advice Are the VIPs trying to keep Newbies out of the business?

[siyavuya]

Everyone here is saying that it takes a long time to sell a domain name (If you're lucky)
But when you look at sites like Sedo, Flippa, Afternic, and even Park.io I see 100s of domains selling daily and at a good price. I know not every domain will be a winner

Most of those domains are fairly new. So how come people here are saying you need to wait years to make a sell? Are people trying to keep the newbie out of the business?

Also have to say: Most of the advice I got here has been extremely helpful. Just a little bit worried about this part and it's the most important.

HELP

 

[Bob Hawkes]

Fundamentally a domain name will sell if someone wants it and sees it will add value to their organization or business.

We can (and I and many others like to ) talk about trends, and statistics, and extensions, and past sales, and niches, and aesthetics, and appraisals (human or bot), etc. but really the question is as simple as the above.

Who benefits from ArtShop and how do you get them to notice it? You undoubtedly have expertise in the niche or would not have considered the name, and have ideas about how it could be used. You are the expert in many ways on your own domain name, Never forget that, or that the key question is who benefits from this name.

Best of luck with your domain name. Remember you have thought far more about your domain name than anyone here. Give your own opinions the weight they deserve.

Bob

PS agree with @1Darko that I am both a VIP and a relative newbie, learning every day. Being VIP takes a year on NPs and a certain level of activity and positive views, that is all. We have VIPs and future VIPs .

 

[Furquan]

Assuming what he says is even true - he seems to be advocating buying hand regs only and never after market - just because this worked for him during a given period doesn’t mean that is the way to go for everyone. Or that it will continue to work for him.

You have to reread my post before going on anything, I advised hand reg as well as buying cheap.

Invest little money the first year, I would recommend hand reg or buying silently for as cheap as you can

 

[MapleDots]

Everyone here is saying that it takes a long time to sell a domain name (If you're lucky)
But when you look at sites like Sedo, Flippa, Afternic, and even Park.io I see 100s of domains selling daily and at a good price. I know not every domain will be a winner

Most of those domains are fairly new. So how come people here are saying you need to wait years to make a sell? Are people trying to keep the newbie out of the business?

Also have to say: Most of the advice I got here has been extremely helpful. Just a little bit worried about this part and it's the most important.

HELP

It only really comes down to a few things....

- Take advice / or don't
- Spend like crazy on hand regs / or be frugal and researched

Depending on what you pick....

We will see if you're still in domaining a few years from now

Time usually tells the tale of a good domainer.

Nothing more needs to be said.

 

[E-Promote]

Are people trying to keep the newbie out of the business?...a little bit worried about this part and it's the most important.

The question to ask yourself should be: "Am I trying to keep myself out of the business?" Even if it were true that people are trying to "keep newbies out of the business" it is not "most important", in fact it's not important at all.

If your gut tells you there is something to this (domaining), something powerful, then push forward and ignore what other people think about what you are doing. There is a reason why there are a smaller % of people at the "top" of domaining. If you want to join them you can't act on, or pay much attention to, the noise of the other %.

 

[NameLlama]

There's a limited number of good domains to be had.
If you found a way of gaining wealth, but there was a limited opportunity (a kind of "gold mine"), would you join a public forum and give advice about the best ways to obtain it? Wouldn't it increase competition (drive up prices at expired auctions and dropcatchers?)
If someone is giving you a lot of free advice about how to make money from a limited resource, then
1. They might not be making much money in the area they're telling you about, but they want to be seen as wise. Maybe they're profitable in other ways that will always be out of your reach.
2. They don't believe most people who read their advice will actually follow it, so they're not worried. They're just wasting their time posting for some reason.
3. They would rather have competition than see tons of crap domains for sale and so much money wasted? Seems a bit odd.
4. They just want to be helpful, even if it brings competition? Also seems odd.

