Start your own design contest today for only 20 USD. Designers join today and start working with contest holders that provide you feedback and don’t abandon their contests.
ok, this is true, i was just trying to make a point. even if the CH was going give rude feedback, the most the deisgner should do is remember not to enter that persons contests again....
It all comes down to "were all adults here". common sense and curtesy does go a long way.
if the CH skips out ont he contest, i just assume he is either 1) trying to steal ideas or 2) a person with less common sense than brains.
But over all, jackieh, you do bring a good point to the tabel.
Thanks for the comments James. The object of this being in place is so that initially, over the first week or two, people get used to the format of how people's threads/contests are posted. You'll find once the main core of posts on the first page are formatted in this way, when people post new threads, the majority will automaticaly keep to this format.
As for SV's coment, which I know Mark enforces quite heavily, the "jury is out" in my eyes. I think it does make obvious sense to watermark your work. I do know of one instance not 24 hours ago, where someone has had their "concept" design taken, nothing paid for and the logo is now being used on the website. Suprisingly, the person who has "taken" it is non contactable, and has made one post in the forums. This transaction was done in the NP chat room unfortunately and we're doing what we can to help, however, it looks like the designer will end up being out of pocket for $30.00
I think watermarking should be done, and it is down to the designers to do this. However, it should also be optional. There's alot of designs I have done in the past and I have not watermarked them. I've been lucky. Now, I am starting to watermark all designs I put forward. Do remember, these are PUBLIC threads, so anyone can see your design and potentially lift it.
Next Please...
Thanks for the feedback mogbase.
1) I agree to a point on these comments. My personal opinion is that there should ALWAYS be a cash prize. It's like comeing to the forums and saying "I want to swap my 1974 Barry White album for a new logo for my Barry White website". One example of this might be :
PRIZE : $25 or $1250 NP$
The designer should have the choice. I don't believe there should be a problem with having NP$ only competitions, but I would prefer to get everything on the level from the cash side first.
2) Couldn't agree more. I do honestly think that this design was submitted by a member with little or no standing within the NP community. I have noticed there are an increasing number of entries by people with 5-10 posts and 0-1 TR. This is by no means a downside, as it's important to get people into the forums and have fresh new blood offering concepts and works. HOWEVER!, I do agree, if it is found that people have clearly taken another logo and classed it as their own, then the design will be removed, the designer warned officially and negative feedback given. If it happens a second time, THEN they should be banned from NP period, not just the DC Forums (imo).
3) This is quite a hard one to make a judgement call. In many ways I do agree. On the other hand, this is a community and input is always a good thing (as I think I mentioned originally). I'm leaning towards agreeing at this point, as I believe it could be classed as going "off topic" and as others have mentioned, it is down to the competition holder to make/decide the winner and the revisions, NOT a third party. In one such case, the comments made were actually beneficial to the thread starter, however, it does not change the fact it wasn't the thread start who posted them. I'll have a good hard think about this over the weekend, with a view to formalising some rules at the end of the weekend and we can take it from there, although I think this will be included.
Next Please...
This is EXACTLY the kind of response we do NOT need in these forums. If you can NOT be bothered to read through the thread and give your thoughts on an intelligent level, then there is little point even giving you the time of day. However, as a Forum Leader I should give you some response with regards to your comment.
If you do not like the terms of holding a contest in the DC Forum, then please, go post it somewhere else. We have thousands of very happy members of this community who give alot to it. They are all happy to abide by the rules. The fact that there is "to much crap" to read clearly indicates you dont really care for the quality , style and thoughtfulness of this community.
Put simply, if a contest is held within NamePros DC, you WILL decide a winner from the submissions by the NP community. End Of.
Next please...
Agreed on both counts. Jackie, exactly the point I am trying to make. Feedback takes all of 1 minute to do. If you cant do this, should you really be holding a contest?
Next please...
Indeed. I have already spoken to RJ about this and we are going to try to implement something soon. Yes, the mods would make the call initially. Then, personally, I'm thinking if there are certain people who are providing good comps and the designers believe they should be voted, then we could put it to the designer vote. As I said, hoepfully, we'll be test running this after the weekend. I'm going to find 1-2 contest holders, plus hold one myself, to see if this looks ok and works well and you designers can give us feedback. Hopefully, DomanBell will accept as I have asked for her to be one of the first due to her long standing contests!.
Welp, I think I've covered the nights threads and comments. Anything, post away. The more the better.
