Shout-Out To Bob Hawkes

Jv1999 said:

Ur one of da bullies, u kno that right?

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Is bully the correct adjective here?

Maybe I missed the bullying posts elsewhere.

The post you quoted was more critical than bullying.

Much like his other posts.

Wouldn't critic be a better descriptive adjective?

Further, does his experience and education give him more credibility to his criticism?

The random pic I found as my current display pic says successful people compliment, unsuccessful people criticize. Granted the definition of success is subjective to each individual. Nonetheless, I have it as my display pic for the time being to remind myself of alternative things to do/say besides more negative attracting things such as criticizing.



I don't want to profess to know everything as I'm trying to figure it out just like everyone else. But for what my opinion is worth, might I suggest more compliments are in order (from all parties)?

Not necessarily complimenting the content if you disagree, but perhaps compliment the time they took to reply. Some people value their time more than others. For those struggling to find value in their time, the value of somebody else's time may often be overlooked.

@HotKey "I think it's totally ok to adjust our posting style towards the person we're posting to.. otherwise sometimes it can feel like we're all a product on an assembly line. We're not, we're all individuals. But adjusting ours posts to the individual, well that's a different art altogether. We all have our strengths and weaknesses. Its recognizing them that really defines us."

I have been reading all these related threads and have stayed clear posting in public, but this is one of the most insightful comments I have read in a long time........

Grilled said:

Is bully the correct adjective here?

Maybe I missed the bullying posts elsewhere.

The post you quoted was more critical than bullying.

Much like his other posts.

Wouldn't critic be a better descriptive adjective?

Further, does his experience and education give him more credibility to his criticism?

The random pic I found as my current display pic says successful people compliment, unsuccessful people criticize. Granted the definition of success is subjective to each individual. Nonetheless, I have it as my display pic for the time being to remind myself of alternative things to do/say besides more negative attracting things such as criticizing.

Show attachment 119607

I don't want to profess to know everything as I'm trying to figure it out just like everyone else. But for what my opinion is worth, might I suggest more compliments are in order (from all parties)?

Not necessarily complimenting the content if you disagree, but perhaps compliment the time they took to reply. Some people value their time more than others. For those struggling to find value in their time, the value of somebody else's time may often be overlooked.

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Well you can look at post history between Bob and xy and decide for yourself. But honestly, at times and certain threads i felt like if I was bob id be afraid to post because xy was just waiting to retort with some heated insults and not just criticism.

I mean, the least harshest thing I remember was xy saying bob posted pages only to say nothing and not take any kind of side.

But I guess it's normal for people to clash when people become frequent posters. So if two frequent posters have friction, they'll collide over and over in threads.

@Bob Hawkes hey keep it up


.. but keep it short , too

Grilled said:

Nonetheless, I have it as my display pic for the time being to remind myself of alternative things to do/say besides more negative attracting things such as criticizing.

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The graphic you shared is a terrific message for all of us to strive for. Thank you for sharing it. As well as the obvious relevant ones like make it about the ideas not the people, I particularly like the one about goals. We should each set our personal goals in domaining. Those goals will be very different for different people, and we should respect that. NPs would be boring if we all had same goals and approaches!
Thanks again. Have a positive and great day.
Bob

Grilled said:

Is bully the correct adjective here?

Maybe I missed the bullying posts elsewhere.

The post you quoted was more critical than bullying.

Much like his other posts.

Wouldn't critic be a better descriptive adjective?

Further, does his experience and education give him more credibility to his criticism?

The random pic I found as my current display pic says successful people compliment, unsuccessful people criticize. Granted the definition of success is subjective to each individual. Nonetheless, I have it as my display pic for the time being to remind myself of alternative things to do/say besides more negative attracting things such as criticizing.

Show attachment 119607

I don't want to profess to know everything as I'm trying to figure it out just like everyone else. But for what my opinion is worth, might I suggest more compliments are in order (from all parties)?

Not necessarily complimenting the content if you disagree, but perhaps compliment the time they took to reply. Some people value their time more than others. For those struggling to find value in their time, the value of somebody else's time may often be overlooked.

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Yes, I completely agree with @Bob Hawkes , that the graphic @Grilled shared is a terrific message.

