Ruby on Rails (RoR) all it's cracked up to be?

SimpleMan · 05-16-2008, 08:13 AM

I'm curious for some opinions on this one. I've been doing some research lately because I'd like to learn and be able to support another language besides just PHP. (Note: I know Ruby is the language and on Rails is the framework, so I don't need that lecture that almost always seems to come.)
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/programming/470037-ruby-rails-ror-all-its-cracked.html

Now my own experiences seem to confirm this, but the number one issue with RoR is that it's slow in some cases. I ran it under the FCGI setup on a cPanel box and while I was working on a client's issue, I realized it's just pretty darn slow. I was looking at the mongrel setup, but supporting it client-side with having to edit httpd.conf everytime is annoying and problematic given the tendency of control panels to overwrite these changes periodically. From what basic things I know, I like the idea behind the language and I've read up on using some features such as caching to speed things up. However, this is the era of instant gratification and as powerful and as fast as PHP on the web is, I don't see where a slower language can compete.

Now I've read both sides of the argument and I see merit from both parties. Ruby seems quite powerful and easy to work with. However, some of the other languages out there Python w/ Django was a combo that I liked, seemed to be faster. On the flip side, there are a lot of web 2.0 apps out there powered by RoR and doing well.

Then again there are things out there like Python (w/ Django), Tomcat (JSP), Perl, PHP (doh!), and so on. I'm just left wondering if (two years later) Ruby on Rails is worth it or is it doomed to be the free Coldfusion? Am I better off sticking to learning PHP?

risoknop · 05-16-2008, 08:23 AM

Well, it depends on what you need RoR for? Does it something that can't be accomplished in PHP rather easily? Because if not then I really don't see a reason to learn it. PHP can handle almost everything that you could ever need while developing a websites. Moreover PHP has grown so popular that is almost a default feature nowadays. I'd stick with PHP

mrtaylef · 05-22-2008, 04:01 AM

I'd have to agree with risknop -
Ruby on rails doesn't do much of anything that couldn't been done as easily in php.

when ROR first came out and even 6 months after it was see as a new cool thing that "will change the web" as all new web things are supposed too do.
the fame and roit for ror has died down quite a bit after the first six months, mainly becuase though ror was great and easy and all, it just didnt bring anything "very" important to the web programming scene.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=470037

Now on the side of php as soon as it came out it was a big hit and the fame and capabilities of it grew extraordinarly in the first 2 years. The fame of php "power" has really died or slowed down much at all, instead it just come to an even level of progression and growing.

ROR hasn't grew much since it came out. I like ruby dont get me wrong, had i redone learn programming i would have started with ruby purly for its simplicity in syntax and art way of organization.

It all really comes down to two simple ideas. 1. the need or project at hand.
2. the pros and cons of ruby and php

For the h3|| of it, in my opinion, the pros and cons are this.
Catagorie PHP Ruby
speed fast slow
capability massive limited
Portability Fair-Easy Ify

Some is opinion, some is fact. Think for yourself, and decide for yourself.

RageD · 05-22-2008, 10:15 AM

I would recommend sticking with PHP. RoR may some day make it a little easier to code but it's just not at that level yet and besides, it normally costs extra to use a host with RoR enabled. Just my 2 cents

-RageD

JamieD · 06-07-2008, 03:08 AM

mrtaylef, where are you getting your information from? Much of what you said is inaccurate or ill informed.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=470037

Ruby, and rails, are more popular now than they have ever been so to say it's not popular and hasn't grown much since it was release is totally inaccurate.

Comparing ruby against PHP is a bit like comparing building a house out of wood or brick. They both serve the same purpose but each has its own advantages and disadvantages.

Ruby on Rails is very good for rapid application development, the time (and money) you save on development is often offset by the additional cost involved in hosting (I'm talking large scale multiple server hosting here).

As for the future of ruby it will be around for a long time, rails on the other hand may or may not be around to stay. However this should not put you off learning either. There are many useful lessons to be learnt from both ruby and rails that you can take with you to other languages and frameworks. There are a number of other frameworks being developed in ruby at the moment, merb and camping are the most obvious. Also there are lots of ruby VM's being developed currently that address the speed issues of ruby.

The future for both ruby and rails is very bright at the moment and there is a very active and rapidly growing community of developers working to improve all aspects of the ruby ecosystem.

hostingbuster · 06-09-2008, 01:48 PM

i think it very hard to learn and can take a lot long to do somthing then it dose in php it could be a good thing to learn but php can do the job better. so i staying with that

pratiknaik · 06-24-2008, 03:04 AM

Clearly, all the people who have said not to go with RoR, have never used it. Ruby is an extremely elegant language. And Rails is an MVC framework. Comparing PHP to Rails, is apples and oranges. Of course you can write any web application in old fashion CGI/C/C++/Whatever. That's not the point.

CrazyTech : I'd suggest you install http://www.modrails.com on your server. It's very easy to setup and one of the best RoR deployment solution around.

dotprofan · 06-24-2008, 09:13 AM

You may be interested in this rant by an ex-ROR community member: http://www.zedshaw.com/rants/rails_is_a_ghetto.html

I do a lot of development in python and I would suggest exploring django. Google is a big advocate of python and this could have a major impact in the popularity of python based frameworks going forward.

