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Ategy

Arif M, NameCult.com TheDomainSocial.comTop Member
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Wow .. I'm actually having a frustrating day at auction .. just about all the domains I'm watching (just about all the best on my personal list and quite a few from my shared public list are getting far above average number of bids and well above average prices.

Usually on my days off I manage to snag a few cheap .. and even turn down some really good ones .. it's almost as if instead of just one heavyweight (like HugeDomains) competing with the rest of us .. that there are now two heavy hitters battling it out for everything barely even leaving any scraps for the rest of us.

To the point where names of the type/quality I was getting at at $17, $12 or even closeout are hitting three figures .. and domains I'd grab mid-high $xx are hitting $250++ and up.

While this certainly sucks for auction buyers in the short term .. if it keeps up .. it could mean significantly better wholesale prices in the long term .. which could be either good or bad for domainers depending on the particulars of their portfolio.

I did notice patterns like this last year .. wish I tracked it better. Before the day even started and most bids began, I did notice it certainly was a big day in terms of number of good names .. maybe that was part of it?

Curious if I'm the only one seeing this?
 
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The views expressed on this page by users and staff are their own, not those of NamePros.
Understood, do you still have an active account executive over there in recent times?

Not any more since I transferred all my domains out of GoDaddy, after "the incident". Since I no longer had the 300 domains minimum requirement to have an Account Manager. GoDaddy took my Account Manager away. Quite legitimately. It was the price I was prepared to pay for GoDaddy not to be able to take my domains away from me, at will. It was inconvenient not having email support any longer. But with no domains in my account, and with my deep knowledge of how GoDaddy Registrar operates, there really isn't much necessity for me to have an Account Manager. My auction activity also dried up at the same time. GoDaddy are not a company I trust to give you a fair shake when push comes to shove. That trust has been irrevocably broken. So my continued business with them is severely limited. On purpose. At the same time auction prices have risen somewhat severely (due to HD and proxy bidders generally), and I haven't followed this upward trend. My focus has been on reducing the size of my portfolio. I'm downsizing. Getting rid of the dross. But not going away.
 
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I meant to favorite / biggest selected clients, exclusively.

Who knows how deep the rabbit hole goes...

Also, what about Verisign? Of course renewals of a big portfolio always form a big part of spending. Now, if somebody has a bunch of registrars and at the same time a bunch of own domains - most of which are acquired using bot-powered filtering and, accordingly, are of lower quality and many TMs. This somebody may well go to Verisign and ask them for registration / renewal / transfer discounts. He may explain that he will either pay $2 per domain per year or drop 90% of his portfolio, as anything else would not be profitable. Verisign may well agree to give such a discount, why not? They will gain even less $$$ should such a customer start dropping his portfolio. And it is not about cost of running a registry - wasn't it Bob Parsons (GoDaddy) who publicly offered to run .com registry charging $2 per domain/year, some time ago, when verisigns .com registry contract was due to expire? The costs to run a registry are not that big - and become cheaper each year (hardware, internet connections etc etc)

Absolutely true about the rabbit hole :) I don't think playing hardball with a registry is going to work. They have their basic costs to survive. Losing money on every domain on a portfolio is not a practical proposition, IMHO. Nobody has a clear idea how much profit the .com registry makes for Verisign. But it probably makes "a lot". I know they signed a continually recurring contract with ICANN. And so it's going to be very messy to transfer .com Registry to somebody else. And Verisign are also making noises about putting .com prices up again.

Yes it was good old Bob, who proposed to take over the .com registry for $2 a domain. Was this a good faith proposition? Or was it designed to put pressure on Verisign? We will never know. And Verisign countered that by signing and automatically recurring renewal of the .com Registry contract. There is something sounding not quite right about having and automatically renewing contract for the .com Registry. So it must be very profitable. Would be my guess :)
 
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So during that flurry of bidding period last week, what we all thought was Huge Domain turned out to be right, they are on the whois of all the did not win section, they are the ones who were churning away, others will probably discover the same results with their whois searches.
Seeing exactly the same thing on my end. HugeDomains show up in the WHOIS record for the vast majority of auctions I've bid in recently. They've actually been winning a lot more auctions than I had anticipated.

Bot bidding seemed to cool down a bit during Feb 11-14. But today and yesterday automated bidding activity was intense again. Looks like they are still testing out how to run their bots, as there has been a lot of variation in bidding patterns over the past week. I've been bidding up bots tens of thousands extra on low quality names over the past few weeks, in the hopes that they'll set up their bots to bid more conservatively. No idea if it has any impact. Doesn't seem like it so far.
 
