So you THOUGHT Flippa was shady?

[S-B]

Sorry in advance, Kevin. Should have had your people leave me alone.

Flippa has been the subject of much controversy over the last 6 months. Speculative talk has ranged from shill bidding to bloated sales reports. Most of the accusations are pure garbage but the company is sketchy as hell.

While you might be thinking that I’m bitter because I haven’t any luck there, you should know that I moved $75,000 of domains in 6 months. At one point, I was the first to go to bat for them all because I try to show some loyalty when someone is taking care of me.

However, I recently had my Super Seller status revoked “due to comments made towards other users.” In fact, this is due to my response to the auction where an individual claimed to have an offer on a 3 day old domain of 10,000 bitcoins — that’s $2,500,000. Apparently, calling out a scammer is grounds for retaliation from the business.

I suppose this is because Flippa values net revenue more than customer satisfaction.

Now that you know my motivation I will move on and share a little bit of insider information.

If you’re paying full price for listing fees and upgrades you have been scammed.

They have gone on the defensive in the past by saying that they “subsidize” upgrades for their top sellers. Subsidize is a cute word for giveaway.

I received somewhere between $3,000 to $5,000 in “subsidies” — as a private seller — over 6 months. At one point, I received $2,000 in credits at one time.

Now I won’t lie, sometimes I had to pay for listings. When I did, I still got hooked up. For every upgrade or listing I purchased I received 2 free.

So when I paid, which was rare, I paid 1/3 of what you’ve been paying. I’m sure you now see why some people make a killing off their platform while others have lost hundreds of dollars per listing.

Oh you thought Editor’s choice was for good domains? Nah. It has been a filter for friends of Flippa.

When I sold on Flippa’s platform, I was given Editor’s Choice for nearly all of my domains. Why? Because I asked.

I know some of you noticed that only 3-5 people showed up when visiting that page. Some might not care but others might understand the value of this.

Domains at Flippa sell for much more when given the Editor’s Choice designation.

Oh so you suspect shilling? I’ve known many users who have shilled their way to a profit. It doesn’t benefit Flippa to eliminate shilling. High sales mean higher success fees.

Simple as that.

Straight up scamming? Yep.

I’ve reported verifiable scams to customer support and I didn’t hear back until after the auction closed. They stated that it was now the buyer’s responsibility to report the sale if something fishy occurred.

Hmmmm.

Would the buyer receive a refund? No. Would the seller be suspended? Yes. Would Flippa still profit? Damn right.

At the end of the day, you can choose to use their platform of boycott them.

I will choose the latter.

P.S.

Have you been curious about what Flippa has been doing?

They are working on adding small business to their platform.

Yeah. Dump money into selling physical business without verifying any of their claims.

That should work. Everyone is honest. Right?

 

[HeyNow]

I've never been able to see reserve prices.

Perhaps not. But if you're on the inside with others who have that information, then the temptation and opportunity are as apparent as if you were, in your own carefully chosen words, "able to see reserve prices."
If someone else tells you the reserve price, it's the same as if you saw it yourself.

Some of us out here believe you cannot be trusted. Congratulations, you've earned quite a reputation, eh?

 

[S-B]

Some of us out here believe you cannot be trusted.

Says a man who hides behind an alias.

 

[DomainGist]

Perhaps not. But if you're on the inside with others who have that information, then the temptation and opportunity are as apparent as if you were, in your own carefully chosen words, "able to see reserve prices."
If someone else tells you the reserve price, it's the same as if you saw it yourself.

Some of us out here believe you cannot be trusted. Congratulations, you've earned quite a reputation out here, eh?

In my opinion if flippa set the ground rules and say that employees can bid on any auction, then it should be flippa who are subjected to criticism on this specific issue.

I find it bizarre that this is permitted, but if it is then the buck stops at flippa.

The conclusion appears to be that flippa the organisation permits shill bidding when carried out by employees, which is rather damning isn't it?

 

[S-B]

In my opinion if flippa set the ground rules and say that employees can bid on any auction, then it should be flippa who are subjected to criticism on this specific issue.

I find it bizarre that this is permitted, but if it is then the buck stops at flippa.

Truthfully, Flippa gave me a second account that was limited to brokerage. I was told that I cannot buy on that account but I was welcome to continue being a member of the community on my personal account.

I know many members are outraged by this but I don't think it should be a point of tension.

I had no incentive to help them earn more revenue. Seems silly to risk my ass for no monetary gain.

