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Ethics of staying quiet when newbies reg rubbish?

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I dip in and out of this forum, leave for 9 months, back for 6 etc. Most recently quit domaining and had a change of heart and started to rebuild.

But every time I come back here I see a few newbies hand-registering absolutely turgid rubbish by the hundreds or even thousands.I won't name any names here as it would look like an attack.

I know that some people just won't listen, and I see a few people trying to get them to stop, but these people are undermined by people who 'like' their reg of the day.

Lets be clear here, I'm not talking about 'subjectivity' here, but I'm talking about people registering domains with 3 hypens, or 50 character nonsense domains.

So two questions:

1. Do we have moral obligation to be straight with these newbies and tell them that they are registering rubbish, even if this is a thankless task and the person refuses to listen and even doubles down on what they are doing.

2. Is it ethical for experienced domainers to 'like' posts which seem to validate the newbies selections.

I look at some of these people with thousands of completely unsellable hand regs, and on one hand I do think that they probably play their part in keeping registration and renewal prices down for every domainer as these nonsense domains are part of the ecosystem and generate cash for the registry and registrars, but on the other hand these domainers could be in debt, or blowing money from family savings without their wives knowing.

I find it very difficult to see people spending like $7000 on terrible handregs without saying something.

One particular individual got very angry with me and suggested that he isn't rich enough to get domains from closeout, but a domain from closeout costs what... $25 including one year renewal, and this individual has hundreds and hundreds of hand regs from all sorts of extentions. So if they took their time they could build a decent port of say 100 closeout domains over a period of 12-18 months, that would probably cost them less.

Why do people ignore these newbies and let them waste their money, and more importantly why do some people seem to encourage this really self-destructive and damaging behaviour by pressing 'like' on red-widget8383eu.biz or whatever nonsense they have registered?

Thoughts?
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
Unasked for advice is a waste of time in many cases. Every year we see a fresh round of newbies who are too bullheaded to accept critiques from those with more experience . Many times those same people are bemoaning no sales after blank amount of time. If you aren’t in this to make money its a rather expensive hobby.

I think its best to just focus on your own portfolio and don’t worry yourself about other people’s garbage domains. If your competitors won’t take constructive criticism thats one less competitor a few years from now. This business is not for everyone and there is a revolving door repetition when people see they can’t get rich quick or don’t have the skills and cash flow needed.

Correct and the truth of the matter is most people don't want unsolicited advice. They want a superstar like Rick, Frank or Mike to give them a roadmap to weatlth, they don't want Insert Forum name to tell them what they think, especially when most times that person is an unknown with little to no documented success.
 
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Keep in mind, 5 months in, 3 offers on hundreds of domains is not a benchmark of a quality portfolio, more so if they are only xx offers. Just sayin’.

Again, appreciate the feedback. I have seen the figure of 1-2% sell through rate as being like an industry standard and it is sometimes used as a cautionary tale which is usually accompanied by lots of stats and figures. However, on a side note one of the offers was $xxx rather than the other two which were both $xx. We live and we learn and I will keep on doing what I do with the odd curve ball thrown in for good measure.
 
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Again, appreciate the feedback. I have seen the figure of 1-2% sell through rate as being like an industry standard and it is sometimes used as a cautionary tale which is usually accompanied by lots of stats and figures. However, on a side note one of the offers was $xxx rather than the other two which were both $xx. We live and we learn and I will keep on doing what I do with the odd curve ball thrown in for good measure.

I use the 1-2% number, but in general to me that is more end user price range (Mid $XXX - Mid $X,XXX).

If people offered quality domains for $XX that sell through rate would obviously be much higher.

Also, accepted offers don't always yield sales. I could retire off the offers I have accepted that didn't pan out.

Brad
 
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I agree with this, offers do provide a proof of concept. Might not be a sale, but it shows you/we are doing something right.

The key is knowing when to accept or how to negotiate those offers into cold hard cash. This is more difficult and something I need to work on...

I agree. At the end of the day money talks, bullshit walks.

If you are putting up consistent results, keep doing what you are doing.
If you are not putting up consistent results, consider changing something.

