LLLL.com evaluation thread

[italiandragon]

While the last LLLL.com are taken (you can check www.dyyo.com to know how many are left) , I really feel the need to have a sort of 4L price guide on the same sort of the 3L/ 3 chars price guide.

I asked to people to create a database of LLLL.com sales but it seems no one can do it so I`m going to create it myself as much as I can on just a forum thread. If I knew how to create a database I was doing it.

Keep in mind that this thread is still in the early stage and I`ll update it as much as I can. I will update this first post so it will be easier for everyone to know what`s going on in the LLLL.com aftermarket. It is going to take me a lot of my spare time but I hope that eventually soon , someone will create a software that will run by itself Till then , let`s hope I can have time!

So, just for the newbies , let`s see what we already know about the 3 chars.com price guide:

"The quality of the letter composition can play a significant role in determining 3-letter valuations. General concensus states that the letters A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, L, M, N, O, P, R, S, T are considered premium letters. Other lesser high quality letters include: J, K, U, V, W. Lower quality letters include: Q, X, Y, Z. Domains selling for less than the above figures would represent a strong buy in today's market. Premium letter only domains tend to fetch a 500% to 600% premium (or more) over the Minimum Wholesale Price. Mixed letter quality domains have valuations somewhere in the middle of these two extremes."


I think we could adjust the same rules to the LLLL.com

Let`s play a little bit with the letters to find out what are the minimun reseller prices as for now , end of September 2007 (NOTE: THIS FIRST THREAD IS CONSTANTLY UPDATED WITH THE NEW INFO HIGHLIGHTED IN RED)

Obviously we should analyse in this thread ONLY the NON pronunciable ones to consider ONLY the quality of letters, so not even a very well known acronym but only 4 random letters.

For the "other" LLLL.com sales and evaluations based on pronunciability , then you may find useful this other thread:

http://www.namepros.com/domain-name-...rt-thread.html

I`ll start with my opinion but feel free to add yours so we can get to a sort of price guide.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

A LLLL.com including 2 or more of "Q, X, Y, Z" (as long as they are not 2 of the same) I`d say less no more than $10 since there are still 12,000 of them left.

EXAMPLE: GXZH.com (no more than $10)

There is one example of these ones right now on ebay, ending in less than 3 hours:

http://cgi.ebay.com/hzxv-com-Origina...QQcmdZViewItem


Obviously even with 2 "bad letters" , when they start to be pronunciable this is what happens:

ZAYM.com $201

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

Double letters such as:

GXXH.com
ZZDC.com
FYYT.com
DRQQ.com

I`d appraise them at minimun $20-$30 depending on the letters. Double but not consecutives letters would just be below the above ones.


XSXT.com $20.50

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1



Triple bad letters such as:

QQQD.com
FZZZ.com
RXXX.com
YYYG.com

I`d appraise them at minimun $70-$100 depending on the letters.


Then we may analyse the ones with only 1 bad letter (always Q, X, Y, Z):

FGZS.com
EYDF.com
PXSE.com
TFQG.com

These kind of LLLL .com are still available so reg fee to $10 , must be for them.


UPDATED:

SOME AUCTIONS ON EBAY ARE GETTING ABOVE $10:


http://cgi.ebay.com/ZWTO-com-4-Lette...QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/FGXR-com-4-Lette...QQcmdZViewItem

UPDATE 13 OCTOBER: ON EBAY PRICES ARE CONSTANTLY ABOVE $10 FOR LLLL WITH JUST 1 BAD LETTER , SOMETIMES ABOVE $20 TOO.

ZATB.com $12.49

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

RLYN.com $36

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


RBYK.com $29.99

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


HRHY.com $30.80

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


YATG.com $23.95

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


a double letter with 1 bad letter :

IIZP.com $42

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1




---------------------------------------------------------------------
Then we have the ones which include the group "lesser high quality letters": J, K, U, V, W.

These ones have lately bought totally so the minimun reseller price must be above reg fee , let`s say $10 - $20 depending from the letters. Some people tend to include J, K and U in the premium letters. I`d definitely include the vowel U but I guess this is a personal point of view.
Even here at NP , LLLL including just the letter U tend to outperform this category:

FGUB.com $32 (October 2007)

http://www.namepros.com/domains-for-...t-4letter.html

It may be also useful to consider that K and W were sold out earlier than J and V.



