IT.COM

status-monitor Reforming the NamePros Thanks and Likes System

NameSilo
Watch

Ategy

Arif M, NameCult.com TheDomainSocial.comTop Member
Impact
17,389
I know I've brought this up in the past .. couldn't find it though so I'm guessing it was within another thread where it was only part of the discussion. I found myself about to post more comments on this in another thread but figured best to create it's own stand alone topic.

Anyhow, in most forums like-count really doesn't matter as much as it potentially does at NamePros, because at NamePros there is business being conducted and money exchanged .. so while a deceptively and unmerited high "like-count" is harmless in most other online forums, at NamePros there could be actual tangible harm do if people equate "like-count" to trust/authority.

Now I know NamePros says people should not make or assume a connection between like count and trust/authority .. but let's be honest and say that people's like count most certainly does influence what people think of them. Particularly newcomers looking for "expert" opinions .. 90%(+) of newcomers will trust someone with a noticeably higher post count than someone else.

Here's what was taken from the other thread ...

Anyone over a ratio of 1.5 is providing good value but for you, your ratio is a whooping 3.4 which is truly amazing - well done and thanks or all the excellent value.
For me personally when I look at likes score I like to see about a 2-1 ratio of likes to posts.
I know I have been using that number as a basis for my contributions.

These were my comments which I won't put in quotes so that the whole thing is visible:
https://www.namepros.com/threads/10-000-likes-the-5-figure-like-club.1169235/page-2#post-7552545

---- Begin Quote ----
That being said .. the likes system at NamePros is effectively meaningless. And I bring this up not to bring anyone with high likes down .. but to point out that there are most definitely people who contribute SIGNIFICANT value to the community whose likes ratio fall significantly lower than many people who actually don't put in much effort.

For example .. I spend hours every day working on my daily lists which I post here at NamePros. For the first year I even did so with NO affiliate links .. but these days with ~150 views a day, I'm lucky to get 1 or 2 likes .. There was a time where I wasn't even getting a single like per week total (plus it was back when my posts were too long I had to split them up, so I was actually getting 0 or 1 like per 14 to 21 posts).

But then I write someone a nice customised welcome in the meet and greet section and get 4-5 likes for a 2-3 minute effort (so 2-3x the likes for literally 100x less effort than I put into my expiration auction posts).

But even more telling of how likes are effectively meaningless at NamePros is that in the very same welcome thread where I'd get 4-5 likes for a nice customised hello/welcome post, someone else will write a one word "welcome", but because they are in a "like group", they get an extra 2-3 likes extra from their "group" and get 7-8 likes .. for a 3 second ZERO effort/content post (they don't even read the person's post because sometimes the first post is junk from an obvious spambot yet they still just post "Welcome" looking to increase their like count .. lol) .. it's pretty sad and why I think most off-topic sections of namepros should have likes turned off and removed as well as having a minimum 100 character count on a post before it can be liked.

Just so you know, it's really not that much, this sentence is actually more than one hundred characters!

More importantly .. in most discussion forum likes are effectively meaningless .. but at NamePros there is indeed commerce taking place .. and most people equate the "likes" to trust (or even worse .. to "authority".. but in the case of NamePros, likes most certainly does not mean that at all the way it's set up now. :-/

---- End Quote ----

I didn't really mean that to mean that people with a lot of likes should not be given props (I'm still grateful for all of mine) .. but more to say I see a lot of people with low like-ratios who often post helpful high-quality posts.

I probably am simply most aware of it because the spectrum of helpfulness of my posts is so wide .. but it's actually my most helpful posts that get the least likes and my least helpful that gets the most .. lol. (So for me it probably balances out when it comes to my ratio, but for others unfortunately it doesn't)

I remember when I first started at NamePros I didn't post in the welcome threads because I felt a little out of place welcoming a newcomer when I was a newcomer myself. But looking back that's a bit silly and everyone should feel welcome to welcome everybody!
(lmaorotf .. Black Box - Everybody Everybody just started playing on my playlist)

I think I had 500 likes and 500 posts both at almost exactly 6 months I think (1like:1post). Then when I started welcoming members in the meet and greet section, my like ratio exploded to far over 3:1 and I think it was closing in on 4likes:1post at one point .. then as I started posting my lists more and more regularly, my ratio dropped and now I've dropped back below 3:1.