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Seeing exactly the same thing on my end. HugeDomains show up in the WHOIS record for the vast majority of auctions I've bid in recently. They've actually been winning a lot more auctions than I had anticipated.

Bot bidding seemed to cool down a bit during Feb 11-14. But today and yesterday automated bidding activity was intense again. Looks like they are still testing out how to run their bots, as there has been a lot of variation in bidding patterns over the past week. I've been bidding up bots tens of thousands extra on low quality names over the past few weeks, in the hopes that they'll set up their bots to bid more conservatively. No idea if it has any impact. Doesn't seem like it so far.
I have seen that also, some days they are just grabbing everything, then they ease up a bit, I wonder if it goes with their bank roll, and a %, nice haul on the ebike.com, that should buy them a few days of dominance.
 
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some days they are just grabbing everything, then they ease up a bit
With their bidding activity recently it's looking more like they are testing things out and tweaking bot settings, rather than taking budget restraints into consideration.
 
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nice haul on the ebike.com, that should buy them a few days of dominance.
End user sales have noticeably increased recently, and I'm sure HD are seeing that with their 4 million portfolio. Add sales like the ebike.com one on DC, and it all adds up to a significant amount. So if they want to dominate I'm sure they don't lack the funds to do so these days.

HD's growth have moved in tandem with the economic recovery and growth both globally and in the US over the past few years, which surely has played part in making their quick growth from 2.4 mill to 4 mill domains viable. They're still riding that wave. I wonder whether their model can be sustained if the economic winds change and we enter a more serious financial downturn or recession again.
 
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End user sales have noticeably increased recently, and I'm sure HD are seeing that with their 4 million portfolio. Add sales like the ebike.com one on DC, and it all adds up to a significant amount. So if they want to dominate I'm sure they don't lack the funds to do so these days.

HD's growth have moved in tandem with the economic recovery and growth both globally and in the US over the past few years, which surely has played part in making their quick growth from 2.4 mill to 4 mill domains viable. They're still riding that wave. I wonder whether their model can be sustained if the economic winds change and we enter a more serious financial downturn or recession again.
You make a good point there, they do have that attractive price point that you can take a flyer on their domains. They are ramping up big, the president likes to keep the economy moving, and probably will do whatever it takes so it will keep moving no matter what the consequences are during his presidency.
 
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When people set a proxy bid, and you bid against them, their automated higher bid is marked with "automatic bid" in the "comment" field. I just noticed that when I'm auto outbid by what appears to be bot bidding the comment field is empty (there is no "automatic bid" indication"). I've seen the same thing in other auctions too. Anyone know why/what this means?
 
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GoDaddy is very hit or miss. I see domains go for much cheaper than they should sometimes. Works out frequently.

Occasionally we run up against another party. However, I still think that many of the domains go for less than they are worth.

Just be thankful for the cheap days.
 
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GoDaddy is very hit or miss. I see domains go for much cheaper than they should sometimes. Works out frequently.

Occasionally we run up against another party. However, I still think that many of the domains go for less than they are worth.

Just be thankful for the cheap days.
Please show some examples, as I am seeing the opposite, but maybe we see difference of opinions of valuations in regards to wholesale, and retail.
 
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Just today or yesterday "Landlording.com" went for $1,200! :-o That is a wholesale $5k domain and retail $20k+.

Pugs.net went for $1,125. Which I don't mess with .nets often... but seriously that is a steal.

Both of the above I missed because I'm still learning GoDaddy's shitty bidding system. Whoever got them owes me a drink because they got them for at least $1500 less than I would have been willing to pay.

I haven't messed with GoDaddy for like 5 years because they pissed me off, so these are just over the last few days since I've been back.

I have a posting on NamePros asking for wholesale pricing for .COMs. I've received 90% garbage priced like gold. Compared to what I've been able to see on NamePros GoDaddy is a steal.
 
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Just today or yesterday "Landlording.com" went for $1,200! :-o That is a wholesale $5k domain and retail $20k+.

Pugs.net went for $1,125. Which I don't mess with .nets often... but seriously that is a steal.

Both of the above I missed because I'm still learning GoDaddy's sh*tty bidding system. Whoever got them owes me a drink because they got them for at least $1500 less than I would have been willing to pay.

I haven't messed with GoDaddy for like 5 years because they pissed me off, so these are just over the last few days since I've been back.

