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| "Short" Domain Discussion Generally defined as easily resalable domains of 5 characters or less -- LLL, LLLL, L-L-L, 2c, 3c, acronyms, etc |
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09-18-2008, 10:23 PM
| THREAD STARTER #1 (permalink) |
| NamePros Expert  Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Las Vegas
Posts: 6,268
     | LLLL.com's plummeting in value? Is it just my imagination or are these no longer something to hold. I actually sold most of my quality LLLL.com for $xxx and a few crappers for $60-$80. I saw just a couple months ago it seemed the minimal was $40-$50 but now it's like $20-$25 if that even. I believe these "sellouts" aren't going to be earners anymore. CCC.net's have gone nowhere and now LLLL.com's are faultering. Quality is one again winning over quality. Doesn't matter how many LLLL.com's are sold out because fqzx.com is still low quality no matter how you look at it. Discuss.
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09-18-2008, 10:34 PM
| #2 (permalink) |
| NamePros Regular Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 227
| It's been $20-$25 minimum for a few months.
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09-18-2008, 10:48 PM
| #3 (permalink) |
| Domain Buyer  Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 5,224
      | I think that right now a lot of people are looking at renewals coming up and want to unload them. Right now there is an abundance of supply that has hit the market, so it's easy to snag them for cheap prices.
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09-18-2008, 11:21 PM
| #4 (permalink) |
| Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: by the beach
Posts: 1,123
| It's interesting to see as I have not kept up with the price much lately. If these are failing then it's not a great sign for other LLLL ones like .net & .info etc or LL-L.com etc... Maybe with the stock market crash we will see more speculators with cash soon to pick the market up again. I'm guessing it is a lot to do with over supply, bad economy & also the way new extensions will be on offer soon as announced by ICann a few months ago...
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09-19-2008, 12:15 AM
| #5 (permalink) |
| Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: EU
Posts: 1,846
| I think it's not good for LLLL nets infos etc. but .com remains .com even in recession, I predict that the prices will go up in 2009. might fall to regfee for the worst ones before that though  but in that case we have several members here who promised last year to buy out every available LLLL.com this fall/winter.
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09-19-2008, 12:38 AM
| #6 (permalink) |
| NamePros Regular Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: AllPurposes.com
Posts: 485
| @lab it is not minimum 20 anymore I asked like 2-5 days ago that it is actually around 15 by now for bulk buy  .
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09-19-2008, 12:39 AM
| #7 (permalink) |
| Domain Buyer Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 5,224
| I'm going to forward this thread to Reece by PM to see if he can comment on what he thinks. If there's someone who is an expert on short domains, it would be NamePros' very own Reece!
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09-19-2008, 12:44 AM
| #8 (permalink) |
| VURG Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Australia
Posts: 2,565
| I say that until LLLL.com are 100% backordered, the value in the lower value domains is volatile. This trend appears same for any type of bought out domain. When CCC.com became 100% backordered, it was very exciting but they hovered between $20 and $50 for quite a while before then. There was some excitement in January/February as it looked like there was a large enough demand to reach this stage but it didn't happen. There is still a lot of domainers who invested into these names with the intension of a quick flip who are liquidating their domains and the long term investors have little motivation to backorder the low quality domains when you can get them cheaper on the reseller market. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/short-domain-discussion/515596-llll-coms-plummeting-in-value.html That said, I was never a big fan of domains like fqzx.com. I much prefer a nice sounding LLLLL.com. |
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09-19-2008, 01:53 AM
| #9 (permalink) |
| Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,299
| I have been wondering where Reece is. 4letternoob.com is a holding page. The world economy is in recession. All domains will continue to fall in price until the economy finds bottom. The new federal buy-up of junk mortgage loans may do it, or there could be a long while yet to go. No way to tell from here. I think LLLL.coms will do very well, compared to the over all domain market, once the recession is over. Until then there are few with money to buy. I agree there are still short-timers in the market, more so than more mature sectors. |
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09-19-2008, 02:07 AM
| #10 (permalink) |
| Domain Buyer Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 5,224
| A post by Reece back in June entitled "Portrait of a Crashing LLLL.com Market": http://bqb.com/4letternoob/index.php...ashing-market/
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09-19-2008, 02:25 AM
| #11 (permalink) | ||||
| NamePros Expert  Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Canada
Posts: 8,984
   | Completely agree. I know many of us have been saying for many months now that renewal time would be "interesting". The low end LLLL.com market is still saturated with flippers who are imho largely to blame for both the rapid rise and rapid decline. Many LLLL.com investors have been saying from the start that the low end market was a long term play.. I really can't see it any other way at present and I doubt things will get better before they get worse. The very high end LLLL.com market seems to be doing just fine, with CVCVs leading the way. This would seem to defy any argument which places blame for what's happened largely on the economy. The economy certainly isn't helping, however I think the majority of the blame lies on speculators who quite simply, over-speculated. For a domainer interested in entering this market, the next couple months present an interesting opportunity for them to observe and/or capitalize on what happens next. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 Freshly renewed LLLL.coms are being had for as little as $15 at present, placing the value of an LLLL.com expiring in the Sep-Nov 08 timeframe at about $8. At that price point, flippers are at best breaking even (and that's assuming they got in pre-buyout which most didn't). What these flippers decide to do will imho largely decide how these renewals play out. Some of the flippers who got into LLLL.coms in the Jan-March 08 period have gotten burnt pretty bad already and it'll be interesting to see how much more they can take.
