Dynadot

What's going on with Epik and Rob Monster?

Spaceship Spaceship
Watch

MapleDots

Account Closed (Requested)
Impact
13,169
I'm catching the tail end of this, seems to be some kind of controversy...

https://domaingang.com/domain-news/rob-monster-off-twitter-after-christchurch-massacre-controversy/

Must be something odd to evoke this type of a response from one of our members.

Picture0016.png
 
8
•••
The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
.....I stopped wearing my Epik cap yesterday.....
Bob

Even though you stopped wearing your Epik hat your very long in-depth post seems to spend far more time in-effect praising him vs condemning that he does not do best and ACT.BEST which attitude by you I think is both disturbing and sad,
 
Last edited:
1
•••
I think in Europe you can be jailed for saying the holocaust didn't happen. .

Broadly yes, depending on country and circumstances - even when there is no explicit law as such you can be guilty of hate crimes or be extradited to another country

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...ial-songs-to-youtube-convicted-alison-chabloz

Woman who posted Holocaust denial songs to YouTube convicted


Judge rules songs were not satirical as Alison Chabloz claimed, but intended to insult Jewish people

This man was extradited from UK to Austria to stand trial - found guilty:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2006/feb/20/austria.thefarright

https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/List_of_countries_where_Holocaust_denial_is_legal
 
Last edited:
0
•••
Yes. Slave owners in the United States used to like Africans so much they bought them, but that doesn't really prove much either.

It's against the law to refuse to employ persons on the basis of religion.
Unless your a red indian a native american Then we steal your land make our own laws, have no chance defending your civil rights in our courts.
 
0
•••
Can you imagine him coming here and trying to clarify his tweet?
The attacks would be monstrous, he is far better staying away and letting things settle, the internet archives are very unforgiving.

Personally I think opinions are opinions and actions are actions.

Sometimes one says things but does quite the opposite and I personally think nobody should be judged by a single spoken word or tweet.

He's certainly better than coming here to engage - he'd rather post on Gab to complain about how victimized he feels by attaboys on Namepros.

But you're right, opinions are opinions and actions are actions. Defending a platform's right to exist to fight censorship is one thing - but to become an active user and share in the bigotry, and doing so using the handle of the company you represent?

I have not seen the post that created this controversy (other than as screen captures shared). If it is true that it offered a link to the 'manifesto' and the video, and that it implied that some aspects of the video might suggest the event did not really happen, then I condemn the post.

Here's an action:
epikg.png

You can look for the original post on gab.com/epik if you doubt the accuracy of screen captures.

This isn't merely making sure documents that may be valuable to authorities and for research purposes are available to those interested - in the name of preventing censorship - this is amplifying the message of a mass murderer on a platform that shelters users who applaud crimes against certain people. On a platform where people like Cantwell call out for murder loud and clear. (#freespeechamiright)

And doing so from an account on said platform with the handle of the company some wish to not see named in a situation that only concerns its CEO.

I'm all for being measured in judging others' actions and opinions, but this isn't one incident, it's not a faux pas that is brushed away with a quick apology. You can be a nice guy, a family man, committed to your religion and community, and still be hateful toward other groups, bigoted, and so forth.

Rob is not the victim here.
 
Last edited:
5
•••
0
•••
Capture3.PNG


Is this is a misunderstood man who needs to redirect his energies
 
Last edited:
1
•••
It's free speech.

What could be more American than leafleting a neighborhood?

Rob has a problem with people leafleting Rob's neighborhood, or saying what they like about his wife, his kids or him, but he's fine mocking the violent deaths of other people's loved ones by calling it a hoax.

What a hypocritical snowflake.

Did someone's speech hurt his fee-fee's?

is it really free speech and not libel / slander when you hand out leaflets or pamphlets making false claims about a person?

People were saying it's illegal to post people's address/ contact info online -- even though that's "free speech."
 
1
•••
0
•••
The following are my personal thoughts on this...obviously no one has to agree with any of them.