For me personally, I really liked the Forgive vs. Hold a Grudge. Holding a grudge is like carrying around extra baggage that is very burdensome.

On the other hand, forgiving others is very liberating.

Hope you all find some peace today and beyond!

My 2 cents:

Bob is wonderful. Love reading through his posts. Some find them long, but I find them mostly eloquent. Although, I often find myself disagreeing with conclusions from that, I can still appreciate nicely put opinion differing from mine.

Now, xynames and others similar to him, although having harsh and straight shooting manner of expressing their opinions, also need to be recognized as valuable and contributing members of the community. I probably have clashed with him on occasion or two, but I have no problem admitting that the guy adds lots of value, is analytical and bases many things on his experience.

The key here is to recognize that Bob is more of a blogger and journalist than domain investor in the pure sense that you are investing considerable amount and expecting a return that is adequate for the very high risk of this industry and the time invested. So he cannot be measured by "but have you sold anything?".

But that question has to be asked of Lolwarrior who claims to be making money and offers lots of advice that goes AGAINST CONVENTIONAL WISDOM of the industry with no proof AT ALL. Bob took lots of heat for him, because he took on to clarify what Lol was saying in his absense. At this point, it is clear that Lolwarrior does not care about credibility, as apparently he was writing something to the tune of community members coming and offering him in excess of $5K for the names that many wouldn't pick up at a reg fee, based on a sale that supposedly happened but he won't tell us about. The guy is offering valuation services on forum (for free) and on his website (for $495), while having no factual sales to back up that he knows what he is doing.

I think if there is a lesson to be learned here for Bob, it is that he shouldn't get involved in a heated discussion summarizing all the arguments for and against and doing "thinking aloud" in the writing process, as the responses will get personalized. Most people cannot distinguish between the opinion and the person behind it.

Thank you Recons.

You know, the other day someone posted something I believe it was namemarket? that made me stop and think, he said that something I had said to him in the past made him shy away from NamePros for a while. That is never my intention and I felt bad when I read that statement from namemarket.

There are others I have clashed with too, Keith I think is one, and from what you are saying, maybe you too, Recons? But the fact that I can't recall the usernames or the exact things said is because it was never anything personal, was just differing opinions. I try to criticize ideas not people.

I recall a thread where Mike Mann came into a thread here at NP, on my invitation, and said something to someone about "Somehow I don't find Clockwork Orange to be a viable threat" referring to the guy's avatar. NOW, in the context of what we are discussing today, that would have been considered a personal attack, no? But the person to whom it was directed mostly took it in stride and came back with a joke as his response.

There are a couple people on here whom I clashed with in the past, who after a few direct messages have now become allies and associates/friends.

But anyway, if we have learned anything from this experience it is to be more professional, and I will endeavor to uphold that professionalism in my posts.

I wrote this a while back and I think it is good to be reminded of it:

I agree with virtually everything in your post just now @xynames and was proud to be the first of, what I think will be many likes, on the content. It is easy to in a heated thread become more one sided than you would be in person to person conversation, or even in DM sometimes. As you say, by building bridges like that, can help foster more respectful and professional discussions down the road.

If I could say one more thing, I think sometimes we overlook the critical difference in exactly how we say something. Let me give a couple of examples (made up ones) to demonstrate what I mean.

Let's say someone really thinks an idea proposed is terrible, and says: "That is a foolish and anyone who is really knowledgeable or successful would not say it." What saying it that way does is indirectly labels the person a fool for thinking that way, and also implies they don't know anything much in general. Most will respond and the fight is on because it was worded personally.

But what if instead it was "While I appreciate the time you took to explain the idea, I am not buying it at all. In my opinion, the justification overlooks (blah blah) and instead what I prefer to do is to concentrate on what has resulted in sales in my own portfolio, which is (blah blah)" Words like in my opinion moves it from an attack on someone else's beliefs to a rationale for why you feel differently. It is a world of difference. I think it not only is a more professional way to say it, but also way more effective.

