Ethics of staying quiet when newbies reg rubbish?

equity78 said:

Namepros cannot take that or want that responsibility. Over the years that would have been given to Adam Dicker, Rick Latona, maybe Shane Bellone and Chef Patrick.

There are no absolutes. There is no such thing as instant trust.

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Why would any of us trust another domain investor. That makes no logical sense either as a human or as a domain investor. We are a multitude of individual businesses each competing against the other.

That would be akin to BMW telling Ford the best way to build cars and then getting annoyed when they get told to sod off.

Maybe Ford are doing just fine and don't want to be told that what they are doing is wrong. Maybe, they are doing things differently but heck they've been doing it for a mighty long time.

Why would or should Ford trust BMW even if the advice was well intentioned.

Dog eat dog. Wóóf.com

Reddstagg said:

Why would any of us trust another domain investor. That makes no logical sense either as a human or as a domain investor. We are a multitude of individual businesses each competing against the other.

That would be akin to BMW telling Ford the best way to build cars and then getting annoyed when they get told to sod off.

Maybe Ford are doing just fine and don't want to be told that what they are doing is wrong. Maybe, they are doing things differently but heck they've been doing it for a mighty long time.

Why would or should Ford trust BMW even if the advice was well intentioned.

Dog eat dog. Wóóf.com

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I think I just said that, there would no reason for that tag or instant trust.

Reddstagg said:

Why would any of us trust another domain investor.

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I'm not the guy to follow people blindly but when it comes to trust, there are some people commenting on this thread who's opinion I trust a lot.

Why? Follow them around for a bit. I like people who put their money where their mouth is and if you are able to read between the lines it's easy to find very experienced domainers with a kind heart , and very knowledgeable, willing to give advice and help where needed.

very odd, I was under the impression that collaboration, honesty and transparency where virtues that some businesses aspire towards?

I know quite a few owners of companies that follow these values, they are successful and have a happy workforce.

We don't all have to sell our souls to run a profitable and well run company......

Sh*t I must be getting naive in my middle years........

This thread had nothing do with the dashing venison, and he has lassoed no-one nor taken control of it. The thread belongs to everyone whom participates, with an important nod to the thread's OP for giving all a platform to express their opinion on the matter.

We all know by now those whom we interact with, which lead to either learning opportunities or being lost in a forest and trying to get out only to end up back at the same spot in which we began.

Bob Hawkes said:

But we should not do anything that takes the responsibility for their decisions away from the person themselves. Each of us should be responsible for our own decisions.

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NLP said:

But in general, I think don't really sink in until the person makes their own mistakes. Registering and dropping 200-300 names is painful. It's money that could be spent on other things.

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Silentptnr said:

I think each investor has a plan, solid or not, that I may not know about. I respect that.

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I think these sentiments sum up the answer for domain investing, crypto investing, fishing, stock investing, or just about anything else in life.

People are driven by curiosity, experimentation, and free will. In the end, all of us are ultimately responsible for our own actions. If someone asks advice on their names, then by all means let them have any criticism that you think will help them. But if they are not asking for the advice, and even worse, if they have been given unwanted advice over and over again, are we really making life better for that person?

The chances that any significant number of people on here are dumping all their money into bad domains, and are no longer able to buy food, is pretty slim. Though, I've seen people go to the casino and blow their life savings in a matter of months. Do I now have a duty to stand outside the casino with a Public Service Announcement? Of course not. It's common sense you shouldn't do this. But people do it every day.

Luckily, as domain investors, all of us face 1 day every year where we're forced to reflect on our past decisions and that is renewal day. If we made a poor choice last year by registering 1,000 bad domains ($8,500 worth), then decide to re-register all 1,000 of those domains without getting a single sale, then I don't think it matters what advice we get at that point.