 

[DomainRecap]

But when you look at sites like Sedo, Flippa, Afternic, and even Park.io I see 100s of domains selling daily and at a good price.

If you ever want a reality check, look at it the other way around, and do a domain search for unsold domains on some of these sites. Like just take 4-6 characters starting with a certain Letter.

That'll give you a very tiny piece of the pill you'll need to swallow before moving on.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

But when you look at sites like Sedo, Flippa, Afternic, and even Park.io I see 100s of domains selling daily

A little confused, Afternic do not release their sales data to NameBio - where are you seeing them? (a few are individually reported on NameBio but for sure not 100s daily) Thanks.

It is important to put the numbers in perspective. Yes there are many sales reported daily, about 220 on average on NameBio. Let's look at Sedo - in the last year there were 4631 reported domain sales there. Sounds like a lot. especially since the average price was $5800, until you realize they have 19 million domains for sale. Over the year there was one reported sale per 4100 domain names. Now Sedo do not report most sales under $2000, so the complete numbers are more positive (maybe by factor of 20?), but it is still a tiny chance of any one domain name selling in a year.

It is important to look at the numbers and realize you must do substantially better than the average domain investor simply to break even, and you need to do as well as the select few to make a significantly amount at this.

Bob

 

[dande]

Selling domain names is by no means easy. Even harder when you are new in the industry. I don't think anyone is trying to keep you off the goldmine, just simple facts.

I started playing around domain business since 2009 but not until 2017 before making serious sales. It can be that hard. However, the profits can be very rewarding if you finally gets it right.

 

[Bob Hawkes]

I like your post @NameLlama and suspect there is some truth in each of your hypotheses. I think most of us do want the overall market to be stronger and the quality better (3) and also a lot of people on NPs are simply generous and helpful (4). And well some truth in (1) too .

But fundamentally I don't really think it is necessarily a negative for us when we help someone else do better. Yes, more competition in drops and auctions, I agree, and finding non-premium ngTLDs. But in terms of selling domains I don't think the main competition is each other, but rather organizations choosing to hand register, buy from the big companies (like HugeDomains), use a FB page or Wix etc.

A number of months ago I speculated on some numbers. In a typical day there are about 220 sales listed on NameBio but about 8800 hand registrations. On that typical day, over the entire globe, about 50,000 new businesses start. I think a healthier domain aftermarket can help us all, it is not a zero-sum game that if you help someone that is a sale you will never have. I think the after market can potentially grow, a lot, if we can better serve the needs of end users.

JMHO

Bob

 

[J Sokol]

On that typical day, over the entire globe, about 50,000 new businesses start.

I like this number and the fact that the market is so vast. And I agree that a healthier domain market can benefit all of us.

 

[WhoaDomain.com]

As someone who pissed off or annoyed or combo of people on NP. You have to take the good with the bad. Not everyone will like you in this world. Don't take it person. just keep on truckin.

although you can help your situation by not immediately posting a thread like this one.

you can't change people. That's mistake #1.
the only person you have control over is yourself. and how you deal with it.

 

[Kate]

2. They don't believe most people who read their advice will actually follow it, so they're not worried. They're just wasting their time posting for some reason.

This is a forum, it's made to discuss domains, and share knowledge. Some people are leeches, but some contribute and get knowledge in return. It's win-win. But it's true that lots of people are not listening to sound advice. So the words of caution from the veterans are not really deterring everyone

What is true is that the most successful domainers don't have a lot of time to post on forums. They are too busy making money. Now I gave myself away.

 

[PeakDots]

This is a forum, it's made to discuss domains, and share knowledge. Some people are leeches, but some contribute and get knowledge in return. It's win-win. But it's true that lots of people are not listening to sound advice. So the words of caution from the veterans are not really deterring everyone

What is true is that the most successful domainers don't have a lot of time to post on forums. They are too busy making money. Now I gave myself away.