So not to take anything away from anyone with a lot of post .. but to me it unfortunately becomes a meaningless and even misleading metric .. (I say unfortunately, because indeed if set up properly it could actually be significantly more meaningful (obviously not perfect .. but certainly noticeable better).

To me reforming the likes system is not about bringing people down, it's about lifting those who's contributions are discounted because they don't post a one word "welcome" to a spambot or aren't able to offer promotions or lists, etc. .. it's more about letting those with lower like counts or ratios know, to not be discouraged .. because there are only a few of us who see through and beyond like the current like count and post count systems! :)

When I had my old club music / DJ forum with 35k members, "like technology" (lol) did not exists, so it was post count that everyone looked at. It got to the point where a select few super-inflated their post counts in the off-topic forums. So I did effectively exactly as I recommended above (except with posts since there were no "likes") and I turned off post-count in off-topic forums. It wasn't a night and day difference, it certainly did not make things perfect .. but there most certainly was a noticeable drop in garbage/non-genuine post and an increase in quality posts.

I know it's not easy to change and reform such an ingrained system .. but figured I'd post the suggestion here since I already wrote half of the above elsewhere (and didn't want to veer the thread in question too much off-topic) .. and more importantly it is a serious suggestion that 100% would increase the quality:post overall. How much I can't say say .. but most certainly better! ;)


@Ategy , I agree with you on "likes" not carrying as much weight as they should, I wish there was a more accurate metric that would reflect the amount of useful contributions that are made in the forum.
Yup .. obviously I agree! :)



Moderators' response:
 
Last edited:
9
•••
The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
0
•••
People who feel they have too few dislikes should contribute to the appraisal section more often, a great way to boost your dislikes count!
 
2
•••
I feel like I want to dislike you just so I can be in the exclusive club of the two people to ever dislike you :xf.laugh:

What the heck, since we are giving out titles I'm tempted to go after that one :ROFL:

Have you been lurking all this time to get me:-D

I thought we were all supposed to be friendly and professional towards one another at NamePros. :'(

Now I don't mind if you disagree with me in certain threads, but don't dislike me.

We do need a disagree option for sure.;)

IMO
 
Last edited:
1
•••
Just spit-balling here...

@Ategy and others have mentioned that one of the major concerns of members getting too many "easy" likes is that it could instil newer members with a false sense of trust/authority.

So, how about NP just doesn't display our likes under our avatars?

The likes would still exist. You could still find them in the person's profile info, or on the Top Members list, but they wouldn't be in our face all the time.
 
0
•••
Regarding the likes to posts ratio, if you actively buy/sell in Marketplace then most of your posts will be marketplace posts, and those posts do not get likes (actually they are not allowed to get likes or thanks these buttons are missing from marketplace posts).

I for example have 2975 posts but more than 80% of them are Marketplace posts, and 90% of those 80% posts are "UP" bumping posts :xf.grin:

What I think should be done is excluding marketplace posts from users stats, because those posts do not contribute to NP discussions.
 
Last edited:
4
•••
Just some thoughts...

Add the ability to see a breakdown of where likes came from under Likes Received.

Show a Top 5/10 Liked posts that are clickable so a newbie could view each and see for themselves why the post was liked.

With all the data gathered so far, add a Rep/Trust Rating for each member based on AI :)

The AI would use existing data and new data. New data would come from adding a nomination system that gives members the power to vote for the most trustworthy members. It could be similar to getting link juice from authority websites but instead it's trust from authority members.

By using all this data, AI could correlate everything and build the Rep/Trust Rating system.

So I like to dream :)
 
Last edited:
0
•••
Has been said by a few people already but I will say it as well.....The number of likes a person has means nothing to me. I read what you write and make my own judgement if I agree with it or not and whether there is something to be learnt from it. The number of likes you have is not going to change my opinion or the way I read a post......

Blindly trusting someone on likes, followers etc is plain stupid. I hate Social Media for this very reason, people don't judge a person on who they are, their worth, contribution etc anymore just on how many followers, so called friends etc etc they have.

I play the game on LinkedIn now for work, but do not use Facebook, Instagram etc

imo nothing needs changing........
 
