Afternic changing domain to in review after leaving GD

7363824 · Dec 8, 2019

So I transfered out a domain I had at GD (only because I bought it on their auction site) to Epik only to have Afternic within about an hour of the transfer completing email me to say the domain was removed from my Afternic account. I log in and find it "in review" presumably as a way to discourage leaving GD. Very problematic as I have more GD domains I plan to transfer out as they become eligible. What do I have to do unlist prior to transfer than relist again after transfer?

KDN · Dec 8, 2019

Epik is also a partner registrar so it shouldn't be an issue. I would suggest waiting for the new name servers to appear on Whois before relisting the name.

7363824 · Dec 8, 2019

Kenndien said:
Epik is also a partner registrar so it shouldn't be an issue...

My thoughts exactly but it is as now the domain shows in review. Now I'll have to wait days to get a response from Afternic support to fix this. Very poor system.

KDN · Dec 8, 2019

Ryan217 said:
My thoughts exactly but it is as now the domain shows in review. Now I'll have to wait days to get a response from Afternic support to fix this. Very poor system.

I had names that were under review for a few days but were accepted immediately after relisting. Try doing it at least 3 times. And I agree. The system needs a rework.

Not a robot · Dec 8, 2019

I think that’s actually a good thing. We have heard stories of people acquiring a domain but then received a mail it’s sold and needed to be transferred because the domain was not removed from Sedo. So it’s a good thing that Afternic actively de-list domains that it thinks may have been sold.

7363824 · Dec 8, 2019

Not a robot said:
I think that’s actually a good thing. We have heard stories of people acquiring a domain but then received a mail it’s sold and needed to be transferred because the domain was not removed from Sedo. So it’s a good thing that Afternic actively de-list domains that it thinks may have been sold.

Spoken like someone who thinks GD/Afternic can do no wrong. It's clearly designed to discourage you from moving away from GD. If they actually cared about that they would use real verification. It's a big leap to "think" a domain changed owners just because the registrar changed when the registrant data is WHOIS hasn't.

Meanwhile I could literally miss a sell because the listing isn't active. This is NOT a good thing. I am seriously considering filing a complaint with my state's attorney general's office because this is nothing more than an anti-competitive move to keep domains at GD.

Recons.Com · Dec 9, 2019

Ryan217 said:
Spoken like someone who thinks GD/Afternic can do no wrong. It's clearly designed to discourage you from moving away from GD. If they actually cared about that they would use real verification. It's a big leap to "think" a domain changed owners just because the registrar changed when the registrant data is WHOIS hasn't.

Meanwhile I could literally miss a sell because the listing isn't active. This is NOT a good thing. I am seriously considering filing a complaint with my state's attorney general's office because this is nothing more than an anti-competitive move to keep domains at GD.

Afternic does the same when you move TO godaddy. So, no, it has nothing to do with discouraging. Fast transfer assumes no locks, when you move a name, you put it under the lock. That is why I keep my names put and don't chase transfer promos.

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

Recons.Com said:
Afternic does the same when you move TO godaddy. So, no, it has nothing to do with discouraging. Fast transfer assumes no locks, when you move a name, you put it under the lock. That is why I keep my names put and don't chase transfer promos.

I dont know anything about moving to GD. The only names I have there I aquired trough their auctions and I transfer as soon as eligible. Im consolidating everything to Epik rather than keeping domains and numerous registrars and I cant stand GDs registrar interface anyway.

It can still be sold without fast transfer. There is no reason to remove it from sale completely and put it in review.

DanSanchez · Dec 9, 2019

Ryan217 said:
Spoken like someone who thinks GD/Afternic can do no wrong. It's clearly designed to discourage you from moving away from GD. If they actually cared about that they would use real verification. It's a big leap to "think" a domain changed owners just because the registrar changed when the registrant data is WHOIS hasn't.