There is one example of these ones right now on ebay, ending in 3 hours:

http://cgi.ebay.com/UMGV-COM-4-Lette...QQcmdZViewItem


UPDATE 25 OCTOBER:

Things are getting hotter (at the moment less than 7000 LLLL are left) and U and this category is quickly raising its reselling value on EBAY:

DPTU.com $54.51 now

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


RWEO.com $78.00

http://cgi.ebay.com/RWEO-com-LLLL-4-...QQcmdZViewItem


The letter U and W obviously are not that bad

The letter V in Italian is very much used , while in China is not so a lot depends from your background.

J is not my favourite in this group (as in the Italian alphabet there is no J-K-W-X-Y ) but certainly is getting attention by someone else:

RCEJ.com $30

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


Then we have 2 of the group J, K, U, V, W such as:

GJJA.com
FVVO.com
KKTR.com

I`d say $30 to $50 as they are all gone and the double letter will increase their rarity.


FNKK.com $52

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

2 of them but not the same 2 (double) are less valuable:

http://cgi.ebay.com/VWTP-com-4-Lette...QQcmdZViewItem

VDUZ.com $26

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


WPEJ.com $23.15

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


With 3 of them , like :

GJJJ.com
FVVV.com
KKKT.com

I`d say $100 -$150

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Then we have the best of the best: ALL PREMIUM letters:


A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I, L, M, N, O, P, R, S, T



Names like CLFO.com or FGTR.com or ATFI.com are going to get $$$.

I can`t find any of these LLLL.com for less than $100 , sometimes not even $200 buy them.
So I`d say a really minimun of $100 to easily $200 each.
At places like Snapnames.com, the all premium letters even if they are non pronunciables , are going already for above $400 and the market is getting hotter day by day.

If the name appears to have 2 of a kind like:

SSFO.com or GBBT.com then we should be at minimun $200 to $300

3 of a kind such DDDF.com or TLLL.com will get over $300 to $500

SPECIALS

Anything like this is an added value.

In my daily observation of LLLL.com sales I noticed that any of the following abbreviations and/or suffixes are more valuable:

- IT (Information Tecnology or Italy)

- MY

Examples:

IMYO.com $449

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

BMMY.com $350

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=


HFMY.com $37.50

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


- UK

UKIX.com ended on TDNAM.com @ $146

- DE

- US

- CA

- OZ (Australia)

- NZ (new Zealand)

- GO

- HI

Examples:

HIXV.com $59 (October 2007)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

- OK

- KG

- CV (Curriculum Vitae)

- DR (Doctor)

- DJ

Examples:

DJBX.com $45 (October 2007)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


And more that I`ll add as soon as I can think of them!

Also,some letters add value because of their very common use.

The letter E , I and O add value usually because can mean E-lectronic , I-nternet and O-nline.

Other nice letters are:

C for Corporation or Company , L for Limited , A for Association.

The best positions are usually in the first or in the 4th spot depending from the letter. For example E will be better in the first spot while L for Limited will be better in the 4th spot but all of these letters can add value.


Other special categories that attract a bonus are based on the numbers of vowels.
There are only 5 vowels so the LLLL.com with 4 vowels are extremely rare and even the ones with 3 vowels perform very well as their demand is high.

Some recent examples:

OEOV.com $56

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


EOAJ.com $52

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1

CVCV & VCVC

Let`s start from the TOP this time:

CVCV.com

all premium letters Like BIFE.com or DAGO.com

minimun......well here it is hard since prices increase quickly ....maybe $1,500 ?


CVCV.com with 1 bad letter like BIZE or DAQO.com about $800

CVCV.com with 1 bad and 1 average letters like NUQE.com or VAXO.com about $500

CVCV.com with 1 bad and 2 average letters like WUQA.com or ZOVU.com

about $300

It was right WUQA.com that made me realize that I forgot the 1 bad + 2 average ones. People reported that WUQA.com ended on TDNAM.com at $315 (end of October)

CVCV.com with 2 bad letters like QEZI.com or ZIXO.com about $400

CVCV.com with 2 bad letters and 1 average letter like QUZI.com or ZUXO.com about $300

CVCV.com with 2 bad and 2 average letters (MUST BE DOUBLE U) like QUZU.com or ZUXU.com about 300



Now let`s see the VCVC.com

all premium letters Like IFEB.com or AGOC.com about $1,000 ?