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09-19-2008, 02:45 AM
| #12 (permalink) |
| Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Blaine, Wa.
Posts: 1,971
| LLLL owners caught in a poor economy Shock and awe is hitting the world now as people lift their heads out of the sand and see how the commies who run this government is now -ucking up our lifestyles and our freedoms. Lower priced LLLL are owned mostly by domainers on a lower budget. Its those domainers who are feeling the downturn. When money is tight due to the inflation we have been getting I can understand the renew or sell cheap theory. To call this a recession is overstating the economy. This is a revelation moment where the curtain has been lifted and we can see the lies and ignorance of our elected officials. This bunch of morons out did any party before them and sold out capitialism to socialism. We will have a much longer downturn then a normal recession. The massive paper dollars to fund this nationalization for this gang of looters will guarantee massive inflation. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 If the economy continues to implode will LLLL go up? Probably, after 2010.
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Last edited by goodkarmaco; 09-19-2008 at 12:18 PM.
Reason: Misspell
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09-19-2008, 04:12 AM
| #15 (permalink) |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: goldnames.com
Posts: 4,634
| As easy as it is, good LLLL.COM will raise in the value, bad ones lost their value.
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09-19-2008, 05:16 AM
| #16 (permalink) |
| NamePros Regular  Join Date: May 2006 Location: NamePower.us
Posts: 760
  | IMO LLLL.com's were always overvalued, pumped up by domainers eager for the next LLL.com, which may never materialize. The number of potential endusers with four word names/products is simply geometrically less than those with three. Your prospects go down exponentially by adding in the fourth letter abbreviation. And it's hard for me to ever see an enduser market in XZQQ.com. The overvalued prices were driven by wishful thinking on the part of domainers who didn't get in early enough to get useful letters, imo. ripley.
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09-19-2008, 08:07 AM
| #17 (permalink) |
| NamePros Expert  Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Carlsbad, CA
Posts: 7,848
   | I think LLLL.com's this year have been the "primary" reseller focus this past year. I think the economy taking tumbles is a huge factor on people spending money in this sector. The truth is, its a risky investment. Early on, the returns were fantastic - better then just about anything out there. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 However, the realization is, when the market is in a slump, its clear that speculation was driving prices (especially on the lower end spectrum). Everyone is affected, but the higher quality your holdings, the less dip your seeing rihgt now. Many of the bigger players warned people this was going to happen. I know I talked to a few people about it early on. Since the economy is clearly in recession, does that mean that there are less internet users? Nope. It just means consumers are cautious about spending money. This means advertisers need to be smarter and attract more visitors just to maintain their current/past sales volumes. One thing I love about the internet. You need more sales, buy more traffic.
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09-19-2008, 12:16 PM
| #18 (permalink) |
| NamePros Regular Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 349
| I just think the problem is that people look at LLLL.coms like some kind of get rich quick investment, now that they're seeing it isnt many are in panic. Everyone just needs to look at LLLL names for what they are, a solid investment thats sure to outperform traditional ones. Everyone just needs to sit tight and start thinking more long term. Things are going to get better, we just need to ride this downturn out.
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09-19-2008, 02:02 PM
| #19 (permalink) | ||||
| Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,187
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 ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 I've never been a huge believer in LLLL .coms, and the only reason I ever bought any was to sell back to domainers that thought they were the next big thing. Sometimes, for people like me, hype is a good thing.  At the end of the day, the only true valuable domains are the ones that can be sold to end users. "VQBZ.COM" is not something an end user will use. In today's Internet, even though a company might use an acronym as their name (which LLLL .coms are commonly used for -- obscure acronyms) an acronym URL isn't the best way to go. Many times, call-to-action names are the way to go to get people to remember your website. For example, if I own a product called "Steve's Zany Skin 'Juvenator" I'm not going to use the domain szsj.com; instead, I'll use something like "GoodbyeDrySkin.com." 