I believe "success" is not always about the money.
If some do soak up the wisdom that you and other vets share here to help others, when they become better because of it, you may be a successful teacher and not even know it.

 

[MapleDots]

I believe "success" is not always about the money.

I beg to differ

success = being self sufficient, and having the money to do what you want to do.

There are a lot of other terms one can use but in business success has only one meaning and that is being profitable. I don't see anyone running a charity so we are all in it for the money.

Now in other aspects of life you can use any analogy you want but business has only one goal and that is to be profitable. Even the government requires you to be profitable, in Canada there are specific statements in the tax code saying you have to have a reasonable expectation to be profitable.

 

[PeakDots]

I beg to differ

success = being self sufficient, and having the money to do what you want to do.

There are a lot of other terms one can use but in business success has only one meaning and that is being profitable. I don't see anyone running a charity so we are all in it for the money.

Now in other aspects of life you can use any analogy you want but business has only one goal and that is to be profitable. Even the government requires you to be profitable, in Canada there are specific statements in the tax code saying you have to have a reasonable expectation to be profitable.

Understood,

I was just saying that some may not realize that they are accually helping others with the advice they give (for free) therefore being "successful" at teaching newcomers,that's all.

 

[alcy]

every new domainer wants to believe domaining is quick and easy money... and then every new domainer realizes domaing is exact oposite of quick and easy money.

sure some may get lucky with a few sales when they begin, but that means nothing because the ultimate goal of domaining is to minimize the "luck" factor of it all. even if it can never be completely eliminated.

if you understand and believe this now, which most new domainers fail to do, instead of thinking someone is trying to keep you out of the domaining biz, then it'll only make the road ahead that much more enjoyable and less stressful for you... cause you will know the key and secret to success in domaining, which is time, patience, learning (or in short: experience) ... while everyone else who does not believe this will be pulling their hairs out trying to understand why they are not making sales or having success in their beginnings or with their first domain regs.

cheers.

 

[.X.]

I have never heard of anyone trying to keep anyone out of the industry.

NooBs make no difference good, bad or indifferent in an experienced domainers endeavors, It's a huge industry and plenty of room for everyone who wishes to challenge it IMO

 

[lock]

Only when you learn the secret handshake and pass the initiation will you get VIP. Then you can control the domain industry.

 

[DOMAIN ILLUMINATI]

Are the VIPs trying to keep Newbies out of the business?

No, the VIPs are just trying to keep themselve in the businesss
Like the IPs.
And like the Ps.

VIPs = Very Important Persons

VIPs = Important Persons
VIPs = Persons​

 

[EbookLover]

Everyone is going to have their own opinions on this subject. It's going to be very hard to make sense out of it all once a thread like this is over.

If you want to sell domains fast, then you have to be a trend chaser. You have to be good at spotting internet trends and register good domains within that trend and immediately put them up for sale. You never want to hold on to a trendy domain as the domain loses all or most of it's value as the trend matures and dies. there are exceptions to every rule, but that is the rule. You have to be quick to register, but not so quick that you make mistakes and register a bunch of trendy domains that suck. But it's like high frequency trading - there are a lot of seasoned folks out there using a lot of tools to find $$$ domains quickly. But this is one way I know of to make fast sales.

Also, you may want to consider developing some domains in order to increase their value and hasten their sale. Just because a domain has a nice, brandable name, it doesn't mean much in many cases. An example would be a domain I own e/s/m/o/k/a (dot) com. It is a very brandable domain in the ecig/vaping genre. I own it because I had planed on developing it and going into the ecig business back in 2013 with a "buddy". I was going to start a line of vaping products for older smokers. But my "partner" bailed on me (he was going to be the $$$ investor in the deal). Then a year or so later my state made it very hard for folks within my state to get into selling vaping supplies by imposing super-high taxes. So for these and for various other reasons I did not pursue it. Point is, it's a very brandable name in it's niche, but that's all it is. I will get nothing or very little for it if I tried to sell it. At this point, I have spent roughly $48 in reg fees on it and I am doubtful it will sell for a profit, if it sells at all. What I should have done (had I had a crystal ball) was I should have tried selling it back in 2013. It still would have brought little profit, but probably more than today.