Meanwhile I could literally miss a sell because the listing isn't active. This is NOT a good thing. I am seriously considering filing a complaint with my state's attorney general's office because this is nothing more than an anti-competitive move to keep domains at GD.

Ryan, I feel your pain. But I would discourage filing a complaint with any state attorney. Regulators tend to have a costly effect on industries that could easily regulate themselves. I think Afternic does this for any movement among registrars, the biggest irony in that is they barely verify ownership in the first place. I discovered one account with hundreds of thousands of domains that were owned by hundreds of different individuals. But that is for another thread.

tonyk2000 · Dec 9, 2019

It is very likely that they would also remove the listing if you transferred Epik-registered domain to GoDaddy. Which is the correct thing to do, as it allows to minimize the number of incorrect listings. Of course the domain can be deleted and added to Afternic again.

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

DanSanchez said:
Ryan, I feel your pain. But I would discourage filing a complaint with any state attorney. Regulators tend to have a costly effect on industries that could easily regulate themselves. I think Afternic does this for any movement among registrars, the biggest irony in that is they barely verify ownership in the first place. I discovered one account with hundreds of thousands of domains that were owned by hundreds of different individuals. But that is for another thread.

Their actions are inexcusable. And for the record I havent ran into this moving from another registrar to Epik with a domain currently listed it just is part of the regular network only for the 60 day lock period.

Bob Hawkes · Dec 9, 2019

If it changes registrar isn't it a good thing they put under review? Otherwise danger someone sells a name they no longer own. Or would be good if they effectively verified ownership.
Bob

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

tonyk2000 said:
It is very likely that they would also remove the listing if you transferred Epik-registered domain to GoDaddy. Which is the correct thing to do, as it allows to minimize the number of incorrect listings. Of course the domain can be deleted and added to Afternic again.

No it is not right to assume change in ownership where the WHOIS info hasn't changed! If they actually cared about that they'd use a real verification process.

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

Bob Hawkes said:
If it changes registrar isn't it a good thing they put under review? Otherwise danger someone sells a name they no longer own. Or would be good if they effectivel verified ownership.
Bob

Best option do real ownership verification. But dont assume things based solely off registrar change. Especially when you can see registrant data does not change.

I've bought names from NP usrs which I transfered with Auth code and couldn't list it, because the old owner had it listed. I've transfered names from other registrars to Epik that weren't put in review when I did so. They aren't looking at WHOIS they are relying on what they see as GD and it certainly looks like an anti competitive move to me.

tonyk2000 · Dec 9, 2019

The "registrar" field forms a part of afternic listing. It may not be in default view, but it is still there. Unfortunately, it is not editable. In Sedo it is editable, but in Afternic it is not. So, within the current system, the most logical way to perform registrar transfer would be: 1) delete afternic listing 2) transfer the domain 3) add domain to afternic again. If it is sold, and incorrect registrar is listed @ afternic, there may be tons of transfer-related issues as a matter of fact.

Not a robot · Dec 9, 2019

I understand the stress you are having.

An important aspect of domaining is acquisition. It’s important that when we buy a domain, we are sure we can actually use it. Often time a domain is listed for sale in many marketplaces. For example, it could be listed on Afternic and then sold here. It’s important, therefore, that there is some verification process.

No system is perfect. Even though Sedo validates a domain through DNS record, a domain still can be sold after its been sold already. This could happen because the DNS text record would remain intact after transfer.

I don’t know if Afternic validate a domain. I know Epik doesn’t, and I do complain about it.

GoDaddy owns Afternic, so it’s in a unique situation that it knows if a domain changes hand, either by auth code or push.

As a seller, it is important that we treat the buyer’s interest as our priority. That means providing the best purchasing experience with smooth transaction. That also means the seller makes compromises.

If we do that, we maintain a good reputation of the industry, and that drives sale.