And you might say Flippa cut some people in to this scheme but they are way too cheap to compensate people for such a remedial activity.

 

[HeyNow]

In my opinion if flippa set the ground rules and say that employees can bid on any auction, then it should be flippa who are subjected to criticism on this specific issue.

I find it bizarre that this is permitted, but if it is then the buck stops at flippa.

What you find bizarre matters little. What you demonstrate is that you've not been following this issue in this forum. Lots of posts laying blame on Flippa's doorstep and that paid hack who seems to work damage control for them in this forum.

 

[DomainGist]

What you demonstrate is that you've not been following this issue in this forum.

Really? It wasn't me who quoted Shane Bellone posts from March to July on the previous page of this thread then? I seem to have been switched on enough to notice those disparities?

I believe I'm perfectly justified in simply pointing out that if flippa has a policy which allows employees to bid on auctions then they continue to leave themselves wide open to accusations of shill bidding, my point was really quite clear, those are accusations which will continue to arise for as long as brokers and other employees are bidding, doesn't matter whether that is Shane or some other guy.

You don't agree with that why?

 

[FlippaDomains]

Catching up, here:

The conclusion appears to be that flippa the organisation permits shill bidding when carried out by employees, which is rather damning isn't it?

Sorry, I missed exactly how you got to this "conclusion."

And if we go deeper, things will get dirtier. Their (Flippa) creation Ali, his manipulated auctions and fake profits. His interviews with another "super seller" were full of lies. As we proved that in one of his threads. And these interviews went viral and many newbies lost a lot. Flippa is so unethical, that some of you may call this "business". I am calling it - scam.

Flippa didn't "create" Ali -- Ali became our best seller and we hired him. Can you explicitly explain exactly what you're referring to, and prove your accusations, please?

I didn't read all the original thread about that 3 day old domain but what I did see was hardly worthy of getting Shane banned. He made good points and Flippa should be policing the unsubstantiable crap some people write.

We did, we took the listing down -- And let me take this opportunity to remind anyone reading this that if you EVER SEE ANYTHING SUSPECT like this auction (or weird bidding patterns, or A-N-Y-thing), email [email protected] and put it in my Attn.

Shane had pointed out many weird looking auctions before, and we had taken action. Others point out the same, and we take action. If something looks off, report it - we take it seriously. We have mechanisms behind the scenes to flag things that may be dodgy, and sometimes there are false positives. But usually, we have reason to crackdown. We stop anything dodgy that we see. If you feel that we don't, then write me personally and let me know.

Shane, if you 'knew' about shill bidding on a platform and didn't tell anyone because it was benefiting you, it's amoral and unethical.

And if Kevin / Flippa are aware of shill bidding and condone it, it's downright criminal.It doesn't matter how much you try to dress it up, sh*t stinks.

I'd like to be able to assure it never happens - anywhere. Do you have a perfect solution as to how to stop it? I'm all ears. As for bidder aliases, I'm going to start a new thread about that.

1. As Shane admitted he is no saint, the discussion should focus on whether Flippa's "integrity" team can revoke a well-known super seller for a comment on a scam listing.

2. Though Shane says that could be the reason I feel there is more to it. The relationship seems to have been strained before itself. Shane has said multiple times before (recently) Flippa as a platform is dead.

3. Kevin says the "integrity team" does not know Shane. lol. So they will block those who are not known by them, at the first instance itself. For others that are known to them, they will play caution (read, they allow established shill bidders who are big guys to do anything in the platform and fast to block a small time newbie for small offenses). Seems like there is no connection between Kevin and the integrity team.

What probably happened is that somebody at Flippa saw that thread, looked up Shane's account to see if they were making money from him, and when they realized that they no longer were, decided to use the comment to withdraw his super seller status. Most probably not as a punishment but as a way to open dialogue with him about becoming active again.

We don't make business decisions based out of spite or trying to leverage someone to "sell more." Shane stopped selling on Flippa and I'll explain more about this and some more behind-the-scenes things everyone should know in a subsequent post.

When I mentioned previously that the Marketplace Integrity Team didn't know it was Shane, it's because...I know Shane. Shane speaks his mind. What he sometimes says gets him in trouble -- but like I mentioned previously, I'd rather have a vigilant M.I. team working for us that acts first and apologizes later.

Maybe the SuperSeller status was taken away as Shane last sold 3 months back and has no intent to use the platform moving forward?

Edit: see Shane's post below.

Truthfully, there was no strain on my relationship with Kevin.