I volunteer at community newspaper and we often have to deal with opinions in submissions. One important thing I learned is that we can never know with certainty others' motivations, and therefore it is always wrong to claim that we do. That is why when someone hypothetically says something like "Fred is just hyping this because he is getting a payback from the zzz registry." we are doing several things we should not, in my opinion, do. We really don't know why Fred is so positive on whatever. We almost certainly had no evidence for bit about payback and were saying as fact something that is not. Instead it would be far more effective to say something like. "I don't agree with Fred's enthusiasm for TLD because the biggest sale yet on it is $450 and there are only 5 sales overall." I think that would be far more effective in persuading others because it provides evidence, and Fred can, if he wants, react to the sales data, but it is not about Fred or his ethics.

I think also we sometimes think that we are simply debating an issue, but our own enthusiasm for one side causes us to misrepresent what the other person said. Now that is for sure to escalate debate because the other person will correct and the fight is on.

Bob

I'd like to thank @Bob Hawkes for a suggested available domain and all his great posts!

I think a lot of our nature comes down to both our personality and of course experiences. Some people just need to be liked and loved .. Probably comes down to bullying and also being taken advantage of in later life.

I know I have a direct nature - to the point and but I do analyse. Its what I have been trained to do.After merchandising for thorn EMI I was sent to manage one of their failing warehouses in East London. 60 odd, East End guys who didn't like me at-all. Sure I had a couple of Supervisors and an assistant manager already on the staff. The first thing I did on arrival was close down their self created Indoor football pitch. then turn this into bays for picked-stock and returned items from the Installers. They bloody hated me, Then I told every installer all their stock would be pre-picked and signed off by numbered bay, No longer having to wait for stock checks. I then took the very and most knowledgeable installer off the road, they hated me more. But i had him managing all their route planning in the most efficient manner, (you can't rely on journey planning around London without knowing all the traffic conditions) next I allowed every installer to just leave his stock on return to an assigned bay, No checking in, they were then free to leave on full-pay no matter what time they returned. Next I instructed the 50 odd shops under our jurisdiction, they could guarantee next day delivery for every item in stock, saving hours of office booking time-slots, I insisted every damaged item had a insurance report attached saving the Company tens of thousands.and thousands. I promised next day delivery by having the ability to offer an hours extra overtime for every additional job they took, even if it was still in company time - plus with all the greater efficiencies we now had, I had dozens of spare slots.and a greater budget saved from the claimed insurance losses. Finally all the warehouse staff were super efficient because they were in control of their own internal task scheduling. Not dictated to by delivery and returns turning-up at any time of the day

Anyway the end to all this, I returned from a holiday towards the end of the first year of being in charge. Instead of being called by my first name, and occasionally having to suffer having threats to have my lights punched out. Everyone including my close associates were calling me Mr Mxxxx. The supervisors had everyone onboard with showing me greater respect, I couldn't ask for that I had to earn it - I tell you it nearly had me in tears. The only person working 12 hour days through all this was me

So sorry yes this is a bit like one of Bobs blogs - But I am a man of action, you start pulling the wool over my eyes and I will respond, and not always politely.

Hope you understand my nature - don't think I can change

Thanks for so honestly and transparently sharing both your challenges and your success, and how your past experiences shaped who you are, which as you say, they do affect all of us. It is not easy to write like that, but I think it is valuable to do so. It maybe builds on what @xynames wrote in a way, about if we can go to the step of the personal connection, it can help us avoid some escalations. I suspect we will never see eye to eye on quite a few things, but huge respect for the sharing you just did above @BaileyUK.
Have a good evening, and best wishes for continued success.
Bob

BaileyUK:
Right, in the end, what usually matters most are results. Money talks...B.S. .... well, you know.

BaileyUK said:

Anyway the end to all this, I returned from a holiday towards the end of the first year of being in charge. Instead of being called by my first name, and occasionally having to suffer having threats to have my lights punched out. Everyone including my close associates were calling me Mr Mxxxx. The supervisors had everyone onboard with showing me greater respect, I couldn't ask for that I had to earn it - I tell you it nearly had me in tears. The only person working 12 hour days through all this was me

So sorry yes this is a bit like one of Bobs blogs - But I am a man of action, you start pulling the wool over my eyes and I will respond, and not always politely.