VCVC.com with 1 bad letter like IZEB or AQOC.com about $500

VCVC.com with 1 bad and 1 average letters like OZUD.com or AXUF.com about $300 - $350 (I sold OZUD.com on SEDO in August for $330)

VCVC.com with 2 bad letters like AXEZ.com or IQOX.com about $200

VCVC.com with 2 bad letters and 1 average letter like UXEZ.com or UXOQ.com about $100

VCVC.com with 2 bad and 2 average letters (MUST BE DOUBLE U) like UZUQ.com or UXUZ.com about 100



I`m currently taking input on the CVCV and the VCVC where Y is the last vowel.

The first recent example is this one:

OGYZ.com $57.99

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


I leave the CVVC and VCCV to others as I did not have much experience with them yet.


SALES OF RANDOM (NON PRONUNCIABLE) LLLL.COM AT OTHER VENUES:

SEDO.com

Interesting Sedo Auctions show many crappy LLLL.com with bids

UPDATE: CHECK THE AUCTIONS BELOW THAT ARE NOW ALL ENDED....PRICES ARE GETTING SHOCKING!

zekh.com $120

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=

zeow.com $300

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=

ucnk.com $120

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=

ahlq.com $243

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=


hobf.com 100 Eur= $140

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=


jvbb.com 100 Eur=$140

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=

yvze.com 70 Euros=$105

http://sedo.com/auction/auction_deta...ed=&partnerid=


Are we already starting to see a minimun price of $100 for each LLLL.com ?


Please share your opinions on the one of the hottest niches of the domain market

Thank you

[tzsxc]

"Usually J , K and U are a bit better then the rest, they were sold out much before the V and the W."

This is not true. K & W was earlier then all the rest.

[clowesy]

gggp.com went for $300 yesterday so that is about right..

[tristanperry]

Very nice, rep given

I'd agree with all these values, they're roughly correct IMHO.

Just to add that one of my domains is an all premium LLLL.com, so that thread should hopefully give some good information on them.

[hr]

Just to say that you didn't mention CVCV.com or VCVC.com patterns. I'd say that for "medium quality" LLLL.coms (maybe 1 'lesser high quality letter' and sometimes one low quality):

VCVC.com = $40 - $100
CVCV.com = $300 - $600

[Shane]

what would you price QVJJ.com?

[tristanperry]

$20, to me.

[Netizen]

How would you guys price following type of domains or they dont make any difference ?

iLLL.com
eLLL.com
oLLL or LLLo (o for online)

Rep to italiandragon for the time he spent collecting data and creating this thread ...

[tristanperry]

It depends on the following letters, although starting with "i" and "e" is always very nice.. and "o" isn't too bad either (although I and E are better to start, IMHO).

I'd say that something like iQZK.com would still be worth only $15 max, although eKRF.com would be worth maybe $50.

[Netizen]

Thanks,Price will also vary based on results returned by google ,and other taken extensions IMO

[yandig]

I just grabbed a couple of names last week:

UOEF
UOET

3 vowels and a premium letter. What do you see the value of these names at?
(I like T better than F)

Some people may not like 'U' as much, but it does stand for University, among other things.

[Halobitt]

How about seemingly random QKAJ

Checkout the picture I made for the Bodis page.

[champ_rock]

Originally Posted by clowesy

gggp.com went for $300 yesterday so that is about right..

1. i feel that triple letters in a sequence should be worth more as total combinations possilble are only about 676
2. i think Y is not such a bad letter afterall. many people consider it as a vowel which itself means that it is good

[sashas]

Originally Posted by Halobitt

How about seemingly random QKAJ Checkout the picture I made for the Bodis page.

nice!

[Deaol]

bah.. i broke down and reg'd a LLLL.com with "Q" in it...

qowt.com

I dunno... I tried pronouncing it and It kinda sounded like "Quote" .. or maybe.. "Kwhat"

who knows

[xXDanteXx]

Originally Posted by Anobiz

How would you guys price following type of domains or they dont make any difference ? iLLL.com eLLL.com oLLL or LLLo (o for online) Rep to italiandragon for the time he spent collecting data and creating this thread ...