Aside from my main collection of domains bought between years 2000-2020, I've made other posts on NamePros where I've laid out how I've gone from a $20k ($10k one year and $10k 3 years later) domain investment with a partner in 2015 and turned that into over $40k per year in recurring annual sales from this same account, and also detailed how this year I was able to get a $24,500 sale from that same set of domains. In other posts, I've given the same (or better) guidelines I've used myself in buying each domain in recent years. Do any of the people follow this advice when registering bad domains? Not even close. Yet, it's all out there for free just like countless amounts of good information on here.

So even though we think we are just saving people by telling them the "truth", the information is out there already and it's FREE. If they are deciding not to read it, and are not asking for advice, then we should really just let them be. In life, some people prefer learning via their own experience and path.

Now that I've reflected on everything, I really went through some distinct stages in Domain Investing and if I try to pull someone out of stage 1 and stick them in stage 5, is it really going to work? For the right person it may, but likely it will not.

• Stage 1 (Liking the domain idea stage) - Bought names that interested me (up to 300-450 domains)
• Stage 2 (Hmmm, my names are not half bad stage) - Got unsolicited offers on domains
• Stage 3 (I don't like selling my names, what if I find names that others like stage) - Started buying names to sell.
• Stage 4 (I've sold a domain that others like stage) - Sold my first domain
• Stage 5 (Maybe I should buy more of these stage) - Bought 1,000 more domains
• Stage 6 (Maybe I should buy even more of these stage ) - Sold $20k in domains in 1 year

I've gone through many stages since then, and many that required learning new information or new ways of thinking. Traveling between each of these stages is a paradigm shift between what you currently believe and what your new set of beliefs are. Stage 1 by itself took a few years for me as I didn't even know domain investing existed. Stage 2 to Stage 4 took me about 1-2 years. So everyone is really on their own journey in one way or another.

NickB said:

Sh*t I must be getting naive in my middle years........

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It's not just the years that add to that. Eversince I had a kid I've become a real pussy .

Love your signature quote btw.

most who tell newbies not reg..also regged...me too......
so its called life and biz experience..and yes we can read a book about travels to india...but it never replaces our own experience of it...

alcy said:

most who tell newbies not reg..also regged...me too......
so its called life and biz experience..and yes we can read a book about travels to india...but it never replaces our own experience of it...

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This is true.. how ever those books might help in gaining insight as to what to expect. eh., what hostels to stay at, transportation mechanisms, eateries, local customs, a whole plethora of weaponry before going into battle. It certainly doesn't hurt anyways...yes?

I get ya though, nothing replaces your own experience- and in fact it can lead to exciting, unexpected outcomes, be it travel thru domaining, or travel thru life. And some of us, need to experience this for ourselves, not being "told" to..

For me it is simple. If the person asked for opinion I will tell him what I think, if the name sucks or not. If no request then no need to get involved.

HotKey said:

This is true.. how ever those books might help in gaining insight as to what to expect. eh., what hostels to stay at, transportation mechanisms, eateries, local customs, a whole plethora of weaponry before going into battle. It certainly doesn't hurt anyways...yes?

I get ya though, nothing replaces your own experience- and in fact it can lead to exciting, unexpected outcomes, be it travel thru domaining, or travel thru life. And some of us, need to experience this for ourselves, not being "told" to..

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To continue with the travel analogy...

I would be frustrated if every evening for a month a fellow hostel guest recounts how they again paid too much at the market by not taking simple precautions. That's what it feels like when I see someone repeatedly, over a long period, post worthless domain names. Of course, if I didn't like it enough, I could always move hostels (or put them on ignore).

I like to help out when I can, but we can only do so much. Domaining is a business for most of us and we only have so many hours in the day to make money. For me it’s more a matter of time management than ethics. I’d love to help every new domainer, but I only have so much spare time. That being said, I think we should all strive to help. I hate seeing people waste money on a lost cause.

Reddstagg said:

Why would any of us trust another domain investor. That makes no logical sense either as a human or as a domain investor. We are a multitude of individual businesses each competing against the other.

That would be akin to BMW telling Ford the best way to build cars and then getting annoyed when they get told to sod off.

Maybe Ford are doing just fine and don't want to be told that what they are doing is wrong. Maybe, they are doing things differently but heck they've been doing it for a mighty long time.