Let me first say this clearly. The New Zealand shooting has an atrocity and my heart goes out to all of those who have had their lives impacted. As a society we should do nothing to give oxygen to hateful views such as those of the alleged shooter, and I support the Prime Ministers decision to never utter his name and efforts to make sure his manifesto and video are not distributed. I applaud her governments swift action to make the instruments of such atrocity less accessible. I am touched by those of all religions who have reached out to comfort the survivors and the families of the deceased. It was not a hoax and to say so is simply wrong, no matter who you are.

But this thread is, fundamentally, about @Rob Monster and Epik. I got to know Rob first through NPs and found him a knowledgeable and helpful and respectful presence. I was particularly impressed by the many times he reached out to help individuals who were stressed over some situation, even though there seemed little or no possible payback to Epik. I also respected that he treated those with few friends here just as though they were a VIP with a high value portfolio.

On the opening day of NamesCon I sat down with Rob for the better part of an hour in an interview that I had requested for a future article on Epik and it's CEO. For a variety of reasons, mainly my own procrastination, that article has not yet been written, and doing so now is clearly more challenging. Rob and I talked about his personal beliefs and story, Epik's development, lifetime registrations, innovative plans on the horizon and more. We did talk a bit about due process, deplatforming, and freedom of speech, but that was not the main focus I wanted.

The smart, generous and kind person I had expected from online contact was confirmed in my mind. Rob genuinely cares about people. In fact one of my strongest impressions from that hour was that Rob started it by wanting to talk about me. Rob is a caring person. I saw nothing that would suggest to me any racist opinions or hatred, in fact just the opposite. Those who have tried to paint him that way are wrong in my opinion. As @Ategy.com has related in his detailed and well expressed posts in this thread, Rob Monster even when his views are quite different, respects differences. My political views are undoubtedly very distant from his, but he seemed to genuinely respect that.

I have not seen the post that created this controversy (other than as screen captures shared). If it is true that it offered a link to the 'manifesto' and the video, and that it implied that some aspects of the video might suggest the event did not really happen, then I condemn the post.

There are valid reasons that some need access to documents such as this. Obviously law enforcement, the court system, victim advocacy professionals, researchers in racism and anti-social violence, etc. need access to the document. For me, freedom of speech does not mean anyone who wants it should have access to those documents. While I support Epik's stand on the need for due process in deciding issues such as deplatforming, that is not to say, in my opinion, that anything anyone posts has the right to be seen by anyone.

As it turns out when all of this happened I was reading a book by Dr. Julia Shaw. Early in it she asks the reader to do the following exercise. Think about the worst thing you personally did in your life? Maybe just once you bullied someone, but it was a really weak person in a tough time in life. Maybe just once you stole something and never got caught. Maybe you cheated on your taxes. Maybe you treated a mentally fragile person harshly. Maybe it is something worse. Would you want forever for people to in a black and white way know you always and forever as the bully, cheat, thief, etc., rather than the complex person, with good traits and faults, that you are?

Now I accept that people who I respect, like Shane, feel that a line has been crossed here and have called for Epik to pay the ultimate price. While I do not agree, I understand and respect his view and those who have supported him.

I thank @Slanted for his long posts here, and at Shane's blog, for giving us a glimpse into the situations that probably helped to contribute to the unfortunate response. I disagree with those who say it is irrelevant and simply an excuse. In difficult and stressful times knowing context helps.

Frankly, I find it hard to believe how smart people can come to believe in complex and unrealistic conspiracy scenarios. To some degree I even respect their right to believe crazy things. But only up to the point where their beliefs begin to harm or threaten other people. Parents who went through heartbreak when their children were killed in their school and were then continuously hounded on social media by those who proclaim it did not happen and it was just a staged government to try to take away guns were hurt cruelly. Conspiracy theories are not without consequences. Promoting conspiracy theories hurts real people. Promoting manifestos of shooters makes the world more dangerous.

