New Bill in US Senate Threatens Domain Registrants! - Page 4

.jd. · 03-07-2008, 12:21 AM

RJ are you going to go further with this? Will there be more action then a simple post? Will you be writing to your local congressman?

RJ · 03-07-2008, 12:45 AM

Yes, I'm going further with this but this is not on just me. Everyone who owns a domain name portfolio needs to get involved in one way or another.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/industry-news/441421-new-bill-us-senate-threatens-domain.html

What we need to do is make sure this bill doesn't leave that committee in its present form. We could be writing the Senators on the Senate Commerce Committee at this point. These are the people that will determine if the larger Senate body will even see this bill. I'm getting varying information on how long it's likely to stay in this committee, but it's good to get started on this campaign early and keep it persistent.

If it passes the Senate committee, and then passes Senate, only then does it go to the House of Representatives. I wouldn't even bother writing your House Rep at this point. Start with the Senate Commerce Committee and your own Senators.

Let's not rely on the online petition alone to protest the bill.

Letter writing seems like a good place to start. Phil Corwin of the ICA says he'll have a sample letter available within a few days. Once we have a clear plan of action, we'll get the larger NamePros community involved to the fullest extent.

RJ

metronome · 03-07-2008, 03:47 AM

a question, will that bill make the big business acquire short domain names easily?

(LLLL, LLL)

JoeCanadian · 03-07-2008, 07:24 AM

Originally Posted by metronome

a question, will that bill make the big business acquire short domain names easily?

(LLLL, LLL)

Absolutely. You have a domain with no trademark on it. Somebody decides they like the name. They trademark it. You receive a demand letter in the mail. You give up the name for free because you can't afford either the legal costs to fight or the potential penalties.

BigSotong.com · 03-07-2008, 08:03 AM

That is serious, Although I do not reside in the US, but it will definitly affect the whole world. Other Countries would likely follow suit.

Suggest that all members be informed about this.

.jd. · 03-07-2008, 11:38 AM

Whats the chances of this being passed?

RJ · 03-07-2008, 12:54 PM

I believe it has a very high probability of getting passed.

They're calling it anti-phishing legislation, when up and down it is really a trademark bill. Who would vote against a bill outlawing phishing?
It's unlikely the senators voting on this bill understand the full technical details of what they are voting on. They probably really believe this will help stop phishing.
Domain owners traditionally do not garner much sympathy, nor are they commonly recognized on capital hill as legitimate business industry.

????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421
To remind everyone what this bill does:

Companies and trademark holders can sue any domain owner with a similar domain similar to their name.
NO bad faith is required to be proven.
There is NO protection for generic domains.
WHOIS privacy will be eliminated.
It will do next to nothing to stop phishing. Phishers are already breaking the law by committing fraud. Do you really think outlawing whois privacy and allowing companies to sue them over their domain will help?

I believe the domainer community could help by an organized letter writing campaign, and possibly proposing alternative language for the bill that would actually help curb phishing without infringing on domain owners rights.

GeoOwners · 03-07-2008, 01:54 PM

would have ones domains at a non-US registrar prevent losing names?

Arabian · 03-07-2008, 02:27 PM

Signed.

~ The 34 Year Buzz!! · 03-07-2008, 02:42 PM

Originally Posted by dentalpro

would have ones domains at a non-US registrar prevent losing names?

You are probably not safe if you still live in America.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421
Why?

1) For 'more traditional security' you want your non-US registrar to be ICANN certified.
2) If they are ICANN certified, then the US gov can probably still 'get to you'.

ps. I would feel much better if someone could convince me I'm wrong about all American domain holders being in serious danger, even if they use non-US registrars.

######

Finally, would people living outside of America, and using ICANN certified registrars be safe?
(for legitimate cases not cybersquatting)

RJ · 03-07-2008, 02:53 PM

This potentially could affect domainers outside the USA because the central registry for .COM (Verisign) is based in the US. As a result even if your registrar is outside the US, ultimately every .COM is within legal reach of the US government.

~ The 34 Year Buzz!! · 03-07-2008, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by -RJ-

This potentially could affect domainers outside the USA because the central registry for .COM (Verisign) is based in the US. As a result even if your registrar is outside the US, ultimately every .COM is within legal reach of the US government.

Thanks,
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421
It's better to be informed, and deal with 'the bad news', than blindly hope for the best.

nicedomains · 03-07-2008, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by -RJ-

This potentially could affect domainers outside the USA because the central registry for .COM (Verisign) is based in the US. As a result even if your registrar is outside the US, ultimately every .COM is within legal reach of the US government.

I foresee some major problems with this fact..