He's a great guy and super honest.

I actually put off writing this post for months because I didn't want him to have to go on the defensive.

However, when someone - in this case a company - spits in my face I will respond.

@Shane Bellone I wish it could have been handled better. More in my next post...

 

[DomainGist]

Sorry, I missed exactly how you got to this "conclusion."

Your domain brokers are allowed to bid on listings in whatever manner they please, according to a former domain broker.

Perhaps you could counter this claim with a deeper explanation of what flippa employees are and are not allowed to do.

Does "whatever manner they please" include bidding up listings for which flippa (and themselves) are set to gain a brokerage commission? Is it true that no restrictions exist on what listings employees are permitted to bid on?

Are they allowed, for example, to bid on listings created by other flippa employees?

I'd have thought the implication that there are no limitations on what a flippa employees can bid on has potential consequences which are patently obvious to all, but obviously not to you?

 

[S-B]

Your domain brokers are allowed to bid on listings in whatever manner they please, according to a former domain broker.

In all fairness, you are allowed to bid in whatever manner you please as well.

Read their Terms of Service.

 

[tik5]

How many flippa employees have access to the reserve price?

Are all flippa employees allowed to bid on auctions?

 

[DomainGist]

That was probably their reason for revoking.

You've had 50+ hours to ask them the reason, if you had done so you wouldn't need to publicly speculate?

Shane Bellone claims that they gave him the reason in the email, and that it was comments made towards other members, so it was 'probably not' their reason. Just saying.

 

[JamesCrew]

How many flippa employees have access to the reserve price?

Are all flippa employees allowed to bid on auctions?

And this my friends would open floodgates (of so many questions) for Flippa.

 

[HeyNow]

Finally, and deservedly, implosion.

 

[S-B]

You've had 50+ hours to ask them the reason, if you had done so you wouldn't need to publicly speculate?

Shane Bellone claims that they gave him the reason in the email, and that it was comments made towards other members, so it was 'probably not' their reason. Just saying.

Hi Shane Bellone,

Your Super seller status has been revoked due to comments you have made towards other users which his not in line with the high standards we expect of Super Sellers.

Kind Regards,

The Flippa Team

Flippa.com - The leading marketplace for buying and selling websites, domains and apps.

 

[biggie]

i think

those who used the service, played a part in promoting the service.

and as the user base grew, so did the hype

that hype fed the listings, which fueled the frenzy

cuz, in the minds of domainiers, they sold names.

as the reported sales continued, it spurred the tiered fee structure

premium listings, editors choice, super sellers....this ball was rolling!

perks, are what makes shit happen sometimes, who gives them and who gets them, can always be a problem for the non-receivers, but if you aren't a participant, then you don't get caught-up.

and that's really the crux of this epishit, folks got caught-up and cuz an insider spilled the beans, some wanna step on em.

if you still in it, then you still in it, if you're unhappy, either get out or lobby for the changes you want.
but hating the messenger won't affect the service.

imo....

 

[NameOmnia]

We stop anything dodgy that we see

LOL apart from giving away stuff to your "family members", gifting the same people with editor's choice and Super Seller statuses...plus all the rest that has been pointed out a million times in this forum...

You've had 50+ hours to ask them the reason, if you had done so you wouldn't need to publicly speculate?

They always do that..they reply saying they are looking..they will look at implementing...they are going to fix it...they might do this or that but NOTHING ever happens. It is just a way to take time and let people forget so they can keep being the same until the next issue comes up on the forum. The loop at that point would simply start over.

As for the incriminated auction that caused the stir; I have seen the OPs comments and they were really over the top. One thing is pointing out facts, another is making fun of the seller and becoming something very close to offensive. Such comments would never be allowed on ANY sale thread on NP; so Flippa employees simply applied their procedures not knowing, though, that Shane is ( was ) one of the untouchable PROs & Flippa-gang members.


You didn't create Ali Flippa? Sorry but it doesn't take much to create a brand by giving away editor's choices, upgrades, Super Seller statuses etc; it is number one rule of marketing so do not go on treating us like we are dumb or so.

Is https://flippa.com/5163653-great-it-branche-website-for-sale considered as shill bidding?

What the appropriate name for that is I do not know but they have been doing here on the forum too. Specifically the OP listed a name for auction and Ali was bidding on it against another member if I remember properly. It can obviously be 100% white hat but considering the last events ( and all that we are not ware of both at Flippa and among PRO members ) it could be suspicious.... Apologies if it's not.