Brad

Couldn't agree more. Other people seem to be more concerned by my lack of sales than I am. I went into this with a long term plan. I prepared for the first year of renewals and just dropped those domains that were part of the learning curve. Live and learn. Success can be measured in many different ways. I'm living in a Country where it was only possible to get broadband to the house a year ago so in some ways I am playing catch up and probably always will be. People seem to forget that this is only my second year. Name me one other business where there would be any return on investment in maybe the first five years. Zero to 400 in just one year. Part of learning is discovering when to hold them and when to fold them. I'm getting there. If I have ever needed any help I have been intelligent enough to know what to ask and from whom and I have then processed the information and made decisions.

This is a long game and I'm set to be here when many others may have quit.
 
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I dip in and out of this forum, leave for 9 months, back for 6 etc. Most recently quit domaining and had a change of heart and started to rebuild.

But every time I come back here I see a few newbies hand-registering absolutely turgid rubbish by the hundreds or even thousands.I won't name any names here as it would look like an attack.

I know that some people just won't listen, and I see a few people trying to get them to stop, but these people are undermined by people who 'like' their reg of the day.

Lets be clear here, I'm not talking about 'subjectivity' here, but I'm talking about people registering domains with 3 hypens, or 50 character nonsense domains.

So two questions:

1. Do we have moral obligation to be straight with these newbies and tell them that they are registering rubbish, even if this is a thankless task and the person refuses to listen and even doubles down on what they are doing.

2. Is it ethical for experienced domainers to 'like' posts which seem to validate the newbies selections.

I look at some of these people with thousands of completely unsellable hand regs, and on one hand I do think that they probably play their part in keeping registration and renewal prices down for every domainer as these nonsense domains are part of the ecosystem and generate cash for the registry and registrars, but on the other hand these domainers could be in debt, or blowing money from family savings without their wives knowing.

I find it very difficult to see people spending like $7000 on terrible handregs without saying something.

One particular individual got very angry with me and suggested that he isn't rich enough to get domains from closeout, but a domain from closeout costs what... $25 including one year renewal, and this individual has hundreds and hundreds of hand regs from all sorts of extentions. So if they took their time they could build a decent port of say 100 closeout domains over a period of 12-18 months, that would probably cost them less.

Why do people ignore these newbies and let them waste their money, and more importantly why do some people seem to encourage this really self-destructive and damaging behaviour by pressing 'like' on red-widget8383eu.biz or whatever nonsense they have registered?

Thoughts?

when asked
weather in public or PM

I name it the way it is.


when asking for help
why not be honest?
 
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I have seen the figure of 1-2% sell through rate as being like an industry standard
It's not going to be anywhere near 1% if your domains are all trash.
 
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Name me one other business where there would be any return on investment in maybe the first five years. Zero to 400 in just one year. Part of learning is discovering when to hold them and when to fold them. I'm getting there. If I have ever needed any help I have been intelligent enough to know what to ask and from whom and I have then processed the information and made decisions.

It is a tough analogy to make because in most other businesses you have proof of concepts built in.

If you pay $200K to open a restaurant, sure it might take you several years to offset that investment but you would have steady income. You would know sooner than later if that initial investment is likely to pay off.

Brad
 
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I use the 1-2% number, but in general to me that is more end user price range (Mid $XXX - Mid $X,XXX).

If people offered quality domains for $XX that sell through rate would obviously be much higher.

Also, accepted offers don't always yield sales. I could retire off the offers I have accepted that didn't pan out.

Brad

That's a point that people don't consider. I can reg a .com for $6. if I sell it for $9 I have achieved a return on investment of 1.5. I' don't need to be selling every domain name that I have for $xxxx. I am in a completely different arena to most people but maybe that is what scares them. Those lights they see in the rear view mirror could well be mine...move over...beeep beeep.
 
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It's not going to be anywhere near 1% if your domains are all trash.

Are you stating a fact or are your just presuming that all of my domains are trash?

All three offers were on not.coms. Explain that if all my names are trash.
 
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That's a point that people don't consider. I can reg a .com for $6. if I sell it for $9 I have achieved a return on investment of 1.5. I' don't need to be selling every domain name that I have for $xxxx. I am in a completely different arena to most people but maybe that is what scares them. Those lights they see in the rear view mirror could well be mine...move over...beeep beeep.

That math is flawed though, unless you never renew a single domain. Otherwise, you need to account for all the domains you don't sell in a given year, not just the ones you do sell.

And if you never renew a single domain you would need to make an awful lot of sales at $3 a pop profit, to make it worth doing.

I know personally I am not wasting the time it takes to send multiple emails, transfer domains, etc. for $3 each.