Of course, in order to develop a domain, you have to have that skill. Otherwise, you will have to pay someone else. There's nothing wrong with paying a developer, but obviously you can't be doing this on domains that are not going to bring at least X,XXX after developed.

DO NOT USE WHO IS PRIVACY!

I have gotten offers for domains that had whois privacy and have sold one. Whois privacy does not stop people from contacting you via email. It's just that they cannot see your email address...it's masked, like hsdf9834ljsfdo987345lijdrf90873w4ierdf8974ewifdg908.whoisprivacyservice.com. They only know your real email if you reply.

Is it best to remove whois privacy from a domain? I don't know. There are many opinions on this matter. Some say it increases their inbound sales by 10%, others say that the increase in sales, if any, is negligible. I think it depends on the domain and your portfolio. But if a buyer is serious about buying a domain, that buyer is not only going to send their offer to the whois privacy email address, but they are also going to check the domain's home page for a "for sale" landing page and a contact form. If a buyer is only surfing whois data, then that tells me they are not really that serious about buying a domain and may probably be a reseller (which means you will get less for your domain). I'm not against selling to resellers, but I'm also not going to sell a domain to a reseller that I think will garner 3X to 5X more if I wait a bit longer.

 

[cipcip]

Easy, you need years to sell a domain for big bucks because you need years to get the experience to know what to register.
If you register todayiamsellingdomains.com , this will never sell for even $1.

My advice: Look at what it sells and try to mimic, ofc, do not register any trademarks and such..

 

[Arfy]

I see people are quoting percentage figures of domains from their portfolio that they sell every year and the numbers vary considerably. This is because you are more likely to sell and flip premium domains than non premiums. However, the trade-off is that premium domains cost more to acquire in the first place so the ROI can be much lower. The level of quality varies from portfolio to portfolio.

For example, owning 1,000 ten letter domains may get a 1% sale rate. However, if you spent an average of $25 on each name and sold 10 names at $1k each in a year, then you have already made 40% of your investment back.

Now, if you buy 3 three letter .coms for $100k in total and sell 1 for $45k, again you have recouped 45% of your investment and it probably took less time to sell. However, you would need to put up more money in the first place and so the ROI is less per domain. The plus is that you are renewing less domains ever year. Also, with premium domains you are more likely to get a huge offer that will pay off your portfolio many times over (more likely doesn't mean it will happen).

Anyway, what I am trying to say is that, yes there are lots of sales but most of those domainers probably fit into the first category where they are holding a lot of inventory and selling a small percentage every year as well as spending a good portion of their profits on renewals.

It is not all rainbows but rather it is hard work, planning and a bit of luck.

 

[November]

wrong thread

 

[Haroon Basha]

Instead of blaming VIPs for discouraging you, you better start on your own, buy a dozen names, and try to sell them at a profit. I give you one month time. You register 12 names, and market it at various places, like NamePros, Sedo, Afternic etc. If you manage to sell even a SINGLE name in a month at a profit, YOU WON.

 

[Domainace]

Instead of blaming VIPs for discouraging you, you better start on your own

I don't see any evidence of old domainers trying to keep newbies out of the business. After all, the old domainers need newbies to buy the names they dump, and to buy up kryp-to.com and crypto.xyz2 - which enhances the value of their crypto.com.

In fact, if you see the old guard in any business trying to keep the new guys out, that's a sign that you need to work even harder. They are trying to protect their goldmine.

Sadly, that's not the case in domains. The market is weak at the moment, and the OG don't care one way or another if you are part of it. Sorry to say, but the "vips" are not trying to keep you out. They are all busy buying cryptocurrencies.