As wrong as the (apparent) post was, I think it is not fair to Epik and its employees or to Rob to let one tweet (if it was a tweet) forever characterize the man and the company. What I do feel is needed however is the following:
  • A clear statement from Epik that they apologize for the post and recognize how wrong it was.
  • A clear statement from Epik that a post like that will never happen again and procedures to make sure that it will not.
  • A clear statement that while they continue to stand up for due process and freedom of speech, that there are limits on free speech when making items available will extend pain to victims or potentially lead to increased risk. Anyone who has been charged in a violent crime should have everything they wrote archived (in case later found not guilty) in a form that cannot be generally accessed until court proceedings are complete. That would include the writings of all shooters. In other words access to this manifesto and video should immediately cease, if it is still available (I do not know).
  • Some action to mitigate the hurt that was caused by the unfortunate post.
  • Just as the head of Starbucks instituted company wide measures to correct for racial profiling, Epik should commit to measures where specialists help all employees see that free speech can not go so far as to inflict additional pain on sufferers and heighten risk. This is something many organizations, not just Epik, need to take seriously. Epik should refocus to lead responsible freedom of speech, not wide open freedom of speech.
I stopped wearing my Epik cap yesterday. I challenge the company to institute changes so that I can once again proudly wear the cap. Rob and Epik are smart and forward looking and focussed on providing great service and products. Rob is a kind and generous person. I want to see them recover from this. But we must all learn from this.

Bob

Not here to comment further on this issue I think it's clear that Monster was in the wrong and anyone supporting him in any way has his own, in some cases subtly disguised, agenda, or bias.

I don't think that Bob speaking here is necessarily to support the Monster's action. I don't think Bob has his own agenda. I respect Bob.

BUT - my friend Bob, your posts have gotten so MEALY MOUTHED. They go on and on and end up saying and signifying nothing. Can't you take a stand one way or another?

Honestly, I just blip over most of your posts these days because I know they will end up taking both sides of the argument or issue and in the end come to no resolution. Even your "appraisal" posts end up sounding like, "it could be worthless, but it may be worth a mint, no one knows."

In my opinion, meaningful content needs to take at least SOME kind of stand, and direction. Polite, sure, but definitive.
 
Last edited:
1
•••
Not here to comment further on this issue I think it's clear that Monster was in the wrong and anyone supporting him in any way has his own, in some cases subtly disguised, agenda.

I don't think that Bob speaking here is necessarily to support the Monster's action. I don't think Bob has his own agenda. I respect Bob.

BUT - my friend Bob, your posts have gotten so MEALY MOUTHED. They go on and on and end up saying and signifying nothing. Can't you take a stand one way or another?

Honestly, I just blip over most of your posts these days because I know they will end up taking both sides of the argument or issue and in the end come to no resolution. Even your "appraisal" posts end up sounding like, "it could be worthless, but it may be worth a mint, no one knows."

In my opinion, meaningful content needs to take at least SOME kind of stand, and direction. Polite, sure, but definitive.
Wow!.....I thought he was very clear and definitive on his stance. You may want to read his post again.

Best to you!
 
0
•••
Well, give me your summary. You choke through it and give me the reader notes.

While you're at it, please DM me a summary of every post of his over the next week, and its conclusion. I doubt you'll find any solid conclusions, but since you seem so willing to pore through his posts, I'd like to hire you (with no pay) to summarize them all for me. Thanks!

Maybe after you've done that for a week, you'll comprehend that he generally takes both sides of each issue, and usually comes to no definitive resolution.
 
Last edited:
0
•••
Well, give me your summary. You choke through it and give me the reader notes.
If you don't know or understand what was posted than why are you saying you don't like what was posted?......In other words, you already posted your thoughts on his stance, but now your asking me to summarize it for you?.... You have already reserved judgement. What would my summary change?........Your actions make a great point that pertains to our core subject.
 