Hope you understand my nature - don't think I can change

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Hope you got a good bonus

stub said:

Hope you got a good bonus

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Yes I did get a substantial pay rise, and choice of a new car every year. (which I didn't need for work) Funny enough the repercussions of success can be harder to predict, For then you have to up your game even to a higher level.

For, suddenly I had made unintentional enemies of all the other warehouse managers in the south of England. Who were asked the question why can't you deliver the same efficiencies. Next I had the Regional sales managers on my back. Because by offering, guaranteed next day delivery to their shops customers (who weren't my responsibility). I had taken away about half their workload, which was about 50% of the time placating customers ( on delivery delays) and negotiating these slots.

Yes success means you have to up your own game to another level, which I must admit I wasn't quite ready for.

Lesson learnt, managers, of all people need to be seen to be busy, even when they aren't.. You take that away and man they won't like you.. further lesson be aware of ALL the implications of change.

Such is Life - It never stops being an education

@frank-germany, famous for his one liners

@Bob Hawkes, famous for his one pagers

Man if we could somehow combine those two there is no telling what we would get

I think the time has come for sure to wind down this thread. Thank you @Internet.Domains for starting the thread. It was a kind and brave, at the time, thing to do.

But I don't want to end the discussion about professional behaviour, but I do want to shift the focus away from me. So I created a new thread.

It is called We Can and Must Fix This. I want us all, every single one of us, to work together to make this community better. I even think it can help us sell domains, long term.

I have posted some ideas to start the discussion.
https://www.namepros.com/threads/we-must-and-can-fix-this.1138079/

I hope to see you all there.

Bob

So which thread is the root cause of all this drama? I still have some popcorn left.

Where is the thread?

BaileyUK said:

But thankfully a recent posting has cleared up some of the misunderstanding of direction of NamePros .
I refer to the recent posting by Namepros CMO

"Who wouldn't want want to own a dot Ninja domain" That posting brought a smile to my face and showed me why, and perhaps a few others had been on the wrong track and tact.in calling out a certain other Ntld advocate

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Interesting interpretation, Ray.

To clarify:

1. NamePros does not currently have a CMO, which stands for Chief Marketing Officer.
2. The staff member you are quoting is @Paul Buonopane and the letters under his username on his posts show CTO, which stands for Chief Technology Officer. To further drive that point home, his avatar is of a computer terminal.
3. Ninjas are popular in some sectors of tech, and therefore, popular with some CTO's.
4. Paul is a technology expert working in the domain industry, so it's natural for him to have an affinity toward .ninja domains. That is his personal opinion, those are his personal domains, and none of it has anything to do with NamePros itself or the way moderators handle reports.
5. We handle all reports the same, regardless of what they're about or who reported them.
6. You should read about confirmation bias because it appears to have caused you to misinterpret information (and misread letters that look nothing alike).

Please be more responsible when you post so as to not intentionally spread misinformation.

Update: Read Paul's response.

Somehow this thread reminds me on the phrase: "Let's agree to disagree.".

WHERE IS TNE BULLY THREAD?

hookbox said:

WHERE IS TNE BULLY THREAD?

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Was between this and another read with words facts questioned twisted was domain drama and my lunchtime read as a fly on wall. Was going to sell some popcorn but their going to need sodas now and a manicure.

Reserve the finger pointing to some deserving scam rather than someone that doesn't agree on every speculation.

Internet.Domains said:

It was recently uncovered that Bob was feeling a little less motivated, and possibly retiring from Namepros, after some recent bullying.

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In cases of bullying I am always on the side of the victim.

In this time and age, the charge of bullying is to be taken very seriously. If you make such a charge, please provide proof.

equity78 said:

This is not a nice industry overall

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No industry or business is "nice". However, in the years I have been part of this industry, the spirit of camaraderie is stronger than in any other.

TCK said:

In cases of bullying I am always on the side of the victim.

In this time and age, the charge of bullying is to be taken very seriously. If you make such a charge, please provide proof.



No industry or business is "nice". However, in the years I have been part of this industry, the spirit of camaraderie is stronger than in any other.

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I am glad you have had that experience I have had far stronger in just about every industry I have participated in.