05-16-2008, 08:13 AM	THREAD STARTER #1 (permalink)
SimpleMan NamePros Expert Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: South Carolina Posts: 5,050	Ruby on Rails (RoR) all it's cracked up to be? I'm curious for some opinions on this one. I've been doing some research lately because I'd like to learn and be able to support another language besides just PHP. (Note: I know Ruby is the language and on Rails is the framework, so I don't need that lecture that almost always seems to come.) ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/programming/470037-ruby-rails-ror-all-its-cracked.html Now my own experiences seem to confirm this, but the number one issue with RoR is that it's slow in some cases. I ran it under the FCGI setup on a cPanel box and while I was working on a client's issue, I realized it's just pretty darn slow. I was looking at the mongrel setup, but supporting it client-side with having to edit httpd.conf everytime is annoying and problematic given the tendency of control panels to overwrite these changes periodically. From what basic things I know, I like the idea behind the language and I've read up on using some features such as caching to speed things up. However, this is the era of instant gratification and as powerful and as fast as PHP on the web is, I don't see where a slower language can compete. Now I've read both sides of the argument and I see merit from both parties. Ruby seems quite powerful and easy to work with. However, some of the other languages out there Python w/ Django was a combo that I liked, seemed to be faster. On the flip side, there are a lot of web 2.0 apps out there powered by RoR and doing well. Then again there are things out there like Python (w/ Django), Tomcat (JSP), Perl, PHP (doh!), and so on. I'm just left wondering if (two years later) Ruby on Rails is worth it or is it doomed to be the free Coldfusion? Am I better off sticking to learning PHP?

05-16-2008, 08:23 AM	#2 (permalink)
risoknop NamePros Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 82	Well, it depends on what you need RoR for? Does it something that can't be accomplished in PHP rather easily? Because if not then I really don't see a reason to learn it. PHP can handle almost everything that you could ever need while developing a websites. Moreover PHP has grown so popular that is almost a default feature nowadays. I'd stick with PHP Last edited by risoknop; 05-16-2008 at 08:28 AM.

05-22-2008, 04:01 AM	#3 (permalink)
mrtaylef First Time Poster! Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1	hmm I'd have to agree with risknop - Ruby on rails doesn't do much of anything that couldn't been done as easily in php. when ROR first came out and even 6 months after it was see as a new cool thing that "will change the web" as all new web things are supposed too do. the fame and roit for ror has died down quite a bit after the first six months, mainly becuase though ror was great and easy and all, it just didnt bring anything "very" important to the web programming scene. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=470037 Now on the side of php as soon as it came out it was a big hit and the fame and capabilities of it grew extraordinarly in the first 2 years. The fame of php "power" has really died or slowed down much at all, instead it just come to an even level of progression and growing. ROR hasn't grew much since it came out. I like ruby dont get me wrong, had i redone learn programming i would have started with ruby purly for its simplicity in syntax and art way of organization. It all really comes down to two simple ideas. 1. the need or project at hand. 2. the pros and cons of ruby and php For the h3\|\| of it, in my opinion, the pros and cons are this. Catagorie PHP Ruby speed fast slow capability massive limited Portability Fair-Easy Ify Some is opinion, some is fact. Think for yourself, and decide for yourself.

05-22-2008, 10:15 AM	#4 (permalink)
RageD Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Joliet, Illinois Posts: 1,177	I would recommend sticking with PHP. RoR may some day make it a little easier to code but it's just not at that level yet and besides, it normally costs extra to use a host with RoR enabled. Just my 2 cents -RageD __________________ Microsonic Development New Programming Video Tutorials

06-24-2008, 03:04 AM	#7 (permalink)
pratiknaik Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Lost somewhere in a stack of queues.. Posts: 1,200	Clearly, all the people who have said not to go with RoR, have never used it. Ruby is an extremely elegant language. And Rails is an MVC framework. Comparing PHP to Rails, is apples and oranges. Of course you can write any web application in old fashion CGI/C/C++/Whatever. That's not the point. CrazyTech : I'd suggest you install http://www.modrails.com on your server. It's very easy to setup and one of the best RoR deployment solution around. __________________ Ruby on Rails Developer - http://m.onkey.org

06-07-2008, 03:08 AM	#5 (permalink)
JamieD First Time Poster! Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 1	mrtaylef, where are you getting your information from? Much of what you said is inaccurate or ill informed. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=470037 Ruby, and rails, are more popular now than they have ever been so to say it's not popular and hasn't grown much since it was release is totally inaccurate. Comparing ruby against PHP is a bit like comparing building a house out of wood or brick. They both serve the same purpose but each has its own advantages and disadvantages. Ruby on Rails is very good for rapid application development, the time (and money) you save on development is often offset by the additional cost involved in hosting (I'm talking large scale multiple server hosting here). As for the future of ruby it will be around for a long time, rails on the other hand may or may not be around to stay. However this should not put you off learning either. There are many useful lessons to be learnt from both ruby and rails that you can take with you to other languages and frameworks. There are a number of other frameworks being developed in ruby at the moment, merb and camping are the most obvious. Also there are lots of ruby VM's being developed currently that address the speed issues of ruby. The future for both ruby and rails is very bright at the moment and there is a very active and rapidly growing community of developers working to improve all aspects of the ruby ecosystem.

06-09-2008, 01:48 PM	#6 (permalink)
hostingbuster New Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 11	i think it very hard to learn and can take a lot long to do somthing then it dose in php it could be a good thing to learn but php can do the job better. so i staying with that

06-24-2008, 09:13 AM	#8 (permalink)
dotprofan NamePros Regular Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 386	You may be interested in this rant by an ex-ROR community member: http://www.zedshaw.com/rants/rails_is_a_ghetto.html I do a lot of development in python and I would suggest exploring django. Google is a big advocate of python and this could have a major impact in the popularity of python based frameworks going forward. __________________ Videos.pro \| Gamble.pro \| Military.pro \| Telecom.pro \| Value.pro \| Beijing.pro

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)

Ruby on Rails (RoR) all it's cracked up to be?

hmm