I was also wondering the same thing. Can anyone please tell me what could I expect for I H G Y .com?

[italiandragon]

Originally Posted by tzsxc

"Usually J , K and U are a bit better then the rest, they were sold out much before the V and the W." This is not true. K & W was earlier then all the rest.

Thank you for pointing that, I did a mistake about that, probably was too tired when I was writing this thread

I`ll edit it with your info

[ssamriga]

nice thread, thanks italiandragon

[SJM211]

I'd agree with most of that but the 3 repeated letters (in sequence) pricing seems low - it's pretty tricky to pick up even bad letter combinations for under $200 at the moment (e.g. zzzr.com $211.00, krrr.com $201.00 both recent snap sales). Premium are costing $300 minimum (usually $400+), with a number selling for high $xxx+ (e.g. fffg.com $785.00) then there are exceptions like wooo.com (which sold for $5101.00).

Also palindromic (e.g. MQQM.com) and repeated pairs of letters (e.g. QQZZ.com or QZQZ.com) should probably have their own classes too as they tend to fetch a premium.

[italiandragon]

Originally Posted by SJM211

I'd agree with most of that but the 3 repeated letters (in sequence) pricing seems low - it's pretty tricky to pick up even bad letter combinations for under $200 at the moment (e.g. zzzr.com $211.00, krrr.com $201.00 both recent snap sales). Premium are costing $300 minimum (usually $400+), with a number selling for high $xxx+ (e.g. fffg.com $785.00) then there are exceptions like wooo.com (which sold for $5101.00). Also palindromic (e.g. MQQM.com) and repeated pairs of letters (e.g. QQZZ.com or QZQZ.com) should probably have their own classes too as they tend to fetch a premium.

Thanks alot for your inputs, I did not have many sales for the 3 repeated letters so I just wrote my estimate but I totally forgot of the "double pairs" so I`ll edit my initial post after we get some more opinions as I have seen only few of those names so far.

Thank you

Originally Posted by tristanperry

Just to say that you didn't mention CVCV.com or VCVC.com patterns. I'd say that for "medium quality" LLLL.coms (maybe 1 'lesser high quality letter' and sometimes one low quality): VCVC.com = $40 - $100 CVCV.com = $300 - $600

Maybe you did not read carefully what I wrote:

"Obviously we should analyse in this thread ONLY the NON pronunciable ones to consider ONLY the quality of letters, so not even a very well known acronym but only 4 random letters."


I did not include them as we already know that all CVCV and VCVC and also most of the VCCV and CVVC are pronunciable.

But surely we can include them all. I think these are harder to appraise as the prices are increasing day after day.

Let`s start from the TOP this time:

CVCV.com

all premium letters Like BIFE.com or DAGO.com

minimun......well here it is hard since prices increase quickly ....maybe $1,500 ?


CVCV.com with 1 bad letter like BIZE or DAQO.com about $800

CVCV.com with 1 bad and 1 average letters like NUQE.com or VAXO.com about $500

CVCV.com with 2 bad letters like QEZI.com or ZIXO.com about $400

CVCV.com with 2 bad letters and 1 average letter like QUZI.com or ZUXO.com about $300

CVCV.com with 2 bad and 2 average letters (MUST BE DOUBLE U) like QUZU.com or ZUXU.com about 300


Now let`s see the VCVC.com

all premium letters Like IFEB.com or AGOC.com about $1,000 ?

VCVC.com with 1 bad letter like IZEB or AQOC.com about $500

VCVC.com with 1 bad and 1 average letters like OZUD.com or AXUF.com about $300 - $350 (I sold OZUD.com on SEDO in August for $330)

VCVC.com with 2 bad letters like AXEZ.com or IQOX.com about $200

VCVC.com with 2 bad letters and 1 average letter like UXEZ.com or UXOQ.com about $100

VCVC.com with 2 bad and 2 average letters (MUST BE DOUBLE U) like UZUQ.com or UXUZ.com about 100



I`m currently taking input on the CVCV and the VCVC where Y is the last vowel.