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09-19-2008, 07:38 PM
| #20 (permalink) |
| Senior Member  Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Malaysia
Posts: 3,277
 | luckily i manage to sell some in feb price,..n manage to stock in more now some better quality LLLL.coms at much cheaper price. from the market i am seeing LLLL.com is going for about $15 or so now.. can easily can one at that price esp the crappy ones..the last few % of last year available LLLL.com before buyout..i guess for them its no loss since its 100% profit for them.. even quads premium are going for 160-220 ish price nowadays.. i think its a very bad time to sell these nowadays..better hold a few years more n we will be able to see the true value in them...by then more n more LLLL.com will be in end users hands or developed...
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09-19-2008, 07:43 PM
| #21 (permalink) | ||||
| Account Closed Join Date: May 2003
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09-19-2008, 09:14 PM
| #22 (permalink) | ||||
| NamePros Regular  Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: CA,USA
Posts: 812
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????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 You may feel that people whom believe in LLLL.coms are crazy, however, there are people paying hundreds of thousands for short domains. You may feel that "goodbyedryskin.com is gold, however, for some of us domainers, we'd have a very hard time selling something like that as the domain is so limiting. GBDS.com has hundreds of potential endusers. Further, the fact that it is a rare LLLL.com also makes it easier to sell. With GBD.com at 12,000 GBDS.com at $200 looks great. I think that a lot of people are in shock at how well the short domains are doing and still lashing out. Except for a few with unpopular letters that have only doubled in price in a year, many domains that were registered in 2004 are in the hundreds to thousand range already. Face it LL.coms are $90,000 and up. LLL.coms are $7,000 and up. L-L.coms are $2,000 and up, CCC.coms are $200 and up. Why? Because they are short and rare. In closing, moderators rediculing people for investing in these in the short domain forum and stating things like "I told you so", make me dislike posting on Namepros. I applied to be a Moderator once, however, I was turned down. Evidently you were chosen because your a fair and impartial person and thus I hope you won't continue blasting these to suit your own agenda. Again, I'm not blasting you for your opinions, I just think that a moderator in any forum, say the web design forum, should not state things like "anyone who does web designing is wasting their time and money." Edit: I just noticed that your not a moderator, but Namepros staff. Guess I'll probably be banned now.
Last edited by 4LTR.org; 09-19-2008 at 09:18 PM.
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09-19-2008, 09:49 PM
| #23 (permalink) | ||||||||
| Senior Member  Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: X-I
Posts: 2,873
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????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 Let me guess..these are what you have in portfolio now right? This is just an observation of course.
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09-20-2008, 04:04 AM
| #24 (permalink) | ||||||||
| NamePros Expert Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Canada
Posts: 8,984
| That's correct, I dumped 1800+ pre-buyout LLLL.coms and a few hundred I picked up cheap shortly after buyout between late December 07 and January-March 08. I've said from the start (even at buyout) that I believed lower quality LLLL.coms were a long term play and didn't initially get into the LLLL.com market planning to flip. Quite the contrary, I was at peace on November 2nd 2008 knowing I'd likely be paying steep renewal fees annually to renew my portfolio for years to come. When people are happily paying you $35-$55 for LLLL.coms you picked up for $7 only a few months earlier, anyone not overshadowed with greed would take the money and run. People pay hedge fund managers 2 and 20 (sometimes more) and most would consider themselves lucky to get an annual return 1/20th of what I got in the LLLL.com market. I have nothing against people investing in this market, I only advise that caution be exercised, as I've advised for several months now when investing in this market. Purchasing low end LLLL.coms for quick flips (at present) is pretty much like trying to corner the options market by picking your calls at the flip of a coin. "Heads" says the LLLL.com buyout doesn't hold, "Tails" says the LLLL.com buyout does hold but prices at best stagnate and at worst decline further as supply continues to outstrip demand. Anyone want to flip a coin on that? Those are your options for the next couple months. That's calling it as it is... Want to level the playing field? Invest in an LLLL.com where some poor sap has already paid next year's renewal for you. At least that way you'll have another whole year to watch what happens next without sinking more money into your investment. That's the only way I'd consider investing in this market... Flippers had their chance (January, February, March) and most seem to have missed the LLLL.com boat. There won't be another one of that magnitude in such a short period of time, that much is certain. The only intelligent move to make in the low end LLLL.com market at present is a long term move.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596
As for me having any "high quality LLLL.com bias", I have but 1 CVCV myself, a handful of triple repeats remaining (all listed in sig), a couple AABB and that's it. I also keep approximately 50 low quality LLLL.coms at most times and continue to buy + sell them to test market liquidity and arrive at my own conclusions about where the market is heading. Many people on this board have echoed the same statements presented in this post for many months now but it sadly appears to always fall on deaf ears. Closing thoughts: Whatever happens, happens. It's not so much about "what happens" but rather about what position you're in when "what happens", happens. 