1
•••
With all the data gathered so far, add a Rep/Trust Rating for each member based on AI
I suppose your AI will search the entire Web for other traces of members, to get the whole picture and draw conclusions. People will chat even more about AI discoveries to members than about domaining.

So I like to dream
To me it´s more a nightmare vision: the Namepros Intelligence Agency.
 
1
•••
Unfortunately as already have been pointed out by many others the number of likes does not necessarily correlate with how much members have contributed to the forum since they could have received many of those likes from posts that were of no value . The same thing could also be said about the number of posts as some people might have accumulated a large number of posts that weren't that helpful to the community, but then there might be some other members with a lot lower number of post that were thoughtful and informative enough to have made a positive impact on the forum or the domain Industry at large. Also it's important to note that when people receive likes it's more about their posts and their interactions on the forum and not about who they are as a person since most people are anonymous here and don't really know each other at a personal level.

So what it comes down to is that the only way to gauge the members on this forum (or any public forum for that matter) is by reading their posts and also remembering the way that they have been treating others as far as being friendly, professional, helpful, and fair.

There are certain places that likes could be useful like in the daily hand registration thread, but then if people only gave likes if the domains really stood out rather than just trying to please their buddies.

IMO
 
Last edited:
0
•••
Hi

anything that can be manipulated or coerced by a member, is a potential liability for those who look at it as a positive metric or equate it with trust and reputation.

there are a lot of immature and gullible members, and many will like a post just to align themselves or dislike a post, to show alliance with the person they like.
all while ignoring the points of concern and why they where brought up.


imo...
 
Last edited:
0
•••
Whew...it's a lot to read about 'likes' and/ or 'dislikes' so I will admit I did some scanning (was actually reading posts in other thread when they got moved here).

So, here goes my input: Likes are important regardless of the reason (no other effective way to gauge participation in a forum like this without a major coding overhaul).

I purposely do not 'like' posts by those offering names for sale (WHY would I want to lead others to a thread I am looking at to get purchase ideas!?!?!). My thanks to those people, that make that type of post, is when I use their link so they can make some money. As a matter of fact, I communicated recently with someone new here (privately) encouraging them to embed links so they could make a little extra money for their effort of bringing unique names to attention of the namepros community.

As far as the 'like' being used in the welcome/new member threads, those are well earned by those that take a second to say hello to someone new. When I first started here, I was surprised at how many people spoke to me right off the bat...I am not a spring chicken and this stuff isn't new to me, but it was a big part of getting and keeping me active here rather on other sites I will not mention.
 
2
•••
I am very pleased to be a member, I am a guest really, here on NamePros!

I try hard to conduct myself via my comments with respect to the precepts and principles expected of NamePros members by the Forum's management team..

Welcoming new members with courtesy and a bit of direction is IMO the very least I as an appreciative member can do and should do as part of my member / guest status.

New members are the fabric and the lifeblood of most Forums and some onetime new members, which is really everybody, go on to become substantive and important contributors.

Personally I have never, ever offered a name for sale here on NPs, I have never sought to secure funds from you or anyone on the Forum and absolutely fail to believe you can equate the number of Likes with some high degree of trust that then takes unscrupulous advantage of new members!

You complain about your lack of likes for what you perceive as some major contribution ( drop list ?) you offer to members - well then - are you only making your contribution for the very likes you on the one hand
" don't like " and on the other hand, desire?

The number of likes your contribution receives is commensurate with the opinions of thousands of viewers
and the voters have spoken.

Just do your contribution ( name drop list ? ) because you believe in it, not for likes.

I have never used your list but I happily THANK YOU for trying to make NamePros a better Forum as you see fit.

The NamePros Forum is seemingly running pretty well with it's Thanks - Like - Dislike system and an excellent management team although the adding of a " disagree " option might be worth considering, or having a rational discussion about same.
 
2
•••
If we don't state our opinion, whether we click on “agree / like” or “disagree / dislike”, we are not part of the discussion. If we are unwilling to discuss our opinions ... it's probably better to logout and read only.

Regards
 
0
•••
Hello,

Here are some of our responses on this topic from the past:
Likes, Thanks, and Dislikes can mean different things to different people, but ultimately, users decide how to use them, similar to the freedom of their use on other websites (e.g., Facebook and Twitter).