The first recent example is this one:

OGYZ.com $57.99

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...0%3D%26fvi%3D1


I leave the CVVC and VCCV to others as I did not have much experience with them yet.
If you are happy with the above values I`ll it add to the opening post, thank you

Originally Posted by Anobiz

How would you guys price following type of domains or they dont make any difference ? iLLL.com eLLL.com oLLL or LLLo (o for online) Rep to italiandragon for the time he spent collecting data and creating this thread ...

Thanks for the rep, I think that all those examples would add value to the name but appraise this added value is beyond our info at the moment as we are just starting a LLLL.com price guide and there have been not enought sales of similar names that include your examples.

[buckshotdots]

There are so many exceptions that I really find it hard to put a blanket price on them. What about LLLL's that have meaning and are all quality letters ex- I picked up last month bbno and bboh for bread and breakfasts in ohio and new orleans. I have no idea if this adds extra value to them. ALso mrqc I picked up last year- qc is a top lawyer in canada, does having mr or md or st etc in a LLLL increase it as it could have meaning or be more brandable that way? ex I just picked up RJst (know anyojne with the name RJ ), could have meaning to them. Nice thread, gets you thinking rep added.

gary-

[DomainMayhem.com]

I have a few, though my best is DVQO (Digital Video Quest Online).

[cache]

I agree with you. In addition I would nominate you as the master of the
rare letter domain market maker, you probably single handed created the market +. Nice job.

Originally Posted by SJM211

I'd agree with most of that but the 3 repeated letters (in sequence) pricing seems low - it's pretty tricky to pick up even bad letter combinations for under $200 at the moment (e.g. zzzr.com $211.00, krrr.com $201.00 both recent snap sales). Premium are costing $300 minimum (usually $400+), with a number selling for high $xxx+ (e.g. fffg.com $785.00) then there are exceptions like wooo.com (which sold for $5101.00). Also palindromic (e.g. MQQM.com) and repeated pairs of letters (e.g. QQZZ.com or QZQZ.com) should probably have their own classes too as they tend to fetch a premium.

[italiandragon]

Originally Posted by buckshotdots

There are so many exceptions that I really find it hard to put a blanket price on them. What about LLLL's that have meaning and are all quality letters ex- I picked up last month bbno and bboh for bread and breakfasts in ohio and new orleans. I have no idea if this adds extra value to them. ALso mrqc I picked up last year- qc is a top lawyer in canada, does having mr or md or st etc in a LLLL increase it as it could have meaning or be more brandable that way? ex I just picked up RJst (know anyojne with the name RJ ), could have meaning to them. Nice thread, gets you thinking rep added. gary-

Hi Gary, thanks for the rep.

Of course all added meanings are a plus but as stated in my opening post, My intention was to draw a really bottom price for random LLLL.com so it is obvious that the ones with any meaning will have bigger value.

[SJM211]

Originally Posted by cache

I agree with you. In addition I would nominate you as the master of the rare letter domain market maker, you probably single handed created the market +. Nice job.

Thanks! Don't think it's down to me though, I'm pretty amazed that the market has taken off the way it has (if I'd known I wouldn't have sold the bulk of my premium LLLL.coms off over the last 12 months).. I think this time last year all premium letter combinations were selling for $20-30 each (and I had trouble selling at this price), 6 months ago it seemed that you'd get around $40-60, now people will pay $100-150 minimum, that's a pretty huge rise in such a short space of time (much faster than LLL/NNN/CCC price growth).

Anyway, I know a lot of people here have invested quite heavily in LLLL.coms so let's hope the upward trend continues - I'm sure it will, but whether it will increase at the same rate is another matter, guess time will tell..

[champ_rock]

Originally Posted by SJM211

Thanks! Don't think it's down to me though, I'm pretty amazed that the market has taken off the way it has (if I'd known I wouldn't have sold the bulk of my premium LLLL.coms off over the last 12 months).. I think this time last year all premium letter combinations were selling for $20-30 each (and I had trouble selling at this price), 6 months ago it seemed that you'd get around $40-60, now people will pay $100-150 minimum, that's a pretty huge rise in such a short space of time (much faster than LLL/NNN/CCC price growth). Anyway, I know a lot of people here have invested quite heavily in LLLL.coms so let's hope the upward trend continues - I'm sure it will, but whether it will increase at the same rate is another matter, guess time will tell..

Lol, it is more like stock market, when people expect the prices to be greater in the future, their actions right now force the prices to be actually greater in the future