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First, congratulations Matt. I know you will have your work cut out, keeping so many people happy is a task in itself. It looks like you have things under control so far... great!
Reading through the comments and suggestions made in this thread, I've noticed a few times people saying 'we're all adults here'. I think this is not the the case. It's not a major issue but, dealing with a twelve year old is going to be slightly different to dealing with someone who is a lot older and mature.
As a very new member of NP, I have already experienced a CH 'doing a runner', wasting everybody's time and efforts. Now I'm not totally sure what you need to be a CH but, some sort of registration for the holder would be some security for the designers.
The registration should include a contact address, phone number etc only for forum mods to have access to. The contact address etc should be checkable.
Let's face facts, money is being offered for services, if the service is delivered but there is no money transaction, then who ever has taken the service deliberately without paying, in my eyes, that makes them a thief.
Making sure that the designers know who is a genuine CH, such as an avatar with 'Verified CH Member' under it, is a good idea.
I'm sorry if I have repeated anything that has already been brought up. I, as a designer appreciates ALL the protection offered to me and for my work so the more protection the better.
One quick comment on the public giving feedback on design. Yes it is nice to be complimented on your work by the general public and other designers, but this should be done via pm's. It keeps the CH thread clean and on topic.
This is a valid point. It will always be different in dealing with people. You will even find differences in dealing with 2 people the same age, just different nationalities. There will have to be a degree of patience during this "implementation" process and it will be a learning curve, of varying degrees for all involved. Mostly, when people say "we're all adults" I think the direction is more towards "We all have common sense". There is a difference between the two. We'll see what other feedbck is like and put together a stratagy later in the weekend If we have to spell it out, in font size 46, then we will
Sorry to hear that. Obviously we will try to stop this from happening as best as possible. The "registration" part is being discussed and I'm a big believer of it...however...keep reading ....
Taking personal contact details and storing them means incorporating practices to allow for the Data Protection Act. This causes massive headaches on splitting data, storage and all sorts. It also starts implying we have legal/libel situations and this is obviously something we can not accept at NamePros. I think with carefull moderation from both myself and the ommunity, we should be able to self govern this. It also doesn't hurt using some common sense and speaking to the person holding the comp. in chat, check their profile, see their site, run a google search. It can't hurt and could save some potential pain if they slip through the controls.
As mentioned above. This is being considered and hopefully actioned soon.
No worries about the repatition. As a mod, I appreciate everyones comments and thoughts.
As for the comments within a CH thread. This is being bandied around at the moment. The general consensus seems to be "keep it out of the thread and leave it to PM's". If this is the ultimate agreement of the community, then it shall be enforced. We'll see at the end of the weekend
Thanks for the feedback.
Next Please...
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About the tidyness of the threads. i belive that all contests that have ended should be deleted. that way we (the designers) can find the contests easier.
Jon
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I've given this some considerable thought, and oddly enough it was something I was thinking anyway, however, I'm also concious that it MUST, to a degree, stick with the "style" of the forums. Therefore, I'm proposing that the Admins and Staff pick 2 Tag's and the public then vote for the winner.
Hope this clears it up a little.
MAtt
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i completly agree with jackieh1791. I myself as a desginer is a disrespect for the contest holder not to give me feedback just because he did't like my first revision. I believe that the contest holder needs to be fair, every designer learn from the holder's point of view and bring what the holder wants.
My seggestion:
1. No person under 20 posts should be allowd to post a contest because the main problem is scammers come, make an account and then leave and they spam everyone. (this happend to me in my last contest)
2. I suggest atleast one or two new moderators especialy for the Design Contest forum. That way the global mods can work on other places.
On the whole, I agree with your initial comment. As per Jackies comments we are lokoing to get contest holders to provide more feedback. It is imperative on 2 levels. 1) for teh designer, 2) for the CH to get the design they want/need.
Comment #1
this is VERY tricky to do. Plus, it would not stop a real scammer from posting various posts that = 20 posts and then enter the DC Forum. We are working on various methds, as mentioned in the above posts. One of these is a deposit system for "unknowns" and a "DC forum ontest Holder Approved" tag for those we know are good, solid contest holders. These awards will NOT be handed out for everyone. It is likely we will hold weekly votes for certain holders to obtain them. With them, will come special privalidges, which, will be defined later.
Comment #2
this will happen. For now tho, I need to gain some order to the forums and have people posting within the required formats. Once there is a level of stability (over the next week or two), then we will look at introducing another mod for these forums.