NamePros used to have a rep(utation) system that was akin to what you're seeking. There are certainly merits to it, and encouraging quality content and engagement is important, so it's a good idea for us to try to think of ways to support that without trying to force members to use them based on specific criteria, which wouldn't be feasible.

For example, we could weigh Likes more heavily in certain sections or have an option to rate posts after liking/thanking them.

Likes should be understood to mean many different things to different people. With that understanding, then you can decide whether you place any level of significance on them and how much. As for business deals, we do not recommend using Likes for that purpose; we have the Trade Reviews system to facilitate that purpose, but neither are a replacement for due diligence.

All things considered, it takes a lot of time to accumulate of a lot of Likes, so when members have a lot of Likes, you know they've invested a lot of time in the community. You can get an idea of where they spent that time using the Areas tab on their profiles.

We understand what you're saying, but it's infeasible to get people to use a feature like this in a specific way. It doesn't scale, and therefore, it doesn't work. You can provide the tools, but you can't decide how or when they're used unless you can do so programmatically. However, if you can enforce it programmatically, then you don't need to enforce it at all because you can automatically calculate a rating without any need for members to change their behavior.


We are going to look into doing something like that.


. . . an improved rating system or use of the existing Like system is unlikely to improve the issues brought up in this thread. On the contrary, it may actually worsen the problems because there would be an added incentive to create new threads that get a lot of engagement, and there aren't many of those types of threads that haven't already been created many times before.

On December 23, 2019:
  • There are a total of 36 members with at least 10,000 likes.
  • It takes 13,731 likes to be in the top 20 most-liked members of all time.
The current 36 members of the 5-Figure Like Club are:


Needless to say, it's no easy feat. Even if you post daily in sections that are easier to obtain likes, it takes a huge commitment of time, dedication, and contribution to reach these milestones.


It's absolutely not meaningless. The data itself is very valuable and insightful in a variety of ways.

In terms of fair criticism, what you could say is that there is a lot of noise in it, and we could provide more ways to filter out that noise. For example, weighted scores that value the likes based on their difficulty to obtain or importance in a particular section or thread.

We are actively thinking about ways to improve the Reactions system and its scoring, so we appreciate all of the feedback and ideas to help us do that.

Thanks.
 
4
•••
@NamePros @Mod Team Bravo .. *IF* you were to implement a "smarter" weighted system that took multiple scaled factors into consideration .. then that would most definitely be the better option. That being said .. is NamePros actually going to do it? Because the things I was suggesting are relatively quick and easy solutions .. and no offence .. lol .. but sometimes when NamePros says "We are going to look into doing something like that.", it often means years if ever (although admittedly sometimes it means days .. but there's no way for us to know unless you tell us).

*Bump* .. (from 2.5 years ago .. lol)


NOTE: In fairness NP most certainly does and cool new things .. but I'm just saying .. that in this specific case .. if you're truly SERIOUSLY looking to implement something in the next few weeks, then let us know so we can get off your case and/or offer specific suggestions .. but otherwise, maybe take some of the shorter term suggestions until you actually have the time to be serious about making a better system!


It seems that at the very least there's a broad support for:

1- Removing post counts from replies in the auctions/sales forums.

2- Removing the ability to "like" posts that are BOTH (1) super short *AND* (2) in off-topic forums


Those would be pretty much common sense basics I think a majority of members could agree upon until you figured out how much further you'd like to go and/or implement the new system you were hinting about above.


Because in the end even posts in on-topic forums get likes that shouldn't really count towards "authority"/"credibilty"/etc. "Your reg of the day" is a good example of that. In that thread some people post the reasons why they bought a domain which 100% is VERY helpful to others. While others only post the domain name without any other info .. in those later cases people use "like" to mean they like the domain .. but when it comes to forum posts, people should be liking the information/effort the poster makes.

But while it is not the way things should be done .. I do understand how some might do it that way .. and also that it would be hard to change (well .. not too hard if you set a minimum number of characters before a post is likeable).


So in the end I certainly do concede it's not that simple .. but on the other side .. nobody is asking for perfect .. and there most certainly are things proposed above that can make likes/posts stats more "accurately" tuned to their actual intended (and most beneficial) purposes.
 
0
•••
Back