on the site.

Did you skip ethics class when you got your MBA, Jonathan?

 

[offthehandle]

"In this case, there were a few auctions that exhibited concerning bidding patterns. We investigated and took immediate action, including suspending the auctions and the seller, who was new to our platform. This was not a widespread operation as only a few domains were involved and they did not result in any sales."

Some of you will have believed this crap then, and you will again?
History always repeats itself.

 

[domeen]

Now If I think about the poor Chinese who got suck out on those 4 letter auctions, 3 letter auctions. And even 2 letter auction. I feel a little sorry for them actually. That Oliver guy sold those 4 letters in 4cn also I think.

I mean that all has to do with ethics. I mean I know its wrong to bid on my brothers domains. And I would not do it. But some guys think and publicly admit thats ok. I mean you can`t do anything about it, because I would not see a way how you can prove that they acted together. unless you have theyre phone records etc.. But I mean ETHICS guys.

One word is GREED, they all got to greedy. You get to greedy you get caught.

 

[offthehandle]

http://www.coinworld.com/voices/michaelbugeja/2017/04/beware_of_shill_bidd.html#

And those that advocate it as being legal.

http://community.ebay.com/t5/Bidding-Buying/When-the-law-says-shilling-is-legal/qaq-p/23695771

Being talked about in 2002. Nothing has changed, nor will it!!!

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/3078735/n...t/cautionary-tales-two-auctions/#.WXBMRrFMGhA

https://law.stackexchange.com/quest...ow-max-bids-and-place-bids-themselves-to-incr


http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2005/10/05/1467138.htm

 

[anantj]

I don't think there is a single NJ buyer that is somewhat active that has not been bid up and paid more than they should as a result of HKDN's bidding activity. This bidder handle is extremely active, and has affected the sales price of hundreds of auctions, if not more. That adds up to a lot of $$$!

edit: and if your bidding handle at NJ is the same as your NP username, I've seen you get bid up by this guy a few times recently on names I was following as well...

I've been bid up as well. Just went back and checked my won auctions... I hope I can join others in an action against NJ... Not sure though since I'm not based out of the US

 

[Beezy]

I've been bid up as well. Just went back and checked my won auctions... I hope I can join others in an action against NJ... Not sure though since I'm not based out of the US

We're looking for Florida residents now to file with the Florida Attorney General's office ASAP.

 

[anantj]

I so got baited on this $10 dollars from the reserve i didn't even mean to win it haha

Show attachment 64610

I had this happen for two auctions as well

 

[Beezy]

I had this happen for two auctions as well

The thing is, @NameJetGM knows EXACTLY what happened here and in all of these similar cases.

I can't say more...

 

[Hemanttilotia]

We're looking for Florida residents now to file with the Florida Attorney General's office ASAP.

Nice

 

[anantj]

P.S. ShillJet.com is available for hand reg. I suspect this will be a term used in the future to describe NJ if their management continues to condone this type of behavior through their actions (or inaction in their case)

Also available - NamejetGate.com & BoothGate.com

 

[offthehandle]

https://www.griffith.edu.au/enginee...ed-intelligent-systems/staff/jarrod-trevathan

Here is a guy who has published and research the matter, you might contact him to investigate and or be an expert witness.

Pdf paper here:
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.61.7728&rep=rep1&type=pdf