To illustrate what I mean, let’s say I sell you a domain that you want to resell. I neglect to remove it from my marketplace and now it’s sold again. Now I could not deliver the domain and now the buyer has bad experience. The buyer could the best end user there is, but he may get cold feet and you lost a sale.

Now let’s say I sell a domain to an end user this time. And the domain is sold again. I could not deliver. Now suppose you own the domain that’s the second buyer’s second option. Will the buyer buy from you now he doesn’t trust the system?

To protect the reputation of the domain market, what GoDaddy did is correct. You may wonder why GoDaddy didn’t offer you a chance to clarify it. But GoDaddy couldn’t and shouldn’t. GoDaddy should trust the new owner, not the previous owner. It is up to you, the new owner, to re-list the domain.

Domainers should also understand that, when switching registra, a domain could be placed on 60 day lock. That means the domain can only be pushed but not transferred for 60 days, and that could lead to bad customer experience.

Again, no system is perfect. It’s not easy validating each domain on Sedo as DNS change can be a painful process. It would take a long while until different registra work together to figure out a way to validate ownership despite WHOIS privacy (and that’s assuming they want to work together), domainers have to prepare to work with the inconvenience of this imperfect system.

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

Not a robot said:
I understand the stress you are having.

An important aspect of domaining is acquisition. It’s important that when we buy a domain, we are sure we can actually use it. Often time a domain is listed for sale in many marketplaces. For example, it could be listed on Afternic and then sold here. It’s important, therefore, that there is some verification process.

No system is perfect. Even though Sedo validates a domain through DNS record, a domain still can be sold after its been sold already. This could happen because the DNS text record would remain intact after transfer.

I don’t know if Afternic validate a domain. I know Epik doesn’t, and I do complain about it.

GoDaddy owns Afternic, so it’s in a unique situation that it knows if a domain changes hand, either by auth code or push.

As a seller, it is important that we treat the buyer’s interest as our priority. That means providing the best purchasing experience with smooth transaction. That also means the seller makes compromises.

If we do that, we maintain a good reputation of the industry, and that drives sale.

To illustrate what I mean, let’s say I sell you a domain that you want to resell. I neglect to remove it from my marketplace and now it’s sold again. Now I could not deliver the domain and now the buyer has bad experience. The buyer could the best end user there is, but he may get cold feet and you lost a sale.

Now let’s say I sell a domain to an end user this time. And the domain is sold again. I could not deliver. Now suppose you own the domain that’s the second buyer’s second option. Will the buyer buy from you now he doesn’t trust the system?

To protect the reputation of the domain market, what GoDaddy did is correct. You may wonder why GoDaddy didn’t offer you a chance to clarify it. But GoDaddy couldn’t and shouldn’t. GoDaddy should trust the new owner, not the previous owner. It is up to you, the new owner, to re-list the domain.

Domainers should also understand that, when switching registra, a domain could be placed on 60 day lock. That means the domain can only be pushed but not transferred for 60 days, and that could lead to bad customer experience.

Again, no system is perfect. It’s not easy validating each domain on Sedo as DNS change can be a painful process. It would take a long while until different registra work together to figure out a way to validate ownership despite WHOIS privacy (and that’s assuming they want to work together), domainers have to prepare to work with the inconvenience of this imperfect system.

My point stands. The registrant data did NOT change! Afternic is horribly inconsistent as I mentioned the hasn't happened when GD wasnt the previous registrar. If they cared about verification they'd do DNS verification like Sedo. It's really not that hard almost any registrar will give you the option to apply a default DNS profile to new domains that you register/transfer in. I'm sick of having to wait days for Adternix support to respond to issues like when I get a new name that is already listed. Their system IS broken!

Recons.Com · Dec 9, 2019

Ryan217 said:
My point stands. The registrant data did NOT change! Afternic is horribly inconsistent as I mentioned the hasn't happened when GD wasnt the previous registrar. If they cared about verification they'd do DNS verification like Sedo. It's really not that hard almost any registrar will give you the option to apply a default DNS profile to new domains that you register/transfer in. I'm sick of having to wait days for Adternix support to respond to issues like when I get a new name that is already listed. Their system IS broken!