Why would or should Ford trust BMW even if the advice was well intentioned.

Dog eat dog. Wóóf.com

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When you become wealthy, up to a certain extent, you will found that it's meaningless to chase for profit only. You will chase for something more spiritual.

pb said:

I tend to stay quiet when I see people posting crap domains in "reg of the day" or "snap of the day" threads, just as I tend to stay quiet when people post crap domains going for 4-figures in "report completed sales".

Thing is, it's very subjective so while it's great to share tips and advice about regging/buying domains, it's not always wise to comment on how someone uses that advice, because nobody is always right.

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pb you should check my hand reg please and dislike the ones you think are long shot to sell, I understand but trying to learn!

kam said:

When you become wealthy, up to a certain extent, you will found that it's meaningless to chase for profit only. You will chase for something more spiritual.

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How do you measure wealth? I could have nothing tangible and still be the richest person on earth. I may find richness in something that has no value.

I may just be happy having nothing but experience and memories.

Reddstagg said:

How do you measure wealth? I could have nothing tangible and still be the richest person on earth. I may find richness in something that has no value.

I may just be happy having nothing but experience and memories.

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True, but now you are just talking philosophy.

That is all fine and dandy, but can you pay rent or bills with nothing? Not really.

Is money everything? No. But a lack of it is often a major issue and can limit your options.

Brad

Reddstagg said:

Why would any of us trust another domain investor.

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I must have been fortunate then, I've bought dozens of domains from fellow domainers and have always received the domain after sending the money.

I've sold dozens of domains to other domainers without escrow and have never had any of them try and pull a fast one by disputing the transaction with paypal or their bank after taking the domain.

In 11 years I've not been screwed over by a domainer.

bmugford said:

True, but now you are just talking philosophy.

That is all fine and dandy, but can you pay rent or bills with nothing? Not really.

Is money everything? No. But a lack of it is often a major issue and can limit your options.

Brad

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Maybe then the path to serenity and peace and the true measure of success is to have many things but no rent or bills.

Only when one is financially free can one walk their own path and not take the path that has already been trodded.

You can do what you like when money isn't the motivating factor. Take risks that others will not or cannot.

Maybe, domain investing really is just about the journey and not the final destination.

We-is-Woke.com

Rob Monster said:

Almost every domain investor goes through the phase where they think they found something that others missed and then back up the truck. Early in my own domaining career, I had 5000 domains at Godaddy, and probably kept 5% of those in the end. So, yes, it is a thing and we do see it often.

Sometimes the stories are heartbreaking, e.g. people who spent their entire nest-egg on names that are almost unsellable. The reality is that the vast majority of the 390 million domains registered are of no value to anyone, even the registrant themselves.

If you see someone spending way too much on domains that are almost certainly not to sell, or where the new investor has a wildly uninformed expectation, I think you can gently engage them in a dialog about their domain investing history and see if they want any help selling their domains. Some will appreciate the help.

DomainGraduate.com is a free online course that we did produce in part for this exact reason. The course was acquired from veteran domainer, Sean Stafford, and then upgraded. We made it free from the outset, precisely to help more folks learn before they spend big. It exists in a few languages now.

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Ironically Rob....i'm sure the name DomainGraduate.com would have been considered "rubbish" when it was first registered back in 2007. Ironically I just hand registered "Scotch Academy" to compliment "Discover Scotch" that some old time domainers here would consider rubbish as well.

Rob, i've actually learned a lot from you, but I've also learned that you too have an agenda like most of us. My agenda has always been to question everything I don't understand...thus the name of one of my businesses i owned for 15 years, "Inquisitor Investigations".

Finally, it's because I question everything that I learn, and for some people learning is FUN

DomainGist said:

I dip in and out of this forum, leave for 9 months, back for 6 etc. Most recently quit domaining and had a change of heart and started to rebuild.

But every time I come back here I see a few newbies hand-registering absolutely turgid rubbish by the hundreds or even thousands.I won't name any names here as it would look like an attack.