????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421

Petition signing has slowed down considerably the last day.. We should be talking about this even to people who aren't domainers!

sOliver · 03-07-2008, 04:28 PM

How much does it cost to trademark your own domains?
I think we will have to do this sooner or later anyway, I don't have a problem with developing, but I suppose that a trademark won't be so cheap :/

RJ · 03-07-2008, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by sOliver

How much does it cost to trademark your own domains?
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421
I think we will have to do this sooner or later anyway, I don't have a problem with developing, but I suppose that a trademark won't be so cheap :/

$275 if you file online yourself. Legalzoom.com will do it for $494. If you have a very valuable domain, it's worth considering seeking a trademark on the term and NOT parking it. Even if the Snowe bill doesn't pass, owning a trademark gives you excellent protection.

GeoOwners · 03-07-2008, 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by -RJ-

$275 if you file online yourself. Legalzoom.com will do it for $494. If you have a very valuable domain, it's worth considering seeking a trademark on the term and NOT parking it. Even if the Snowe bill doesn't pass, owning a trademark gives you excellent protection.

????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421
I would inagine trademarking would increase the value of the domain...selling a trademarked domain would be like selling it with insurance...buyer would have some peace-of-mind.

.

RJ · 03-07-2008, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by dentalpro

I would inagine trademarking would increase the value of the domain...selling a trademarked domain would be like selling it with insurance...buyer would have some peace-of-mind.

Exactly. UDRP's are now considering a change of ownership to be the same as a new registration. That means anyone who has established trademark rights in a term after your registration could dispute the domain the minute it changes hands to a new owner.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421

The only downside of a trademark is that it takes almost a year from your application to get the final registration.

Truthman · 03-07-2008, 05:51 PM

I read the bit saying:

"such domain name is or contains the identical name or brand name of, or is confusingly similar to the name or brand name of a government office, nonprofit organization, business, or other entity;"

And was considering how such a law would affect my domain: www.Justice.info
considering the Justice department website:
www.Justice.gov

Eventually the domain will be developed further as a parody style site, to voice views about various issues...

I am not an American, I am an Australian residing in Australia.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421

I have also been thinking that .info domains would be safer from US laws because the extension is managed by Afilias which is based in Europe. Whereas .com and .net are managed by the Verisign, which is US based.

And Verisign can close non-us sites based on US laws quite easily, as was the case reported in this article:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03...cuba_websites/

.jd. · 03-07-2008, 06:40 PM

Where are the other extensions located? This could mean different business under many different extensions.. Better websites on cctlds and gtlds?

Truthman · 03-07-2008, 07:06 PM

Originally Posted by .jd.

Where are the other extensions located?

.biz - NeuLevel - Sterling, Virginia, USA
.org - PIR (Public Interest Registry) - Reston, Virginia, USA
.mobi - dotMobi - Dublin, Ireland

Zinc · 03-08-2008, 03:35 AM

Signed.

rexvnus · 03-08-2008, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by -RJ-

$275 if you file online yourself. Legalzoom.com will do it for $494. If you have a very valuable domain, it's worth considering seeking a trademark on the term and NOT parking it. Even if the Snowe bill doesn't pass, owning a trademark gives you excellent protection.

Where can I file online?
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421

If I file it with .com, could anyone regged the same name but with ccTLD?

Thanks

sdsinc · 03-08-2008, 04:41 PM

Originally Posted by rexvnus

If I file it with .com, could anyone regged the same name but with ccTLD?

Thanks

Usually you TM the name without extension eg. Apples and not 'apples.com'.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421
If the name is distinctive or another party is using the same name in a different TLD in a way that infriges your TM maybe you could go after them.
BTW certain TLDs like .co.uk or .eu have their own dispute resolution services while others rely on UDRP. Some TLDs don't have any dispute policy at all.

rexvnus · 03-08-2008, 05:22 PM

Thanks for your information. I appreciate it

~ The 34 Year Buzz!! · 03-08-2008, 09:12 PM

Originally Posted by -RJ-

Exactly. UDRP's are now considering a change of ownership to be the same as a new registration. That means anyone who has established trademark rights in a term after your registration could dispute the domain the minute it changes hands to a new owner.

The only downside of a trademark is that it takes almost a year from your application to get the final registration.

1) I'm holding Original_Idea.com (for example) and my domain reg is in place before someone tries to get a trademark.
2) Someone applies for a trademark for the term 'Original_Idea'.
????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421

Does my original domain ownership give me rights to apply for a trademark, even after someone else?
Would I win under current laws??

03-07-2008, 03:47 AM	#78 (permalink)
metronome NamePros Regular Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: AllPurposes.com Posts: 489	a question, will that bill make the big business acquire short domain names easily?(LLLL, LLL) __________________ YOUR PARENTS LIE! You deserves FREE monthly passive income doing NOTHING!!