You are assuming all registrars have unlimited access to whois data. That might not be the case.

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

Recons.Com said:
You are assuming all registrars have unlimited access to whois data. That might not be the case.

Its publically avalible for anyone registrar, marketplace, even you.

Recons.Com · Dec 9, 2019

Ryan217 said:
Its publically avalible for anyone registrar, marketplace, even you.

Not true with the recent changes.

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

Recons.Com said:
Not true with the recent changes.

Sorry but you are wrong. I can see the registrant info though any third party WHOIS search site...

Not a robot · Dec 9, 2019

I guess you didn’t understand why GoDaddy/Afternic cannot ask the previous owner about the change. WHOIS is unreliable and can be faked. The only way to fully validate ownership is for the new owner to set up DNS record.

Not every marketplace support DNS validation. Sedo does this but it’s not foolproof. As I have mentioned, the DNS record won’t be immediately changed and so a domain can be sold twice. Also, DNS record change can take a long time to propagate, and this is painful whether you are setting up a mail server or a Web site. Sedo’s implementation is problematic because one unique ID can be used to trace ownership, which defeats the purpose of WHOIS privacy. Lastly, not all registra do not support mass editing of DNS record.

And we all must remember the whole system is designed for actual use, not prospecting. Even Epik, which is more domainers friendly than GoDaddy, is not perfect.

I understand your stress in possible lost sale. That said, the best way to domaining is to list your portfolio in as many venues as possible. So if lost sales is to be avoided, the best solution is to stay with Afternic

7363824 · Dec 9, 2019

Not a robot said:
I guess you didn’t understand why GoDaddy/Afternic cannot ask the previous owner about the change. WHOIS is unreliable and can be faked.

First I have never heard of such a thing. Second they DO rely on it. If you email them about a domain that you own already being listed first thing they do is check the WHOIS, then if the registrant email doesn't match your Afternic account they ask for a screenshot of the domain in your registrar account.

Not a robot said:
Not every marketplace support DNS validation. Sedo does this but it’s not foolproof. As I have mentioned, the DNS record won’t be immediately changed and so a domain can be sold twice. Also, DNS record change can take a long time to propagate, and this is painful whether you are setting up a mail server or a Web site.

Certainly the best method apart from WHOIS which cant always be used due to GDPR or Privimplement. And propagation in most cases is actually quite reasonable. Unlike the good old days when you literally did have to wait 48 hours. I can get Sedo to verify in minutes using DNS.

Not a robot said:
Sedo’s implementation is problematic because one unique ID can be used to trace ownership, which defeats the purpose of WHOIS privacy.

More ideal in my book versus a per domain ID makes it easier to impliment by using default records or bulk edits. Also it can only correlate same ownership which is only a problem if there is a domain without privacy while the rest have it. Though personally I don't bother with whois privacy. There are other ways to correlate names besides this though.

But all of this ignores the real problem. Inconsistent treatment. When I've transfered domains from other registrars it just worked. Only now that GD is the loosing registrar is this a problem.

All signs point to an attempt to discourage moving further domains out of GD...not that I'm surprised I expect as much from them which is part of the reason why I dont keep names there any longer than I absolutely have to.

xynames · Dec 9, 2019

Nameserver change is one thing but registrar change may indicate change of ownership. I’ve sold domains where the new owner doesn’t change Whois at all.

Recons.Com · Dec 9, 2019

Ryan217 said:
Sorry but you are wrong. I can see the registrant info though any third party WHOIS search site...

Ryan217 said:
apart from WHOIS which cant always be used due to GDPR or Privimplement.

So which one is it?

And, to @xynames point, even if you get to check Whois, that might not reflect change in ownership.

Afternic changing domain to in review after leaving GD

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