 

[S-B]

What the appropriate name for that is I do not know but they have been doing here on the forum too. Specifically Shane listed a name for auction and Ali was bidding on it against another member if I remember properly. It can obviously be 100% white hat but considering the last events ( and all that we are not ware of both at Flippa and among PRO members ) it could be suspicious.... Apologies if it's not.

People bid when you have names worth owning. One day you'll understand that. Until then... keep my name out of your mouth. K. Thanks.

 

[NameOmnia]

People bid when you have names worth owning. One day you'll understand that. Until then... keep my name out of your mouth. K. Thanks.

First of all calm down you chose to use your real name so take responsibility for your choices. I will call you the OP or the scammer if you prefer.
It was a name that went for low xxx so brag about your successes somewhere else or with someone else. You put me on your ignore list long ago and it was a very comfortable place so please leave me there.

 

[S-B]

First of all calm down you chose to use your real name so take responsibility for your choices. I will call you the OP or the scammer if you prefer.
The name was a .net that went for xx or low xxx so brag about your successes somewhere else or with someone else. You put me on your ignore list long ago and it was a very comfortable place so please leave me there.

I do use my real name because I'm man enough to stand behind my words and actions.

Feel free to call me a scammer. Hell, you assume everyone who doesn't coddle you to be illegitimate. "Oh no! VYLY.com didn't make the TOP forum. Must be that damn PRO group. What do they know! I live, breathe, and eat LLLL.coms."

*Rolls Eyes*

 

[NameOmnia]

LOL..you are a funny character...
And well..yes..women tend to be suspicious or hysteric especially during PMS

You are so right; thanks for letting everyone know : I truly ate 2 lllls for breakfast and 6 for lunch, filled my car tank with 1, made my bed with 7 ( odd numbers make me sleep better.. ) and I frtd 1 one out just for you...

 

[iowadawg]

This thread is a great roller coaster!
Goes up slow, comes down fast.
Then speeds around corners.
Hope the ride does not end before me.

 

[daj]

FlippaDomains,

Can't flippa set up some sort of escrow "holding account" that all bidders have to directly deposit into in order for their bid to show up?

This would prevent all sorts of fraud as only those who have the money on hand can bid. It would also allow for a quicker payment to the seller.

After the auction is over...
Those bidders who didn't win...refund them.
If the bidder did win...pay the seller after they turn over the domain to the buyer.

 

[brandnow]

Thank you, Shane. Rock on!

 

[none11]

Loving this thread learned a lot!

 

[sofiapartner]

You didn't create Ali Flippa? Sorry but it doesn't take much to create a brand by giving away editor's choices, upgrades, Super Seller statuses etc; it is number one rule of marketing so do not go on treating us like we are dumb or so.

Thank you, @photonmymind . However, Kevin makes me angry when he continues to think that we are dumb. So I decided to answer him and to all the newbies that PMd me asking where we discussed the AliZandi "miracles"

It all started when Flippa decided to make one genius marketing move. To create and promote Ali Zandi - "ordinary guy making a lot of money over night thanks to domains and Flippa".

To be honest I was already suspicious when he came from nowhere here at namepros and started to teach us with his long, positive posts summing up as - "work hard, list at flippa, become rich". His posts smelled from the beginning. It was just too easy. And we knew and we know - that it isn't.

Then - the interview with DomainSherpa. I don't know how much flippa paid for that, but it was genius. This interview was shared and shared and went viral and many newbies entered the game. The game that they didn't know how to play, but it seems so easy. Just look at Ali. Already in Hawai living the Flippa dream. Since we know that this is not how things work in domaining - we were safe - but not the newbies. So many of them started to list at flippa, buying premium upgrades (they were actually buying them, not like Shane).

So these newbies were waiting to become rich, move to hawaii, propose to their fiancee - you know... the ali zandi stuff . Well - they didn't . They ask me over and over again - where we discussed this. Is this true - that flippa and Ali are lying. Of course it's true. It's all business. Right, Shane?

Here is the promo of DomainSherpa (another businessman) for his interview with Ali.

[QUOTE]Ali Zandi entered the domain name industry as an investor in mid-2014. He started by purchasing 10 domain names and sold every single one within 30 days on Flippa.

He did such a good job, he moved from selling about $2,000 to $12,000 in a period of three months, was upgraded from "New" to "Super Seller" on Flippa, and was offered a newly created senior broker position at Flippa. (His sales are now $402,000 in the first 7 months.)