0
•••
@xynames Bob said he only had positive interactions with Rob so far and he listed all he would like to see including apologies or statements... What else would you like him to say?
 
1
•••
BUT - my friend Bob, your posts have gotten so MEALY MOUTHED.
Sometimes when we say too little we don't say the right thing.
(BTW had to look up meaning of mealy mouthed :xf.grin:)
 
Last edited:
6
•••
For you @xynames : I condemned the post, said that conspiracy theories can have real consequences, we should not give oxygen to hate filled manifestos by making them available generally, I believe in due process, I condemn the post, all my personal interactions with Rob found him to be generous and kind, I don't believe in defining people by one action, I believe in the power of learning lessons from wrong moves, I hope Epik recovers, I spelled out at end 5 specific things I want the company to do. With respect, I actually feel I was fairly specific (while agree wordy).
 
Last edited:
1
•••
What I do feel is needed however is the following:
  • A clear statement from Epik that they apologize for the post and recognize how wrong it was.
  • A clear statement from Epik that a post like that will never happen again and procedures to make sure that it will not.
No, he has said
"As for status as "public figure", I am humble enough to put truth and liberty ahead of personal prosperity or social acceptance. This is not the act of a reckless man but rather the act of someone with an eternal perspective who values truth and considers the search for truth to be a core goal of life well lived.

The Internet has been an enormous blessing to me personally. Once you acknowledge that life is not an accident, and that creation is not random, it becomes obvious that temporal rewards are of no great consequence, and that includes the fleeting plaudits (and the critiques) of others."

He does not care for your social acceptance
He has an eternal perspective..So he can do whatever the hell he wants and still live happily for eternity, because God will be pleased that he did not give in to the stupid sheeple
Temporal rewards..who cares, Any praise or critiques from Bob Hawkes are of little importance
Search for truth, aka imbecilic conspiracy theories, is paramount
 
1
•••
@Bob Hawkes I got that...but it went in circles...by saying everything you sometimes end up saying nothing.
 
1
•••
Lol Gab.com/epik clearyl says ROB MONSTER

Yep.

Let's be honest here, Epik is not some massive corporation.
There is no separation between Rob Monster (Epik CEO) and the company Epik itself.

Brad
 
Last edited:
1
•••
Over many decades I learned that over simplifying messages can lead to bad decisions sometimes. I see that actually happening in domains. Satisfying to be simple, but sometimes dangerous. Sorry I carry that in all I write. I like to be fair and balanced, and doing that means the background, limitations, evidence and nuances are important. Oh I left out of my summary, I totally respect people having different opinions.
Bob
 
4
•••
It's free speech.

What could be more American than leafleting a neighborhood?

Rob has a problem with people leafleting Rob's neighborhood, or saying what they like about his wife, his kids or him, but he's fine mocking the violent deaths of other people's loved ones by calling it a hoax.

What a hypocritical snowflake.

Did someone's speech hurt his fee-fee's?

It's illegal in the United States to discriminate in employment on the basis of those things. Rob doesn't have the freedom to NOT hire persons on the basis of religion, ethnicity, handicap, etc..

I'm sure that Epik doesn't regularly commit murders either, but the fact that the company obeys the law has nothing to do with whether people are entitled to make their own decisions about what businesses to patronize.

Whom Rob employs, or chooses to trot out as props and human shields like Joseph here, is beside the point. He doesn't deserve some sort of humanitarian award for simply doing what the law requires. I'll bet he stops at stop signs and red lights too. Wow, what a guy!

Very well said.

Brad
 
0
•••
If you say "kill jews" it is a hate crime, and a racist thing. It doesn't matter whether the word jew refers to a religion or a race.