I have a posting on NamePros asking for wholesale pricing for .COMs. I've received 90% garbage priced like gold. Compared to what I've been able to see on NamePros GoDaddy is a steal.
Landlording.com for $1,200 seems like a great price for godaddy to achieve, ING is not very popular with sell thru rates, so $5K wholesale, I don't see it, as it isn't even a real word, more of a verb type, $20K seems like a real unique one off buyer, but sometimes experience in key industries speaks larger than not for sure.

I agree .net is a crapshoot right now, if you breed dogs, great end user name, but they can add a keyword to the .com, and pay reg fee, which is the way most want to go these days.

I have actually backed off a bit, as prices have titled a over wholesale rates, which will tend to lead to higher outlay, and longer hold times, based on increased ask prices. Will let market settle a bit, or take a breather, but overall more bidders in this small space, can have a huge impact on prices, in this supply and demand based industry.

Thanks for the comments, much appreciated.
 
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Great discussion here guys. I am hoping the bots go crazy today 😁
 
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Just today or yesterday "Landlording.com" went for $1,200! :-o That is a wholesale $5k domain and retail $20k+.

Pugs.net went for $1,125. Which I don't mess with .nets often... but seriously that is a steal.

Both of the above I missed because I'm still learning GoDaddy's sh*tty bidding system. Whoever got them owes me a drink because they got them for at least $1500 less than I would have been willing to pay.

I haven't messed with GoDaddy for like 5 years because they pissed me off, so these are just over the last few days since I've been back.

I have a posting on NamePros asking for wholesale pricing for .COMs. I've received 90% garbage priced like gold. Compared to what I've been able to see on NamePros GoDaddy is a steal.
Landlord is a noun, and it cannot, afaik, be used as a verb. I don't think you can put -ing at the end to denote a verbal action in this case, and I have never heard anyone say they do "landlording" for a living. LandlordING is simply an ungrammatical construct, and a relatively awkward one (lording alone does not denote a verbal action either), it's certainly not a real word, so that really limits the end user price. $1200 already seems really on the high end for reseller (I'd have expected the name to go for $350 to $700 at most in an auction among domainers), and $5K looks more like end-user pricing than "true" re-seller price imo. I struggle to see this name sell for $20K+ unless you own hundreds of thousands of names and follow the Mike Mann strategy.

But the good news is that if you think domains like landlording.com and pugs.net for low $X,XXX are real steals, you haven't missed out on any opportunities because domains of this quality come up for auction at GD every day, and more often than not sell for less. And if you would have been willing to pay $1500 more for each of these (so $2500-3000 range), as you said in your post, I can guarantee you that going forwards you'll be able to win almost every single auction at GoDaddy for domains of a similar quality. The only limit will be your own budget, more so than competition from other domainers.
 
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When people set a proxy bid, and you bid against them, their automated higher bid is marked with "automatic bid" in the "comment" field. I just noticed that when I'm auto outbid by what appears to be bot bidding the comment field is empty (there is no "automatic bid" indication"). I've seen the same thing in other auctions too. Anyone know why/what this means?

It isn´t an "automatic bid" like a proxy bid which goes up if someone makes a lower bid. It´s a "normal" bid done via Auctions API. That´s the reason they are so fast and it seems that it was a proxy.
 
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It isn´t an "automatic bid" like a proxy bid which goes up if someone makes a lower bid. It´s a "normal" bid done via Auctions API. That´s the reason they are so fast and it seems that it was a proxy.
Say if I bid $100, how are they able to outbid me with a $100 bid but without that being a proxy bid? If their bid comes in "response" to mine, however fast, that shouldn't be possible.
 
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But the good news is that if you think domains like landlording.com and pugs.net for low $X,XXX are real steals,

I'm happy to take them when they do.

Say if I bid $100, how are they able to outbid me with a $100 bid but without that being a proxy bid? If their bid comes in "response" to mine, however fast, that shouldn't be possible.

This is a proxy bid for sure. But many of the annoying bids are done by API people. If everyone was forced to do proxy bids then we'd get to the highest price quickly. Instead the "hesi-bid" is a tactic that gives the API users an unfair advantage to manipulate the price valuable domains.

Hoping I can just get API access so we can take advantage of the advantage.
 
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Say if I bid $100, how are they able to outbid me with a $100 bid but without that being a proxy bid? If their bid comes in "response" to mine, however fast, that shouldn't be possible.