03-07-2008, 12:54 PM	#82 (permalink)
RJ NamePros Webmaster Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,930 Follow @DomainBuyer	I believe it has a very high probability of getting passed. They're calling it anti-phishing legislation, when up and down it is really a trademark bill. Who would vote against a bill outlawing phishing? It's unlikely the senators voting on this bill understand the full technical details of what they are voting on. They probably really believe this will help stop phishing. Domain owners traditionally do not garner much sympathy, nor are they commonly recognized on capital hill as legitimate business industry. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421 To remind everyone what this bill does: Companies and trademark holders can sue any domain owner with a similar domain similar to their name. NO bad faith is required to be proven. There is NO protection for generic domains. WHOIS privacy will be eliminated. It will do next to nothing to stop phishing. Phishers are already breaking the law by committing fraud. Do you really think outlawing whois privacy and allowing companies to sue them over their domain will help? I believe the domainer community could help by an organized letter writing campaign, and possibly proposing alternative language for the bill that would actually help curb phishing without infringing on domain owners rights.

03-07-2008, 01:54 PM	#83 (permalink)
GeoOwners Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Near Chicago Posts: 2,397	would have ones domains at a non-US registrar prevent losing names? __________________ MortgageandLoan.com

03-07-2008, 04:28 PM	#89 (permalink)
sOliver NamePros Regular Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 305	How much does it cost to trademark your own domains? I think we will have to do this sooner or later anyway, I don't have a problem with developing, but I suppose that a trademark won't be so cheap :/ __________________ RLTT.com is for SALE Domain-Portfolio.com - Coming Soon \|Webmaster Blog

03-07-2008, 05:51 PM	#93 (permalink)
Truthman NamePros Regular Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Sydney Posts: 313	I read the bit saying: "such domain name is or contains the identical name or brand name of, or is confusingly similar to the name or brand name of a government office, nonprofit organization, business, or other entity;" And was considering how such a law would affect my domain: www.Justice.info considering the Justice department website: www.Justice.gov Eventually the domain will be developed further as a parody style site, to voice views about various issues... I am not an American, I am an Australian residing in Australia. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/showthread.php?t=441421 I have also been thinking that .info domains would be safer from US laws because the extension is managed by Afilias which is based in Europe. Whereas .com and .net are managed by the Verisign, which is US based. And Verisign can close non-us sites based on US laws quite easily, as was the case reported in this article: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/03...cuba_websites/ __________________ I got Jesus! My computers got backup! FOR SALE: NaturalHealth.info, LED.info, Backup.info, Electronic.info, AirTravel.info Last edited by Truthman; 03-07-2008 at 06:36 PM.

03-07-2008, 12:21 AM	#76 (permalink)
.jd. Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,080	RJ are you going to go further with this? Will there be more action then a simple post? Will you be writing to your local congressman?

03-07-2008, 12:45 AM	#77 (permalink)
RJ NamePros Webmaster Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,930 Follow @DomainBuyer	Yes, I'm going further with this but this is not on just me. Everyone who owns a domain name portfolio needs to get involved in one way or another. ????: NamePros.com http://www.namepros.com/industry-news/441421-new-bill-us-senate-threatens-domain.html What we need to do is make sure this bill doesn't leave that committee in its present form. We could be writing the Senators on the Senate Commerce Committee at this point. These are the people that will determine if the larger Senate body will even see this bill. I'm getting varying information on how long it's likely to stay in this committee, but it's good to get started on this campaign early and keep it persistent. If it passes the Senate committee, and then passes Senate, only then does it go to the House of Representatives. I wouldn't even bother writing your House Rep at this point. Start with the Senate Commerce Committee and your own Senators. Let's not rely on the online petition alone to protest the bill. Letter writing seems like a good place to start. Phil Corwin of the ICA says he'll have a sample letter available within a few days. Once we have a clear plan of action, we'll get the larger NamePros community involved to the fullest extent. RJ

03-07-2008, 08:03 AM	#80 (permalink)
BigSotong.com NamePros Regular Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 207	That is serious, Although I do not reside in the US, but it will definitly affect the whole world. Other Countries would likely follow suit. Suggest that all members be informed about this.

03-07-2008, 11:38 AM	#81 (permalink)
.jd. Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,080	Whats the chances of this being passed?

03-07-2008, 02:27 PM	#84 (permalink)
Arabian Account Closed Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Kuwait Posts: 185	Signed.

03-07-2008, 02:53 PM	#86 (permalink)
RJ NamePros Webmaster Join Date: Feb 2003 Posts: 12,930 Follow @DomainBuyer	This potentially could affect domainers outside the USA because the central registry for .COM (Verisign) is based in the US. As a result even if your registrar is outside the US, ultimately every .COM is within legal reach of the US government.

03-07-2008, 06:40 PM	#94 (permalink)
.jd. Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 1,080	Where are the other extensions located? This could mean different business under many different extensions.. Better websites on cctlds and gtlds?

03-08-2008, 03:35 AM	#96 (permalink)
Zinc 1066 Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: UK Posts: 418	Signed.

03-08-2008, 05:22 PM	#99 (permalink)
rexvnus NamePros Regular Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 230	Thanks for your information. I appreciate it

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