In this interview, Ali Zandi talks about who buys what types of domain names on Flippa, and walks us through his exact process for listing domain names for sale on Flippa.
http://www.domainsherpa.com/ali-zandi-flippa-interview/
[/QUOTE]

Actually all the statements made in this promo are lies.

Ali Zandi entered the domain name industry as an investor in mid-2014. First sentence - first lie. He entered the industry before that but had no success. Unfortunately Flippa already had deleted the history, the auctions, the domains of KCGroup (yes - this was AliZandi again). And also most of the auctions of AliZandi when he already was AliZandi.

Here is a question for you, Kevin. Why you deleted all this auctions? Why you deleted all the history of KCGroup and AliZandi?

Fortunately I have some data. Ali entered flippa not in the mid-2014 or in July 2014 as he is stating in the interview. You can see his lie at 3:58 at the interview - "In July when I actually started..."

The truth - He started selling at flippa in March 2014. He sold

Meningocele.com - $20
The following 4 domains for $999:
F0B.com
RO4.com
DOW2.com
1CPO.com

seizure.info - $51

And some other shitty domains for shitty price. Not even close to the interesting story with the ten domains - $2K to $12K and so on. The marketing tricks of Flippa.

Nothing unexpected. Nothing like what is about to start in July. And what happened in July? Well - for some reason all of his domains started to receive ultra premium upgrades with the logo, standing always on the top, editor's choces, collecting watchers, etc. and started to sell for some unbelievable prices. Did he paid for his updates? Well - we all know the answer of that, don't we? Did these domains actually were sold? Well - for most of them - I honestly doubt that.

These domain include the famous
cupcakefrosting.com for $601 sold in Sep 12th 2014

Do you know where is this domain now? Well - again at flippa. Another "Super seller" is trying to sell it - > https://flippa.com/3474570-no-title. I bet that he will have hard time to do so. If this is his intention. Or he played his role in making Ali - a domain wonder. We can only guess.

Let me ask again @FlippaDomains - Why all Ali Zandi sales are deleted? Why is his profile is deleted? Actually you deleted two of his profiles - KCGroup and AliZandi with all thiese fake sales there? Come on, man. We have some archives.

----------
Let me remind you what they claim in the interview:

His sales are now $402,000 in the first 7 months.

The Truth - These are his actual sales for his "first" 7 months - Total - 50 sales @ $68,727

Many of these domains are sold with bonus domains.

MobileDrones.com $2875
RealEstateForeclosures.com $7500
DomainDropper.com $505
Throttles.com $1050
FirearmMagazine.com $455
Holeout.com $2000
Minorities.com $5000
OsakaTourism.com $850
ScubaTank.com $2500
Enlargements.org $90
Jihad.info $350
Bean-Bags.com $400
TokyoTourism.com $2000
PisaItaly.com $450
OahuResorts.com $1999
Epiphora.com $350
VicePrincipal.com $399
MonthlyRewards.com $1500
Semtex.com $3500
FlooringOptions.com $999
InpatientDetox.com $800
Hitler.info $2999
ExoticCarAuction.com $1500
FreeInstrumentals.com $4000
BackupMac.com $551
Cloey.com $1999
GunEngraver.com $395
MyPropertyListings.com $1500
Flipped.net $1999
Occults.com $799
Whift.com $501
StereoDeals.com $449
ReggaeSongs.com $1999
NearestRestaurants.com $1500
CupcakeFrosting.com $601
CeremonyMusic.com $2100
RealEstateAuctions.info $65
AppDesignSchool.com $7500
FiOS.info $100
Muse.info $200
BaytownApartments.com $124
Condos-For-Sale.com $175
T3i.net $206
F5O.com $365
seizure.info $51
sexywallpapers.org $90
F0B.com $999
Meningocele.com $20
soundboards.org $118
StockPhotoPlanet.com $250

Total = 50 sales @ $68,727

Here is one interesting thread where this and more is discussed -> https://www.namepros.com/threads/flippa.849498/

And I can't find another one where all of his lies and much more was exposed.

Ali Zandi removed his comments from this thread, because he had nothing smart to say - then he was AliZandi, after that he became "Perception", now he is "The Group". So you can't read his comments which are edited and replaced by him with " My comments have been removed to proceed in a positive manner."

Some of his lies however are quoted by other members - so they stay. Not all unfortunately.

Do you want me to continue, Kevin? I have some really interesting things to say about Ali and Flippa.