In my experience and with my understanding this should not be possible. I had it sometimes that I make a first bid and a second bid bidder jumps in the same second I put in my "first" offer for a domain. But this bid has never been the same bid amount. At least in my case. And it was performed later than mine. For this reason, I would be the high bidder.

If they had the same bid amount and placed the bid before you did it without showing up as a proxy that´s maybe because API proxy bids don´t show up as "Automatic bids."?! Will take a look at it the next days if no one knows for sure. Would be easier to follow if GoDaddy would show the bid times with seconds instead of just minutes.
 
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I'm glad I found this thread as I have been meaning to post about this for awhile. It seems that since late last year, the minimum price to win a domain auction at GD, NJ and DC has shot up dramatically. What could be had for <$100 now goes for $400+ on average. I attribute that in large part to players like HD and Afternic increasing their maximum bids, the increasing use of bots/automated software to bid domains up and surreptitious activities by known parties in plain view of auction houses. This is not good for the majority of domains. In fact, I'm believing there will be a big shake-out of average domainers in our industry this year due to the reasons above. All I ask is for is honest, transparent and fair auctions. I brought some of these issues to the attention of GoDaddy, for example, but I get no traction. They know what's going on. Not hard to fix.
 
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Yes GD auctions are going crazy, most of the time domains are sold above wholesale prices, and sometimes are sold even above end user price, like this expired domain auction that is running right now:

22666.com
https://au.godaddy.com/domain-auctions/22666-com-277410846

Current bid is $38,000 with 1 day left :xf.eek:

I wonder if multiple end users are bidding on this domain, it is nice domain but noway above $5k-$10k wholesale price!
 
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I'm glad I found this thread as I have been meaning to post about this for awhile. It seems that since late last year, the minimum price to win a domain auction at GD, NJ and DC has shot up dramatically. What could be had for <$100 now goes for $400+ on average. I attribute that in large part to players like HD and Afternic increasing their maximum bids, the increasing use of bots/automated software to bid domains up and surreptitious activities by known parties in plain view of auction houses. This is not good for the majority of domains. In fact, I'm believing there will be a big shake-out of average domainers in our industry this year due to the reasons above. All I ask is for is honest, transparent and fair auctions. I brought some of these issues to the attention of GoDaddy, for example, but I get no traction. They know what's going on. Not hard to fix.

GD are hardly likely to bite the hand that feeds them. They are more likely to do the opposite. Which is what actually has happened. They stopped the use of their API to regular customers, and at the same time refined it, for their biggest customers.
 
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Bitcoin collapse
New tld collapse
All coming back to .com!
 
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Something that came to mind when reading some of this thread. GoDaddy had the intention, to basically go after the expiring domains market, when they recruited all these other registrars to their auction platform to sell their expiring domains thru the GoDaddy platform. Lets face it. This was an intentional act by GoDaddy to try to sow up the expiring domains market. Which they pretty much had control of anyway, just by auctioning off their own inventory. They have had a lot of teething problems with this along the way. Including the other registrars allowing the domain owners to renew their domain even whilst they are under auction at GoDaddy. I blame GoDaddy mostly for this. Trying to woo these registrars to the table, by saying, they could keep their own ToS. When you should have said, your ToS, needs to be revised to the same rules that GoDaddy uses. But as I say, these are/were just teething problems.

So. GoDaddy now have the biggest market share in terms of domain registrations, and expiring domains. OK. There's still 2 big competitors in the expiring domains market, SnapNames and NameJet. I don't see them buying either of them. But I do see them, at some time in the future, cooperating with them. Which would probably be beneficial to all parties.

GoDaddy's participation in the deleted domain market, is shamefully pitiful. You can buy a deleted domain at GoDaddy by handreg before they can capture the domain by a GoDaddy Backorder. That IS pitiful. Who are their competitors in this expiring domains market? both SnapNames and NameJet, and DropCatch (ie Huge Domains). So I will predict, that at sometime, GoDaddy will make a play for the domain drop catch market. The normal way GoDaddy has launched into these markets, has been by internally developing it's systems. Which are incredibly slow to come to fruition. It's probably safe to say, this would be a lot cheaper than buying SnapName, Namejet, and/or DropCatch/Huge Domains. Beat them into submission before you buy, seems to be the tactics they normally have used. So this could be a long way off. Far enough off, that nobody will remember this prediction :)
 
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I attribute that in large part to players like HD and Afternic increasing their maximum bids

Afternic doesn't buy names.
 
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