Brad
 
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I would like to be told the truth about my domains being junk and believe me i am one of those who has registered some junk domains. I would not be upset if a person told be it was worth $1 or absolutely $0. Obviously I am doing something wrong and would go back and do some research. I like doing this as a hobby and i enjoy messing around with names,Ideas and would only register what i can afford.

I think also the appraisals out there do not help the matter making out it can be a quick buck which of course is not true.


the problem is not only
that you may have unfortunate names

the other problem may be
that the appraiser
has not the same background and information as you do

so you might get a negativ feedback for a domain
that could sell

(when talk about "sell" I talk about at least $400 USD)

so you had some ideas
when registering

they maybe BS or not
YOU only know it

so stick to your guts and ideas
but be more aware and critical
when registering


still your names maybe absolutely unsellable
 
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That math is flawed though, unless you never renew a single domain. Otherwise, you need to account for all the domains you don't sell in a given year, not just the ones you do sell.

And if you never renew a single domain you would need to make an awful lot of sales at $3 a pop profit, to make it worth doing.

I know personally I am not wasting the time it takes to send multiple emails, transfer domains, etc. for $3 each.

Brad

I have a spreadsheet set up recording my profit and loss for all time and ytd so I will be keeping a close eye on expenditure. I may even go as high as $4...live dangerously. Obviously, there is so much to learn and so little time to do it but I'm a fast learner and I'm sure I will be fine.

Ask me in another year. Lol
 
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the problem is not only
that you may have unfortunate names

the other problem may be
that the appraiser
has not the same background and information as you do

so you might get a negativ feedback for a domain
that could sell

(when talk about "sell" I talk about at least $400 USD)

so you had some ideas
when registering

they maybe BS or not
YOU only know it

so stick to your guts and ideas
but be more aware and critical
when registering


still your names maybe absolutely unsellable
Famous straight talking German logic in action 🙂
 
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$20 who the hell is gonna go to io? or even pronounce io
A piece of advice to a newbie who was asking an appraisal for poker.io feeeeeeew years ago :D

A person who can sell "widget8383eu.biz" isn't a newbie at all. :D
 
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"Ethics of staying quiet when newbies reg rubbish?"

The title of this thread assumes many things, firstly of course is that everyone understands and agrees the definition of the word 'ethics'. The term 'ethics' is usually described and defined as involving some form of 'morality', and that alone opens up a huge debate on what and whose morality is the base on which the then definition of 'ethics' is subsequently based on.

The title then goes on to an action, that of 'staying quiet'. Does this include not posting derogatory remarks about a persons vision of the domains they have registered?

Then the word 'newbie' is in the title. Can someone, including the author of the thread please give some kind of sensible definition of the word 'newbie'. The term 'newbie' would seem to be a time limited term, after all an established member can surely not be referred to as a 'newbie' can they? But then again what dictates the definition of an established member? Is a 'newbie' someone who has not registered a domain name yet or perhaps someone who has not been domaining for 1 month, 3 months, 6 months, or even a year? Or is it that the number of domains a domainer has registered that should be used as a yard stick to measure if someone is a 'newbie'?

Then of course we come to the great word 'rubbish'. I look around this world and I see many amazing things with strange names, a giraffe for example, why is it called a giraffe? Even if we think about language many things that we take for granted today was unintelligible in the past, some of them in the recent past. Look at the business names that succeed today and in the recent past, some of them are either totally unrelated to the business they represent or are meaningless in themselves as existing words. All of this should indicate that just to say something is 'rubbish' is as about as 'rubbish' as you could get.

Perhaps my age and mellowing temperament mean that now instead of insulting people or their thoughts I would try to engage them into why they registered a domain. When someone asks for help then if I think I can help with constructive advice I will normally give it.

There is one piece of advice I would give to anyone thinking of taking up domaining - make and follow a plan to read up on cognitive psychology of words, it is a fascinating subject and perhaps will help in understanding domaining and all its facets much better.