I know that some people just won't listen, and I see a few people trying to get them to stop, but these people are undermined by people who 'like' their reg of the day.

Lets be clear here, I'm not talking about 'subjectivity' here, but I'm talking about people registering domains with 3 hypens, or 50 character nonsense domains.

So two questions:

1. Do we have moral obligation to be straight with these newbies and tell them that they are registering rubbish, even if this is a thankless task and the person refuses to listen and even doubles down on what they are doing.

2. Is it ethical for experienced domainers to 'like' posts which seem to validate the newbies selections.

I look at some of these people with thousands of completely unsellable hand regs, and on one hand I do think that they probably play their part in keeping registration and renewal prices down for every domainer as these nonsense domains are part of the ecosystem and generate cash for the registry and registrars, but on the other hand these domainers could be in debt, or blowing money from family savings without their wives knowing.

I find it very difficult to see people spending like $7000 on terrible handregs without saying something.

One particular individual got very angry with me and suggested that he isn't rich enough to get domains from closeout, but a domain from closeout costs what... $25 including one year renewal, and this individual has hundreds and hundreds of hand regs from all sorts of extentions. So if they took their time they could build a decent port of say 100 closeout domains over a period of 12-18 months, that would probably cost them less.

Why do people ignore these newbies and let them waste their money, and more importantly why do some people seem to encourage this really self-destructive and damaging behaviour by pressing 'like' on red-widget8383eu.biz or whatever nonsense they have registered?

Thoughts?

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I agree with your thoughts, but sometimes people just want to do handregs thinking the seniors might not be advising them correctly.

True .. sometimes I believe we wanted to hear a brutal truth than sweet words, I am doing some hand regs and they are in 60 day period lock, but I don't know what sells fast or the quality as I think the ones who selling a lot are the ones who can guess .. but at the end, no one knows what works and what will sell out.

xbank said:

but at the end, no one knows what works and what will sell out.

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There is indeed an element of truth in that. But lets accept that everyone of us that have a history of sales are basing our advice on experience and for every sale we made we are acutely aware of our domains that never received even one offer over the say the 10 to 20 years of buying and selling domains.

There is no hidden agenda in the advice and critique we offer. I consider it my thanks to some great guys that helped me out at my beginnings in 1999 and all the years since

Reddstagg said:

Maybe then the path to serenity and peace and the true measure of success is to have many things but no rent or bills.

Only when one is financially free can one walk their own path and not take the path that has already been trodded.

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I don't believe financial wealth is everything. There are much more meaningful things.

However, now back to reality... If anything you are arguing for financial wealth as that is what provides the freedom you are talking about.

Without financial wealth how do you expect to have no rent and no bills exactly?

Brad

bmugford said:

I don't believe financial wealth is everything. There are much more meaningful things.

However, now back to reality... If anything you are arguing for financial wealth as that is what provides the freedom you are talking about.

Without financial wealth how do you expect to have no rent and no bills exactly?

Brad

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Thanks for your comments.

Then, truly I am blessed as I don't have rent, mortgage payments or large bills which is why I am able to be a domain investor.

Maybe that's why I take some risks that others may not.

What I find disturbing, and I've mentioned it many times in different threads, is the amount of praise heaped upon posters who constantly offer some New avenue or alternative approach to getting results/sales. These members 'Usually' have absolutely no sales history to mention (maybe the odd $10's here and there) But what they do is offer a deceptive avenue that reinforces mostly 'new comers' hopes. Is there an agenda for this - Actually YES, They have, in the main the false belief that is domainers that drive demand and ultimately create potential market.growth -

Quite often they do it unwittingly and will cite obscure one-off (or maybe even a few over time) sales as substantiating their supposed wisdom. It's easy to understand why people follow them. It gives a false dawn and of course the availability of domains to follow that path

These posts are usually based upon the figment of that members hopes and aspirations but dressed-up as sound advice and unfortunately received as such by many. Others just then join in the band-wagon of a hopeful outlook. Unfortunately that is all that it is and ever will be