Last edited by Reece; 09-20-2008 at 04:28 AM.
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09-20-2008, 05:47 AM
| #25 (permalink) | ||||
| Domains my Dominion  Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Web 1.0
Posts: 9,963
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????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=515596 Many people have jumped in on the LLLL bandwagon under the (flawed) assumption that they would obey the same dynamics. It's not just about scarcity. Truth is, the LLL (and LL) are a different breed of animals. LLL are great for acronyms but the LLLL ?? Tougher game IMHO. A usual the better combos like CVCV continue to do well but most LLLL do not fall in that category. The bottom line is this: there is little demand if any for crappy short names. Sure, one mediocre domain could sell here and there but the liquidity of that particular market probably isn't too great as a whole. Besides, transactions between domainers provide no indication as to the health of the (real) end user market. Dnsaleprice.com data: Code: 1 DKVT.com 60 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 2 IUZO.com 181 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 3 IELW.com 130 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 4 YMix.com 224 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 5 QEKI.com 311 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 6 ZIOE.com 310 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 7 ICCQ.com 1,848 Sep-08 Sedo 8 CCZM.com 80 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 9 BITY.com 2,702 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 10 EZXB.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 11 YILV.com 981 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 12 PUZR.com 500 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 13 AGGR.com 400 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 14 MZBT.com 110 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 15 QTom.com 210 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 16 Aius.com 1,050 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 17 IIPR.com 1,500 Sep-08 TDNam 18 Frug.com 1,050 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 19 KQTQ.com 89 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 20 TTUV.com 119 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 21 DGFY.com 80 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 22 MMQV.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 23 HTTH.com 904 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 24 CIDK.com 160 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 25 YHAR.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 26 STWI.com 350 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 27 DUKF.com 104 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 28 DUTM.com 163 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 29 IKDU.com 119 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 30 UHPF.com 60 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 31 UHGP.com 60 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 32 ZOZO.com 8,900 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 33 GRMF.com 229 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 34 MTUF.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 35 EDIB.com 750 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 36 BUTJ.com 80 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 37 Debi.com 5,000 Sep-08 Moniker/Internext 38 CUNI.com 2,951 Sep-08 NameJet 39 PhpS.com 2,301 Sep-08 NameJet 40 Tula.com 6,399 Sep-08 NameJet 41 IKIB.com 341 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 42 ZUWO.com 1,482 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 43 VFMM.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 44 IUUW.com 60 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 45 HZVR.com 165 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 46 MZUS.com 1,500 Sep-08 Sedo 47 MGZS.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 48 PWIR.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 49 IUIB.com 360 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 50 UIFR.com 160 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 51 TOTC.com 5,216 Sep-08 Sedo 52 KAGB.com 100 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 53 PEYV.com 60 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 54 SWJE.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 55 QIEB.com 185 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 56 YVHO.com 75 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 57 UFIZ.com 520 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 58 UUUN.com 560 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 59 ONXE.com 326 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 60 WOBU.com 1,854 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 61 UGHB.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 62 UEHP.com 70 Sep-08 Sedo Auction 63 FoxO.com 3,201 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 64 GSTS.com 4,000 Aug-08 AfternicDLS 65 Inny.com 6,000 Aug-08 AfternicDLS 66 IDGO.com 3,800 Aug-08 DotWeekly 67 Craw.com 3,300 Aug-08 NameJet 68 ENew.com 3,552 Aug-08 NameJet 69 Fion.com 8,000 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 70 DFXA.com 85 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 71 MZUC.com 300 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 72 UZFZ.com 90 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 73 XOIW.com 100 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 74 BGAU.com 70 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 75 TTKY.com 70 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 76 ZEZU.com 1,452 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 77 TUJE.com 520 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 78 Slow.com 42,124 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 79 JoJo.com 25,500 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 80 UKQB.com 220 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 81 EMVV.com 70 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 82 GBEK.com 222 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 83 LPZO.com 60 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 84 RRVY.com 70 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 85 HLYE.com 60 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 86 BNBP.com 361 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 87 OGIQ.com 141 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 88 AQOK.com 156 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 89 YUPS.com 2,194 Aug-08 Sedo 90 BBGN.com 210 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 91 FIKU.com 981 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 92 ZERU.com 830 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 93 ENBD.com 1,500 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 94 TEWU.com 1,630 Aug-08 Sedo Auction 95 Ordo.com 3,500 Aug-08 AfternicDLS 96 Piii.com 2,000 Aug-08 AfternicDLS 97 YOLU.com 3,288 Aug-08 AfternicDLS 98 KUYI.com 2,800 Aug-08 NameJet 99 CAYA.com 4,000 Aug-08 AfternicDLS 100 SHCB.com 2,700 Aug-08 Sedo | ||||
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