Oh, and before you think that is 'rubbish' - read the paragraph below:

"Aoccdrnig to rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it deosn't mttaer in waht oredr the ltteers in a wrod are, the olny iprmoetnt tihng is taht the frist and lsat ltteer be at the rghit pclae. The rset can be a toatl mses and you can sitll raed it wouthit a porbelm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe. "

https://www.mrc-cbu.cam.ac.uk/people/matt.davis/cmabridge/

(Damn, I just couldn't resist replying. :xf.smile::xf.grin::xf.rolleyes: )
 
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I have a spreadsheet set up recording my profit and loss for all time and ytd so I will be keeping a close eye on expenditure. I may even go as high as $4...live dangerously. Obviously, there is so much to learn and so little time to do it but I'm a fast learner and I'm sure I will be fine.

Ask me in another year. Lol

I would just be aware of the math.

If you registered 100 .COM @ $6 each you have $600 in expenses in year 1.
If you renew 1/2 of them the next year @ $8 that is another $400 in expenses.

With a 1% STR you could expect to sell 1.5 domains.
With a 2% STR you could expect to sell 3 domains.

The domains need to be of a certain quality to reach that STR when it comes to end user pricing.
You would need to sell those 1.5 - 3 domains for $1000 total just to break even.

Brad
 
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Couldn't agree more. Other people seem to be more concerned by my lack of sales than I am. I went into this with a long term plan. I prepared for the first year of renewals and just dropped those domains that were part of the learning curve. Live and learn. Success can be measured in many different ways. I'm living in a Country where it was only possible to get broadband to the house a year ago so in some ways I am playing catch up and probably always will be. People seem to forget that this is only my second year. Name me one other business where there would be any return on investment in maybe the first five years. Zero to 400 in just one year. Part of learning is discovering when to hold them and when to fold them. I'm getting there. If I have ever needed any help I have been intelligent enough to know what to ask and from whom and I have then processed the information and made decisions.

This is a long game and I'm set to be here when many others may have quit.
You might be a bit too concerned by what people on this forum think about you. You don't need to justify your actions or plans to anyone.

So what if no-one gets you? These kinds of posts won't change that, and it shouldn't matter. Go do your thing and don't get involved in debates regarding your ideas.
 
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You can't help anyone that doesn't want help, so I will usually only post if they're asking for a review/appraisal. I was a cook in the past and we had a saying, "don't serve anything you wouldn't eat yourself". For example in the handreg/purchase of the day forums I would only like a name that I would buy myself. I can see how the likes may be misleading, that's why you have to trust your source of approval. One of my favorite segments of the sherpa was portfolio review and perhaps namepros could benefit from having a have a similar section in appraisals. We should all just listen to Nick, he knows me make our own luck :)

I think it is a little condescending of the original poster to presume that people are being encouraged further just because they got a like on a forum. It's a small victory, but it isn't the main motivating factor. Buying or regging is easy it's the selling that is the hard bit. People who are new or not so confident seek approval from their peers and more often than not they will be let down gently and re-directed and encouraged to study and learn.

I should give more likes or thanks personally but I always forget. I will try harder in future.
 
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I would just be aware of the math.

If you registered 100 .COM @ $6 each you have $600 in expenses in year 1.
If you renew 1/2 of them the next year @ $8 that is another $400 in expenses.

With a 1% STR you could expect to sell 1.5 domains.
With a 2% STR you could expect to sell 3 domains.

The domains need to be of a certain quality to reach that STR when it comes to end user pricing.
You would need to sell those 1.5 - 3 domains for $1000 total just to break even.

Brad

I think that those figures are doable. I mean, how hard can it really be? Joking. I'm still learning the whole process so I just write that off as start-up costs and maybe they will be returned to me in year 5,6 or 7. I'm in this for the long haul.

Maybe, people take my fun loving attitude as a sign that I do not take this seriously but I can assure your that I'm doing something domain related 3-4 hours per day 7 days a week. I bought several domains lately rather than just hand regging names so I can switch it up a bit when an opportunity presents itself. One of the name I now own gets 50,000 searches every month apparently. Now, if only I knew how to make money from that I think I'd retire early and happy.
 
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One of the difficult things about domaining compared to most industries is that for the most part you don’t know much if anything about the person you are conversing with, getting advice from. There are exceptions of course, people get to meet people at domain conferences, (though no one has on their badge, I am broke or I am a scammer). There are also high profile domainers who share a lot and use their real name.

Opinions or advice without knowing anything behind the person giving them are pretty empty imo.

You get people who give opinions on names in appraisal sections and you have no idea if they know anything about the industry said name belongs to. Do they know anything about linguistics, branding? No?