Hope this answers your comments and questions
Matt
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Like Matt said, I dont think that will stop scammers. With the new badge system, you will just need to be extra careful with those who do not have a badge, so watermark your work for example.
What about the Contest Holder - (of which I am one)
Having to PURCHASE the contest....
you know how NP sells the little ribbons we can purchase ??
what if there was a menu of different prices $5-up in increments of $5 dollars
and increasing by $5 all the way up to say $500
$5 $10 $1 5 $20 etc...
the contest holder decides the PRIZE amount they want to offer....
they click that dollar amount option in the menu....
a PRE-SET standard form appears....
with the outline and format you already want each contest to have...
and the Contest holder simply answers those questions...
fills in a bit in the comments section...
clicks a button that takes the contest holder to PayPal
where they pay for the contest....
when winner is selected there can be a simple automated system for the contest holder to issue an invoice to pay design-winner so and so in contest such and such - the prize amount of such and such.... and that invoice to pay be automated into the paypal system to pay that winner
it's sounds like a hassel....
but if you know the PayPal system and how to automate things
it'll be much easier than you think...
I personally as a contest holder - have no problem pre-paying for my contests.... and quite frankly any contest holder that does - makes me leary as to are they going to pay our designers...
I've seen our designers be taken advantage of so bad that it really angers me...
I wish it to be more automated...
the approved contest holder button is a good idea... for those that meet a pre-determined set of guidelines... I think those should be something along the lines of:
Contest HOLDER:
Must have been a member of NP for more than 45 days
Must have earned a TR of at least 1
Must have a verified PayPal account
Contest DESIGNER:
Use of copyrighted material - prohibited. - Membership NP-wide terminated on first violation - after all they KNOW when they are thieving - and if they would do it on a design contest - they'd do it elsewhere on NP if given the chance.
All designs must be watermarked or NOT submitted.
The automated contest holder form is what I think will be the easiest way for compliance in format...
Just a few thoughts...
excuse typos and rambling I have the worst sinus headache right now...
I shouldn't even be here typing this right now...
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Pre-paying is an excelent idea, I think. Then there is no doubt a winner will be paid, and if no winner is found, the money can be given back to the holder. The only thing is, this might throw off new contest holders...
Firstly, WOW. Thanks for the comprehensive thought put into this DB. In answer to your first point above, I agree. I have already spoken to RJ about this and it is do-able. I think there is likely to be "some" resistance to it, however, time heals all wounds, so people should eventually get used to it. It would probably be set up in a similar basis but probably not so many breaks within the pricing options. RJ hjas confirmed it will also be able to generate a "tag/image" that will automaticaly be included within the thread showing that the money has been deposited. The immediate concerns that arise are :
1) PayPal takes a fee for the money being taken. This would have to be allowed within the contest holder posting their ammount. As you know, $30.00 can turn into $29 allowing for this - I dont think people would have a huge concern KNOWING they would get the money and it's assured.
2) Chargebacks and Fraud
This is something RJ is going to look into. We'll have more information later and closer to the date should this system be implemented.
In reality, having briefly looked at the technical integration, we would expect it to be circa 2 weeks from time of agreement to implement this. It's quite a while, however, it is something that is posatively being looked at.
Your second point is also already being looked at. There would be certain criteria we will implement for anyone to achieve the title of CH Approved. I'm personally thinking of the following :
Contest HOLDER:
Must have been a member of NP for more than 45 days - Agreed
Must have earned a TR of at least 1 - Should be TR of 3+, possibly even 5+.
Must have a verified PayPal account - I dont think that Verified is crucial. Must have held at least 3 successful pervious Design Competitions - Added
Must be older than 16years of age - Added
As for the comments on a designer requirement, I agree. My only concern is following each entry, on every contest and researching all images used is a massive job. There has to be a degree of common sense here. We will never stamp it out completely, however, I think by making visable examples out of those that have been caught should assist in the self governing aspect. What I want to avoid is people screaming "theif" just to give them a chance of winning or causing delays in the contest.
As for the watermark aspect, well, I think the "removal" aspect is to harsh. The bottom line is that these forums ARE public. If you dont watermark your image, then there is a chance anyone, especially non members, can rip your design and use it. Chances are, with 40billion pages out there or more, you'll never know. If you dont watermark your work, then dont complain. However, this being said, there is no reason why the contest holder can not specify that they will only select a winner from watermarked designs.
Thanks for the input DB Hope this covers my thoughts.