But if you say "there is no holocaust" it should not be a crime. By making saying "there is no holocaust" a crime, you might be hiding some historical facts, distorting history. Of course here I don't say there is no holocaust. There are some obvious lies in history. Someone may question validity of official history and let them do it. Let them show their evidence, if any, disprove them if you can. Some obvious lies in recent history are Apollo Moon landings, 9/11 official story, probably also Titanic's sinking after hitting an iceberg.
Hitler was an evil guy, but certainly he didn't target all jews, and actually he was puppet of people who are known as jews. Was Einstein inventor of relativity theory..or did he do part of it, or did he steal it all. Einstein was one of my childhood heros, but now I have suspicions.

"Hitler was an evil guy, but certainly he didn't target all jews" & "actually he was puppet of people who are known as jews"

Are you serious? Trying to justify Hitler's actions and saying the people he committed genocide against are in fact the real perpetrators

seriously you are blocked and I am glad I will never have to read anything you write again.....absolutely disgusting and you should be fu**ing banned - outrageous.....

@Amanda remove this post please and look into these comments for further action this is totally unacceptable and highly offensive....
 
1
•••
Folks, this is a defining moment in time for the domaining industry. Namepros is at this time the defacto industry forum bar none.

It saddens me the regurgitation of hateful comments and ideologies this thread has spawned. Or the justification of such.

This shows that the domaining business is still young, immature, and as such, unregulated. Allowing for this venom to be spewed in a mainstream industry forum.

Imagine if this occurred in an established industry. You don't have to imagine, because it has happened. And was dealt with swiftly.

How domaining companies (today its Epik, tomorrow may be another) and how domaining blogs and domain news sites react to this, will speak a lot to the future of our business.

If this type of speech is tolerated here then God help us. Because I don't see a bright future for domaining as a whole.
 
3
•••
I can't wait! Seriously, though, I understand you feel the PR need to placate some people here, but the long winded prefaces are unlikely to do this. This was Rob's personal "thing", has nothing to do with Epik - is all you need to say, which to me, goes without saying. I'm not moving my domains out of Epik, because I disagree with Rob's personal opinion (actually, I don't care about his opinion on this matter).

Perfectly understandable. If anything, Rob should do any clarifying here.

Now, this is a mistake, IMHO. As Epik's exec, you should not entangle Epik in this controversy any further. It's your call to make, of course. I speak only as a client with 100+ domains at Epik.

Man, there's no such thing as a "personal" life separate from a professional life! It's why companies check your social media when you're interviewed for employment. It's why Bill Clinton almost got impeached. It's why those neonazis at the rallies all got fired from their irl jobs when their identities were exposed.

It's also why lawyers can't pass the fitness part of the state bar if their "personal" lives are somewhat murky, like espousing racist beliefs even if they never committed hate crimes.
 
5
•••
Can you imagine him coming here and trying to clarify his tweet?
The attacks would be monstrous, he is far better staying away and letting things settle, the internet archives are very unforgiving.

Personally I think opinions are opinions and actions are actions.

Sometimes one says things but does quite the opposite and I personally think nobody should be judged by a single spoken word or tweet. In today's social media world a lot of people have put their foot in their mouth and paid a high price.

Social media should have a setting in your account where it sets all posts to a 24 hour delay. This way people who make chronic mistakes can think about their posts and review them the next day before posting. I bet you a lot of them would get deleted.

Now I don't know what his intentions were and I am not defending him as much as I am saying one should be able to apologize for a mistweet and have it be taken at face value. The more you try to explain it the bigger the controversy gets and the whole Rosanne Barr incident shows you that.

Rob should apologize if he feels he did wrong but leave it at that. Opening the can further will make this thing never go away.

I don't buy that it was a mistake. I believe Mr. Monster meant every word he said.
 
2
•••
....I believe in the power of learning lessons from wrong moves, I hope Epik recovers, I spelled out at end 5 specific things I want the company to do. With respect, I actually feel I was fairly specific (while agree wordy).

Nevertheless you spent FAR more time in your very long post praising how wonderful The Monster was and how much you enjoyed his hand holding and friendship than anything else.
 
Last edited:
0
•••
  • The sidebar remains visible by scrolling at a speed relative to the page’s height.
Back