The value of that opinion is reg fee, like so many domains are appraised at reg fee. The theory for some goes if someone paid $9 for it then it can’t be worthless, others would differ in their opinion. So the same goes for people, you have the right to speak and to give an opinion, but it equates to reg fee.

Same goes with negotiation advice, some people give very bad advice in forums and blog comments. For the person seeking negotiation advice, all they know is MetallicaFan has a sweet avatar but might not even know how to negotiate for an extra .50 an hour at their job.

The worst advice in my opinion, comes from those anonymous sources who are giving legal advice. “You tell that company to go f themselves!” “I would ignore it, you have every right to own a name with Instagram it.” Yeah might be better to contact Berryhill or Lieberman. The truth is most domainers who participate on forums and blogs know very little to nothing about TM law and intellectual property.

Another thing that happens with not knowing the people you interact with is there are many false narratives that get built up.

One tidbit that surprised a lot of people came up in the CQD.com case on Namepros. James Booth had unknowingly bought a stolen domain, that belonged to a lady in Florida.

One of the hot takes of that thread was some people who never met or knew anything about Mr.Booth, declaring he was a millionaire and that he should just eat the loss, he can afford it.

To which Mr. Booth posted:



I had a couple people say to me they were flabbergasted that Booth was not a millionaire. I asked the one person if they ever met James or knew anything about him? They just figured that they saw him mentioned on Namepros and DNJournal so he was rich.

You have to do your homework in the business and verify from more than one source if you are going to spend money, or make a deal.

You need to do your homework thoroughly, you need to be meticulous before making a decision that affects your domain business.

In this business no one really knows a lot about anyone. Hopefully you know yourself and go from there. Best of luck.
 
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I have been seeing a lot of cringe-worthy domain regs, mostly domains with dashes. Domains I wouldn't have even registered when I was a noob. Focusing on dashed domains, people who reg keywords with dashes think they are domains that will rank well & thus have value, Google has said that dashes were seen as spam as they were being used by people trying to win the system. I've never seen or heard of a well-established company willingly use dashes in their domain. Don't you think that's an obvious hint that dashes are not user friendly? Honestly, dashes in domains should not be allowed as they are indeed usually taken & used for malicious purposes.
 
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I have been seeing a lot of cringe-worthy domain regs, mostly domains with dashes. Domains I wouldn't have even registered when I was a noob. Focusing on dashed domains, people who reg keywords with dashes think they are domains that will rank well & thus have value, Google has said that dashes were seen as spam as they were being used by people trying to win the system. I've never seen or heard of a well-established company willingly use dashes in their domain. Don't you think that's an obvious hint that dashes are not user friendly? Honestly, dashes in domains should not be allowed as they are indeed usually taken & used for malicious purposes.

Germany would disagree
 
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Germany would disagree

I have sold plenty of hyphenated .COM for $X,XXX+. The key is it needs to be a popular term separated by one well placed hyphen. Some examples I have sold are ones like Cash-Back, Wedding-Dress, etc.

Brad
 
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You might be a bit too concerned by what people on this forum think about you. You don't need to justify your actions or plans to anyone.

So what if no-one gets you? These kinds of posts won't change that, and it shouldn't matter. Go do your thing and don't get involved in debates regarding your ideas.

I was outed on a public post and I took the right to reply which was deemed to be antagonistic by The Mods and my post was removed. I accepted that and moved on this thread was started and aimed specifically at me. People can see what has been posted and I have the right to reply again.

If people would worry less about my business model and leave me alone I will not need to keep on defending my actions.

The thing that bugs me the most about this sort of behavior is when it may be directed at someone that maybe is more easily influenced by the opinion of others and may take the criticism to heart. Maybe I am wrong or even right but if we are here to learn maybe people can accept that learning comes in many forms. Just because I am new to domain investing does not mean that I am new to life.

I think I have had enough now so I will come to a close and wish you all well for the future.

Remember the name. REDDSTAGG...two D's and two G's
 
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I have sold plenty of hyphenated .COM for $X,XXX+. The key is it needs to be a popular term separated by one well placed hyphen. Some examples I have sold are ones like Cash-Back, Wedding-Dress, etc.

Brad

I remember you saying


I sold a hyphenated .COM in the last couple weeks for $14K. It was probably a term that would have sold for $500,000+ without the hyphen.

However, I will say hyphenated sales are few and far between even for top quality terms that make sense.
That type of sale is an outlier.

Brad
 
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